Official Viability Ratings v2 | Competitive Impressions

[ParanoidDrone]

so why is everyone crying about tournament mode?
so far I'm in two 1v1 competitive tournamentsa one with customs on(miis on) and customs off (miis on), 2 stock 8 minutes competitive stages only, no problems.
if there are 3 players on the lobby one instantly leaves

I don't even know how tournament mode works in general yet. Hoping to dig up information about it later today.

 

[Balgorxz]

I don't even know how tournament mode works in general yet. Hoping to dig up information about it later today.

they are not easy to understand, most of people think you can only play with items lol

 

[NachoOfCheese]

I'm calling it right now. People are going to cry about this:
http://youtu.be/tR8LVDb8WZI
I'm not entirely sure how they can justify making DK this good.
I'm not one to get on board hype trains that easily (like when people thought Lucas was better than Ness) but I am 100% sure that this takes DK's competitive viability to upper mid tier.
Like, do you guys actually know what this means?
-The ZSS matchup is no longer a hard-counter because she falls victim to this as a fast faller and lightweight (it's still a hard matchup, but it's doable now.
-Counterpicking stages against DK becomes more difficult. He now benefits a TON from low ceilings such as on Dreamland or Halberd.
-Lightweights and fastfallers: beware (looking at you, Falcon, Diddy, Fox and Sheik)

Basically, 5 top tier matchups go from being very hard to just bad/winnable. These matchups really held DK back (among other things) and now they're not as bad.
Oh and did I mention that DK's grab range is really good? And you can confirm it with Jab-> Grab or Dtilt ->grab.
Do not misunderstand. DK isn't suddenly broken or anything. He isn't top tier. He still loses to those characters but now he at least has something on them other than weight.
This is huge.

 

[Emblem Lord]

I will see ANY DK with my Ryu.

Lets go.

 

[FullMoon]

Seems like quite a few characters got just the right buffs.

Greninja, Robin, Doc, DK, wow.

I really like what they did to Greninja's shuriken, it's more useful but not as abusive as it was on release because the ending lag is still there. Being able to short hop double shuriken still helps his zoning a lot and he forces approaches really well now, characters that struggle to approach are really going to suffer against him.

His bad OoS options are still there, but he does need a weakness. Sakurai was super on-point with his buffs, I'm very impressed.

 

[DunnoBro]

Like the crazy thing is luigi has such a hard and consistent air dodge punish game that he doesn't even really need that many true combos

You'd still get mad free stuff because people won't wanna get read and die at 50% to fbp

All the true combos do is take the middleman out and make it totally braindead.

 

[NachoOfCheese]

I will see ANY DK with my Ryu.

Lets go.

When did I say DK could beat Ryu? Ryu makes DK approach and DK can't approach. The buffs were great and all but as long as that's true Ryu pretty much wins that matchup.
But I'd still love to fight your Ryu tbh.

 

[Man Li Gi]

Can people stop talking about DK? Seriously, just ignore him. The more people think he sucks......you know where I'm getting at. I'll gladly take buffs because he "sucks". If the 5 DK mains keep praising their character, they will end like CF (a character who was quite overrated but continuously receives nerfs because of how much people play/talk about him). Let people think DK sucks so more things could come out the wood work (like changing fair from a spike to a regular fair thus adding the possibility for it to AC out of SH because that's what really is holding back the move's usage).
@ NachoOfCheese
@anyone speaking about DK in positive light. Just keep complaining and whining......it works.

@ Emblem Lord
Challenge Accepted. When do you want to spar?

 

[migul]

Bruh. Shut up.

Keep quiet about Fire Emblem buffs. We need people to think they suck so they keep getting more.

Robin mains please chill. jesus christ.

Don't worry fam. As long as Japan thinks they suck you're good.

 

[DunnoBro]

Real talk who doesn't make donkey kong approach

 

[ParanoidDrone]

WFT got +2 KBG on all her smashes and aerials. How significant is this change, though?

 

[Man Li Gi]

Real talk who doesn't make donkey kong approach

Spacing characters and non projectile characters. I know I just chill whenever I play Marth/Lucina, Ganon, Ike, Mac, Kirby, Roy....to name a few.

 

[Dabuz]

*Sees DK and Robin getting low % hoo-hahs*

*Remembers I live in the region with DKWill and Nairo*

Oh...well...ok then Sakurai

 

[meleebrawler]

Can people stop talking about DK? Seriously, just ignore him. The more people think he sucks......you know where I'm getting at. I'll gladly take buffs because he "sucks". If the 5 DK mains keep praising their character, they will end like CF (a character who was quite overrated but continuously receives nerfs because of how much people play/talk about him). Let people think DK sucks so more things could come out the wood work (like changing fair from a spike to a regular fair thus adding the possibility for it to AC out of SH because that's what really is holding back the move's usage).
@ NachoOfCheese
@anyone speaking about DK in positive light. Just keep complaining and whining......it works.

@ Emblem Lord
Challenge Accepted. When do you want to spar?

Falcon hasn't received that many nerfs, the biggest one he got was his uair and even then it still does it's job really
well, only killing a little later. His relatively disappointing results definitely seem not to warrant consecutive nerfs, but he is still
spoken highly of so buffs are unlikely either.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Seems like quite a few characters got just the right buffs.

Greninja, Robin, Doc, DK, wow.

G&W has received massive buffs as well. Bair, Nair, Jab 1 and Fsmash are all noticeably better now.

 

[Emblem Lord]

What doesnt kill us makes us STRONGER, Samuel!!!!!

@ Man Li Gi Where do you live?

 

[ParanoidDrone]

*Sees DK and Robin getting low % hoo-hahs*

*Remembers I live in the region with DKWill and Nairo*

Oh...well...ok then Sakurai

I think Robin's hoohah only starts working at like 85% or so? Character dependent of course. Also it's been dubbed the Checkmate.

And honestly, Robin needed all the help he could get. Although your personal situation is ripe with schadenfreude.

 

[NachoOfCheese]

*Sees DK and Robin getting low % hoo-hahs*

*Remembers I live in the region with DKWill and Nairo*

Oh...well...ok then Sakurai

It's okay man. It's not like DK can get in on Rosalina.
Or Olimar.

 

[Vipermoon]

Check then mate. I like it.

 

[Smog Frog]

its not like he can kill at like 50% with rage w/ the banana slamma lol, not the case at all!

 

[FullMoon]

G&W has received massive buffs as well. Bair, Nair, Jab 1 and Fsmash are all noticeably better now.

Yet Samus is left to rot lol.

I think Robin's hoohah only starts working at like 85% or so? Character dependent of course. Also it's been dubbed the Checkmate.

And honestly, Robin needed all the help he could get. Although your personal situation is ripe with schadenfreude.

I could only get it to work on 117% on Mario, that might be me though.

 

[Mr. Johan]

I think Robin's hoohah only starts working at like 85% or so? Character dependent of course. Also it's been dubbed the Checkmate.

Yeah, 85% or so.

But Dthrow -> Usmash kills as well, and earlier on certain characters, thanks to the Usmash range buff.

And that's assuming Robin doesn't cut the middleman out and read the airdodge and kill you with partially charged Fsmash at 75%.

bcasjddfskhfskjlk

 

[WolfieXVII ❂]

Kirby buffssss
Fthrow is soooo useful
Another utilt juggle setup
Last patch it was a dthrow damage buff
Next patch uthrow better kill like Charizards : ^ )

 

[thehard]

No Rosa nerfs though @ Dabuz !

 

[Man Li Gi]

Falcon hasn't received that many nerfs, the biggest one he got was his uair and even then it still does it's job really
well, only killing a little later. His relatively disappointing results definitely seem not to warrant consecutive nerfs, but he is still
spoken highly of so buffs are unlikely either.

His jab range has been nerfed. Uair was such a make break move to CF that it did hurt though it still combos. Nerfed power on downward Fsmash means the one move that hits crouched characters with High knockback only helps my feelings towards him. The nerfs aren't the worst, but since they affect his best moves and like I said being overrated, it doesn't help at all.

@ Emblem Lord
I live in a suburb of Chicago. I can give specifics, but people don't know the Midwest and think we free.

 

[DunnoBro]

The duck hunt "buffs" are depressingly pointless.

 

[Ffamran]

Captain Falcon's rapid jab finisher was pretty ridiculous... Now it's not. His jab 1, jab 2, and jab 3 (the Gentleman's finisher and rapid jab) were left untouched.

 

[Vipermoon]

His jab range has been nerfed. Uair was such a make break move to CF that it did hurt though it still combos. Nerfed power on downward Fsmash means the one move that hits crouched characters with High knockback only helps my feelings towards him. The nerfs aren't the worst, but since they affect his best moves and like I said being overrated, it doesn't help at all.

@ Emblem Lord
I live in a suburb of Chicago. I can give specifics, but people don't know the Midwest and think we free.

I honestly heard Chicago and Ohio were free but Michigan definitely isn't.

 

[NachoOfCheese]

its not like he can kill at like 50% with rage w/ the banana slamma lol, not the case at all!

Are we calling it that? I am a full supporter of calling it the Banana Slamma. All in favor?
In all seriousness, DK still loses that matchup. How are you supposed to get out of disadvantage and what does DK have in neutral?

 

[Gamegenie222]

His jab range has been nerfed. Uair was such a make break move to CF that it did hurt though it still combos. Nerfed power on downward Fsmash means the one move that hits crouched characters with High knockback only helps my feelings towards him. The nerfs aren't the worst, but since they affect his best moves and like I said being overrated, it doesn't help at all.

@ Emblem Lord
I live in a suburb of Chicago. I can give specifics, but people don't know the Midwest and think we free.

The Midwest struggles. As least Chicago has JJrockets. And try being in Nebraska lmao.

 

[Smog Frog]

i was implying that the numbers dont matter in vs because if you **** up once you're dead at 50. not unlike . i'd be hasty on calling it worse than 6:4, since now she has to worry ALOT about being grabbed. with rage, its as simple as getting 1-2 hits and blowing her away. and dk has actual mobility and a decent grab range.

also, how volatile is this mu on halberd? both characters dying sub 50% on easy stuff is hilarious

and dk has cargo up toss->aerial up b for like 30% at lower %.

 

[Ffamran]

The Midwest struggles. As least Chicago has JJrockets. And try being in Nebraska lmao.

Illinois had Akiro; he's living in Wisconsin, but is still considered an Illinois rep. There's also Greenbeast, a monster Olimar player. As for Wisconsin... I don't know... The only thing WI has is Frootloop, but he's a Melee player.

 

[Gamegenie222]

Illinois had Akiro; he's living in Wisconsin, but is still considered an Illinois rep. There's also Greenbeast, a monster Olimar player. As for Wisconsin... I don't know... The only thing WI has is Frootloop, but he's a Melee player.

I know who those people are don't worry.

 

[Man Li Gi]

Illinois had Akiro; he's living in Wisconsin, but is still considered an Illinois rep. There's also Greenbeast, a monster Olimar player. As for Wisconsin... I don't know... The only thing WI has is Frootloop, but he's a Melee player.

So sad about Akiro. Plus what gets me, is my parents hate whenever I drive to Chicago cuz of Chiraq.

 

[NachoOfCheese]

i was implying that the numbers dont matter in vs because if you **** up once you're dead at 50. not unlike . i'd be hasty on calling it worse than 6:4, since now she has to worry ALOT about being grabbed. with rage, its as simple as getting 1-2 hits and blowing her away. and dk has actual mobility and a decent grab range.

also, how volatile is this mu on halberd? both characters dying sub 50% on easy stuff is hilarious

and dk has cargo up toss->aerial up b for like 30% at lower %.

This is true.

 

[Ffamran]

I know who those people are don't worry.

Nobody even knows who they are. Greenbeast giving trouble to Dabuz's Rosalina as Olimar doesn't do anything. I guess it's like Hawaii, but the Midwest is in the middle of the states instead of being a series of islands away from the mainland or Alaska. It's west vs. east coast with the Midwest just being there. I didn't know who they were until Keitaro, False, and Dabuz showed up to kick ***, well, False and Dabuz did while Keitaro was suffering from a mains crisis. Wisconsin's even worse because it's a Melee state with the stream called "MeleeMilwaukee". It doesn't even help that in this little isolated region, WI never shows up on Events2Compete's stream.

Akiro was and still is despite living in WI, Chicago's best Sheik and Greenbeast is an Olimar and Luigi main. Borrowed from the PR ranking thread. Sage and Sturm's usually the commentators.

Spoiler

Updated: 7/20/15
Source: http://chicagosm4sh.blogspot.com/
Graphic: https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/t31.0-8/11221487_10153201010189160_1448517947965399753_o.jpg

1. Akiro
2. Sheldon
3. JJROCKETS
4. GreenBeast
5. JTWild
6. Nite
7. Bo X7
8. Demitus
9. GamerHead22/Semoponume
10. Dan
11) Knubs
12) Shion
13) Shevy
14) Sage
15) Lefty
16) Hoenn
17) zStorm
18) iTony
19) SlowJoe
20) XYZ
21) Blind
22) DOM
23) Naoto
24) Santo
25) Lord Sturm

 

[CommanderRin]

People talking about regions that are "free" and I'm just sitting here in Alberta Canada...

Marcina buffs were good but they aren't doing enough to distinguish each other. Marth is always better than Lucina and I want them to change up Lucina's game plan instead of just copy pasting Marth changes on to her.

Overall though I'm glad the Falchions got another meaningful buff. Heres to hopefully next balance patch helping their grab game

 

[Emblem Lord]

People talking about regions that are "free" and I'm just sitting here in Alberta Canada...

Marcina buffs were good but they aren't doing enough to distinguish each other. Marth is always better than Lucina and I want them to change up Lucina's game plan instead of just copy pasting Marth changes on to her.

Overall though I'm glad the Falchions got another meaningful buff. Heres to hopefully next balance patch helping their grab game

I'm getting really tired of Marth/Lucina mains trying to make Roy not matter.

Cut that bull**** out.

 

[bc1910]

Shuirkens are hilarious now

At release you had to worry about their tick throw setups but their startup was really bad, and this made them less effective for camping (though still very good).

They now have faster startup and last for about 44 total frames. They retain their fast travel speed and good range. They are SO good for forcing approaches.

I love this patch

 

[CommanderRin]

I'm getting really tired of Marth/Lucina mains trying to make Roy not matter.

Cut that bull**** out.

*shrugs*
I'd rather they get something like that over free spacing tools that make approaching them stupid.

In my opinion, if throws knock-back was changed to make the positional advantage more meaningful Marth would be fine. I feel like his throws minus Up-throw are a little too lack luster.

I don't mean to imply that they need combo throws like the majority of the cast.

Maybe I'm not informed enough to talk about this though I can just shut up until I'm in a position where my thoughts are interesting and reasonable.