Weekly Character Discussion: Sonic

[Overswarm]

Since when do we have a Weekly Character Discussion?

www.overswarm.com/puzzle2/puzzle2.php

join in on the fun

 

[Jim Morrison]

**** it, stuck at question 4.

 

[Overswarm]

**** it, stuck at question 4.

might want to check the original thread on smashboards for help.

 

[Jim Morrison]

Lol no one gets stuck at question 4. Besides, I'll just wait a week.

 

[Camalange]

Dangit. I always miss all the good stuff when I log off...
Ah well, this didn't go by so smoothly anyway. Fun to read though.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Since when do we have a Weekly Character Discussion?

...Where the hell have you been for the past 30 weeks??? *looks at join date* Ah right fair enough

*reads the discussion* Lol the Sonic mains are not going to let this die. I'm not one to talk but it seems you don't know a huge deal about Sonic (not that you can really be blamed on that matter)

I'm still fairly new to actually putting a lot of thought into using Sonic even though he's currently my secondary and a lot of stuff has been already said but...I'll try give my opinion anyway

Sonic is better than a lot of people think. The first time I faced a truly good Sonic who knew what they were doing, I was very impressed at the amount of thought that was put into their playing

Just like the Sonic games themselves, it's not all about rushing in just because you're fast - you're much better taking things slower despite being the fastest character in the game. Sonic has a lot of tricks up his sleeve which is saying a lot considering he doesn't have sleeves. There is a whole range of things he can do, mainly with his spindashes (I'm not going to say what because I'm still trying to get my head around them and there's really quite a lot anyway). This makes predicting Sonic somewhat difficult as a good Sonic user can completely alter their playing, forcing you to change how you cope fighting Sonic

Nothing has really been said about Sonics recovery. It's very good. Spinshots/homing attack/Up + B give him a reasonably versatile recovery. Sonic is one of those characters you generally have to outright kill rather than get gimps and the like. His Up + B, the Spring, not only gives him very good vertical recovery but is an effective combo escaper and if you use it in the air, the Spring gives you a free 4% if it hits someone

Having said that, Sonic is held back by his horrible priority and poor range. Sonic has lots of nifty tricks but a lot of characters can overwhelm Sonic with a combination of priority and range, making it difficult for Sonic to actually pull off stuff. When I was fighting Sonic with my Peach, the majority of the time if I was worried about something hitting me, all I had to do was use Nair and it would stop most of the things coming at me

Sonic is not going to be a top tier character. He's a good character with lots of tricks and has an excellent punishment game with a combination of fast speed and feints but some characters like Meta Knight simply outclass him in priority/range. A great character that requires a lot of patience to play


...am I doing it right you guys?

 

[Jim Morrison]

Lol Rick I meant Sonic boards with we.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Lol Rick I meant Sonic boards with we.

Ah right They do one every week for each character. This week happens to be Sonic. They make the SBR discussion public after a week and post the sticky in the respective character board

Next week could be anyone...anyone remaining that hasn't been done that is

Spoiler

It's probably Yoshi. It always is

 

[Jim Morrison]

Yes Rick I know that, but they give WTFHAX clues. Just be like YOUR TOOO SLOW LOL STEAK.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Yes Rick I know that, but they give WTFHAX clues. Just be like YOUR TOOO SLOW LOL STEAK.

Harder clues make it more interesting Besides, they got complaints in previous characters abuot the hints being too easy...so yea, they made them harder

 

[Overswarm]

If you guys don't like our discussion, add to it... then prove us wrong with vids!

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

If you guys don't like our discussion, add to it... then prove us wrong with vids!

Meh, I sadly can't take vids but my Sonic isn't great anyway.

Lol, getting something out of the Sonic mains is like trying to get blood out of a stone
Or steak out of a stone in this paticular case

But yea, I agree that vids of Sonic would help. Who in the SBR uses Sonic as their main if you don't mind me asking?

 

[Tenki]

Kel does.

 

[Jim Morrison]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QMRTsGfy0c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1bDV10-6uU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZN_SSH1rbLk

BTW, your right, Sonic sucks on paper.

 

[Tenki]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QMRTsGfy0c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1bDV10-6uU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZN_SSH1rbLk

BTW, your right, Sonic sucks on paper.

I'm pretty sure that they know about most of the stuff in the first vid.

The second vid was wifi, the Link was, sadly, horrible, and I did too much stuff just to be flashy. I don't know how many times I did ASC > Grab. Against a better player, it would have been punished SOOO much lol. Like wanting to do a U-throw kill at the end, but screwd up and did an ASC kill.

 

[Jim Morrison]

Sonic has to be flashy, otherwise... What would we have (Steak excluded)?

 

[Dark Sonic]

^^Why use such old vids?
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=8jEtEQDFj08
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=jKA5lgGpQIU
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=gzdRrh66lco
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=oyy1PJnjaUE
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=nwlke7Ekv1k

 

[Jim Morrison]

Why so serious? It's Sonic boards.

 

[CaliburChamp]

Sonic on paper makes him look like a horrible character, which he is because match up charts dont measure mindgame tricks. However, Sonic has loads of mind games with spin dash cancels, ASC to grab, spin shots, being able to move up in the air real quick (spring) being able to move down quick (D-air) and his insane run speed is alot more controllable with shield cancels. You have to play Sonic alot to get good with him more so than any other character. Which is why we don't see him represented in many big tournaments and also because he has alot of bad match ups, so the player has to know their opponents character well to trick them to whiff an attack or make a mistake.

 

[Chis]

Many of us who are quite knowledgeable about a subject don't have the time nor the will to discuss it (I, for one, know everything you people are posting about Sonic). Mostly because nobody gives a **** about Sonic. You guys call the top players ignorant? Wanna know why they are ignorant?(Lol) Its because it doesn't matter if they know everything or not. There aren't many Sonics out there than can pose a problem to most high level players. Want to educate the top players about how good Sonic is? Then get better.

I find it silly how high and mighty some of you act. I'm not blaming all of you, but it truly astounds me the lengths to which some members will go just to act out and get attention.

*: Meta Knight
S: Snake, (King Dedede, Wario)
A: (Mr. Game & Watch, Marth), (Olimar, ROB, Falco, Lucario, Diddy Kong), (Kirby, Donkey Kong, Peach)
B: (Pikachu, Ice Climbers), Wolf, Sonic, (Zelda/Sheik, Zero Suit Samus, Pit, Toon Link)
C: Luigi, (Bowser, Fox, Ike), Mario
D: Yoshi, Captain Falcon, Lucas, Link
E: (Pokémon Trainer, Ness, Jigglypuff), Samus, Ganondorf

DETAILS

[18 Sonic (12 top8, 3 top4, 2 top2, 5 wins) - 71.5 - 23

Sonic is standard. And If you're not going to bother the point of this thread is...?

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Chis, isn't that really only the first time Sonics been in B rank though? I'm pretty sure it's not been consistant - Sonic's been in D rank for the majority of his results

And Samurai, just because you yourself don't care about Sonic, can you actually say that no one cares about Sonic? You've shown several times that you're very biased against Sonic and whilst I understand the amount of spam you sometimes have to deal with in here must be incredibly irritating and I don't blame you for hating Sonic, generalizing that nobody cares sounds completely untrue. So unless you can actually provide us with evidence that nobody does care about Sonic (hard to believe since the SBR all contributed towards this thread) I refuse to believe that statement. Take Anther for example. Would he have picked Sonic up if he really hadn't cared about him?

They are calling the 'top players' ignorant because if you use the evidence from the Back Room to conclude what Sonic is like (which is what a lot of people rely on when concluding their opinions on characters) then I know enough about Sonic to know that the majority of the stuff said about Sonic isn't paticularly accurate. If you knew so much about Sonic and all the stuff that the Sonic mains posted after it was opened to the public, why didn't you say it. I get you hate Sonic but really, can you blame them for thinking you lot ignorant especially when you didn't post stuff that may have changed their opinion on your discussion? That's really poor attitude on your behalf if you didn't say it simply because you don't like Sonic. I respect you and all that but I can't help but shake the impression that you're not making any effort at all. You don't have the time or will to discuss it? Time - fair enough but will? That's a poor excuse. I thought your job as an SBR member was to find/discuss everything their is about every character

I'm not saying the Sonic mains are in the right either because their reaction to this could have been a bit more helpful and less rude. But seriously, if everyone as you implied it feels this way about Sonic, a character who is no way going to get higher than mid tier, what's the point in the Back Room discussing characters who are even lower? I don't want to fall out with you but...not posting information just because no one supposdly cares really doesn't improve characters meta games and it certainly doesn't help in the creation of a tier list does it?

Like Chis said, then the point of this thread is...?

 

[Chis]

Chis, isn't that really only the first time Sonics been in B rank though? I'm pretty sure it's not been consistant - Sonic's been in D rank for the majority of his results.

It's based on all of his results and compared to the rest of the cast. It shows them that Sonic can be tournament worthy and can perform well at higher levels. Has Roy posted yet?

Also I'm sure that the 'can't be bothered' thing is an excuse. Because 'Its because it doesn't matter if they know everything or not. There aren't many Sonics out there than can pose a problem to most high level players' in your own words. So this makes me think that this is the best you can do (Yet to be proved other wise) or couldn't you really be bother which is kind of sad.

 

[memphischains]

I can't believe some of the things I have been reading in here.

This thread proves I'm right.

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

It's based on all of his results and compared to the rest of the cast. It shows them that Sonic can be tournament worthy and can perform well at higher levels. Has Roy posted yet?

Also I'm sure that the 'can't be bothered' thing is an excuse. Because 'Its because it doesn't matter if they know everything or not. There aren't many Sonics out there than can pose a problem to most high level players' in your own words. So this makes me think that this is the best you can do (Yet to be proved other wise) or couldn't you really be bother which is kind of sad.

Is this for all of his results so far? I'm not saying its very impressive but I just thought I'd point it out

Is that 2nd paragraph aimed at me?

 

[Chis]

Is this for all of his results so far? I see.

Is that 2nd paragraph aimed at me?

No, it's aimed at SP.

 

[memphischains]

why didn't Kel give any more input on this?

hes like, our only rep

 

[ROOOOY!]

Attacks are easily telegraphed?
That's a player attribute, being predictable, not a character attribute.
SBR might know anything about Sonic, but this is basic intelligence.

The fact that they say he has poor aerial ability, which is the only proper point they made other than saying 'lol sonic is fun' is also calamitously wrong. 6th highest aerial mobility, fastest with spinshot, which can be attacked out of.

I'm sure most Sonic players saw this ignorance coming >_>

This is absolutely laughable. Good god.

I'm still sifting through this garbage. More comments to follow.

 

[Jim Morrison]

Just... Let this die, we don't honestly need it. The less they know about us, the more we know about them... Yeeeeeessss, let us be.

 

[MarKO X]

lol @ this whole thingy.

First of all, Eddress had the best post from the SBR. (Sonic SatAM theme song fto)

Secondly, I agree with Gf2tw... that clue was ****ing ridiculous.

And finally... forget the SBRs post. Sure, it's not gonna bring in ppl to play Sonic, but you know what... do we really need more noobs coming in and saying "OMG! Look what I discovered! You can uair spring jump uair for a Star KO!"?

I mean, Sonic is a difficult character to pick up and understand (thus the postings in the SBR). We main Sonic, and we've maining him for the lifespan of the game. While I do think it's a little unfair that their synopsis is solely based on what Sonic is on paper and not so much his full scale abilities, kinda like what they did with other characters, I think it's kinda accurate... ignorant, but accurate. That doesn't make much sense, does it?

Oh yeah, they do fail for not mentioning steak. If they really knew as much as they claim about Sonic, they'd mention steak in the synopsis. Period.

 

[ROOOOY!]

I am in complete and absolute disbelief with this whole topic.

"Good Sonic's do nothing different from bad Sonic's".

I remember reading. It's probably the least true and most provably wrong statement I've read on this forum in two years. It was from the SBR too hahaha.

 

[Chis]

What does Mr. 3000 and the like do with him that is different? From what I've seen, all the "good" Sonic players do is no different than the "bad" Sonic players... the good sonic players just do it better and call their opponent on more.

It seems Sonic's entire game is based around punishment.

This statement...is so wrong...

Also many of you are saying bad players=Sonic is bad which is completely false. There are some many things wrong in those three pages but luckily some of them have already been addressed. There are so many false statements made about Sonic (air speed, exaggerated killing and priority problems), generalizations ect.

I...

 

[memphischains]

its depressing to know that the people calling the shots are the people who have no idea whats going on in this thread

 

[infomon]

I think the best way to fight sonic is to throw out attacks as quickly as possible and to pretend his attacks don't exist. It works alarmingly well.

I facepalmed so hard at this. Then on reflection, it may be the case. One of Sonic's greatest attributes is that all his "approaches" are non-approaches; he's got a ton of options to cancel a ton of different ways to come at you from any angle. So if you try to respond, Sonic will punish. He just has to be smart enough to know how to evade whatever hitboxes you're slinging out, but if you're ignoring the Sonic then he can't force particular responses lol.

But I still think it's silly.... Sonics have defensive options too >.>

First of all, Eddress had the best post from the SBR. (Sonic SatAM theme song fto)

fto? fto = for the own? or, what?

its depressing to know that the people calling the shots are the people who have no idea whats going on in this thread

Can you blame them? We need to step it up /lamejoke. The SBR is too busy dealing exclusively with high-tiers and MK meta-dominance. In fact, OS' comments sure sound like he's given up even thinking about other characters, since he's convinced that MK is way above the rest of the cast, so can answer everything the other characters have to offer without penalty. And he doesn't mind encouraging MK-hatred in every thread he posts in lol.

Yes, MK is a brutal matchup for Sonic, but that might not be the best way to consider Sonic's strengths. Unfortunately, Sonic vs. even or good matchups is irrelevant to the SBR if there are only a handful of tournament-viable characters, and Sonic doesn't have a great matchup against any of them. (arguable)

But yeah, I wonder how many of the posters even know what an ASC or spinshot is, and how they're essential to Sonic's gameplay.

 

[ROOOOY!]

We should just give up.
Education can't save ignorance/bias.

 

[memphischains]

its hard to tell if they are serious,
which is a problem

 

[Flayl]

I didn't think character discussions could get any worse than Kirby's. I am proven wrong.

 

[ROOOOY!]

The entire first few pages of this thread could have just been scrubs drool and I wouldn't have noticed the difference.
It's absolutely ridiculous how they failed to mention anything good about Sonic at all.
And how a group like that are qualified to be looked up to and have their information widely accepted for truth by the public, I don't know.

I thought the Peach write-up was bad.. D:

 

[Chis]

SP says they couldn't be bothered to go into detail and didn't care in general but it looks to me like they were serious. No wonder they were looking for applications the other day.

They better let Tenki in...

 

[ROOOOY!]

They should let SonicX>9000 or me in after that rubbish.
It's just sad to see that they did no research at all in our boards, despite us having a lot of legit good information. Which they really should've considering none of them main him/know anything about him.
And to say they didn't care enough to do it properly, well that's not really a good enough excuse.

It's just annoying, and really unprofessional.

 

[MarKO X]

yes, fto = for the ownage

i "came up with it" yesterday with Obama's stunning results in the election.