X or Y? - PT Social

[Dre89]

Having a secondary is always a good idea no matter who you main

Yeah that's if your goal is solely to win. When you're using a lower tier, winning is not necessarily the primary goal, because you're using a bad char simply because you enjoy that char, and are prepared to have bad matchups so that you can enjoy the char you are using, so the goal moreso becomes doing well for that char's standards.

I guess what I don't get is that people use bad chars, then switch chars for bad MUs, but if you care so much about winning that you're gonna switch chars for competitive purposes, what's the point of using a bad char in the first place? If you care so much about winning that you're gonna change chars for it, why not just main MK, because by that logic, even when you're versing someone that isn't a particularly horrible MU for PT, using MK would still give you a better MU.

I'm not trying to change people's opinions or anything, or imply that you're illogical, it's just to me havign a secondary defeats the purpose of maining a lower tier char in the first place.

 

[Vermy]

I play PT because I enjoy PT.
I play Falco because I enjoy Falco.
I play Diddy because I enjoy Diddy.

I have a pretty mean MK, but I by no means have as much fun than when I'm playing my real mains. If I wanted to "win" then I'd play MK, but if I have a solid chance of beating a bad matchup (65:35 or worse) for PT with Diddy or Falco, hell, I'll take it.

Play to win, or play for fun, it all comes down to each person. If they wanna main PT and second MK, good on them, it's their choice. But if they want to be "loyal" to their character and go 100% PT, then that's fine too. Don't hate the player, hate the game, yo.

Vermy has spoken.

Merry Christmas y'all. <3 Vermy and the inhabitants of Vermy's household.

 

[Zigsta]

Vermy pretty much nailed it.

Speaking of secondaries, who do you guys think I should focus on? I have a pretty good amount of characters I play for fun that I'm pretty good with:

Jigglypuff
Bowser
Wario
Lucario
DK
Mario
Wolf

 

[tankzortz]

i secondary snake.
but i would say lucario zigsta

 

[Magik0722]

Yeah that's if your goal is solely to win. When you're using a lower tier, winning is not necessarily the primary goal, because you're using a bad char simply because you enjoy that char, and are prepared to have bad matchups so that you can enjoy the char you are using, so the goal moreso becomes doing well for that char's standards.

I guess what I don't get is that people use bad chars, then switch chars for bad MUs, but if you care so much about winning that you're gonna switch chars for competitive purposes, what's the point of using a bad char in the first place? If you care so much about winning that you're gonna change chars for it, why not just main MK, because by that logic, even when you're versing someone that isn't a particularly horrible MU for PT, using MK would still give you a better MU.

I'm not trying to change people's opinions or anything, or imply that you're illogical, it's just to me havign a secondary defeats the purpose of maining a lower tier char in the first place.

I play PT, and my goal is to win. Heres the thing you forogt, playing low tier has its advantages as well, because very few people actually know the matchup and you can surprise your opponent. Also I play PT because for some reason he is my best character. Also If people play the way you feel about low tiers, then the secondary you pick up doesnt have to be MK, pick up someone like lucas, samus or some other low tier.

 

[Chuckles_KSU]

I pretty much knew I was going to main PT and second Link, before the game even came out. Just happens that luck wasn't in my favor when the tier lists started cropping up. XD

 

[Vermy]

@Zigsta:
Go Lucario and Wario and you'll never need anyone else to cover PT's back.

Atm, i'm struggling having a decent matchup against Marth with my mains, but most Marths in my area are stupid and fall for Zards bthrow>fair ****, so for now I'm good.


.....unless Shaya comes to visit. ;__;

 

[Zigsta]

I hard 3 stocked my friend's Marth yesterday because she doesn't know how to get out of bthrow to fair. XD

 

[Steeler]

i second ganondorf

no joke

 

[Vermy]

I love it. They get all cocky because its a **** matchup for them, then take a fair and cry like a little girl

Spoiler

in a tiara

That being said, if they vaguely know what they're doing and can space a fair OUT of shield grab range, then we're in trouble.

 

[Shaya]

Backthrow to fair?

**** that ****, just fall fall to some **** uair combo.
Silly Zard, JUMPING, psshhh.

 

[Vermy]

Like I said Shaya, you're wise to the Zard's BnB, and know how to punish it well.

 

[PokemonMasterIRL]

hey shaya you and any other ptbr peeps to the br there is an interesting vid that needs explaining..

 

[T-block]

merry christmas guys ^^

or whatever the hell you celebrate. happy that to you.

 

[Zigsta]

Dang, Miles taunting everyone who's not in the BR. HARD TAUNT.

Thanks, T-block! Happy holidays to everyone else!

 

[Vermy]

Felt the need to share teh lulz.

 

[PokemonMasterIRL]

Felt The Need To Share Teh Lulz.

Lol

Lmao

Rofl

 

[Bomber7]

meh missed christmas with y'all. at least I'll be able to say I hope y'all had a good yesterday.

 

[Bowser_Gangsta]

Why does Ivysaur's crouch make such a cute noise? Like shouldn't it sound like leaves crunching?

 

[Phiddlesticks]

not ivysaurs fault its the cutest character in the game

 

[Vermy]

Lies. Have you seen Charizard sleeping? 10x cuter. <3

 

[Zigsta]

Hydrotaunting Squirtle is way cuter.

 

[T-block]

iono guys...ivysaur is pretty **** cute

 

[Steeler]

sandbag is the cutest

 

[Gates]

Maybe you should work on throwing more rocks and less controllers.

 

[Phiddlesticks]

ivysaur is the cutest character in this game by far

its not even a competition

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I'd like to say that Bowser is the cutest, but they made him so ugly in this game.

 

[Zigsta]

Bowser sounds sooooo weird in Brawl. XD What did Sakurai do to his voice?

 

[Magik0722]

Cute Discussion

Seriously guys?

 

[Vermy]

I hardly think it's a big an issue as your sig of a man licking wood.

Spoiler

yes, i know Sudowoodo is a rock type, but my joke wouldn't have worked otherwise

 

[Toby.]

So in light of recent events, I thought I'd post some stuff that happens in the BR now and then.

I wrote this today, for no particular reason. Enjoy.

P.S I know that this is the social thread. Sue me
-----

A little something for you all. Nothing new, just a little reminder for those of you who don't read frame data (HI MILES :D)
The important section is charizard's but here's all three anyway.

Jumping Frame Data

Squirtle
Start up: 1-4
Landing Lag (full hop): 4
Landing Lag (short hop): 2

Ivysaur
Start up: 1-5
Landing Lag (full hop): 4
Landing Lag (short hop): 2

Charizard
*note: Charizard does not seem to have any buffer for starting aerials upon jumping.
Start up: 1-7
Landing Lag (full hop): 5
Landing Lag (short hop): 2

We can't even do anything until FRAME EIGHT with charizard. Soooo lame. And from there we can't hit them until frame 14 at the earliest (jumping time + first hit of fastest aerial, Uair).

Frame Data for SH Aerials:

Uair - 14
Fair - 17
Bair - 15
Dair - 26

Of course if we do an Aerial from a midair jump, we don't need to worry about the startup frames because midair jumps begin on frame 1. So I highly recommend incorporating infinite second jump renewal now and then. A consistent ISJR offense or defense has a lot of flaws, but doing it once in a while lets us shave off a few frames...quite useful for a slow poke like charoozood.

This post was made possible by Shaya, who took the time to get our frame data all those months ago. Thanks Shaya

 

[PokemonMasterIRL]

WTf I eat frame data for breakfast with my breakfast with extra breakfast.

 

[Toby.]

No miles see you are supposed to READ frame data, not eat it.

Silly!

Come on aim?

 

[T-block]

toby what's your AIM?

edit: or just add tblock7 ^^

 

[Phiddlesticks]

 

[Toby.]

That is an amazing picture.

 

[PokemonMasterIRL]

my favorite troll.

i made that pic on my computer

 

[Zigsta]

Awesome data. This REALLY makes sense now why characters like Marth can just raperaperape Charizard in midair really fast.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Charizard
*note: Charizard does not seem to have any buffer for starting aerials upon jumping.
Start up: 1-7
Landing Lag (full hop): 5
Landing Lag (short hop): 2

We can't even do anything until FRAME EIGHT with charizard. Soooo lame. And from there we can't hit them until frame 14 at the earliest (jumping time + first hit of fastest aerial, Uair).

Frame Data for SH Aerials:

Uair - 14
Fair - 17
Bair - 15
Dair - 26

Of course if we do an Aerial from a midair jump, we don't need to worry about the startup frames because midair jumps begin on frame 1. So I highly recommend incorporating infinite second jump renewal now and then. A consistent ISJR offense or defense has a lot of flaws, but doing it once in a while lets us shave off a few frames...quite useful for a slow poke like charoozood.

This post was made possible by Shaya, who took the time to get our frame data all those months ago. Thanks Shaya

Important question. ISJR is possible when you buffer a jump at the very end of an aerial immediately above the ground, if I'm not mistaken.

That being said, how long the aerial takes overall with how much air time we get on a midair jump seems to be useful information. Like, if we do the midair jump as close to the ground as possible, how long do we have to wait before doing what aerial?

I'm sure that some are easier than others, but seeing it with frame data would make it easier for me, and hopefully others.

 

[Tin Man]

forget cute, les talk about sexy, ROB & Olimar are sexy beasts