Social Bair is underpowered - Puff Social/Disc Thread

[KrIsP!]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvlFMMgvhzc&feature=player_detailpage#t=130s

 

[hungrybox]

you're going down Hbox!

i'll bair you more

 

[Krynxe]

Oh

Damn

The mo****ing callout

 

[Zanx8]

Hype Puff ditto MM?

 

[Chroma]

In your opinion, what's the coolest, but least practical/useful puff technique?

For me, it's the run-off sing to instantly grab the ledge.

 

[Mahone]

ya, thats the coolest

i guess like, rising pounds that lose the least amount of height so you basically stay in place are pretty cool

 

[Massive]

In your opinion, what's the coolest, but least practical/useful puff technique?

Rollout KOing offstage opponents.

For me, it's the run-off sing to instantly grab the ledge.

Run-off sing ledgegrab is actually useful in some matchups (works great on sheik/falcon recoveries) and sing ledgegrab in general is totally awesome if you're facing away from the stage with fairs and don't want to (or have a) jump to turn around.

You can also virtually eliminate those unpleasant super-vulnerable battlefield induced ledge jumps with it.

 

[Zanx8]

^ This right here.

 

[Tekk]

Hey guyyyys
How's it goiiiiing

 

[KrIsP!]

Along with your avi you look like a 13 year old, fat.desperate chick.

Life sucks due to new job...tourney next week though so hopefully I can make it. How's France?

 

[ShroudedOne]

I think I need to get reinvited to the Puff chat

 

[Krynxe]

No such thing exists any longer

 

[ShroudedOne]

Oh wow. Why did it die? What happened?

 

[Krynxe]

Just inactivity and all the good players left the chat

 

[ShroudedOne]

I'll light candles in rememberance.

 

[KrIsP!]

July 24, we shall remember.

 

[Tekk]

I still love y'all
France is fine, I'm very busy atm

 

[KirbyKaze]

Mahone don't drop sets to Plank because you try to up tilt Sheik's enormous fluffy shield 11 times and got grabbed for 8 of them plz. If you're gonna do stupid crap like that, at least do it BEHIND Sheik's shield where her nair OOS sucks, her bair OOS autoloses to duck > f-smash (it's a combo!) and where her shield grab whiffs outright.

Also, your edgeguarding vs Sheik sucks. Correct that. Just c-stick left or right if you can't rest in time, or b-throw her back off and do some gay option coverage thing. You only need to nudge her. Dair > up smash kills at like 112% or something.

I think you could move out of the way of Sheik when she's coming down from being ***** and then f-smash her, or nair her into something, or even just land and shield grab if she's committed to a weak move (like nair or bair). A lot of situations you tried to bair her but failed when easier options were around. Not saying that bair was the wrong choice - it has the highest payoff because if you start a bair chain on a jumpless Sheik then she's dead. But on some of those it looked like you'd need pretty good timing and easier stuff was available... sometimes it can be good to consolidate damage and keep control.

I think you had some chances to do super ballsy combos like bair > rest and didn't take them. Learn to rest off more than just uair, pound, u-throw, d-throw nonsense, and the usual stuff. It makes you so much scarier.

Boss ***** you. But I don't know anything about Doc Puff so I can't say much. I think you could nair more 'cuz of how he pills and you have to stop getting grabbed somehow. Other than that I got nothing.

 

[idea]

i saw that a few days ago...haha dunno if you even want advice but

- too many fullhop aerials, it's easy for sheik to hit you after if you miss
- not enough wavedashing around for movement
- he kept shielding and you rarely grabbed him

 

[Eggz]

yeah i message him 24/7

smashboards 4 life

prolly 30 pages late but thus are the repercussions of annual name searches

 

[hungrybox]

argghhhh

I almost won you guys

almost

 

[Krynxe]

Goos **** anyways, hbox

Also wtf are you doing here, shane? >_<

 

[omgwtfToph]

Namesearching, clearly.

 

[Mahone]

Mahone don't drop sets to Plank because you try to up tilt Sheik's enormous fluffy shield 11 times and got grabbed for 8 of them plz. If you're gonna do stupid crap like that, at least do it BEHIND Sheik's shield where her nair OOS sucks, her bair OOS autoloses to duck > f-smash (it's a combo!) and where her shield grab whiffs outright.

Also, your edgeguarding vs Sheik sucks. Correct that. Just c-stick left or right if you can't rest in time, or b-throw her back off and do some gay option coverage thing. You only need to nudge her. Dair > up smash kills at like 112% or something.

I think you could move out of the way of Sheik when she's coming down from being ***** and then f-smash her, or nair her into something, or even just land and shield grab if she's committed to a weak move (like nair or bair). A lot of situations you tried to bair her but failed when easier options were around. Not saying that bair was the wrong choice - it has the highest payoff because if you start a bair chain on a jumpless Sheik then she's dead. But on some of those it looked like you'd need pretty good timing and easier stuff was available... sometimes it can be good to consolidate damage and keep control.

I think you had some chances to do super ballsy combos like bair > rest and didn't take them. Learn to rest off more than just uair, pound, u-throw, d-throw nonsense, and the usual stuff. It makes you so much scarier.

Boss ***** you. But I don't know anything about Doc Puff so I can't say much. I think you could nair more 'cuz of how he pills and you have to stop getting grabbed somehow. Other than that I got nothing.

i saw that a few days ago...haha dunno if you even want advice but

- too many fullhop aerials, it's easy for sheik to hit you after if you miss
- not enough wavedashing around for movement
- he kept shielding and you rarely grabbed him

ive been kinda busy but dont think i havent read and appreciated this stuff...

ill talk more about it when i get around to watchin the matches

 

[ShroudedOne]

I saw your MM vs Vist. Puff/Luigi is really odd, but I felt like you could've been more patient. There were other things I think I noticed, if you care to hear them, I guess.

 

[Construct]

Just jumping in here to say that your comeback in GFs of P:M was the most amazing thing ever Hbox.

Puff's a pretty cool character too.

 

[Mahone]

I saw your MM vs Vist. Puff/Luigi is really odd, but I felt like you could've been more patient. There were other things I think I noticed, if you care to hear them, I guess.

id love to, i hope u have skype now, i got no facebook


also, a pet peeve of mine is those *******s who keep harassing magicians and throwing out wild guesses on how the tricks work or asking to see all the props...

im not a magician and havent seen this type of person recently, i just thought of it randomly, but man... sooooo annoying

its like, congratulations, u know its a trick... just like everyone in the ****ing audience who isnt a kid or ********... its like running mall to mall at chrismas and telling all the kids the santa who they are waiting in line for isnt real and there is no santa at all

why is it so hard to just enjoy something u cant understand and know that there is a logical explanation that ull never know

 

[knightpraetor]

lol, you are the most random person ever mahone.

also, we need to play soon....really soon..like next weekend

so curious now..is uptilt actually good at piercing shields or does it just catch jumps out of shield?

 

[idea]

it's alright at piercing shields, the hitbox starts at her feet

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ely7VTpG3N4&t=4m4s

why was uptilt the very last move...

 

[KirbyKaze]

The attacks in the Seanson hitbox system are sorted alphabetically iirc.

 

[Mahone]

Also this is pretty good

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=303202

 

[ShroudedOne]

Yeah, I'll be on Skype intermittently this weekend, and during this week. I'll try to be on as often as I can so that we meet up.

 

[knightpraetor]

yeah i thought of that and went and checked it later..and i thought i edited my posts on my thoughts on the hitbox, but i guess not. sorry about that.

 

[GrazzaB]

Hearing Jigglypuff's ping after a summer of not playing sounds so good

 

[Krynxe]

Puff's ping is the best ping

 

[knightpraetor]

so mahone is pretty good at this game...

somehow despite having that extra range I still keep getting wrecked as marth. i kept having my upairs get outspaced at the last second and then get wrecked from the side.

also pound is pretty good if the marth is aggressive. If the marth isn't coming in swinging then jiggs can take her time setting up a good approach angle.

 

[AppleAppleAZ]

Hi Puffs! Could anyone offer any general advice on spacing correctly, and/or just general movement when you have to come down? For some reason I always end up getting grabbed before I can jump again. Also I'm having a bit of trouble telling if I hit my L cancel or not Idk.

Thanks everybody!

Also: Is there a problem with using the control stick jump to WD? I find it a lot easier than using X or Y.

 

[Mahone]

general spacing advice:

you just want to make it so your move's tip hits the opponent and then you start moving away from them before you land...

jiggs can move so much in the air that if u do this right you should be more than far enough away by the time you land that you cant get grabbed

Coming down:

if u are coming down, nair is a really good choice, just try to hit their head with the nair then start moving away from them so you land far away

Not getting grabbed:

also try to do faster things when you land... practice landing and then IMMEDIATELY

a) jumping away - this can dodge a lot of grab attempts since you will be airborne
b) dashing away - this might get you away from then in time as well
c) jabbing them - this could hit their grab and you will most likely be able to do a grab after the jab connects since they will be surprised
d) grab them - this one could work if they arent super close, you will grab their grab attempt
e) do an immediate nair moving backwards
fghahdiofhaioeijfoaefjioafejio

there are a ton more options i cant list them all and explain, but the point is... most of the time the problem is that you are shielding when you land or just not doing a move fast enough

oh, i almost forgot, a really nice one is buffer roll away/towards... its not really good the better you get since jiggs roll sucks, but you can just hold either left/right on the cstick and L or R and you will do a roll the first frame you can, so itll definitely be fast

you could try that at first, maybe it will help give you a feel for when the lcancel lag is over and you might notice when you miss lcancels more



as for the control stick jump thing, i think whatever is easy for u is fine, but someone else might say its suboptimal... idk i wouldnt worry too much about that

 

[Massive]

Using the control stick to wavedash will wear your stick out (substantially) faster, but in general people who use control stick to jump end up with better character control and more reliable tilt abilities. If you were a fox player, you would be rebuked for up-to-jump, because you can't get the shortest shorthop from it. On jiggs it's inconsequential.

Also, you don't really need to worry about L-cancelling bair most of the time, fair definitely, but you shouldn't be grounding that with any frequency. Nair seems to be at its best autocancelled, leaving dair as the sole aerial that really needs to be L-cancelled, and it's tough for many people to do reliably.

Something really easy to do when you land vs. taller characters is to just duck. Falcon, 'Dorf, Sheik, and Marth will all wiff JC or standing grabs if you're ducking.

 

[AppleAppleAZ]

general spacing advice:

you just want to make it so your move's tip hits the opponent and then you start moving away from them before you land...

jiggs can move so much in the air that if u do this right you should be more than far enough away by the time you land that you cant get grabbed

Coming down:

if u are coming down, nair is a really good choice, just try to hit their head with the nair then start moving away from them so you land far away

Not getting grabbed:

also try to do faster things when you land... practice landing and then IMMEDIATELY

a) jumping away - this can dodge a lot of grab attempts since you will be airborne
b) dashing away - this might get you away from then in time as well
c) jabbing them - this could hit their grab and you will most likely be able to do a grab after the jab connects since they will be surprised
d) grab them - this one could work if they arent super close, you will grab their grab attempt
e) do an immediate nair moving backwards
fghahdiofhaioeijfoaefjioafejio

there are a ton more options i cant list them all and explain, but the point is... most of the time the problem is that you are shielding when you land or just not doing a move fast enough

oh, i almost forgot, a really nice one is buffer roll away/towards... its not really good the better you get since jiggs roll sucks, but you can just hold either left/right on the cstick and L or R and you will do a roll the first frame you can, so itll definitely be fast

you could try that at first, maybe it will help give you a feel for when the lcancel lag is over and you might notice when you miss lcancels more



as for the control stick jump thing, i think whatever is easy for u is fine, but someone else might say its suboptimal... idk i wouldnt worry too much about that

Using the control stick to wavedash will wear your stick out (substantially) faster, but in general people who use control stick to jump end up with better character control and more reliable tilt abilities. If you were a fox player, you would be rebuked for up-to-jump, because you can't get the shortest shorthop from it. On jiggs it's inconsequential.

Also, you don't really need to worry about L-cancelling bair most of the time, fair definitely, but you shouldn't be grounding that with any frequency. Nair seems to be at its best autocancelled, leaving dair as the sole aerial that really needs to be L-cancelled, and it's tough for many people to do reliably.

Something really easy to do when you land vs. taller characters is to just duck. Falcon, 'Dorf, Sheik, and Marth will all wiff JC or standing grabs if you're ducking.

Thanks for the help guys! I've been practicing the stuff since I posted and it already seems like I'm getting better at reading my opponent as well as getting out of harms way when I have to land. Thanks Massive for the lowdown on puff's aerials.

Usually I only fair when I'm off the stage or going for a mixup, I tend to stick to Nairs, Bairs, and Uairs most of the time.