Zelda Matchup Thread // OUTDATED

[hippiedude92]

Zelda will have abit ease on flat stages if she camps but it wont prove a huge problem maybe just a little like a nose hair, like FD smashville. Lylat cruise is kinda weird, luigi can crawl when the stage tilts to avoid some attacks but it screws up his and hers recovery so idk.

- Jungle japes. Everyone hates this stage. I think Zelda has like 3 ko vertical moves?(utilt,upair,upsmash) She can partially camp on both end of the platforms with din's fire since luigi's tornado approachs. Luigi can survive as long he isn't knocked down to the water when hes on the left platform. Luigi has Nair, shoryuken, upsmash, up angled Fsmash, and occasionally utilt for vertical kos. Basically luigi has to zone the whole middle platform and combo the living crap outta here unless she resets the situation and controls both left and right platforms. I'm not really sure but I'd give it a 50-50 or a 55:45 in luigi's favor just random guess.

- Like every other luigi main, they find Corneia their favorite stage. Why? Pretty obvious reasons, earlier vertical kos (15% shoryuken kills much earlier here) And alot of luigi mains will LOVE to camp the fin here.
If he misses a shoryuken he can end the lag by auto sweetspot the edge. All it takes a is a DAir nair and a couple of utilts then a OOS shoryuken. Of course Zelda does have a few excellling stuff here like ko options and ****, and I think? you can dtilt wall lock him here idk. Not sure.

- Personally I think Zelda would excel in Luigi's mansion espically wit the pillars. But eh.

- Rainbow cruise. Usually this stage theres always good and bad for luigi. The good is that, it'll be forced to aerial game majority of the time, and is moving and can gimp zelda. The bad?, well he is the 2nd slowest moving aerial mobility character in the game, he can get gimped like vice versa. I'd give it a 50-50 on RC as well but meh =/

 

[SwastikaPyle]

Dunno, over the past couple months i've gone from thinking Zelda had a decent-sized advantage on Weegee....to thinking that it might be in his favor.

Thank you.

Also, Wigi's recovery can be 'predicted' quite easily but it's still a huge gamble to attempt to gimp him.

1. A lot of Wigi's like to green missile their way to the side. The bad news is that like 1 in 4 attempts to do this will cause him to Missfire which is ******** strong. The good news is that your Din's will clank and stop it regardless.

2. Rising tornado. Do not even think about using a dair on this unless you are absolutely certain you can hit, because if it strikes Zelda she will get knocked offstage at an absolutely horrible angle. Wigi eats Zelda for breakfast the moment she goes offstage.


Also, he has better out of shield options (and his upsmash has more range and kills sooner than hers). The match is even until it goes to the air or until Wigi gets inside, which he can usually do with his tornado.

Most Wigis abandon SH approaches after they realize it won't work...sooooo Dtilt and dsmash to the rescue.

I would put it about 55:45 Wigi, 60:40 his favor on a stage with multiple platforms.

 

[Villi]

- Jungle japes. Everyone hates this stage. I think Zelda has like 3 ko vertical moves?(utilt,upair,upsmash) She can partially camp on both end of the platforms with din's fire since luigi's tornado approachs. Luigi can survive as long he isn't knocked down to the water when hes on the left platform. Luigi has Nair, shoryuken, upsmash, up angled Fsmash, and occasionally utilt for vertical kos. Basically luigi has to zone the whole middle platform and combo the living crap outta here unless she resets the situation and controls both left and right platforms. I'm not really sure but I'd give it a 50-50 or a 55:45 in luigi's favor just random guess.

How does Luigi zone Zelda on the middle platform? From my experience, side platforms are where people go to die, not win the match. The center area with the big ol platform right in the middle of it is perfect for Zelda.

 

[hippiedude92]

No I'm saying HE needs to zone the middle platform. Zelda has far better stage control compared to luigi's. Personally this stage is gay from experience.. and hardly benefits most characters cept peach and falco lol.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Thank you.
2. Rising tornado. Do not even think about using a dair on this unless you are absolutely certain you can hit, because if it strikes Zelda she will get knocked offstage at an absolutely horrible angle. Wigi eats Zelda for breakfast the moment she goes offstage.

that's not even hard to do. it might not be a certain thing that she'll get the sweetspot, but Luigi's tornado has NO range above him, so, assuming zelda is on top, he can't do boo about her dair. he just best hope his Down+B doesn't get predicted.

Also, he has better out of shield options (and his upsmash has more range and kills sooner than hers). The match is even until it goes to the air or until Wigi gets inside, which he can usually do with his tornado.

I call false. His upsmash might kill zelda before zelda's would kill him because of decay and all that, but Zelda's has as much range. it certainly has a lot more vertical range and the horizontal range can't be too far off. Luigi actually has horrible OoS options because of how much he slides if you hit his sheild. he also doesn't have OoS lightning kick... which kills hard. And the matchup is hardly even until luigi gets inside. Zelda has a pretty clear advantage at this point in time before luigi gets inside because she just outranges/prioritizes him

I would put it about 55:45 Wigi, 60:40 his favor on a stage with multiple platforms.

60:40 seems excessive... especially since most luigi's see it as OUR advantage and most of us see it as pretty even

 

[LuigiKing]

I've argued this to death, and I still think this is Zelda's advantage. It isn't nearly as big of an advantage as I once thought, but its still 60:40 Zelda I think. Now a Luigi who doesn't know the matchup is going to get destroyed, I'll tell you that... And the stage plays a huge roll in this one.

 

[-Mars-]

I've argued this to death, and I still think this is Zelda's advantage. It isn't nearly as big of an advantage as I once thought, but its still 60:40 Zelda I think. Now a Luigi who doesn't know the matchup is going to get destroyed, I'll tell you that... And the stage plays a huge roll in this one.

You know it might possibly be, on the reverse side a Zelda who doesn't understand the matchup is also going to be destroyed.

I just feel like Luigi baits Zelda really well, baiting usmashes with Luigi is fairly easy. I need to test whether or not jabs will stop his SH approaches. His pressure game and juggles are very effective on Zelda and they can leave her desperate for space.

Plus you always have the threat of an jab-up b or an up angled fsmash. I really haven't set my mind on a ratio. I could see it being anywhere from Luigi's advantage, to neutral, to Zelda's advantage.

 

[hippiedude92]

I call false. His upsmash might kill zelda before zelda's would kill him because of decay and all that, but Zelda's has as much range. it certainly has a lot more vertical range and the horizontal range can't be too far off. Luigi actually has horrible OoS options because of how much he slides if you hit his sheild. he also doesn't have OoS lightning kick... which kills hard. And the matchup is hardly even until luigi gets inside. Zelda has a pretty clear advantage at this point in time before luigi gets inside because she just outranges/prioritizes him

60:40 seems excessive... especially since most luigi's see it as OUR advantage and most of us see it as pretty even

Nope. Just nope. Luigi's Upsmash has huge lingering hitbox espically from behind. He will be only sliding depending on the knockback of your moves. Also if the luigi is good at powershielding, this problem won't pose much of a threat. Luigi doesn't have to approach. He can't be outcamped by din's fire. Potentially, he can force Zelda to approach. It should be a campfest, so whoever approachs will take a beating.

that's not even hard to do. it might not be a certain thing that she'll get the sweetspot, but Luigi's tornado has NO range above him, so, assuming zelda is on top, he can't do boo about her dair. he just best hope his Down+B doesn't get predicted.

The only time you'll be able to do this is if the luigi is completely knocked off at a angle from a assuming a dsmash, and is directly below you and is forced to use it. Most luigi's will always do their best to slightly hit you off on the side of the tornado. And as Sp, said before, if your hit, you'll be sent in a bad angle to recover. So it's a 50/50 gamble. Don't make it sound it's godsend easy.

50-50 would make me happy. 55:45 if you guys wanna be biased. probably stage decides it all.

 

[Voyeur]

Luigi I think is pretty simple to camp all together and gimp. (oh woah first post on Zelda forums)
Is the option of bringing in Sheik to the match up not ever for discussion, because needles take care of Luigi until they decide to come in for some Chain play.

It would seem though Zelda can easily win the ranged game but in once the gap has been filled, with out proper spacing, Luigi will dominate with those Aerials. 50/50 and chalk it up to Skill or CP level with that 5% leaning in on those inputs.

p.s.: the description of Sheik in the match up, it's completely the most asinine thing I've ever seen written about her.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Nope. Just nope. Luigi's Upsmash has huge lingering hitbox espically from behind. He will be only sliding depending on the knockback of your moves. Also if the luigi is good at powershielding, this problem won't pose much of a threat. Luigi doesn't have to approach. He can't be outcamped by din's fire. Potentially, he can force Zelda to approach. It should be a campfest, so whoever approachs will take a beating.

yes, this may be true... but zelda's Usmash has a hitbox that lingers a hell of a lot longer, is taller, has at least as much range in front and is only, really, shorter in the back... plus it comes out faster, has at least as much priority and has good killing power. not to belittle luigi's good Usmash, but it's not zelda's.

The only time you'll be able to do this is if the luigi is completely knocked off at a angle from a assuming a dsmash, and is directly below you and is forced to use it. Most luigi's will always do their best to slightly hit you off on the side of the tornado. And as Sp, said before, if your hit, you'll be sent in a bad angle to recover. So it's a 50/50 gamble. Don't make it sound it's godsend easy.

no. I never suggested it'd be easy to get him in a place where he HAS to use that to recover... but if he does... it IS easy to spike.

50-50 would make me happy. 55:45 if you guys wanna be biased. probably stage decides it all.

50:50-55:45 either way would make me happy at this point.

 

[hippiedude92]

Luigi I think is pretty simple to camp all together and gimp. (oh woah first post on Zelda forums)
Is the option of bringing in Sheik to the match up not ever for discussion, because needles take care of Luigi until they decide to come in for some Chain play.

It would seem though Zelda can easily win the ranged game but in once the gap has been filled, with out proper spacing, Luigi will dominate with those Aerials. 50/50 and chalk it up to Skill or CP level with that 5% leaning in on those inputs.

p.s.: the description of Sheik in the match up, it's completely the most asinine thing I've ever seen written about her.

Um what? Nair and powershield ***** Din's fire. Luigi isn't simple to camp. Same vice versa. Watch Lk and Sp's matchs. Lk doesn't have much problem in dealing Din's fire,. I was wondering the same with the shiek. But this is zelda's board so meh =/.

yes, this may be true... but zelda's Usmash has a hitbox that lingers a hell of a lot longer, is taller, has at least as much range in front and is only, really, shorter in the back... plus it comes out faster, has at least as much priority and has good killing power. not to belittle luigi's good Usmash, but it's not zelda's.




no. I never suggested it'd be easy to get him in a place where he HAS to use that to recover... but if he does... it IS easy to spike.


50:50-55:45 either way would make me happy at this point.

50-50 is fine with me. 55:45 in either way ONLY with stages. The stage choices seem to make the difference on the outcome.

 

[Voyeur]

Um what? Nair and powershield ***** Din's fire. Luigi isn't simple to camp. Same vice versa. Watch Lk and Sp's matchs. Lk doesn't have much problem in dealing Din's fire,. I was wondering the same with the shiek. But this is zelda's board so meh =/.

You can avoid and not be hit by din's fire all you like, that doesn't mean it will eventually force you to make the advancement, e.g. Pikachu's jolts force most players to make the approach or for the advantage to be taken while said opponent is nullifying the ranged attack with some other follow up.


if this is going to be put down as StZ, then it is 55:45 because not only would Stage make the difference but the option of Sheik showing up is viable.

 

[PolMex23]

K.... I 3 stocked a guy who used shiek for 2 stock an zelda the last at Battlefield within 1min an 10 seconds last kill being 0 to death....

Oh an he got top 20 in a 97 person tourney...so for some reason he was decent...

What Im trying to say is....both can rupture each others spleens...but Luigi does it much faster an consistent...

One mistake from the Zelda player = combo into death range...

At death range,, one mistake = death.

To win with Zelda requires alot of passive aggressive style an accurate punishment...

Uphill battle, Luigi has the advantage 70-30

 

[Voyeur]

that's a completely biased statement there. Basing it off one Sheik/Zelda player, and the very generic and broad statement of "one mistake" can go both ways for anyone character of any roster in any fight, so it really doesn't fit the bill to back up anything. ...overall everything you said is basic stuff on how either player of the entire cast can win a match....

it's definitely not 70-30 though......50:50 pure Zelda to Luigi, 55:45 leaning towards a favorable CP for both characters or if Sheik to Zelda (which is mostly the case in tournament oriented matches)

 

[#HBC | Scary]

D*** Polmex lol! Your filled with so much rage! 70-30?!?!?!? Kind of rough, especially when I kick the tar out of you.

But honestly we run even, with me on the upper hand as of late. BF helps Wigi so much so it may be and actual match at FD.

 

[Kataefi]

I agree with 50-50 ^^. This is a great match to fight!

As for stages - hmmm, I have no idea. I would obviously choose Luigi's Mansion here, but Battlefield seems like a no no for me.

Luigi is very floaty - does this mean he dies better vertically than horizontally? I would take him to corneria here. Then again, he's just as powerful so I'm not too sure.... :/

 

[Voyeur]

I agree with 50-50 ^^. This is a great match to fight!

As for stages - hmmm, I have no idea. I would obviously choose Luigi's Mansion here, but Battlefield seems like a no no for me.

Luigi is very floaty - does this mean he dies better vertically than horizontally? I would take him to corneria here. Then again, he's just as powerful so I'm not too sure.... :/

you probably want to just get the meteor mash on him for a Down KO or that Upsmash. So I think he's easier to kill vertically (up & down) for Zelda.

 

[PolMex23]

Nope, 60-40 ill give yall...65-35 much better

Trust me ed, let me play you again, or in tourney son...Youll get full rage.

I ban FD regardless, as should every ****ing luigi against zelda.

Its not biased if its the truth *****!!!!

 

[Voyeur]

yeah so.........ignore this troll and continue on with the agreement of 50/50
even though Ankoku in our thread says zelda gets 60/40, which I'm sure can go to be based on Skills of RyokoYaksa.

 

[hippiedude92]

You can avoid and not be hit by din's fire all you like, that doesn't mean it will eventually force you to make the advancement, e.g. Pikachu's jolts force most players to make the approach or for the advantage to be taken while said opponent is nullifying the ranged attack with some other follow up.


if this is going to be put down as StZ, then it is 55:45 because not only would Stage make the difference but the option of Sheik showing up is viable.

Hey, Luigi has a projectile too :/ You can avoid and not be hit by fireball all you like, that doesn't mean it will eventually force you to make the advancement. It's a test of patience sir. Oh don't think he can't avoid the din's fire and still throw a fireball. SH Nair to fireball takes care of this.

Campfest makes me go pooop youu =3

that's a completely biased statement there. Basing it off one Sheik/Zelda player, and the very generic and broad statement of "one mistake" can go both ways for anyone character of any roster in any fight, so it really doesn't fit the bill to back up anything. ...overall everything you said is basic stuff on how either player of the entire cast can win a match....

it's definitely not 70-30 though......50:50 pure Zelda to Luigi, 55:45 leaning towards a favorable CP for both characters or if Sheik to Zelda (which is mostly the case in tournament oriented matches)

Don't worry. He's with me smoking mucho weed so don't mind him.

D*** Polmex lol! Your filled with so much rage! 70-30?!?!?!? Kind of rough, especially when I kick the tar out of you.

But honestly we run even, with me on the upper hand as of late. BF helps Wigi so much so it may be and actual match at FD.

Wigi get's bypassed din's fire with ease in BF sorta. But still lol.

Nope, 60-40 ill give yall...65-35 much better

Trust me ed, let me play you again, or in tourney son...Youll get full rage.

I ban FD regardless, as should every ****ing luigi against zelda.

Its not biased if its the truth *****!!!!

LMFAO ROFLMFAO!!!! Holy ****. This is the quote of the day. It's not biased if its the truth ****

Come on Polmex... you know I love you and ****... nohomo... But let me handle it... there's no need for a shoryuken luigi like you to waste energy. on this.. I'll handle it... besides 50-50 makes it nice and just mainly shows both players skill...

yeah so.........ignore this troll and continue on with the agreement of 50/50
even though Ankoku in our thread says zelda gets 60/40, which I'm sure can go to be based on Skills of RyokoYaksa.

Yes just do it lol. BTW, just saying we're only doing this discussion just pure zelda alone (no shiek in between). Just remindin ye.

 

[RoyalBlood]

Have we come to an agreement people?

Start discussing stages in depth please ;3

 

[Kataefi]

I'll put 50-50 on the chart. I like hippie's train of thought ^^ 'shows players skill'.

No smoking on the Zelda boards

Luigiking sounds like he's very experienced to write stuff about this matchup. I'll send him a message.

 

[Brawl4Lyfe]

zelda gets it 55-45 imo

she punishes luigi endlessly

he can get heel'd out of all of his recoveries like no tomorrow

his d.b recovery gets intercepted and wrecked

but he can still pressure, has good d.b movement

on the stage

his up b ***** her worse then DK ***** peach in the first dk game

but overall

she wins cause she's a witch

 

[hippiedude92]

Have we come to an agreement people?

Start discussing stages in depth please ;3

Yeah seems like 50-50. 55:45 in ANYONE'S favor seemily because of the stage. So stage will look like a differnece if we go over this. Btw start from neutrals then CPS because it hurts my head to do all mixed up LOL. Sorry.

I'll put 50-50 on the chart. I like hippie's train of thought ^^ 'shows players skill'.

No smoking on the Zelda boards

Luigiking sounds like he's very experienced to write stuff about this matchup. I'll send him a message.

LOL thanks. What do you mean train of thought for which? About the smoking on Zeldaboards ? or just throwing my 2 cents here? LMAO.

And yes Luigiking and Plye, play each other on daily basis and are tourney wh0res. But they've given their sides and said 60:40 in boths favors LOL. But go ahead and see if they're willing to do it.

zelda gets it 55-45 imo

she punishes luigi endlessly

he can get heel'd out of all of his recoveries like no tomorrow

his d.b recovery gets intercepted and wrecked

but he can still pressure, has good d.b movement

on the stage

his up b ***** her worse then DK ***** peach in the first dk game

but overall

she wins cause she's a witch

Look back on few posts. Then look at your original post =/

 

[LuigiKing]

You know it might possibly be, on the reverse side a Zelda who doesn't understand the matchup is also going to be destroyed.

You know I think this is actually really accurate. I two stocked a pretty good zelda in tourney not too long ago... Swastikapyle said the other zelda was way better than he was, but me and pyle usually go pretty even, and I destroyed this other guy, so it does seem like matchup knowledge is huge in this one.

Nair does go through dins fire, but it is riskier than an air dodge when the dins hitbox gets giant. When you're close, however, nair is really fast and you can bounce around fireballs and bait zelda a lot. Maybe I am leaning towards 50:50 now that I think about it a little more. Luigi really does do a pretty good job of camping zelda as weird as it sounds... because when zelda is forced to approach it usually doesn't end well.

And for the record, you can Dair luigi out of tornado just fine, there isn't a hitbox directly above him.

 

[PolMex23]

Hippie I love you =)

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

from what I can see, Zelda has a slight advantage with just straight up character-to-character and direct playstyle counter considerations.... but, and maybe I'm wrong, luigi can do more to screw zelda over with stage choice than zelda can do to luigi. Take me to a stage that doesn't do anything bad to zelda, like FD, BF, SV, LM, etc, and I expect to have the slight upper hand, but take me to a stage that's gonna give me problems sweetspoeeting the ledge when I recover and luigi suddenly has a more reliable way to kill zelda.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Polmex you crazy man, stop raging lol! I'm gonna have to put you down some more lol.

BF is great because even though Luigi can have a tremendous platform pressure game there, so can Zelda. I generally dislike FD but for this match-up, it can work because the platforms that help Luigi are now gone; although, Zelda loses that as well. Zelda's Mansion is always a great place, especially since it gives you a better chance to live through an UpB.

Zelda shouldn't get hit by jab -> thanks to Nayru's but still be wary of it. Be ready to stay grounded, and avoid the air since Luigi does naughty things in the air. Two aerials per short hop and of course the deadly Nair of his. Just play smart, avoid UpB and everything should be ok.

 

[SwastikaPyle]

Battlefield works much better for Wigi.

1. Almost ALL of Wigi's moves send the opponent vertically. (jab--->grab---->dthrow comes to mind here)

2. When Zelda is on the platform above, she gets ***** hardcore. Wigi can combo her and do more damage in one jump than Zelda could ever dream of doing.

3. Sorry Sonic, his upsmash has a bigger hitbox. Go test it right now if you want. His head stretches behind, up, then in front of him. I still think Zelda's is better because of it's astonishing priority, but the fact is that Wigi's kills sooner.

4. Wigi also shouldn't use Final D (or Pokemon Stadium, which is LuigiKing's favorite but doesn't really work for him) because his best kill moves are all verticals (Nair, Shoryuken, up angle'd fsmash, DI'd bthrow, upsmash). I've never once been killed by Wigi's utilt but I suppose it could happen. Smashville and Battlefield should be his favorite stages.

5. Usually, dairing a Wigi out of his down+b is never going to happen since most Wigi's won't do it from directly below the stage.

Altogether, Wigi can make a lot more mistakes than Zelda in this matchup and get away with it (which is my main criteria for determining the matchup). Wigi wiffs a move at 90%, he's probably going to be okay. Zelda wiffs at move at 50%+, she's dead.

(also for the love of god Kat do not take Wigi to Corneria. This is his dream stage because of how low the ceiling is)

 

[Kataefi]

You sound so melodramatic about it. I'll counterpick something else instead.

 

[PolMex23]

OK, after a day of raging on ed...we came to a agreement...

50/50, stage in the end determines whose favor it is.

There....me being un ****ing biased....jeezz

 

[-Mars-]

Oh by the way, a falling nair from Luigi will beat Zelda's usmash in case there was any question about it.

Look at 1:10- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gc3I...890D8139A&index=3&playnext=4&playnext_from=PL

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Oh by the way, a falling nair from Luigi will beat Zelda's usmash in case there was any question about it.

Look at 1:10- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gc3I...890D8139A&index=3&playnext=4&playnext_from=PL

timing is ridic and payout is normally not worth it though.

 

[hippiedude92]

Wow I lol'd. Luigi's spaced (wow) Nair (his foot sticking out like his Jackie Chan) beat out zelda's upsmash. I lol'd. Kinda swore because luigis nair came out first. But meh either way. Since its weekend im going to guess your gonna conclude luigi pretty soon,

personally i find rainbow cruise a cp against zelda. alot of moving, ground game most of the time shut down and forced to moving air game, not really sweetspots, din's fire is mehish here. I'm seeing it as a 55:45 in luigis favor, no? 50/50 possibly at corniera though i want to lean on luigi because many luigis adore this stage. Hm, lylat 55:45 in zeldas and 55:45 in luigis sound good? thats just my opinon btw.

i just wanted to conclude it soon cuz i know its almost new week

 

[JigglyZelda003]

what does luigi think of halberd?

 

[hippiedude92]

Eh. He does alright. I think zelda will do slightly better IMO. I have bad memories of getting ***** by that claw and lazersz **** lmao. When it doesn't turn the flat stage, when your on the floating stage, alot of bad habits from luigi's will be attacking from below espically with tornado so yeah easy spikes lol. The edges on the flat stage are pretty sexy stage spikes. The middle platform is pretty okay for upair binds and such. alot of room to move around, so mucho fireball/tornado approachs but nothing incrediblely special or anything. 50/50 IMO, but its alot of ground game going on so go ahead and throw it out to zelda really lol.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

normally its not a good stage for Zelda either, i just like going there w/ her (i blame this on Lucas), so i just had to ask about for luigi too. it could be interesting cp a stage both sides kinda fall neutral at. and i agree on RC being more for luigi.

 

[hippiedude92]

so like did this die? lol.

 

[Kataefi]

It often does at times xD I think we've finished luigi now, thanks for coming in to contribute!

 

[JigglyZelda003]

whos next on the list btw since its coming to a close?