Brawl+ - Official 5.0 RC1 Build is now online! (Re-Use Autoupdater, Snake bug fixed)

[TLMSheikant]

Why is toony ignored completely :[. We need some buffs. Toon Link is the least changed character in brawl plus.

 

[Roxas215]

hell no, now where at, lamme guess 600? and the texture codes is perhaps 50 but probably less.

he should use the snapshot method, works fine and is compatible with the latest set (double gct however is not)

I can't even do the snapshot method as that requires a sd card as well. ARRRRRRRG. O well. Im not going to buy a new wii just for brawl+

Why is toony ignored completely :[. We need some buffs. Toon Link is the least changed character in brawl plus.

Last time i played tl was beast of course this was about 3 weeks ago when my sd slot was still working lol.

 

[Yingyay]

Okay, what in the world does TL need?
Can camp like no 2morow
bair combos into itself.
fair I believe still ko's
great recovery
Dair spike has legit setups.
only thing hindering him is his light weight.
He's already good. So was Wolf witout the shine buff, im glad it got taken out, made my wolf fell dirty inside for gwtting free Bairs lol

 

[TLMSheikant]

Tink is good already yeah but he could be more varied...I mean there are still useless moves in his moveset ( namely ftilt, and to an extent down tilt and fsmash needs fixing to connect both hits). And almost every other character in the game has had buffs from what i see...

 

[Dan_X]

I personally have not played toon link too much, as he's not my style. However, he's very spammable, and his Bair is awesome. It's so fun to combo with him! Also, though I'm not too skilled with him, I understand his Dair can be set up. I think one of those ways is to footstool into a Dair spike.

Toon link is pretty bad @$$ though.

Anyway, I'm not against buffs for Toon Link, I don't know him well enough. Being that I don't main him, I have no idea what he does or does not need.

 

[Revven]

Tink is good already yeah but he could be more varied...I mean there are still useless moves in his moveset ( namely ftilt, and to an extent down tilt and fsmash needs fixing to connect both hits). And almost every other character in the game has had buffs from what i see...

TL doesn't need any buffs because he is REALLY freakin' good. He doesn't need every move of his to be good to BE good. Characters who received buffs are those who needed the help (DDD, who lost his CG for example and thus became mediocre) while TL has remained pretty much the same but more powerful than before due to hitstun.

He doesn't need any buffs for that reason. You can want buffs, but, it doesn't mean he needs them.

 

[JCaesar]

DDD infinite(the one where he dont have to move) And planking should deftinely not be allowed or even encouraged in brawl. Everything else is cool as it requires setups.(Also the whole mk being banned arugment has been shut down once and for all after apex)

I can't think of a better way to increase the size of the Brawl+ community than to encourage Brawl players to abuse the most broken and anticompetitive aspects of Brawl as much as possible. I'm all for it.

 

[TLMSheikant]

At falco400- doesnt change the fact that his fsmash is ******** XD. U get punished for landing it not exactly fair i say. I only consider it fair for a hard-to-hit-with move to be fixed no matter if the character is good or not. I know TL is beast in brawl plus ;D (im a TL main in both brawls duh XD)

 

[lonelytraveler8]

Ok, I just got Brawl+ running and played for the first time. I went straight for MK, who's my favorite for fooling around with and I noticed a lot of differences (obviously). He's much heavier and doesn't go as high and his jab actually seems to be useful, although I haven't test it much more than using it 3-4 times.

There is one major drawback that I think should be addressed unless, of course, it was made this way on purpose. MK's Tornado is supposed to rise when you repeatedly press the B button (you knew that), but now it doesn't really do much of anything. It was a great recovery move before, but now it's hardly useful as an attack because once the opponent bounces out, you can't really follow them up and try to catch them again.

Other than that, I like the feel thus far. Going to go play with more characters now.

 

[Revven]

At falco400- doesnt change the fact that his fsmash is ******** XD. U get punished for landing it not exactly fair i say. I only consider it fair for a hard-to-hit-with move to be fixed no matter if the character is good or not. I know TL is beast in brawl plus ;D (im a TL main in both brawls duh XD)

I was thinking of an Fsmash fix a long while ago and thanks for reminding me of it, we'll have to have a look at it for the next build (probably after the official 4.1 release).

 

[Shell]

The tornado nerf you mentioned was intentional.

 

[Marufuji Ryo]

I don't need to make a separate gct for textures right?

 

[El Raspa]

I don't need to make a separate gct for textures right?

No, this builds are already prepared for textures.

When is the scheduled date for releasing a new one public codeset? (not a nightly build)

Regards

 

[Shadic]

Soon, very soon. Probably less than a week.

 

[GuruKid]

An official codeset created RIGHT after BtL? Very sad face.

 

[GPDP]

No feedback on my character gravity mods? I'll post them again so people can see them:

Marth: 116865C0
Falcon: 093868C0
Mario: 003865C0

These go on the Jump/Grav Values code on the set.

For those that didn't follow last night, what I'm trying to do is get characters to have faster jumps and short hops, while still falling just as fast as they currently do so as to not mess with their established comboability. This is in order to get rid of that floatiness that characters have on the way up. The reason I am doing this is not so much the floatiness per se, but the fact that characters tend to fall quite a bit faster than they rise, which, to me, feels inconsistent and jarring, especially with characters such as Marth and Mario, whose shffls are slow and sluggish, despite lowered short hop height.

So what I did in order to correct this is prioritize fullgrav over down grav. This mostly entailed switching both values and increasing short hops and fullshops and decreasing fast fall speed accordingly, thus achieving much the same overall down grav, fast fall speed, and short hop and fulljump height, while making characters jump faster and thus reach the apex of their jumps and short hops faster (this is particularly useful with Marth and Mario; just try their shffls!). Overall, what I hope to accomplish is a gravity setting that feels consistent both on the way up and the way down.

I tried to do Sonic as well, but his UpB suffers from increased gravity. I know we were able to increase Link's UpB height, so perhaps the same could be done with Sonic. Guess I'll ask Almas.

 

[5ive]

Wolf's shine needs to be back. That is all.

 

[bajisci]

i dont even use wolf and i think it didnt need to be nerfed like that, it was perfectly fine sending people up, it may have been a bit overpowered but couldnt u increase the knockback or sumthing so it wasnt so amazing?

edit: nvm at the knockback thing, just read a previous post

 

[5ive]

It wasn't that OP'd. It didn't lead to any insane combos, and with proper DI, you could only follow up with one hit. It was mainly used as a combo breaker, and still can, but Wolf needed that Falco shine.

 

[Perfect Chaos]

i dont even use wolf and i think it didnt need to be nerfed like that, it was perfectly fine sending people up, it may have been a bit overpowered but couldnt u increase the knockback or sumthing so it wasnt so amazing?

That's the thing; I think the main problem with Wolf's shine right now is that they haven't found a way to increase its knockback growth.

Edit: Ugh...I guess you realized it as I typed it.

 

[kupo15]

It wasn't even OP'd. It didn't lead to any insane combos, and with proper DI, you could only follow up with one hit. It was mainly used as a combo breaker, but Wolf needed that.

Not to mention a kill combo that has invincibility frames on the initiating attack

 

[shanus]

No feedback on my character gravity mods? I'll post them again so people can see them:

Marth: 116865C0
Falcon: 093868C0
Mario: 003865C0

These go on the Jump/Grav Values code on the set.

For those that didn't follow last night, what I'm trying to do is get characters to have faster jumps and short hops, while still falling just as fast as they currently do so as to not mess with their established comboability. This is in order to get rid of that floatiness that characters have on the way up. The reason I am doing this is not so much the floatiness per se, but the fact that characters tend to fall quite a bit faster than they rise, which, to me, feels inconsistent and jarring, especially with characters such as Marth and Mario, whose shffls are slow and sluggish, despite lowered short hop height.

So what I did in order to correct this is prioritize fullgrav over down grav. This mostly entailed switching both values and increasing short hops and fullshops and decreasing fast fall speed accordingly, thus achieving much the same overall down grav, fast fall speed, and short hop and fulljump height, while making characters jump faster and thus reach the apex of their jumps and short hops faster (this is particularly useful with Marth and Mario; just try their shffls!). Overall, what I hope to accomplish is a gravity setting that feels consistent both on the way up and the way down.

I tried to do Sonic as well, but his UpB suffers from increased gravity. I know we were able to increase Link's UpB height, so perhaps the same could be done with Sonic. Guess I'll ask Almas.

I'll try them out later in a BR test set and let you know. However, I'm not going to include them in the public build I'm releasing today because its gonna be out for the Beyond the Limit tournament this saturday and these values might need tweaking, etc. I'll let you know our opinions on them when they all get tested.

 

[VietGeek]

Hmm...has anyone noticed Nana doesn't seem to be affected by the hitlag mod? She's like receiving full hitlag from tipped fairs from Marth.

EDIT: Either that or hitlag mod is borked. It's checked off on my codelist but results don't seem to translate to actual game. I need to see if the .gct was corrupted or something.

Also...yeah, fsmash fix on TL please, forget about buffing anything else lol.

In vBrawl, it seems the advantage of linking the two is -14 (fresh). Taken from Rutger's TL research thread (here). I should not be Rested for hitting Jiggs with the move. Or shine, or DS, or Dragon Punch, or any other "combo breaker."

And even then...Fsmash 1st hit has 48 or so frames of cooldown, and only IASA frames for the second hit, and the second hit has around that same amount of lag. AKA TL is screwed.

 

[Deleted member]

vietgeek, are you using a codeset from before 5-11? because that's when the nana fix was included.
use 5-12 though cuz the fix in 5-11 has some bugs

 

[Plum]

SMK told me that Wolf has a guaranteed Fsmash out of his shine the way it is now; haven't checked it out but it should at least give it some offensive capabilities and a guaranteed kill option especially considering the ease of landing a shine..

 

[VietGeek]

vietgeek, are you using a codeset from before 5-11? because that's when the nana fix was included.
use 5-12 though cuz the fix in 5-11 has some bugs

Is 5-12 even out yet...? o_O

Also yeah, my .gct was corrupted, didn't include hitlag mod. I think I fixed it. False alarm. =X

SMK told me that Wolf has a guaranteed Fsmash out of his shine the way it is now; haven't checked it out but it should at least give it some offensive capabilities and a guaranteed kill option especially considering the ease of landing a shine..

Can't you hold up to avoid the second hit, or for frame adv./cool factor, SDI down and tech the fsmash?

But yeah, it still helps Wolf a lot. I don't mind a sped up normal shine either.

 

[Deleted member]

ow my bad I always look in the BR codeset section first. shanus will prob release somewher in the next couple hours

 

[Totaldragon]

Has wolf's shine sped up? If not, maybe that could be a fair exchange for loosing the rising part.

 

[shanus]

I just updated the set. Bug fixes and wolf changes among a few other slight tweaks. I think the wolf shine needs a bit more work though, I think I need to crank it up to 3x to get the exact frame set up that I'm aiming for.

 

[Roxas215]

Why release a official codeset after btl?

 

[Sails]

Me and my friend just had the most EPIC DK Vs. DDD match. It was online and laggy, but it's a lot more fun than the match would have been in VBrawl.

We were both at around 130%, and I got killed by the **** crane on the Halberd. He should get it online soon.

Also, the fact that handicap defaults to 0% after every match online sucks. :|

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eVEdsoEJl4&fmt=18

Enjoy.

 

[Shadic]

Lag sucks, as well. Oh well.

 

[Silent Mike]

Stupid question, but does the Online Waiting Room just play the one usual song or does it have all of NPC's songs?

 

[HeroPenguin]

Stupid question, but does the Online Waiting Room just play the one usual song or does it have all of NPC's songs?

It plays the usual song.

5-12 Impressions:

Wolf's new fair angle seems weird to me, but it does seem to be easy to juggle out of it, often for a kill. I'm assuming that was the intended effect of the change.

DDD can also pick up and throw Waddles during his stopping animation after a dash (technically part of a dash, but worth mentioning) and while in the air. However, unless he's running or airborne, he cannot pick up ANY items. I don't know if this applies to catching as well, but I have no reason to doubt that it does. I imagine this being a BIG problem for him whenever he fights Peach, Diddy, Snake, and to a lesser extent, ROB. I don't think the trade is worth it.

Falco's shine hasn't gotten any easier for me to use since the change popped yesterday. It seems like either the angle is too shallow, making it too easy to send opponents behind you instead of above, or the hitstun isn't quite high enough to allow Falco to recover in time to properly set up a follow up that isn't utilt, which only works if the spacing is perfect.

In a side comment, Falco's shine no longer has an electric effect on hit, which seems a little odd given the sfx. Purely aesthetic concern.

I'm liking ZSS's fsmash buff. It feels pretty meaty now, and the backswing isn't bad. She still needs work, but she feels nicer than before.

 

[Perfect Chaos]

It has the banjo playing the Brawl theme song (which is awesome, IMO, since I find it pretty catchy and unique).

Edit: Beat out by a couple of seconds...

 

[shanus]

It plays the usual song.

5-12 Impressions:

Wolf's new fair angle seems weird to me, but it does seem to be easy to juggle out of it, often for a kill. I'm assuming that was the intended effect of the change.

DDD can also pick up and throw Waddles during his stopping animation after a dash (technically part of a dash, but worth mentioning) and while in the air. However, unless he's running or airborne, he cannot pick up ANY items. I don't know if this applies to catching as well, but I have no reason to doubt that it does. I imagine this being a BIG problem for him whenever he fights Peach, Diddy, Snake, and to a lesser extent, ROB. I don't think the trade is worth it.

Falco's shine hasn't gotten any easier for me to use since the change popped yesterday. It seems like either the angle is too shallow, making it too easy to send opponents behind you instead of above, or the hitstun isn't quite high enough to allow Falco to recover in time to properly set up a follow up that isn't utilt, which only works if the spacing is perfect.

In a side comment, Falco's shine no longer has an electric effect on hit, which seems a little odd given the sfx. Purely aesthetic concern.

I'm liking ZSS's fsmash buff. It feels pretty meaty now, and the backswing isn't bad. She still needs work, but she feels nicer than before.

Nice find on the waddles, looks like that will have to go.

Falco shine isn't electric because requires hitstun, the SFX just fits the move I thought ;-)

Wolf fair angle is just being tested, doesn't necessarily have to stay

 

[Silent Mike]

It has the banjo playing the Brawl theme song (which is awesome, IMO, since I find it pretty catchy and unique).

It's catchy but I'd rather change it if there's gonna be some brawl+ action goin' on

Quick reference if anyone's interested...

Waiting room music [spunit262]
0410FE04 3863XXXX
(EDIT: For XXXX values go here and ctrl-F search Music List)

(Sorry if any of this is offtopic)

 

[bajisci]

edit: nvm...

 

[Plum]

It plays the usual song.

5-12 Impressions:

Wolf's new fair angle seems weird to me, but it does seem to be easy to juggle out of it, often for a kill. I'm assuming that was the intended effect of the change.

DDD can also pick up and throw Waddles during his stopping animation after a dash (technically part of a dash, but worth mentioning) and while in the air. However, unless he's running or airborne, he cannot pick up ANY items. I don't know if this applies to catching as well, but I have no reason to doubt that it does. I imagine this being a BIG problem for him whenever he fights Peach, Diddy, Snake, and to a lesser extent, ROB. I don't think the trade is worth it.

Falco's shine hasn't gotten any easier for me to use since the change popped yesterday. It seems like either the angle is too shallow, making it too easy to send opponents behind you instead of above, or the hitstun isn't quite high enough to allow Falco to recover in time to properly set up a follow up that isn't utilt, which only works if the spacing is perfect.

In a side comment, Falco's shine no longer has an electric effect on hit, which seems a little odd given the sfx. Purely aesthetic concern.

I'm liking ZSS's fsmash buff. It feels pretty meaty now, and the backswing isn't bad. She still needs work, but she feels nicer than before.

I actually like the trade off for DDD. The best way to pick up items imo is to just hit grab as you pass it while in the air because the items literally poof into your hand without any lag. Just short hop, fast fall and press Z, or whatever grab is set to. When fighting an aggressive Diddy it becomes a necessity to grab the bananas like this because the small lag of picking up the banana by standing next to it and pressing A can be punished by his second banana, and air dodging, using an aerial, or dash attack has even more lag.
If it can be fixed, cool, but for now it is worth to deal with a minor inconvenience to not have those stupid waddles get in the way imo.

 

[ToxiCrow]

i have a request regarding Lucas.
he goes into helpless if he uses PKFreeze in the air but it doesnt aide his recovery at all. can we remove the helpless state after he uses it? i mean, if Zelda doesnt go into helpless after using her side-b and ness doesnt after using his up-b, why cant Lucas?
yeah i no people dont really care much for him, but he's still a character =]