3DS Community Patch Notes v1.0.4 -- Engine Changes to DI

[Thinkaman]

Sonic u-smash did 78 kb on 0% mario and killed in training at 110% in 1.0.4.

It did 75 and killed at 117% in 1.0.3.

Why was this buffed?!?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

AA (1.0.3): Rosalina no Luma usmash against Training mode Mario kills at 121%

Me (1.0.4): Rosalina no Luma usmash against Training mode Mario kills at 137%

I heard mario weight was buffed

 

[SamuraiPanda]

Depressing.

Not all-inclusive

 

[Terotrous]

I heard mario weight was buffed

That would make almost all of our testing data useless since we were using Mario to test.

If Thinkaman's KB numbers are right though it looks like it's the same.

 

[Black Mantis]

 

[Thinkaman]

I heard mario weight was buffed

I get the same kill %s on the majority of moves tested, using Mario.

Sonic f-smash and d-smash unchanged in knockback.

 

[Terotrous]

Shirt too strong, must nerf.

 

[Flamecircle]

About one-inch-punch: isn't it escapable with downward DI? I'll agree that it's a ridiculously powerful and centralizing move, otherwise though.

Mario's weight probably isn't buffed, or else people would, across the board, be complaining that their moves were nerfed in knockback.

 

[Thinkaman]

Red Olimar f-smash knockback buffed from 36 to 44 on 0% Mario.

 

[Strawhat64]

Falcon's Raptor Boost no longer kills at 120%. It now kills at 140%
and I felt like there no lag on his nair.

 

[ZombieBran]

Not all-inclusive

Oh I know. But it's a good indication of where they're going to go with Zelda in future patches.

 

[TheZage]

Guys just so you know you can freely test the old version. Just delete your update data to remove the patch from your SD card then load up the game. It will ask you to update. Just say no and tell the system you wish to play without saving any data. You will lose everything that you had to unlock but not permanently. Once you are done testing you must re-download the patch and everything you unlocked will still be there.

So I tested the d-throw combos and yeah I guess we were wrong. You CAN combo d-throw in the old versions with Marth. d-throw uair works same as in the patch. I guess that whole month of playing on 3DS made it more consistent for me.

can you examine any changes to his tipper. Im playing patch 1.04 and there is some noticable disjoint. You don't even have to really connect a fsmash to tipper. Has it always been like this?

 

[Tagxy]

I am pretty mad about this. It was like the most uninformed changes I have ever seen. It seems like they based their decisions entirely off of forum whining and not off of actual competitive game play.

I'm not mad at the nerfs to Sheik directly but I am mad about them removing mechanics like DACUS and edge cancel bouncing fish, why would they remove the stuff that actually makes you put time into the character. Lets make her easier to use....

It's funny I jokingly told my friend when he mentioned the bouncing fish nerf, that they probably nerfed bowsercide......... and then he told me they did and i died laughing. Literally catering to the casual player with every change............

Glitches are bad

When people ask that glitches remain in the game, theyre essentially asking that the game be balanced around jank which in turn can create more jank. Remove the glitches, see where the game lands, balance accordingly.

The scrubbery level of these changes is so ridiculous. I feel like the nerf to bowsercide is the most irrefutable evidence possible. Evidence that strong may have been capable of banning MK in Brawl (probably not tho lets be real).

Highly doubt it was balanced around casual play or Mac wouldve been nerfed into the ground. Sakurai said as much in an interview as well I believe. Im not going to agree with everything but people are reading too far into things, lol

 

[Thinkaman]

Olimar u-smash, d-smash, and bowser f-smash confirmed unchanged knockback.

 

[NairWizard]

Sonic u-smash did 78 kb on 0% mario and killed in training at 110% in 1.0.4.

It did 75 and killed at 117% in 1.0.3.

Why was this buffed?!?

Sonic was *buffed*? Someone must have been smoking something awful strong

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Oh I know. But it's a good indication of where they're going to go with Zelda in future patches.

You think she needed more changes? I'm curious on this.

Though I lol at, "we buffed hr Utilt to do 1% more!" Was it necessary?

 

[Tagxy]

Testing weights may have been a better first step in retrospect. Hope Marios is actually the same or some of our data is screwed.

 

[Thinkaman]

Sonic was *buffed*? Someone must have been smoking something awful strong

There are reports that a lot of his stuff is less safe now, longer cooldowns. It's hard to confirm things like that though.

Testing weights may have been a better first step in retrospect. Hope Marios is actually the same or all our data is screwed.

Mario's weight is the same.

 

[erico9001]

Shulk's knockback changes (150% Mario, all controlled for sweetspots (except maybe back slash)).
1.03->1.04

DSmash - 194->205 (up close)
FSmash - 215->223 (no tilt, up close, both hits)
USmash - 201-208 (both hits, Mario is already slightly above me)
<All Smashes are fully charged>

Ftilt - 136->134 (blade, up close)
Utilt - 115->122
Dtilt - 105->112 (about where the beam starts)

Bthrow - 104->104
Fthrow - 98->99
DThrow - 111->112
Uthrow - 83->83

Nair - 95->103 (used while practically inside Mario)
Fair - 102->110 (used very close to Mario)
Bair - 131->139 (where the blade ends and beam starts)
U-air - 131->139 (both hitboxes)
Dair - 117->124 (both hitboxes, no spike.)
Dair (Spike hitbox only) - 94->102

Back slash - no change in knockback from front
From the back 160->170? (I believe...? testing this from behind is difficult. Iffy.)

Air Slash (up-B) knockback - 137->138

Vision (counter) - Not going to attempt

Monado Arts - For later testing

Summary:
Most of Shulk's moves have an increase of 7 or 8. Notable differences:
-The throws are not at all or hardly at all changed in knockback.
-Ftilt has a slight knockback decrease
-Air-Slash is barely increased
​

I could use some help testing back slash's knockback from behind.

edit: Dash attack is 126->132

 

[Thinkaman]

Did we actually have confirmation that Diddy is unchanged?

 

[SonicZeroX]

Falcon and Samus' utilts now cause them to move forward a bit. Same with Falcon's dtilt.

Also Dedede was nerfed? What ever happened to "Dedede is already perfect" Sakurai?

 

[TheZage]

can anyone confirm or deny whether or not the boundaries have shrunk. It sure feels like they did.

 

[GameAngel64]

You think she needed more changes? I'm curious on this.

Though I lol at, "we buffed hr Utilt to do 1% more!" Was it necessary?

Biggest change I would like to see: Din's Fire no longer puts her into helpless mode...

 

[Thinkaman]

Also Dedede was nerfed? What even happened to "Dedede is already perfect" Sakurai?

Details? All I heard was an unconfirmed report of a fair nerf, and a d-throw change that might be a buff.

can anyone confirm or deny whether or not the boundaries have shrunk. It sure feels like they did.

Doesn't seem like it.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Shulk's knockback changes (150% Mario, all controlled for sweetspots (except maybe back slash)).
1.03->1.04

DSmash - 194->205 (up close)
FSmash - 215->223 (no tilt, up close, both hits)
USmash - 201-208 (both hits, Mario is already slightly above me)
<All Smashes are fully charged>

Ftilt - 136->134 (blade, up close)
Utilt - 115->122
Dtilt - 105->112 (about where the beam starts)

Bthrow - 104->104
Fthrow - 98->99
DThrow - 111->112
Uthrow - 83->83

Nair - 95->103 (used while practically inside Mario)
Fair - 102->110 (used very close to Mario)
Bair - 131->139 (where the blade ends and beam starts)
U-air - 131->139 (both hitboxes)
Dair - 117->124 (both hitboxes, no spike.)
Dair (Spike hitbox only) - 94->102

Back slash - no change in knockback from front
From the back 160->170? (I believe...? testing this from behind is difficult. Iffy.)

Air Slash (up-B) knockback - 137->138

Vision (counter) - Not going to attempt

Monado Arts - For later testing

Summary:
Most of Shulk's moves have an increase of 7 or 8. Notable differences:
-The throws are not at all or hardly at all changed in knockback.
-Ftilt has a slight knockback decrease
-Air-Slash is barely increased
​

I could use some help testing back slash's knockback from behind.

You do realise that's a byproduct of the damage dealt increase yeah?

 

[ZombieBran]

You think she needed more changes? I'm curious on this.

Ohoho yes. I'm firmly of the opinion that she is high Low Tier at most.
But I'm guessing you disagree?

 

[erico9001]

You do realise that's a byproduct of the damage dealt increase yeah?

Of course, but it's worth testing anyways due to outliers.
edit: (throws, ftilt, and air slash)

 

[NotLiquid]

There are reports that a lot of his stuff is less safe now, longer cooldowns. It's hard to confirm things like that though.

Cooldown on Sonic has been proven false. His moves function the same. VivaReverie tested this earlier today and I've tried it out as well.

 

[NairWizard]

Cooldown on Sonic has been proven false. His moves function the same. VivaReverie tested this earlier today and I've tried it out as well.

Which means that Sonic was strictly buffed.

 

[Zinoto]

They did remove popgun hit stun cancel.

 

[T4ylor]

Details? All I heard was an unconfirmed report of a fair nerf, and a d-throw change that might be a buff.



Doesn't seem like it.

D3's Gordos were nerfed. Even 1% attacks send em back now (edit: apparently some do*). D throw change is a nerf coz you could combo with it til higher %s and you also lose a good way to deal damage and knock em off stage. F air was nerfed yeh

 

[ParanoidDrone]

While Luma Recall is faster now, he cannot attack during the recall like he used to be until he is VERY close to Rosalina.

I think that's because Rosalina is still stuck in her "return to me" animation for the same amount of time while Luma covers that much more distance in the process.

 

[Tomas Fer]

For all intents and purposes, we have to take 1.0.4 as 1.0.0.

It's the first official Smash Wii U build; meaning it's perfectly normal and understandable that we get so many changes in this patch.
I don't expect upcoming patches to be as significant as this one (minus the extra character ones).

Not really; both need to still be treated has different games.

 

[Conda]

I'm at school and couldn't play the new patch yet, but if this ver is the same as Wii U, then

- Item Cancelling removed. No more airdogde zair->bomb cancel
- Laggier grab. No longer 64 link grab, is now Brawl style grab. RIP

will check more when I get back from school

If he still has the selection between short fuse bombs and normal bombs (both awesome) and normal arrows and fire arrows (both good), then he'll still be great

 

[xOmniSoul]

I'm not really worried if ATs and glitches get swept out. If they do, they do. If they don't then well, they don't. The good players are going to win either way with or without them. If anything those things add minor depth to a playstyle. Marvel had it, they got rid of it, still crazy played. Street fighter had some, they got rid of them, still played a lot. I think people really like the big ATs and glitches because not everyone can nail them down as great. So if you can do it better than the other, you have the advantage and I think that's what people really like now.

 

[Chimera]

D3's Gordos were nerfed. Even 1% attacks send em back now.

Not new.

D throw change is a nerf coz you could combo with it til higher %s and you also lose a good way to deal damage and knock em off stage.

Lol no.

F air was nerfed yeh

I can't seem to notice much difference in the move.

 

[Ryusuta]

Biggest change I would like to see: Din's Fire no longer puts her into helpless mode...

SERIOUSLY. This.

 

[MrGame&Rock]

Are there any changes that further separate Pit from Dark Pit?

Also, if you will permit, a complaint about Bowser's flying slam change. It would have been better to have it force sudden death instead of having Bowser lose. In FG I was using it to rack up damage, but since my opponent had less % than I did, he was able to force me to bowsercide and win the match. It was infuriating. I wanted to find him and punch him in the gut

 

[T4ylor]

Not new. Lol no. I can't seem to notice much difference in the move.

D throw was more consistent before. Spose you can make a case that it's just as good but I prefer the old one. F air does less % now and has decreased knockback

also more moves send Gordos back. This is confirmed zzz

 

[Crescent_Sun]

Falcon and Samus' utilts now cause them to move forward a bit. Same with Falcon's dtilt.

Also Dedede was nerfed? What ever happened to "Dedede is already perfect" Sakurai?

Dedede is going to transcend perfection. Dedede hopes to become god.