Who Creates Worst Play Experience

[leelue]

Besides the Melee top 7 (Fox Falco Sheik Marth Puff Peach Falcon) which characters create the least fun/most frustrating play experiences for you? I figured this would be a nice centralized place for the pmbr to see opinions, rather than have to just notice when people complain.

Right now, in no particular order for me:

Ivysaur:
"So if I shield razor leaf, I have to shield it the entire time it passes through me? ok. but wait, you get a free grab? ok, I'll roll back. wait, no the leaf is still there. ok I'll roll behind you to punish your grab. wait, you're already out of your ranged grab animation already and safe? Well then."
"Oh you did a bair on my shield huh? Well I'll wait for that second hit from it to land and punish you like Bam!
Oh, you can do a second bair out of your short hop before I can jump and Uair. Rock paper scissors prediction game? thanks Obama.
Seed bomb? oh ho, I'll just keep away from that space then. Oh? it can go either forwards or backwards now? it's ok I'll just track it. But it's offscreen now? and it's basically going to come down in one of three places without warning, thereby being in three superimposed states at once until one observes it hitting me? Thanks Schrodinger.
Oh you're on the ledge at all? Well allow me to come by and pressure you off of there- ow. ow. ow. ow. ok, not worth it. I'll go over here."
Why do I play ganondorf...

Zelda:
...ehh

DK
Just kidding, Eli

 

[Kink-Link5]

You said I can't say Falcon but I'm going to say Falcon because I think he's tied with IC's in Melee instead of straight top 7.

Falcon
DK
Ganon
Others

As much as I dislike Zelda's design, Falcon is still the only character that really feels more like a chore than a challenge to play against. DK/Ganon autocombos are similarly obnoxious but at least they don't dashdance for six minutes.

 

[Wavebuster]

To me? Game & Watch. No, seriously. I feel like the experience of fighting Game & Watch can more or less be replicated by playing a tabletop RPG. At least I'd have more fun with that. Don't even get me started with multiple G&Ws on the field.

 

[RKM]

Mario abusing fireballs.

 

[hotdogturtle]

Zelda
10dins

 

[leelue]

I played a gw recently. I was better than him but it was still annoying. Not SO bad but it was like "haha CC everything to Dtilt for free why you play sheik????"

As much as I dislike Zelda's design, Falcon is still the only character that really feels more like a chore than a challenge to play against. DK/Ganon autocombos are similarly obnoxious but at least they don't dashdance for six minutes.

Because I played sonic, I never felt some type of way about Cfalc.

 

[Wavebuster]

I was more or less alluding to [GW'S] RNG being stupid in a setting where powerful RNG effects are highly frowned upon, among other things.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

The Melee top 7 are familiar and not that bad except Puff.

Now G&W on the other hand...

 

[ELI-mination]

I like this whole notion of "auto combos" because its absurd as hell
Every combo is an "auto combo" depending on how you look at it
Fox uthrow to uair is an auto combo. Why? Because I feel like calling it one
DK = pure skill only, everything else = pure luck only
Why? because I play DK

 

[Metà]

DK is one of the dumbest, most one-dimensional characters in smash history, but not annoying to play against.

Now Zelda on the other hand, not very fun. not very good, but annoying to play against

 

[Blondie.]

All this Zelda hate is really rustling my jimmies

 

[MysteryRevengerson]

The salt is real in this thread, though it's to be expected.

I really don't enjoy fighting Sonic, but if the developers made this happen, it just means they got how Sonic would fight, right.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't know about everybody else, but I find the fact that different people mention a wide variety of characters when talking about characters they don't like to be a positive thing. Everybody prefers a different playstyle. Not every character has to be fun for you to play and/or fight against. The only way you're going to find every character incredibly enjoyable is if the entire cast was homogenized to fit your personal taste. So how about instead of complaining, we start appreciating the diversity of the cast.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

I don't know about everybody else, but I find the fact that different people mention a wide variety of characters when talking about characters they don't like to be a positive thing. Everybody prefers a different playstyle. Not every character has to be fun for you to play and/or fight against. The only way you're going to find every character incredibly enjoyable is if the entire cast was homogenized to fit your personal taste. So how about instead of complaining, we start appreciating the diversity of the cast.

Nahhhhh, Lucario/Wolf/Falcon/Fox/Metaknight only tournaments from now on. Yoshi's Story only.

 

[Mr.Pickle]

@smasfromthepast - You can infer that...or maybe it means that most characters have at least one legitimately negative aspect of their character design for people to complain about. I mean, complaining without reason isn't good, but honestly just accepting things as they are when playing a game with a capacity to change, being in demo stage, is just as bad. I'm not trying to say you're wrong per say, but as far as this thread goes, I think its fine as long as everyone remains respectable, and their issues are legitimate and have reason behind it.

 

[Nguz95]

Mario: Dash attack dash attack dash attack. Hitboxes last forever, combos into every single move he has. Move away from him, fireballs fireballs fireballs. Fireball-dash-attack-usmash-fair. Wait, I just died?

Squirtle: Slide slide slide. You can't touch me slide slide. Oh, you hit me? Can't combo me slide slide. I can hit you though. Slide usmash slide. I did that twice now; you're at 50% already. Oh, you hit me really far off the stage? Air slide recover slide slide usmash you're dead.

Marth: I tipped you at 50%. You died. I get rewarded for keeping you as far away from me as I can. BTW I have a tiara on...

Falco: Lasers dair pillar you're dead.

Peach: Dmash all day ery'day. Covers literally all your options so yeah... Did I tell you I have a projectile that occasionally gives me beam swords and bombs too?

Bowser: I have armor on every single one of my moves. You hit me I brush yo hate off my shoulders. I hit you once you're dead because I can sit on the edge and get up attack until you can't get back to the edge.

The life of a scrub is a salty one...

 

[Bryonato]

At this point I'm going to say Ivy. I hate being close to her, far away from her or anywhere above her just due to the ridiculous pressure of seed bomb/leaf, vine whip. She's floaty as **** and is hard to combo. Healing is annoying as **** too.

I'm just really, really bad at fighting Ivy tbh.

 

[HyperrCrow]

G&W, because CC'ing to D-tilt.

 

[Mera Mera]

For me, it's G&W. Part of it is unavoidable in that he is an uninteresting character in terms of where he comes from to me (and I WOULD feel the same way about ROB, but he's just too cool).

A lot of it is my somewhat irrational dislike of random elements in the game. I see the 1 or 2 dots as an improvement, but I still hate the 1 and the 9 since they have stupidly different results (or did they buff 1 in PM?). The random food directions and now the random food size are not helping my liking of him. It'd be cool if food got big by a non-use charge kinda like waft from Wario.

Most other random things I don't mind as much, but I'd prefer to not have it in the game personally (to each their own).

Aside from that, I'll say that I like facing the zoning chars like Ivy (to defend her since she's (he's?) getting some flak. I think she's un-fun to face until you get used to her. She seems REALLY good now, but I don't know about OP. I will admit I have SOME trouble dealing with Razor leaf (which I think is just experience related), and I wish the camera was higher and/or you could see the seed direction on the way up so you could know where it would land, but that's all.

 

[DMG]

Ivysaur and Zelda are not "fun" for the other person to fight. Your character may even have a clear super duper advantage, but chances are you're still not really enjoying it besides saying to yourself "YEAH ZELDA LOOKS LIKE MARTH DOESN'T CARE ABOUT UR ****!!! HNGGGGGGGGG LEMME IMPALE YOU WITH MY SCHWINGR".

PM has more annoying characters in it. Squirtle right now is a pretty decent character, but he's annoying. Lucas can do cool things OR be annoying. Ness is decent AND more annoying. G&W is a thing Pikachu is annoying... There's a god damn pattern all the short characters are annoying. MK is a poo poo head.

Then again, big characters can be annoying too. Bowser may rue getting grabbed, but man he's annoying.

It just makes me wanna go Marth or Sheik and ****in stick things out in public areas and just win. Neutral game in PM is evolving compared to Melee and even though people despise DD camping/old school Melee top tier kind of Neutral games, we're kind of forcing that to be even more useful as an answer to Ivy's camping, Lucas rave-like hypnobobbling around, etc. Answers like brute force, trying to go HAM directly at people seem much harder to accomplish and less rewarding. So yeah I get it, Falcon DD for the win is lolz, but when his opponent is Snake or something, you really think he's gonna be able to win by Nair planing or Kneeing or being 100% direct at him when you consider how many more defensive/buffed defensive options there are now?

The images that Melee brings to mind, are usually offensive ones. Combos, edgeguards, RPS options up close. As lame as it is for Falcon or Marth or x to play patient, the end goal in sight tends to be something big offensively. When a character like Ivy is using Bair as a wall, or Zelda uses a combo of Smash Tilt and B as a wall, it may be effective but it doesn't usually really attempt to lead into anything bigger. So it leads to this annoying feeling of matches and gameplay where you're spending more time breaking walls or setting up walls, and then one side isn't even pulling off much dangerousness offensively. Sometimes in Melee and PM, the disparity of not being able to combo or approach or bait as well as a Sheik Fox Falcon Marth etc feels massive and really hard to overcome, even if you ARE the great D3 wall of God.

 

[CyberZixx]

Snake
Falco
Mario are my top three least favorites to fight

Bowser and game and watch and sonic can be annoying too

Ivysaur and Zelda to an extent as they just want to wall you. as dmg said this game is more defensive than melee so characters who thrive on that style are not as fun to play.

Lucario (not annoying to fight but don't like his design as it goes against smashes combo game.

 

[SpiderMad]

Lucario is just what this game needed

 

[Deleted member]

Wario, Zelda, Ivy.
Bowser/GNW is up there but not as bad.

 

[~Frozen~]

I'll probably edit this post later for my reasoning, but I'd go with Zelda, Ivy, and GnW. Playing those MU's is sometimes a major chore rather than an entertaining experience.

 

[Juushichi]

"Having to learn to play against things that I didn't have to worry about before because everyone is kinda good is annoying" General Discussion.

I play GnW. I am light, my approach is spam bacon or it sucks, my CC is ok but my weight is not my rolls/techs aren't that great and I die at 70%.

I hate zoners like ZSS/Ivysaur/Link/Marth because she/he/it outranges everything everything I want to do + Frametraps and ughhhghfkgdlfjgdlj.
I hate characters with a good CC game like Sheik/Wario/Peach/Snake because nothing I really want to do is safe and they grab me and Frametraps and uggghfkjgfkdh
I hate spacies/rushdown like Lucas/Fox/Falco/Falcon because they just DD and run around and I can't swing at them because they bait me and are fast and can stuff my OOS options and Frametraps and ughughughksdjfklsjl.

...**** it, I'll just play Sheik.

 

[Strong Badam]

fox and falco

 

[leelue]

not allowed to pick those

 

[DMG]

Everyone picks Fox

AND WINS

 

[ELI-mination]

You must collect all the silver coins

AND WIN

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Whoever is circle camping me.

 

[Strong Badam]

You must collect all the silver coins

AND WIN

I legitimately LOL'd pretty good at this one. DKR the best.

 

[CORY]

You must collect all the silver coins

AND WIN

damn, i nostalgia'd hard.

 

[DMG]

That was really good Eli I have nothing to add

 

[AbstractLogic]

All this Zelda hate is really rustling my jimmies

I'm seriously tempted to make a "How to fight Zelda with ____ thread". She is not that bad people!

 

[Deleted member]

Insert wifi and salty players and its a 100-0 matchup zelda wins!

 

[Kink-Link5]

Make a "How to make Zelda fun thread." Start with "Give her Melee kicks and Airdodge out of side B" and post nothing else.

 

[Doomolish]

Sonic was dumb on 2.5, but IDK about him right now.

Zelda it's really bad, so I don't think she's a problem.

Wario is so strong that I get frustated sometimes.

 

[Oracle]

i thought zelda was obnoxious then i started playing as her vs good players

 

[dettadeus]

I hate playing Wario. Dunno why, he's just awkward for me.

I actually like playing Ivy with R.O.B., it's kind of a fun matchup.

 

[Paradoxium]

So far in Project M, every character creates a horrible play experience because it isn't like melee enough.