Padô
Smash Lord
I pick GW in this match up.
It *****.
It *****.
-
Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
Wario Q&A Thread
- Thread starter ssbbFICTION
- Start date
Gichan
Smash Champion
Thanks for the suggestions for counterpicks agianst ROB, I always thought that Brinstar was good for ROB.
And I read a post about suggesting to smash DI up against bair, is that also effective for nair?
And I read a post about suggesting to smash DI up against bair, is that also effective for nair?
omegablackmage
Certified Lion Rider
when i mained gw, i think i only got punished for nairing somone maybe once. you should probably di up most of the time, but you only save yourself a fraction of the time, sometimes avoiding the final hit of it.
not infinite, and doesnt lead into a kill move, but it puts you in kill%, more info on the cg here: http://allisbrawl.com/blogpost.aspx?id=12813
The CG on Bowser is guaranteed if you buffer it correctly til about 160. Up until around 140 you can buffer in a halfwaft and hit him b/c he's tremendous.
ssbbFICTION
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2008
- Messages
- 2,535
According to Kprime who knows all, you can half waft bowser till 100 or so and CG him to about 140 into idk he might have said fsmash or walking grab. It was weird but the buffered one works till around 140.
Only the first hit of bite registers for refreshing moves, much like the first pummel in a grab is the only hit that registers for stale moves.
SDIing up vs GnW's nair is sorta useless. Like you can but it prly wont do much good. IMO it would be better to just DI a direction that would get u out of another nair combo opportunity as best you could. Don't get naired at low percents, try to stay near the ground.
Only the first hit of bite registers for refreshing moves, much like the first pummel in a grab is the only hit that registers for stale moves.
SDIing up vs GnW's nair is sorta useless. Like you can but it prly wont do much good. IMO it would be better to just DI a direction that would get u out of another nair combo opportunity as best you could. Don't get naired at low percents, try to stay near the ground.
MrEh
Smash Hero
The chaingrab is legit. Tested it myself last week.
Gives Bowser another reason to infinite jump like an idiot.
Gives Bowser another reason to infinite jump like an idiot.
omegablackmage
Certified Lion Rider
fiction: if you di up to avoid the last hit, then you can jump out and avoid getting hit by the next one
Legendary Pikachu
Smash Ace
Hi all. Just visiting with a present for everybody.
I was wondering if you guys could make use of this new AT with pikachu? I'm teaming with my bro (arc-thefallen-, plays Toon Link) and am going to advance the technique. Here's the original post AND video! ^_^ enjoy!
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8104088&postcount=14
Thanks for the time. Hope you like and laugh. Please pm me if you have any neat contributions or comments--i'd appreciate that. :D
I was wondering if you guys could make use of this new AT with pikachu? I'm teaming with my bro (arc-thefallen-, plays Toon Link) and am going to advance the technique. Here's the original post AND video! ^_^ enjoy!
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8104088&postcount=14
Thanks for the time. Hope you like and laugh. Please pm me if you have any neat contributions or comments--i'd appreciate that. :D
BOB SAGET!
Smash Lord
what aerial used for momentum cancelling
BOB SAGET!
Smash Lord
Humpy Thrashabout
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2009
- Messages
- 294
In the absence of a Wario GD I figured this would be the place to ask. Anyone going to SNES? I live in Massachusetts so I might just be getting hyped, but this seems like it's going to be huge. What kind of big names are going to be there?
I know Darc, Dazwa, and Fatal are going to be representing New England.
I started going through the attendee list on AiB and in just the first two pages I saw Ally, ADHD, and Atomsk. I'm so pumped.
I know Darc, Dazwa, and Fatal are going to be representing New England.
I started going through the attendee list on AiB and in just the first two pages I saw Ally, ADHD, and Atomsk. I'm so pumped.
toobusytocare
Smash Lord
Wait, really?
you airdodge?
I always thought it was using Dair or fast falling a Fair?
EDIT:
Yeah, it definately is Dair or if you prefer it, fast falling fair
Fair and Dair are the same speed but dair auto fast falls, making it the easier option.
you airdodge?
I always thought it was using Dair or fast falling a Fair?
EDIT:
Yeah, it definately is Dair or if you prefer it, fast falling fair
Fair and Dair are the same speed but dair auto fast falls, making it the easier option.
stnapknah
Smash Journeyman
you use dair with your c-stick. it is your fastest aerial and it will automatically fastfall. Fair is just as fast, but you will manually have to ff that. However, what dmg was saying was that you can airdodge many frames before you can do an aerial, which is why you have control of wario sooner when using an airdodge rather than a ff aerial. He was wrong because although air dodge ends sooner, it doesn't momentum cancel as well as an aerial. That's why airdodges are only good for bike breaking.
-Darc-
Heir to the Monado
I'm totally not entering Brawl
LOL
Sorry ;_;
also sorry that I name search haha
Popertop
Smash Champion
omegablackmage
Certified Lion Rider
hey fooz, i live in MA, so yours truly wario master will be there.
sluys
Smash Journeyman
good. win plz
Lol I didn't explain myself.
Airdodge is indeed his fastest option that also ends soonest. This is his best option when sent horizontally. When sent vertically, I'm not entirely sure whether airdodge or Aerial-FF is faster (airdodge ends sooner, but as you guys know during an aerial you can fast fall before it ends. IDK if airdodge ends BEFORE that particular point where you can fast fall or not). I know airdodge is faster and ends sooner, but IDK exactly at what frame you can start to fast fall aerials. Who knows, it might be better to airdodge and then fast fall instead of aerial and fast fall. The difference would be minor though, good DI is more important for Wario players than momentum cancelling TBH.
Airdodge is indeed his fastest option that also ends soonest. This is his best option when sent horizontally. When sent vertically, I'm not entirely sure whether airdodge or Aerial-FF is faster (airdodge ends sooner, but as you guys know during an aerial you can fast fall before it ends. IDK if airdodge ends BEFORE that particular point where you can fast fall or not). I know airdodge is faster and ends sooner, but IDK exactly at what frame you can start to fast fall aerials. Who knows, it might be better to airdodge and then fast fall instead of aerial and fast fall. The difference would be minor though, good DI is more important for Wario players than momentum cancelling TBH.
ssbbFICTION
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2008
- Messages
- 2,535
Yah guys DMG is actually right to a point. When sent horizontally with absolutely no chance of dying off the top, and you are going to BIKE BRAKE airdodge is the best. When you are going to die off the top, or just want to slow your vertical momentum, a fast falled aerial is best. If my research is correct, every aerial slows your vertical momentum the same amount as long as u fast fall it, so you can pretty much use any aerial. FFed dair is probably the best option because of autofastfalling but you can also use any other one you want (fair ends the same frame as dair). If you are not going to die off the top and you are not going to die off the side, (you dont need to use an aerial and u arent going to bike brake) then dont do anything. You are better off simply waiting for your hitstun to be over and then moving, since an airdodge doesnt slow you down anyway.
If you simply hate to see your character in tumble then you can just wiggle out (tap the control stick back and forth), but thats fairly useless in this game.
Fast falling after an airdodge doesnt make any sense because the airdodge can begin quicker than an aerial even tho it takes longer than his dair. So because it starts earlier it finishes earlier, but since you can fast fall on like the first frame of dair, it is wayyyy better to use it for vertical momentum cancelling.
:D
If you simply hate to see your character in tumble then you can just wiggle out (tap the control stick back and forth), but thats fairly useless in this game.
Fast falling after an airdodge doesnt make any sense because the airdodge can begin quicker than an aerial even tho it takes longer than his dair. So because it starts earlier it finishes earlier, but since you can fast fall on like the first frame of dair, it is wayyyy better to use it for vertical momentum cancelling.
:D
IDK if you can fast fall on the first frame of Dair, but I do know that frame window is fairly early in Dair. What I was saying was that I'm not sure if you could Dair and fast fall BEFORE airdodge would end. I know you can Dair before Airdodge would end, but I wasn't sure when the fast fall window started. If it's that early, then Dair/Fast fall is indeed the best choice probably.
Also, something to point out, it's true that any aerial will slow you down the same, HOWEVER you want the aerial that starts and ends the fastest so that you regain control of Wario sooner. There's no point in using, say Uair, if the additional lag prevents you from controlling him better.
Also, something to point out, it's true that any aerial will slow you down the same, HOWEVER you want the aerial that starts and ends the fastest so that you regain control of Wario sooner. There's no point in using, say Uair, if the additional lag prevents you from controlling him better.
BOB SAGET!
Smash Lord
thanks for all the help guys. Im new to wario and need to know this stuff. I guess bike breaking is in the wario guide so ill read up on it. Itd be great to fight some of u guys too, and get critiqued. But anyways thanks a lot.
Frame 1 or frame 1 of when the first hitbox is out (meaning like frame 8 for Dair (first hitbox is out frame 8 I believe) and frame 5 or whatever for Fair)? If it's frame 1 period, then Fair/Dair is the best option. If it's frame 1 meaning first frame the hitbox is out, then Fair is actually the better choice since it starts sooner than Dair.
Humpy Thrashabout
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2009
- Messages
- 294
Other than you I don't know a single other Wario main who is going to be there. Hope you do well and I hope I get out of pools.
Also, how effective do you guys think Bike Braking is? I always find that when I try it I end up hitting the blast zone on the bike. I doesn't feel like it stops momentum as well as simple DI and aerial/airdodgeing. Is there a trick to it? Do we have conclusive evidence that it is actually a better option?
I have similar experiences as you, Humpy, so I just use dairs and jump. Fiction says it works for him though.
Padô
Smash Lord
Bike brake HELPS, not as much as bucket but its good.
Maybe Humpy and PX are saying that coz the first time you tried you went through the blastzone mounting the bike which is really common.
Maybe Humpy and PX are saying that coz the first time you tried you went through the blastzone mounting the bike which is really common.
Humpy Thrashabout
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2009
- Messages
- 294
I just feel like the animation getting on the bike is too long. It definitely stops momentum, it might even stop it better than the bucket, but it seems like you have to judge whether or not you have the time for it to take effect.
Looking at it quantitatively:
Airdodge is 39 frames
Bike is 20 frames until the hitbox comes out
Assuming momentum starts changing on the same frame the bike hitbox comes out then you effectively have 1 full second (excluding reaction time) before anything but DI takes effect. That just doesn't seem reasonable. Maybe I'm looking at this wrong. Someone please help me out here.
Looking at it quantitatively:
Airdodge is 39 frames
Bike is 20 frames until the hitbox comes out
Assuming momentum starts changing on the same frame the bike hitbox comes out then you effectively have 1 full second (excluding reaction time) before anything but DI takes effect. That just doesn't seem reasonable. Maybe I'm looking at this wrong. Someone please help me out here.
Like I stated earlier, Bike Braking requires more room/a longer flight distance than one would probably expect. Airdodging however is still the best option when sent horizontally, whether you decide to try and Bike Brake or not.
Humpy Thrashabout
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2009
- Messages
- 294
I apologize DMG. I really didn't believe that Bike Braking was effective. For some reason 1 second seems like I would already be dead. I turned on my Wii and did some training mode **** with Bob-ombs to make sure.
I'm still of the belief that if you perfect DI a horizontal hit then you can survive just as long as Bike Braking. The benefit with Bike Braking seems to be the that you don't need to perfect DI (not that that ever happens). In fact, I could not even DI at all and just AD then bike and I could survive quite well.
I'm still of the belief that if you perfect DI a horizontal hit then you can survive just as long as Bike Braking. The benefit with Bike Braking seems to be the that you don't need to perfect DI (not that that ever happens). In fact, I could not even DI at all and just AD then bike and I could survive quite well.
AlMoStLeGeNdArY
Smash Hero
I have trouble gimping with the bike any tips? Also how do you momentum cancel with Wario?
toobusytocare
Smash Lord
Run off the stage then immediately bike into it
you'll wipe out and your bike will be right on the ledge ready to throw off
Also they say that you can bike break but i have yet to see it actually work so for now i use Dair for Momentum canceling
you'll wipe out and your bike will be right on the ledge ready to throw off
Also they say that you can bike break but i have yet to see it actually work so for now i use Dair for Momentum canceling
Humpy Thrashabout
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2009
- Messages
- 294
Momentum canceling was discussed pretty in depth in the past page and a half of this thread.
To gimp with the bike you can either chase your opponent offstage or autowipe the bike and throw it.
When you auto-wipe you have a few ways to throw it using the control stick and A or using the c-stick. Play around with it and figure out the trajectory of each throw so you know when to use each one. I find that down on the c-stick is the most helpful throw so start with that.
When you chase your opponent offstage you run the risk of getting hit off so save your jumps or make sure you have a charged waft so you can recover. If you drop down and bike you will move slower than if you ride off the stage. That can be useful because you can beat an airdodge. Characters with bad recoveries might not have a single option against the bike. For example:
if fat link is a decent distance from the stage then he has to recover perfectly and predictably. If you ride your bike at him offstage his options are to 1. try and hit you off or 2. try to air dodge through it. With either of those option we would be put in a position too far away from the stage to recover.
To gimp with the bike you can either chase your opponent offstage or autowipe the bike and throw it.
When you auto-wipe you have a few ways to throw it using the control stick and A or using the c-stick. Play around with it and figure out the trajectory of each throw so you know when to use each one. I find that down on the c-stick is the most helpful throw so start with that.
When you chase your opponent offstage you run the risk of getting hit off so save your jumps or make sure you have a charged waft so you can recover. If you drop down and bike you will move slower than if you ride off the stage. That can be useful because you can beat an airdodge. Characters with bad recoveries might not have a single option against the bike. For example:
if fat link is a decent distance from the stage then he has to recover perfectly and predictably. If you ride your bike at him offstage his options are to 1. try and hit you off or 2. try to air dodge through it. With either of those option we would be put in a position too far away from the stage to recover.