What Street Fighter players think about Melee.

[Alex Strife]

Blur where did you get all this info. It makes absolutely no sense. Almost, if not, all the things you said are beyond not true.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Blur where did you get all this info. It makes absolutely no sense. Almost, if not, all the things you said are beyond not true.

If you want to know why people hate Brawl, thats why. I didn't say I agree or disagree with it, but thats the reasoning. And yes, tons and tons of people think that way, justly or unjustly.

And until something changes, they will continue to think that way. If you want to break down a problem, then you have to at least know the complaints. And those are the complaints.

 

[Alex Strife]

Sorry but some of the stuff you listed is complete not true and the rest is just reasons that make no sense.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

People always find reasons to segregate each other. Whether it is money, race, creed, or something as silly as a competitive game vs another. This is human nature to want a feeling of superiority.

^^^
that right there is what is untrue.

People don't hate on Brawl because they want a feeling of superiority. OK maybe some people do, but that is not the principle reason.

 

[SnakeMan]

Ive never played brawl.
Am I missing out on anything?

 

[Pengie]

Honestly, I don't think there's any principle reasoning for people hating Brawl; that is to say, I doubt there's anything close to a consensus as to why Melee players hate Brawl. If there is, I doubt it has anything to do with wanting to feel "superior," or anything about not being included in their tournaments, and has more to do with, you know, the fact that some people just don't like the game-play and feel like voicing their opinion on it.

 

[Teczer0]

Simply put, Melee players that dislike Brawl largely hate it because many Melee players feel that Brawl 'killed' the Melee scene. That Brawl took away Melee players and are continuing to take away potential people that want to play the game.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Honestly, I don't think there's any principle reasoning for people hating Brawl; that is to say, I doubt there's anything close to a consensus as to why Melee players hate Brawl. If there is, I doubt it has anything to do with wanting to feel "superior," or anything about not being included in their tournaments, and has more to do with, you know, the fact that some people just don't like the game-play and feel like voicing their opinion on it.

I didn't say Melee kids hate Brawl because they feel that they aren't included in their tournaments. I said that they feel Brawl is parasitic, and that its presence hinders, and does not aid, in the Melee community's growth. Because of this, one thing Brawl TOs can do to change these perceptions is to hold Brawl+Melee tournaments.

Let me paint a picture.
-You are a Melee player who wants to watch the Genesis stream
-The DBR crew is hosting the event, a Melee crew, but they included Brawl as well
-The Melee stream is down most of the day, and the Brawl stream is running perfectly the entire tournament
-You rage, thinking that resources for the Brawl stream should have been used for the Melee stream

Now, you wouldn't be in the right; the Brawl kids brought their own streaming equipment and without them there wouldn't have been a stream for either game, let alone one. However, lets think quickly as to why those feelings exist in the first place. Its because you think Brawl is stealing resources and attention from Melee, which you believe is the better game, and that if Brawl didn't exist, you'd be able to get your content easier.

Pretty much every instance of Brawl/Melee conflict can be boiled down like this...the core idea is the notion that the melee community would be better off if Brawl was never made.

Now let me paint another picture. Bizarro world
-You are a Melee player who wants to watch a stream
-The tournament is hosted by a famous Brawl crew, but they are including Melee as well
-The Melee stream is up all day, but the Brawl one is having issues
-You think "damn, these Brawl kids gave us a venue, kept our stream up, and ran an excellent tournament"
-Good will +1

Bizarro world never happens. There is no good will. And thats why Brawl and Melee kids don't get along. In a Melee player's eyes, Brawl hurts the Melee community much more than it helps it.

Simply put, Melee players that dislike Brawl largely hate it because many Melee players feel that Brawl 'killed' the Melee scene. That Brawl took away Melee players and are continuing to take away potential people that want to play the game.

Mhm.

 

[Iron Dragon]

Strife I don't know why you think what Blur said is so wrong when he and Teczero pretty much hit the core points right on the mark.

Maybe you need to spend more time around the Melee community considering you're a BBR Member? Assumption here...

Anyways, outside of Blur's good reasons, I think Brawl just as a game in itself, doesn't have the proper tools to sustain the life in the way Melee and the FGC do. Hype is such a big part of it that if you have almost no hype for something what's to stop it from dying the next day? Sure many of you will say this with HBox vs Armada but this is ONE time in the history of a game almost 10 years old and even though it happened the way it did, it was a matchup you don't see often and characters who you never see.

Other stuff I'll insert later. I'm so lazy right now.

 

[Divinokage]

If you want to know why people hate Brawl, thats why. I didn't say I agree or disagree with it, but thats the reasoning. And yes, tons and tons of people think that way, justly or unjustly.

And until something changes, they will continue to think that way. If you want to break down a problem, then you have to at least know the complaints. And those are the complaints.

Well back in 2005-2006 and stuff, I don't believe there were a lot of hate going on... everyone was happy and everything was hype from what I've seen. But now in 2011, I observed that people grow more and more bored and to fill that boredom, they would troll endlessly for their own entertainment/feel better about themselves because they have nothing else. Ya sure I got trolled back in the day too but it was for fun.. Not to the point where people start going off until trolling became really really mean now. Like for some reason, people just don't care anymore which is even worse than being loving or a hating person.

 

[Tekk]

one thing Brawl TOs can do to change these perceptions is to hold Brawl+Melee tournaments.

Resulting in the Melee community parasiting the Brawl one.
Brawl players don't owe anything to the Melee ones.

It's not the Brawl community that should put an extra effort in order to please Melee players, it's simply the Melee players that have to grow up.

 

[Divinokage]

Resulting in the Melee community parasiting the Brawl one.
Brawl players don't owe anything to the Melee ones.

It's not the Brawl community that should put an extra effort in order to please Melee players, it's simply the Melee players that have to grow up.

The brawl community has way more young smashers, so of course it's more likely for them to act like kids.. I thought we showed them how to do it for so many years before.. but, well there's nothing much you can do, kids act according to their emotions.. they didn't learn how to control themselves yet. Kids do things without thinking about the consequences of their actions. Not saying there aren't in melee either but ya.. For them to need a system to make them follow the rules just enforces my point. Ya sometimes I hear some disturbing stories..

 

[Pen_island]

yet another decent thread that will be closed because of brawl vs melee

 

[Strong Badam]

Is that really what Brawl players say? There's no way. One of these is actually true, and one isn't.

Brawl does have combos. Don't be naive. They're simply limited due to the general physics of the game.

 

[Zoler]

Sorry but some of the stuff you listed is complete not true and the rest is just reasons that make no sense.

What blur said is pretty much the truth.

 

[Strong Badam]

a lot of Blur's points were true. what was incorrect about them, Alex?

 

[Deleted member]

on-topic

street fighter players hate melee because of brawl

 

[Tekk]

"hating" a game is a really stupid concept.

 

[Largemike32197]

To be fair I don't understand why anyone would be hating on anything it only hurts yourself, it never feels good to hate.

 

[mesa23]

street fighter is cool
not my scene but its alright
prolly same for them

 

[Tekk]

I hate you = I consider myself a better human being than you
I hate this game = my game is sooooo much better

It's that simple really.

 

[Largemike32197]

Sounds more like pride

 

[Tekk]

It's related.

But a bit off-topic, don't you think ?
Gaming communities will always have trouble with each other, just like there will always be trouble within each game community.
The best we can do is ignoring people hating on us, I think.
(and I mean hating, not criticizing)

 

[Jonas]

To be fair I don't understand why anyone would be hating on anything it only hurts yourself, it never feels good to hate.

No, people generally love to hate stuff, otherwise there wouldn't be so many haters.

 

[Largemike32197]

Wanta fight about it? Meet me behind the pier at 7

 

[MuraRengan]

Resulting in the Melee community parasiting the Brawl one.
Brawl players don't owe anything to the Melee ones.

It's not the Brawl community that should put an extra effort in order to please Melee players, it's simply the Melee players that have to grow up.

Extra effort should go both ways. Melee could not and never will parasite the Brawl community to any relevant extent for the sole reason that Brawl is newer and will attract more players because of it.

However, Melee TOs HAVE made reservation for Brawl at large tournaments, despite the more immense parasitic threat Brawl poses for the Melee community. It's not an issue of "pleasing" Melee players. It's about being considerate. If we're all supposed to be one community, then both sides have to participate in treating each other equally.

Melee players don't need to grow up. In fact, I'd argue that in general the hot-headed Anti-Brawl Community sentiments show a greater understanding of the relationship of the two communities rather than the dismissive and down-right ignorant attitudes of the average Brawler.

If anything, Brawl + Melee tournaments may be the most efficient means of attracting the few new players Melee with get in the future simply because new players, attracted by Brawl, will be exposed to both games.

 

[Largemike32197]

What? Melee players don't need to grow up?

 

[choknater]

i've learned not to think of people as mobs or social groups. that's the job of edward bernays and advertisers (and i guess game developers hahaha.) i leave people to their own personal, individual opinions and there are plenty of people who are respectful toward the communities of other games, and each person has a different preference

 

[Life]

I normally would post defending Brawl here, but instead I'll just note how far offtopic this thread has gone. (Not the first tho...)

I think choknater has it figured out best. Lumping people together is generally a bad idea.

 

[Stevo]

I normally would post defending Brawl here, but instead I'll just note how far offtopic this thread has gone. (Not the first tho...)

I think choknater has it figured out best. Lumping people together is generally a bad idea.

I don't actually think it is off topic though.....

people get attached to things and ideas, and when you tell someone something they like sucks, they get defensive. If you attack Justin Bieber songs, you essentially attack everyone that likes him, regardless of how good his music is or whether or not you care that others like him. The problem with Brawl and things like it, is that they are popular for a reason, and yet they really do "suck" from the standpoint of people that "know better".

"Those new players should play melee, not brawl!" cries LuigiLover69. "Don't they realize how much better it is!?!?"

The problem is, they don't. They just know what they love is fun to them. Street Fighter players love what their game offers, Brawl players love what theirs offers. In both cases, brawl vs melee and SF vs melee, they are both fighting games played for money that require much devotion. (you could argue melee requires the most devotion, and therefore, would be the hardest to switch to as well) However, it is worse in the brawl vs melee side for the simple reason that melee is often judged by what they see in brawl. This, mixed with the COMPLETE UTTER DISSAPOINTMENT that Brawl was as a sequel for melee players, creates hostility that, to this day, has not subsided.

In the end, many players that play brawl would not have gotten into smash at all anyway if brawl had not been released, but it is very frustrating for melee players when the game you loathe is not only mistaken as equal to your game, but also hogs the spotlight.

I actually think that Project Melee might be a good way to bring the competitive players from each respective game together, if melee purists will be willing to test out another game after the disaster they went through before.

As for getting street fighter players to play or at least respect melee, it's as easy as making the community as big and well known as possible. Let the quality of the game and quality of the community make the players curious. Be friendly and show them a thing or two when they wander over to your side of the venue/gamestore.

 

[Massive]

What? Melee players don't need to grow up?

I'd say the mean age of Melee players is at least 3-4 years higher than that of brawl players.

Believe it or not, given a normal distribution age IS correlated with maturity... who knew?

 

[MuraRengan]

What? Melee players don't need to grow up?

Nope. I wouldn't be so silly as to think that the Melee community is some strange group of people with mental capacities somehow different from the brawl community. In general people respond to events in no large variety, and in the converse of the current situation (if all melee players had been brawl players and all brawl players had been melee players) the general melee sentiment would be the same. Some might define the stereotypical Melee player's hate of Brawl as "immature" however this does not designate that other group is any better. Immaturity shows itself when there's something to be immature about, and Brawl players have a lot less in that department. They don't have to worry about how to keep their community alive, but Melee players do. Brawl players don't have to climb mountains to get people to play their game, but Melee players do. Brawl players don't have to fight for their game to be important, but Melee players do. When SSB4 comes out, we'll see how mature the community is.

i've learned not to think of people as mobs or social groups. that's the job of edward bernays and advertisers (and i guess game developers hahaha.) i leave people to their own personal, individual opinions and there are plenty of people who are respectful toward the communities of other games, and each person has a different preference

That's all fine and dandy, but one mustn't pretend that opinions don't matter. Opinions decide most of what goes on in this community. It's the reason why Brawl characters are pictured on the top os SWF's banner instead of Melee characters. It's the reason why not all tournaments host both games. It's the reason why the BBR is testing out a MetaKnight ban. It's the reason behind a lot of things. It is always best to see that people's opinions are refined and logical. That's why stupid opinions are rejected. The community, through argument, will naturally select the most refined and logical opinions, but this happens only because more people disagree with your type of mindset.

 

[Qual_]

Majority of Brawls players that i have talked about ssbm they said that they dont want to play a very glitchy game, that for win you must to use glitchs.

They think that is not fair to abuse the engine, also they said that sakurai think that melee is a big fail.

And they said that they dont understand why we say that "we love ssbm" because we only playing 4stocks matchs, with no object on 5 differents stages, denigrates anything else of the game.

" Is like saying that you love a 15 songs album when in fact you only love 1 music "


Interessting point of view ...

 

[Iron Dragon]

Majority of Brawls players that i have talked about ssbm they said that they dont want to play a very glitchy game, that for win you must to use glitchs.

They think that is not fair to abuse the engine, also they said that sakurai think that melee is a big fail.

And they said that they dont understand why we say that "we love ssbm" because we only playing 4stocks matchs, with no object on 5 differents stages, denigrates anything else of the game.

" Is like saying that you love a 15 songs album when in fact you only love 1 music "


Interessting point of view ...

Obvious troll is obvious, etc

 

[keeper]

Majority of Brawls players that i have talked about ssbm they said that they dont want to play a very glitchy game, that for win you must to use glitchs.

They think that is not fair to abuse the engine, also they said that sakurai think that melee is a big fail.

And they said that they dont understand why we say that "we love ssbm" because we only playing 4stocks matchs, with no object on 5 differents stages, denigrates anything else of the game.

" Is like saying that you love a 15 songs album when in fact you only love 1 music "


Interessting point of view ...

http://frogout.org/

Learn what basic syntax and spelling is while you're at it.

 

[Pi]

i guess the only diehard sf friend i have's opinion is that SF is deeper

he thinks he's played melee at high level though because he can wavedash and knows about l canceling

Simply put, Melee players that dislike Brawl largely hate it because many Melee players feel that Brawl 'killed' the Melee scene. That Brawl took away Melee players and are continuing to take away potential people that want to play the game.

personally i just hate having brawl associated w/ melee because of what a non-fighting game it is

it's like if the next halo game was a hello kitty edition and you shot rainbows out of lollipops or some **** -.-

 

[Qual_]

keeper ->

Im sorry im french, im doing my best.

 

[Stevo]

keeper ->

Im sorry im french, im doing my best.

don't worry about it. It was quite obvious actually that your first language is not english. People need to learn to distinguish between people just being too lazy to write properly and people who's first language may not be English. Granted, this is an english forum, but I could fully understand what you were typing. There was commas and obvious attempts to make sense.

 

[Qual_]

thanx.

If you can re-write my post, with a good english, that will be very helpfull for me.

 

[Stevo]

honestly, it is not necessary.

Trust me, they can understand it. If anyone complains THEY are the ones being obnoxious.


As for responding to what you said, I think most brawl players have moved away from that point of view, though I admit at first I think many of them thought that way. I'm sure grab-release combos were intended part of gameplay. Much better than sliding on the stage.