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The Winning Steak Cinemas: Video Archive & Criticism Thread Updated

Espy Rose

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Hey guys, some new videos of mine came in from HOBO 27:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6MCX8vKo5M - Espy (Sonic) + Zori (Olimar) vs. Trela (Lucario) + Ozz (Fox/Marth) 1-3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_iafcWwBz4 - Espy (Sonic) + Zori (Olimar) vs. Trela (Lucario) + Ozz (Marth) 4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZrooOgg9bU - Espy (Sonic) + Zori (Olimar) vs. RoyR (Marth) + K Prime (Pikachu) 1-2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_pD9E3ldTg - Espy (Sonic) vs. P4 (Meta Knight) 1-2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tl6tBUqRB5Q - Espy (Sonic) vs. Ozz (Fox) 1-2

You can see some of my SD-savvy-ness in these videos. It's hilariously bad.
 

Espy Rose

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I love the part in the video where I try to see how many times I can grab him before I get KO'd.
Delicious.
 

B.A.M.

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its not beating our uair from underneath. Sorry for all the grammatical errors, as i was typing it before my way to class.

@ Espy: Sorry if you feel my critique was ill-hearted or inaccurate information. I was just trying give my 2 cents on the matchup, just to see if any of it resonates with you or not. Ill just keep it to myself next time, as seems to always be the case with you. My apologizes.
 

Espy Rose

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The problem, BAM, is that you're looking into videos from sets that are more or less outdated.
I have a tough time "learning" anything when the critics pretty much reinforce what I have already learned.

Oh, and don't apologize. You've done nothing wrong. I appreciate the sentiments, but it just comes at a bad time, if that makes any sense.

PS: Yes, the video of the ZSS says August 31st, and I thought the comments had made some remark to the date being that of A.L.S., but there isn't, so there was just a mis-communication of that part.

A.L.S. was July 24th, about 2 months ago. It's just been too long at that point.

Now, if you interviewed my recent vids, then I'm pretty sure we could dissect them more efficiently.
 

Tesh

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Youtube finally allowed me to upload my other videos (4th time is the charm).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahHwXbmWSV8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msXyhkjEJXA

I could use some help on this matchup as well, we were talking a little during the matches and neither of us really knew what DK should be doing against sonic (aside from punching iSDRs).

Also Espy, are the Diddy Kong and Metaknight in this video Lee Martin and Gnes?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcfI1LfuqOg

P.S. Could anyone critique my videos for me and leave comments somewhere I can read? I feel kinda stuck in a rut with my sonic and I'm trying to get better.
 

B.A.M.

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fair enough Espy. I know you are very knowledge with our character ( wouldnt be asking you tons of questions from time to time if i didnt.) Maybe i have been getting to videos too late. I had no clue that video was old. Especially cuz i just saw it posted up approx. 2 days ago or something by shlike. I appreciate the reply, and i know the majority of stuff im going to say u probably know the bulk of it; i just say it really for all the other sonic main on the boards or lurkers really. Let me critique some of those recent vids, a critique from fresh eyes always helps.
 

B.A.M.

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DOUBLE POST:

So i went through your recent Nike vids Espy. I must say you played it very well. A very good blend of run-based and spin dash. Good ASCSC>uair OoS cross up. That is something that ive been a strong advocate for and that was a very brilliant use of it. In a couple of other instances you pulled a uair OoS which was very great however you rushed your follow ups and especially in the cases where Nike used his DJ i would have ff after the initial missed aerial and land camped. Especially with Marths recovery, one decent read could net you a gimp.

Also something that helps vs Marth from time to time is a delayed sh uair ( so you can auto cancel right after the second hitbox is out) then utilt if theyre close or ftilt to reach them. ftilt is especially useful in the case of Marth because if you follow their aerial movement and land an ftilt you can expect usually a free follow up courtesy of your dash shield and land camping. This ftilt could also be a setup to edgeguard him, again especially if u catch in his DJ.

Saw you were going for some side b hop foostool shenanigans. the footstool was good as it nets you that simple tech chase that you are well aware of. Good to see your use of dtilt, as a combo starter its so solid. dtilt>dash attack is awesome, though i wish afterwards you would dash shield to his inevitable landing for the grab. He wasnt really DJ to safety most of the time, so read that and take advantage because such player habits make it exponentially easier for Sonic to gain a follow up.

While you definitely dominated him with tons of pressure with good use of air chasing and what not, you have to sometime reap the benefits of your toils. What i mean by that is, when you would get mad aggressive and do an austonding string, Nike became even more aggressive alot of occasions. Take that knowledge and get your easy grabs/ aerials from your dash shield. While you definitely did well on your own, I believe that playing reactive on an opponent like Nike(swinging that disjoint) would have net you easier damage.

Some bairs here and there couldve used better spacing but besides that; you did quite well. I love platform cancelling; we look so fast doing it. I love that you are aware of the height your opponent will be for follow ups on uair OoS , keep on doing that.

EDIT: its funny because you used sh uair> ftilt vs Ozz. well done. remember to treat tipper dtilt for sonic is the equivalent of MK's dtilt if it doesnt trip so remember that because its always another follow up option. OH and learn to be comfortable holding side b hop to release when the opponent AD or aerials. its VERY amazing. Id say you were going too aggro vs Ozz when you were in kill percents. that usmash needs to be respected. Glad to see bair>dtilt lock although u kind of messed it up, but the application was great and im sure next time ull get the ftilt + follow up, or grab+ follow up next time. I have never gotten the chance to play TKDs fox except a looooooong time ago so its hard to give you advice on a strong fox that Ozz is bringing to the table. However he goes VERY aerial minded at times and really identifying this and holding side b works wonders because he either has to fall and AD or aerial, any one of them u just wait for the cool down and release. utilize that as ur combo starter as ur follow up espy are always good. Its just a less riskier starter. Thats what i think you need majority of the time; your mixups are good, but some of them have a little too much risk involved. Granted im sure you buffer an escape when you can, but if an opponent that good is making the same approach you gotta bust side b out and let him know ' that dont work against Sonic'.

You spaced very well Espy and your follow ups make me proud. It really is just an issue of your initial hit ideas sometimes if that makes any sense. As you are already aware, get dtilt heavy in this match, it gets u tons of follow ups even to mid late percents because of the zone it places fox in. Decay it like crazy, and you even get a possible kill setup. ftilt is bomb here too, especially at mid-late percents where you get the knockdown, its a free tech chase majority of the time. Abuse it;ftilt>pummels>uthrow is clocking in 30% without potential follow ups. Add a well spaced spring chase and ur getting a very nice look. Again great job Espy.
 

Kinzer

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Hey Excel, how come you never challenge Meta Knight during his glide? You know that Fair can eat right through his attack, right?

... I'm sorry, that's just the main thing I noticed. If you want me to give you a more detailed analysis, pester me or I may never get around to it, what with me being so freaking lazy and all. :/

and Tesh:

How come you rarely follow-up from your footstools? You do them often enough that I can tell you're not accidentally doing it, so what gives?

Same goes for you about the critique.

Nuginuighuhnpuzohyoz I hate myself.
 

Tesh

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I'm honestly scared I'll SD (which i do 90% of the time on wifi) if I do an ASC without my double jump, and I feel tech chasing is better than a free dair or homing attack. Not good reasons I know, I was talking with my opponent about footstools as we played, but I didn't feel like experimenting in a tournament match.
 

Kinzer

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Get more comfortable then. You don't always need to follow-up the techcase with an ASC either, it's just the one that happens to have the best reward for risk. :X

I'm in no position to criticize though. I don't play much anymore, and even when I do I rarely do this intentionally. I should start.
 

pulse131

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the vid...is too slow. too....easy. a peace of cake.
but hey, you should do it again sometime. next time step it up.
 

B.A.M.

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Double Post deserved

We might as well place this or muschoes combo vid as our community vid till we get something worth while.
 

Kinzer

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You are taking this too seriously. :<

Combo videos are meant for entertainment purposes only, not to instigate arguing amongst ourselves.

I'm not trying to take sides here, yeah Wedge could've spent a little bit more time waiting for more of us to get more footage, that way more of us could have more footage to show off; but at the same time it's your fault for not giving him material to work with. If that can't be realized, then what kind of a community am I a part of? :/

I for one don't mind that I'm not in. I'm not good, nor am I even flashy or want to be flashy. I'm such a bore, I'd probably have made teh video look worse if I were in it.
 

da K.I.D.

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Yo kin, why dont you go back and take a look at that thread before you tell people what or how much they contributed to said video

I personally waited until the day before the cut off date that he gave us to give him clips to give him about a full minutes worth or amazing footage, and I know 2-3 other people did the same.

we gave him plenty to work with.that wasnt the issue in the slightest.

 

sonictailslink

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You are taking this too seriously. :<

Combo videos are meant for entertainment purposes only, not to instigate arguing amongst ourselves.

I'm not trying to take sides here, yeah Wedge could've spent a little bit more time waiting for more of us to get more footage, that way more of us could have more footage to show off; but at the same time it's your fault for not giving him material to work with. If that can't be realized, then what kind of a community am I a part of? :/

I for one don't mind that I'm not in. I'm not good, nor am I even flashy or want to be flashy. I'm such a bore, I'd probably have made teh video look worse if I were in it.
Why would you say that Kinzer? I thought your gameplay was good in the combo video I made.
 

Kinzer

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Yo kin, why dont you go back and take a look at that thread before you tell people what or how much they contributed to said video

I personally waited until the day before the cut off date that he gave us to give him clips to give him about a full minutes worth or amazing footage, and I know 2-3 other people did the same.

we gave him plenty to work with.that wasnt the issue in the slightest.

More footage never hurts. I suppose I could've made that more clear.

Though I do acknowledge I'm being ridiculous, because I did look and ys I saw that some clips were sent in.

Worst comes to worst, I could pull the "do it yourself" card, but now I'm trying to be reasonable with this. It's harder than I originally thought. >_<

Why would you say that Kinzer? I thought your gameplay was good in the combo video I made.
I'll tell you when I get home Jerry, I gotta get off to do some schoolwork (lolfinally).

Same for you KID, in case I left out anythi-
 

Sonic-Rave

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Most people who were in the vid were upset at the fact that Wedge put about twice as many clips of himself in the vid.

And from what I hear, there were ALOT of clips from many different people that could have been used. I remember Omega telling me that he had some clips that were worthy of being put in that Wedge just scrapped.

Though I'm not gonna hate on Wedge about it because I understand his reasons, however selfish they may seem.

Oh another note, the next time a Community Combo vid is decided, I would love to participate and be in it.

And finally, I have a tournament tomorrow so hopefully I can get some vids to post here for critique.
 

WedginatorX

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LOL stupid wedgemunity video. we need a new combo video, get Kojin.
I agree, Kojin would have done a much better job with the video. I'm an editing n00b when it comes to smash videos. That's why I stay making history documentaries :l

You are taking this too seriously. :<

Combo videos are meant for entertainment purposes only, not to instigate arguing amongst ourselves.

I'm not trying to take sides here, yeah Wedge could've spent a little bit more time waiting for more of us to get more footage, that way more of us could have more footage to show off; but at the same time it's your fault for not giving him material to work with. If that can't be realized, then what kind of a community am I a part of? :/

I for one don't mind that I'm not in. I'm not good, nor am I even flashy or want to be flashy. I'm such a bore, I'd probably have made teh video look worse if I were in it.
I told you if you sent me something you thought was good I'd put it in D: I put in a clip of everyone that submitted.

Yo kin, why dont you go back and take a look at that thread before you tell people what or how much they contributed to said video

I personally waited until the day before the cut off date that he gave us to give him clips to give him about a full minutes worth or amazing footage, and I know 2-3 other people did the same.

we gave him plenty to work with.that wasnt the issue in the slightest.

KID, your clips were horrendous. That's why you only had like half a clip in lmao. I was trying to make an entertaining video, not a video of you bairing someone 3 times and not killing them and calling it a combo. If you look back, my specific words were that I'd try to fit in at least one clip of everyone that submitted. And that's exactly what I did.

Most people who were in the vid were upset at the fact that Wedge put about twice as many clips of himself in the vid.

And from what I hear, there were ALOT of clips from many different people that could have been used. I remember Omega telling me that he had some clips that were worthy of being put in that Wedge just scrapped.

Though I'm not gonna hate on Wedge about it because I understand his reasons, however selfish they may seem.

Oh another note, the next time a Community Combo vid is decided, I would love to participate and be in it.

And finally, I have a tournament tomorrow so hopefully I can get some vids to post here for critique.
If someone else would have volunteered, I wouldn't have even said anything. I put like, 2 freaking previews up. If someone didn't like how it was looking so far I would have handed it over at any time. Hell if I was almost done and muhsoce wanted to help, he actually has good combo video editing skills- I woulda just let him take my garbage work and finish it himself.

Mine didn't make it in because my downloads kept messing up when he tried to download them. :mad:

I was thinking about making a combo vid as well. But I don't have the proper equipment.
:( AIM me I got the equipment. We just gotta figure out a way to get your clips to work and then I can help you make one, or even just do the editing for you. Or since I'm such a bad editor just do it yourself, it's obvious you could do a better job.
(not hating on you tho :D)


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bottom line. I did exactly what I said. Everyone got at least one clip in. My objective was to make a video of good clips, not clips of KID bairing someone repeatedly and then saying OH LOOK I COMBO'D YOU and then he cut off the clip cuz he got hit by aurasphere. It just so happened that Kupo, Rogueblades, Espy and I had more entertaining clips than the rest of the other sonics. Kupo sent a lot in and I used more than half of his, and I think I used all of rogueblades' clips that he sent me. Wish he sent me more, they were good. As were's Paul's, but I literally put him in right before I rendered the video because he sent me clips last second over aim. Yes, he got special treatment. Itz cuz PhoenixDark is a sexy name <3 (nohomo)
 

Kinzer

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Precisely why I submitted nothing Wedge. I'm glad we're on the same page. =D

/not trolling, I really don't think I'm worthy to display.
 

da K.I.D.

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1. sounds like the wedge-munity has a lot of johns.

2. you saying that me 08 comboing ESAM in a money match isnt worthy of a combo video? and if you say no I know youre lying because you specifically put a clip of an 08 combo and then put the giant words 08 COMBO over the front of the screen lol.

3. I gave you about 12+ of cool stuff. the least you could have done was use my best clip. like where i truepivot f smashed yoshi right at the edge of his grab range

4. more proof that you should change the name to wedge-munity combo video
'Yea i like PD more than I like you guys so he gets more clips in the vid.'
from aim " i would have put 20 rogueblades clips in that video.
if phoenix sent in more clips? most of them would be in the video"

5. If you wanna keep trolling me with the dazwa card, I got something to come right back at you with now =P



seperate note. Since me and him see so eye-to-eye on so many things, I think me and BAM should make a combo vid together.
 

Espy Rose

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Wait KID, lemme get this straight...

You're going to make a combo video that alienates half of the Sonic community...because a Sonic combo video came out that alienated half of the Sonic community?

Also, you need to chill out.
 

Exceladon City

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Wait KID, lemme get this straight...

You're going to make a combo video that alienates half of the Sonic community...because a Sonic combo video came out that alienated half of the Sonic community?

Also, you need to chill out.
We should re-do it and make it spec-****in-tacular. So let's get our tech skill up and make a better vid.

EDIT: That sounded surprisingly optimistic...I need to take my cynicism meds.
 

da K.I.D.

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Wait KID, lemme get this straight...

You're going to make a combo video that alienates half of the Sonic community...because a Sonic combo video came out that alienated half of the Sonic community?

Also, you need to chill out.
1. No. thats not what im doing. I just thought it would be a good Idea to collaborate or something with someone who has the same ideals as myself. Similarly to how you and zori decide to team together because you like the way you mesh in game.

fortunately, should me and BAM do something, it will turn out much less disastrous than any and all of the teams matches Ive watched with you two.
=P

2. also, im very chill. wedge just likes calling me out on shiz, so I figured its time for him to get a little bit of his own medicine.
 

B.A.M.

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^^^http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3ALwKeSEYs


done.


EDIT: Real talk though I believe we should make another community vid. Sonic was utmost disrespected in this previous one. I watched more combo video worthy techs in the recent Espy vs Nike and KID vs Esam than the whole thing. One that actually has the community in it. I mean how sad is it that I didnt submit a single clip and i got the virtually the same video time as every1 else? I thought the whole point was to showcase our community, not to provide my friend Wedge here with visual stimuli for his genitals.



Seriously, someone find Kojin.
 

Espy Rose

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I guess getting third at that tournament was a testament to how garbage Zori and I are in teams, KID.
:p

I mean, we did take out Trela+Ozz, and that's pretty **** good.
Like I said, I had a very, very odd time at HOBO27. I SD'd over 8 times.

In any case, having another community video wouldn't hurt.
Let's give it a go.

Just don't make KID do anything technical. Dude couldn't even upload images. Lord help him when it comes to editing video.
 
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