Meta Wry Mustache Man: Dominating Strategies Discussion

[DavemanCozy]

Found this while browsing youtube
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=989k00Qgv5g
Probably useless but just wanted to spread the info.

I actually found this useful yesterday while playing a match on Halberd, since the stage is pass through you won't hit it and you can jump from below the stage. My opponent wasn't ready for it though, so there's that to consider, but I caught it him by surprise using a F-air.

Lol, more questions from me:

Besides Waft, what are other ways in which Wario finds KOs? Reason I ask is because there are times when I find keeping waft would be better, such as for the opponent respawning with their next stock.

Other ways to ask this question: what do opponents typically fear about Wario (besides waft)? What should I be looking for to condition them?

 

[Sari]

Besides Waft, what are other ways in which Wario finds KOs? Reason I ask is because there are times when I find keeping waft would be better, such as for the opponent respawning with their next stock.

Forward tilt is very useful for getting a KO, since it's quick and can kill at around 100%. Aside from normal smash attacks, here are some other useful KO attacks:

• The bike's wheelie stomp (can kill at about 80%)
• The bike's back wheel as soon as you turn (Gotten a few kills at the edge of the stage while they had about 115%)
• F-throw (can kill somewhere around the 120-130% range if they're at the end of the stage, and it's much stronger than his B-throw)
• Back air and down air (both can kill at about 110%)

Other ways to ask this question: what do opponents typically fear about Wario (besides waft)? What should I be looking for to condition them?

One of Wario's best attributes about him is his air game, since he has an amazing recovery and his aerial attacks are very useful (such as his F-air which can be good for direct approaches). Characters such as Shulk and King Dedede have more aerial range with their weapons, so in cases like these it might be better to avoid using too many aerials and try using ground attacks and grabs.

Opponents also might be worried about Wario's bike (since it's such a quick weapon) so they might try and shield it and attack once you're done. While this might not always work, you can try using a wheelie and then a bike turn to apply lots of shield pressure on them (and since you turned around you'll usually be able to avoid any attacks they were planning once you finished). Learned this trick (as well as other useful bike tricks) from this video.

 

[Spinosaurus]

The bite is what I'm scared of when I play other Wario's.

 

[Rakurai]

You can actually footstool someone directly after a speeding bike hit for a jab reset follow-up at low percents, as I accidentally learned in a tournament yesterday,

Not something I imagine people being able pull off consistently, but it sure is stylish.

 

[Mrwhatzitooya]

Hey guys. I'd really appreciate a little advice for playing the big guy :/ Recently I've found that I'm really struggling online, and while it may be I'm a little rusty, there are a few problems I really cannot solve.

First off *shudders* ...serial rollers. The only way I can seem to hit them is with the Bike or DSmash, but even then that doesn't seem to phase the "better" rollers.

Another problem I have is with characters that have as good/ better airgame than Wario, in particular those with an Uair kick like Falcon's or Mario's. They always seem to outprioritise my moves, and airdodging seems the only option to me.

My other big problem is the matchups vs fast characters, Sonic especially. I'm really not too sure how to rack up the hits or KO them . They always seem to get the best of me.

I'd really appreciate the help guys. I wasn't exactly sure where I should post this request, and starting a new thread didn't seem necessary. Apologies if this is posted in the wrong place, and thanks in advance!

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Wait. Embrace your ability to camp. Waft is always charging, and every moment they move away from you lets you charge your Down-B instead.

I think Mario beats Wario pretty solidly, actually. Don't fight him while moving forward if you can help it. Retreating B-Air and such.

 

[Mrwhatzitooya]

Wait. Embrace your ability to camp. Waft is always charging, and every moment they move away from you lets you charge your Down-B instead.

I think Mario beats Wario pretty solidly, actually. Don't fight him while moving forward if you can help it. Retreating B-Air and such.

The Waft can certainly be very useful for KOing them, but my main problem is landing the hits on rollers, as they always seem to slip away before Wario can dish out a punish.

Is it better to try and keep the fight grounded when facing off Mario/ Falcon then, or is a more defensive game required?

 

[Spinosaurus]

Rolling is pretty hard to punish online because of the input lag unfortunately. Nothing you could do about it except read where they're rolling.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

You have time. Why do you have to hit those rolls? Eventually they don't have any room to roll backward, and you don't lose anything for just letting them roll and keeping yourself protected.

A more defensive game is required for top-level Wario play, period, I'm convinced.

 

[Mrwhatzitooya]

You have time. Why do you have to hit those rolls? Eventually they don't have any room to roll backward, and you don't lose anything for just letting them roll and keeping yourself protected.

A more defensive game is required for top-level Wario play, period, I'm convinced.

Maybe that's where I'm going wrong then... xD any tips for a defensive wario playstyle? I've been a bit too "gung ho", jumping into the fray mostly!

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Rising F-Air, retreating B-Air, moving Neutral-B. All of those are pretty safe and allow you to threaten people at mid-range even if you don't do a lot with it.

Also, Wario's roll was improved greatly in Smash 4. Don't be afraid to roll away, yourself (even if it's dumb).

 

[Mrwhatzitooya]

Rising F-Air, retreating B-Air, moving Neutral-B. All of those are pretty safe and allow you to threaten people at mid-range even if you don't do a lot with it.

Also, Wario's roll was improved greatly in Smash 4. Don't be afraid to roll away, yourself (even if it's dumb).

I see! I use his F-Air a good bit, but the B-Air and Bite are a little underused by me. I'll have to put all these into practise! Thanks so much for the help!

 

[Wafty]

Can we please get tires in this patch lord sakurai?

 

[DavemanCozy]

Not sure about Mario beating Wario. I played some games with Blacktwins and SmashSteve up here in Ontario, I think the MU is closer to even. Luigi on the other hand... that's a tough matchup for Wario, imo. I pulled out customs Wario in a tourney this weekend. I ran 1113, which is my preference now. I think regular chomp, bike, and corkscrew are the best moves, while the rapid charge waft is a straight up improvement.

What do you think of riding the bike to tech chase rolls or getup rolls? If they roll away, I've noticed the bike will most certainly catch them, but if they roll towards I think Wario gets more reward from using one of his aerials. Conditioning would play a big part here.

 

[Rakurai]

I feel like the merits of the speeding bike outweigh those of the standard bike.

You lose the ability to edgeguard by throwing it and it can be blown up easier, but it's easier to punish with it, harder to be punished if it gets dodged or shielded, boosts Wario's recovery even further, and opens up some extremely potent combo options that the standard bike lacks.

 

[Spinosaurus]

I feel like one big thing that's in standard bike's favor is that it can challenge stuff, whereas speeding bike gets stuffed by a LOT of moves. Also throwing the bike is still a very potent option that's worth considering.

I think standard bike's defensive capabilities will make it better for certain matchups. (Mostly characters that would rather be in the mid-to-close range) I will agree that Speeding Bike is probably better overall but it's not exactly a straight up upgrade.

@ DavemanCozy : I think it's a matter of whether you just want easy, guaranteed damage or take the chance to capitalize on your opponent if they tech wrong.

 

[YouReadMyName]

Hey wario boards, my main is ness and I feel that wario may be a great secondary/pocket to fight those characters who own swords. Any advice, tips, tricks, playstyle, etc. for this WAcky char?

 

[Spinosaurus]

Unfortunately Wario isn't a great character against swords. Disjoints are his worst enemy.

 

[Hyper]

Hey wario boards, my main is ness and I feel that wario may be a great secondary/pocket to fight those characters who own swords. Any advice, tips, tricks, playstyle, etc. for this WAcky char?

You think Ness has bad range against swordsmen? wait til you use Wario.

 

[Rakurai]

If you want to deal with characters who have large disjointed hitboxes, Wario is honestly probably one of the worst choices.

A speedy character like Sheik handles those much better.

On a side note, I really wish Wario's forward smash had more active frames then it does, because while it's the ideal follow-up for his speeding bike to footstool jab reset combo, it's really difficult to time it properly...

 

[DavemanCozy]

It's probably just me then not trying speeding bike much. After playing and getting used to the things you can do with turning the bike around, I like that better and don't like that the speeding bike takes that away. Are there videos of customs on matches with Wario using the speeding bike?

I hope the patch brings back some cha cha chas from the crowd

 

[Zionaze]

Whats a good 2ndary to cover Wario's bad MUs?

 

[DavemanCozy]

Whats a good 2ndary to cover Wario's bad MUs?

I find Fox does well against Villager, an MU that I've been seeing around this board that people don't like as Wario.

That's just me. I like having a character with solid ground movement and ground control in Fox, and having Wario with threatening offstage presence and great air mobility.

 

[Foster J.]

Wario hates projectiles for whenever he goes biking, so something anti projectile or something projectilish could probably do the trick.
I'd say Toon Link would be the optimal 2ndary, but they are very different, so probably not a good choice early on, perhaps King Dedede would do the trick as he zones, hits hard and survives like a mofo

 

[YouReadMyName]

I currently use Ness, WFT and Wario. These 3 seem to cover all match ups I have! Ness my main, WFT for swords, and wario for more campier chars. Any uses for wario that I don't know?

 

[Sari]

Luigi has been really giving me a hard time lately. He can very easily d-throw combo Wario and overall is just hard to hit. I've been able to up-B out of some of his hits (even racking a few hits on Luigi) but by then the damage is already done and I eventually end up being grabbed again. Any tips on how to easily get out of his d-throw attacks/deal with Luigi in general?

 

[Mrwhatzitooya]

Luigi has been really giving me a hard time lately. He can very easily d-throw combo Wario and overall is just hard to hit. I've been able to up-B out of some of his hits (even racking a few hits on Luigi) but by then the damage is already done and I eventually end up being grabbed again. Any tips on how to easily get out of his d-throw attacks/deal with Luigi in general?

Maybe his D-throw's been needed in the patch? :D haha

In seriousness, I'd say that you should try using the bite a lot if Luigi's going in for the grabs. Another way to use the bite is to short hop and bite, as a lot of players instinctively go into shield or try to attack when some jumps next to them.

Other than that, I'd recommend keeping Luigi away from you as much as possible. Try to keep on the defensive, using plenty of F-airs, bites and retreating B-airs to give you some distance. The bike can also be very useful for approaching or as a quick escape. Remember, the longer the match lasts, the more waft you have!

Hope this helps you out man, and good luck!

 

[[Obnoxshush/Dasshizer]]

Have any of you guys faced Mewtwo yet, the bike can really mess him up.

 

[Goodstyle_4]

Have any of you guys faced Mewtwo yet, the bike can really mess him up.

Wario is a very small and very heavy character. Mewtwo is a very big and very light character. Wario is faster than Mewtwo, but has better kill moves and generally more damaging attacks. Mewtwo is floaty and awkward to move whereas Wario is nimble and has great air movement.

Based on initial impressions, I'd say Wario walks all over Mewtwo.

 

[Mrwhatzitooya]

I was wondering, does anyone have any tips or experience fighting against Pikachus? After the last patch, he seems to have had a big buff, and he's become pretty troublesome :/ I'd really appreciate any help possible. Thanks in advance guys

 

[dradmclad]

has anyone noticed wario's dair now kills at like 120%?

 

[sogeki]

Wario's Fsmash can kill at lower percents, I tested it, and it's confirmed.
MAINS, REJOICE!

 

[goodgrief]

Luigi has been really giving me a hard time lately. He can very easily d-throw combo Wario and overall is just hard to hit. I've been able to up-B out of some of his hits (even racking a few hits on Luigi) but by then the damage is already done and I eventually end up being grabbed again. Any tips on how to easily get out of his d-throw attacks/deal with Luigi in general?

don't respect him too much offstage that's luigis biggest weakness and wario's recovery is great

instead of getting out of his downthrow work on not getting grabbed in the first place stay out of range don't do stupid stuff on shield
wario is wiggly af he can attack and get out quick

I was wondering, does anyone have any tips or experience fighting against Pikachus? After the last patch, he seems to have had a big buff, and he's become pretty troublesome :/ I'd really appreciate any help possible. Thanks in advance guys

pikachu didn't get buffed but he's still pretty hard. i'd go for grabs/bites a lot punish jolts with bike try to get a back air or downair offstage pikachu is light he'll die early

has anyone noticed wario's dair now kills at like 120%?

Always killed that early, also combos into up smash if fast fallen

Wario's Fsmash can kill at lower percents, I tested it, and it's confirmed.
MAINS, REJOICE!

Fsmash always been strong lol nothing new just hard to hit without a read/shieldbreak

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Is Speeding Bike hit -> footstool -> sourspot F-Air reset a true combo at some percents? I wonder if it can loop itself in any significant fashion.

We may be able to do something similar by pulling out the regular Bike in mid-air, leaning forward to get grounded max speed, and jump off after the hit, but that seems way more situational to get started.

 

[Rakurai]

As far as I've noticed, it's a true combo at any percent it actually works at, since I was mashing on another controller with the game set to 1/4 speed to see if I could break out at any point and couldn't.

I don't think looping it would work well due to how far the bike launches, though.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Rose Waft's huge hitbox can be useful for stage spiking if the opponent tries to hug the stage to avoid traditional edgeguarding, it seems--

https://gfycat.com/LinedUnequaledKilldeer

 

[Sari]

What's the quickest way to destroy a non-damaged bike while it's on the ground so you can eat the parts for health? Wondering this since I often find myself alone with the bike while my opponent is being star KO'd.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Likely a hard Bike throw downward -> aerial as it bounces.

I remember in Brawl it was hard Bike throw down -> N-Air -> U-Tilt.

 

[Rakurai]

Rose Waft's huge hitbox can be useful for stage spiking if the opponent tries to hug the stage to avoid traditional edgeguarding, it seems--

https://gfycat.com/LinedUnequaledKilldeer

Assuming that dash attack is able to exploit the one frame ledge vulnerability, this is going to be a really great setup against a lot of characters.

 

[DavemanCozy]

As far as I've noticed, it's a true combo at any percent it actually works at, since I was mashing on another controller with the game set to 1/4 speed to see if I could break out at any point and couldn't.

I don't think looping it would work well due to how far the bike launches, though.

Would you happen to have a gif or video with this in play?

I'm still leaning towards the regular bike, but I'd like to see Speeding Bike in action to change my mind.

I agree with Spinosaurus as well, the regular bike is really good for toughing out through certain projectiles. Toon Link, who was mentioned earlier in the thread, gets his projectiles walled by a bike: just ride it, ditch it and use it to cover your approach. Against these matchups, I think the pure durability of the regular bike is more useful.

Even leaving the bike in the ground lets Wario hide behind it against certain projectiles. I've been finding myself staying close to the bike to be useful as well: the bike hides some of your attacks behind it since Wario is so short, and the opponent needs to be careful not to accidentally pick it up when you're close to it as well.