Zero Suit Samus Questions & Answers

[Nixernator]

Falco, he just makes you rage quit basically =P.

Is a well spaced Nair > Jab unpunishable against Lolimar?
Also does Uair beat Lucarios Dair.

 

[Roxas1988]

Falco, he just makes you rage quit basically =P.

Is a well spaced Nair > Jab unpunishable against Lolimar?
Also does Uair beat Lucarios Dair.

I would think lucario's would just because his dair would hit your hurtbox first. But then again i wouldnt know without testing it.

 

[solecalibur]

I would think lucario's would just because his dair would hit your hurtbox first. But then again i wouldnt know without testing it.

I have some Uairs before he can spawn his down air since most lucarios I vs just spam it when Im below them so I just space and time correctly

 

[mountain_tiger]

Luigi can be annoying but isn't as bad as Falco.

Hint the falco boards laugh at us because we think the matchup is worse than it is... supposedly.

Ban Final Destination and pick Battlefield. Need I say more?

 

[Nefarious B]

Is a well spaced Nair > Jab unpunishable against Lolimar?

Not unless you're jabbing him from behind. Crossovers are really good against olimar but if you get predictable you're going to eat an usmash or pivot grab every time...

 

[CRASHiC]

What attacks of ours outrange Olimar's Pivot grab?
How can I prevent Pikachu from approaching reliably?
What is the general approach to destroying Nana?

 

[ph00tbag]

What attacks of ours outrange Olimar's Pivot grab?

Plasma Whip? Nothing, really. Unless he's pivot grabbing with a purple a bad Olimar.

How can I prevent Pikachu from approaching reliably?

Well, if the Pikachu is dumb and is going in the air, nair and uair shut him down pretty well. If he's smart and using his shield, mixing grabs into your game can help, but I wouldn't call it reliable.

What is the general approach to destroying Nana?

As a more general, non-character specific rule, everything that I've seen tells me you should focus on Popo unless there is absolutely nothing stopping you from hitting Nana. Threaten Nana, but only with the end of getting Popo to reveal an opening. Hit Nana only to keep her away from Popo while you're trying to edgeguard him.

As far as getting the IC's separated, I'm not sure. I think Paralyzer will only ever hit one of them, which can cause them to desync unintentionally, so you might try that.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Plasma Whip? Nothing, really. Unless he's pivot grabbing with a purple a bad Olimar.

True, but you can get him by jumping over it with plasma whip anyway.

and neutral B! :o

BTW, can we flipjump footstool over pikmanz?

Well, if the Pikachu is dumb and is going in the air, nair and uair shut him down pretty well. If he's smart and using his shield, mixing grabs into your game can help, but I wouldn't call it reliable.

If pikachu is approaching you he's probably not that great a camper, or just plain bad.
retreating rar jumps often lure them out of shield, on which you can bair them, else just tipper bair the shield for super safety.

As a more general, non-character specific rule, everything that I've seen tells me you should focus on Popo unless there is absolutely nothing stopping you from hitting Nana. Threaten Nana, but only with the end of getting Popo to reveal an opening. Hit Nana only to keep her away from Popo while you're trying to edgeguard him.

As far as getting the IC's separated, I'm not sure. I think Paralyzer will only ever hit one of them, which can cause them to desync unintentionally, so you might try that.

Don't use paralyzer, it's too laggy.

 

[noradseven]

True, but you can get him by jumping over it with plasma whip anyway.

and neutral B! :o

BTW, can we flipjump footstool over pikmanz?


If pikachu is approaching you he's probably not that great a camper, or just plain bad.
retreating rar jumps often lure them out of shield, on which you can bair them, else just tipper bair the shield for super safety.



Don't use paralyzer, it's too laggy.

Yeah pikachu player here runs away camping with Thunder shocks high and if I try to punish with aireal game he will 8(special),1,3,j. **** now he is below me.

Thank god u-air is tricky to quick attack around, but unfortunatly its f-air that crush's thundershock spam. Also if you can't DI out of d-smash you will be incred-a-dead against pika. Most though watch out for his n-air and d-air, n-air is like MKs, and his d-air has mad priority.

 

[Nefarious B]

I find paralyzer way too risky against the climbers, I'd say it's a pretty bad idea to use it in just about every situation. I like dsmash much better in this matchup.

My general strategy against ICs is juggle nana while taking advantage of popo's desperate attempts to get you off his girl by knocking him away. Use nana juggles as bait essentially, then abuse popo's terrible speed.

You can flip jump off pikmin, I've never tried using it in my game though... hmmm. I've been considering trying out the flipstool as an approach against Diddy and Snake, I can't really tell how useful it'd be though. You have to be careful about getting knocked off stage if you use it this way though.

 

[solecalibur]

BTW, can we flipjump footstool over pikmanz?

I wana say we can if Olimar makes it so your able to hit them

 

[Nefarious B]

Pikmin toss is a physical object so yes you can footstool them. The question is more is it useful? Down b flipstool gets us moving really fast, and can be canceled at any time (although it is super predictable). I'm starting to like the idea of using it as a mixup approach while onstage.

 

[noradseven]

And yeah for IC just juggle the **** out of nana and punish popo when he tries to punish u-air is way too good in this match.

Pikmin toss is a physical object so yes you can footstool them. The question is more is it useful? Down b flipstool gets us moving really fast, and can be canceled at any time (although it is super predictable). I'm starting to like the idea of using it as a mixup approach while onstage.

Its not really though it can let you live if they start trying to toss them off the edge to stop your recovery.

 

[★Malik★™]

I find paralyzer way too risky against the climbers.

or grabbing. and when you do grab one. nana/popo can be controlled to attack.



note to self-- "never grab against the IC's"

 

[noradseven]

or grabbing. and when you do grab one. nana/popo can be controlled to attack.



note to self-- "never grab against the IC's"

immediatly toss and your normally safe but with ZSS a whiffed grab is a free infinite for them, sooo..

 

[Darky-Sama]

Ice Climbers are just a pain in general. I always abuse the flip jump and try to mindgame there on where I'm going to land.

Flip Jump + Second Jump can help punish accordingly. Playing it safe with the Flip Jump, Plasma Whip (side+B), downsmash and neutral+B are really the best options until you can get them desynced. :/

 

[Roxas1988]

I love the ice climbers but fighting them is one of the most annoying things ever. Desynching makes it two one automatically and the CG ugh. I still love em though.

 

[solecalibur]

or grabbing. and when you do grab one. nana/popo can be controlled to attack.



note to self-- "never grab against the IC's"

If you grab popo and nana is running towards him just hit popo everytime shes close and she flinches back a good IC player would command Nana to throw neutral B
Also note to self never let your guard down after popo is gone but nana isnt
Nana F-smashed me recently while popo was "flying" about to die and I died first and lost the match

 

[Roxas1988]

And now i ask what approach should we have against ice climbers?

 

[Darky-Sama]

Stay as aerial as possible; keep your distance and try to space yourself with side+B as much as possible until you can get them desynced long enough to punish. If they get too close to you, I would use a flip jump to avoid getting grabbed.

It's a stupid match-up, but ZSS's flip jump is one of the few things that she has to prevent them from grabbing her. So why not abuse it as much as possible and make them struggle to get you locked? Personally, the way I see it, since they're going to just attempt to grab spam and throw you back and forth, why not use whatever tools YOU have to spam as well, just to get them away from each other.

Once they're apart, go in for punishing.

 

[Roxas1988]

Stay as aerial as possible; keep your distance and try to space yourself with side+B as much as possible until you can get them desynced long enough to punish. If they get too close to you, I would use a flip jump to avoid getting grabbed.

It's a stupid match-up, but ZSS's flip jump is one of the few things that she has to prevent them from grabbing her. So why not abuse it as much as possible and make them struggle to get you locked? Personally, the way I see it, since they're going to just attempt to grab spam and throw you back and forth, why not use whatever tools YOU have to spam as well, just to get them away from each other.

Once they're apart, go in for punishing.

Nice and would the dash attack werk well, or should i def stay away?

 

[Darky-Sama]

The dash attack is 'okay', but she can easily be shield grabbed and locked if they're both close to each other. Flip Jump, Neutral+B and Side+B are your main life savers in this match-up. Slowly pick off small amounts of damage until you're able to desync them.

The good thing about the flip jump, is even if they DO predict it, if you're playing the keep away game, you'll still have a second jump to punish them for trying to predict you. If they realize they can't grab you normally, they'll most likely attempt to rush you with a short hop down+B (Blizzard), one of their more favorable ways of going in to punish opponents that they have trouble grabbing. You can easily space yourself away from this and punish them for it.

 

[Roxas1988]

Thanks darky and also i've seen a big weakness in the IC against sammy and thats the fact that their space game is no match for Zss at ALL. But they do have the CG of death thats my main concern.

 

[Darky-Sama]

The chaingrab is everyone's main concern. Aside from that, the only other thing to look out for it their down smash. Albeit ZSS has amazing mobility and range, that makes things much more difficult for the Ice Climbers.

Also, if you do get them offstage, Down+B ***** their recovery since Popo doesn't gain invincibility frames until a second later than Nana. This leaves a perfect opportunity for Zero Suit Samus to either Spike, or stage spike Popo. Nine times out of ten, that will guarantee a stock off them.

 

[ph00tbag]

I still think that, more than anything, your prime target should be Popo. Yes, Nana makes the CGs possible, but she can't mind game you, and she only punishes you for hitting Popo some of the time, where as a smart IC will always use Nana as bait for smash attacks if they get separated. So focus on Popo, because he's the brains of the outfit.

One trick I've seen used to good effect is to pretend to chase Nana, and when Popo tries to punish, avoid the punish and just hit him instead.

 

[Roxas1988]

Is it true with the down b you can footstool almost anything in the game like certain projectiles?

 

[mountain_tiger]

Is it true with the down b you can footstool almost anything in the game like certain projectiles?

Yes. You can flipstool any character, Snake's grenades, Diddy's bananas and I think Olimar's Pikmin. Very useful when people are trying to edgehog you.

 

[Roxas1988]

Yes. You can flipstool any character, Snake's grenades, Diddy's bananas and I think Olimar's Pikmin. Very useful when people are trying to edgehog you.

That is effin epic oh wow can that actually help in recovering then?

 

[noradseven]

Yes. You can flipstool any character, Snake's grenades, Diddy's bananas and I think Olimar's Pikmin. Very useful when people are trying to edgehog you.

and peach's turnips :D.

 

[mountain_tiger]

and peach's turnips :D.

Oh yeah, them too.

That is effin epic oh wow can that actually help in recovering then?

You can flipstool opponents hanging on the ledge, even if they have invincibility frames.

 

[ph00tbag]

You can flipstool off the trophies in the background in All-Star and Boss Battles, as well.

Anything except for energy hitboxes, really. You also can't flipstool off of C4, which is disappointing.

 

[Roxas1988]

You can flipstool off the trophies in the background in All-Star and Boss Battles, as well.

Anything except for energy hitboxes, really. You also can't flipstool off of C4, which is disappointing.

That wouldve been so amazing if you could the possibilities would've been endless. And the range you can grab the edge with her tether recovery is mind boggling. I've been spiked before and still grabbed the ledge from death lol.

 

[DeliciousCake]

Anything except for energy hitboxes, really. You also can't flipstool off of C4, which is disappointing.

You can, however, place a butterfly C4 on Samus' ***. It's very enjoyable in teams.

 

[Nefarious B]

One trick I've seen used to good effect is to pretend to chase Nana, and when Popo tries to punish, avoid the punish and just hit him instead.

This is exactly how I do it actually. Normally, when you bust them up and chase nana, you're going to be uair juggling her endlessly, and popo will try to punish by getting under you and hitting you with his uair. That is literally his only real option because otherwise you can juggle him all day with uair.

Knowing he's going to chase you, feint a uair on nana while he tries to come in on you, and move to his side and bair/fair him. It's stupidly easy because the climbers' manuverability is so terrible it means that once you break them up and have nana in that juggle you should really only -not- get the stock if you mess up and let popo hit you.

This is why ICs have been one of my favorite matchups so far (only played friendlies though), because you feel so in control during those times, and yet you also know that one mistake can set you back to even.

Also, oh **** cake sighting? How's BB treatin ya big guy?

 

[noradseven]

This is exactly how I do it actually. Normally, when you bust them up and chase nana, you're going to be uair juggling her endlessly, and popo will try to punish by getting under you and hitting you with his uair. That is literally his only real option because otherwise you can juggle him all day with uair.

Knowing he's going to chase you, feint a uair on nana while he tries to come in on you, and move to his side and bair/fair him. It's stupidly easy because the climbers' manuverability is so terrible it means that once you break them up and have nana in that juggle you should really only -not- get the stock if you mess up and let popo hit you.

This is why ICs have been one of my favorite matchups so far (only played friendlies though), because you feel so in control during those times, and yet you also know that one mistake can set you back to even.

Also, oh **** cake sighting? How's BB treatin ya big guy?

he should tell me his xbox account so I can show him the power of science!

 

[DeliciousCake]

Also, oh **** cake sighting? How's BB treatin ya big guy?

Getting out of the fighter scene, getting serious into League of Legends, a game that I have infinite skill at.

he should tell me his xbox account so I can show him the power of science!

My 360 hasn't been hooked up for months.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Getting out of the fighter scene, getting serious into League of Legends, a game that I have infinite skill at.


My 360 hasn't been hooked up for months.

Whats your LoL tag? I'm imabike, kinda new, transitioning from dota. add me.


Go anivia : D

 

[Roxas1988]

Ok quick question is it better to approach with the dash attack or a more spaced out move?

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Ok quick question is it better to approach with the dash attack or a more spaced out move?

DA is a punisher as it's to punishable to use to approach.

 

[Darky-Sama]

It depends on the match-up really. I would only use dash attack to either punish or follow-up. Since you can lock most characters with it, it's not really a bad approach.