Emblem Lord
The Legendary Lord
- Joined
- Aug 11, 2005
- Messages
- 9,720
- Location
- Scotch Plains, NJ
- NNID
- ShinEmblemLord
- 3DS FC
- 3926-6895-0574
- Switch FC
- SW-0793-4091-6136
So...Shieldbreaker is awesome. I can't think of any other word to describe it. When people first learned of it's changes from the transition to Brawl from Melee, a lot of people were disappointed. But then they found out how much it aids Marth's recovery, which is a big deal since now forward B only gives him a boost one time during a jump. But there is a lot more to Shieldbreaker then just being great for recovery. And that's what I'm going to talk about.
Shieldbreaker is a totally different beast in Brawl. In Melee Shieldbreaker was used primarily as an off the stage edgeguarding tool. It was easier to time then fair, it came out fast and had good knockback too. It was perfect for off the stage gimps. Now those days are gone, but now we have a new weapon that allows Marth to directly attack a corner stone of the Brawl gameplay engine itself. Brawl is a very defensive game. We all know it. Luckily Marth is one of the few characters that can stage an aggressive offense although he is just as effective by being campy and defensive if not more so. But thanks to the changes to Shieldbreaker and the Brawl engine itself Marth can stage an offense that PUNISHES players for being overly defensive and shielding too much. But I have gotten ahead of myself. First let's talk about Shieldbreaker's new properties.
- Charges faster then in Melee.
- Is now a very long stab instead of a double handed overhead slash.
- Does slightly more damage now uncharged but less damage fully charged then in Melee.
- Since shields lose energy faster Shieldbreaker is actually effective at breaking shields now.
- An uncharged Shieldbreaker will take out a lot of shield energy.
- Fully charged Shieldbreaker won't take out a shield at full power, but it will still take out a massive amount of energy.
- Shieldbreaker does 8% damage uncharged, 13% damage when charged up for any amount of time except to full, and 18% when fully charged. It will do 22% of damage when fully charged and you hit with the tip of the sword.
- When fully charged Shieldbreaker hits at the tip it does HUGE knockback. More so then any of Marth's other moves. It kills Mario at 45% at the center of FD.
- Shieldbreaker will push Marth forward in the air which aids in his recovery. A full charge will give him a HUGE boost forward in the air.
- Shieldbreaker has 3 main weaknesses. The first is that when perfectshielded it will do no damage to the shield and Marth is left wide open. The second is that it's unsafe on block. The third is that although Marth is fairly quick to attack, an opponent could react to his stance when he draws his arm back and then spotdodge or perfectshield, if the shieldbreaker is overused.
So just from reading that it can be seen just how different Shieldbreaker is now. Now it's actually useful...for..well..breaking shields! In a game that is so defensive and shielding is being abused to the fullest, it's exciting to have a character that can counter this type of gameplay. In case you didn't know, when your shield breaks you are left defenseless for several seconds. Also as I side note, I said Shieldbreaker is unsafe on block, but I'm not entirely sure you see. It has a lot of range and I'm not too sure on the amount of shieldstun it has. Plus it has IASA frames on it when Marth has pulled the sword almost completely back to his side. At that point you can cancel into any action, so he might be able to up b to stuff any attempts to punish him. I'll need to test this or someone else can test it and then post about it. I would really appreciate it and I would give you credit when I edit this post with the info.
Anyway, it's obvious that Shieldbreaker has the potential to really alter Marth's metagame, but let me go further into an explanation about why I think it's so good. Well, for one thing, it's very high reward. If you break a shield at a moderate percentage, then it's a free kill for you. And the benefits aren't just in terms of getting an easy kill. There is also the effect it has on an opponent. Once you start using that Shieldbreaker, they have to make a choice about how to play you. They can try to be more aggressive since your usage of Shieldbreaker allows you to punish their defensive play. This is risky vs Marth especially if they become reckless. Marth excels at space control and setting the pace of the match, so blindly rushing Marth won't work. Intelligent aggression would do better, but even still they will have to find ways to deal with his range, speed, and safe zoning game. They can also take the option of still being defensive, but shielding less and relying more on spotdodging and rolling. This is ok, but can become predictable when overused. Dancing Blade trumps spot dodging and Marth can fair camp to circumvent the effectiveness of rolling. Again, this makes things harder for your opponent and easier for you if you play patiently.
Now I just said that Shieldbreaker is high reward which is true. But it takes more then high reward for a move to be good. It's all about risk reward ratio. Ideally you want low risk with high reward. Well, to be honest I think that Shieldbreaker is low risk unless Marth doesn't space it well. Even if they block, since it has a lot of range, your opponent can't punish with anything too threatening. They might get a grab off or maybe an aerial. But nothing serious. If you mess up your spacing then it's very high risk, but as long as you space fairly well you shouldn't be taking a lot of damage even if it's blocked or dodged. Now if it turns out that Shieldbreaker really IS safe on block, then there will be no question. It will be very low risk with very high reward.
Ok, so now you know why it's so good. But now the question is how do you setup for easy Shieldbreaker usage to get that wonderful reward of a free kill? Well, it's all about conditioning and playing on habits. First off you would have to actively attack your opponent's shield and space well so that you tip your attacks. I'm not saying being reckless and just go all out. Play your normal game of course. But everytime your attack chips at your opponents shield be aware of it. Make it a point to put pressure on your opponent's shield. If your opponent is at say 60% and they are shielding, well you know you can get an easy grab, but instead why not do a tipper d-tilt? This way you are safe and working towards that reward. Also when you want to get that reward, you might want to grab less in general. If your opponent notices that you simply aren't grabbing them, they will be more likely to abuse shielding since it's not like you are really stopping them. This is called conditioning. You are using your own actions to make your opponent act in a way that you can easily read them and play off of them to control the match. In this case you are drawing out their shields, by not directly punishing them for shielding with grabs.
You also should be paying attention to certain situations where you opponent likes to shield. Do they shield after an airdodge? Do they shield after they roll or take a hit or tech in place? Do they shield after they attack a shield themselves? Do they abuse shield approaches? These are the things you need to keep in mind so when you have an easy chance to unleash that Shieldbreaker you can go for it.
I'm going to give a rundown of some basic Shieldbreaker tactics.
SH Fair to Shieldbreaker - This is good if your opponent has been conditioned to expect SH double fair. Thinking they can shield a second fair you punch through their shield with your neutral b.
SH Fair to reverse Shieldbreaker - Good for opponents who roll after the first fair but learned to shield after a roll to block an attempt to punish on Marth's part. You Fair then click the analog stick in the opposite direction then neutral b. Also you can do this if you SH fair on a shield but overshoot your opponent. He will quickly turn around with that piercing stab.
Dancing Blade to Shieldbreaker - Risky but still pretty nice. When your dancing blade is blocked stop the combo and then do a Shieldbreaker. Don't abuse this a lot. It's just a surprise to pull out every once in a while. Also you can mix-up between that and grabbing, d-tilting, fairing, or restarting the dancing blade. They can do stuff to stop you so it's not guaranteed, but if the DB was spaced well it will be hard to punish you.
Also, I tested the killing power of fully charged Shieldbreaker on King Dedede in the middle of FD. He dies at 59% with no DI. So I'm guessing at around the late 60's to early 70's he will die even with good DI.
So basically if someone has decent damage on them and their shield gets broken, they are dead. Also if you break Jiggs shield she automatically dies off the top.
Alright, so that's it guys.
Discuss.
Shieldbreaker is a totally different beast in Brawl. In Melee Shieldbreaker was used primarily as an off the stage edgeguarding tool. It was easier to time then fair, it came out fast and had good knockback too. It was perfect for off the stage gimps. Now those days are gone, but now we have a new weapon that allows Marth to directly attack a corner stone of the Brawl gameplay engine itself. Brawl is a very defensive game. We all know it. Luckily Marth is one of the few characters that can stage an aggressive offense although he is just as effective by being campy and defensive if not more so. But thanks to the changes to Shieldbreaker and the Brawl engine itself Marth can stage an offense that PUNISHES players for being overly defensive and shielding too much. But I have gotten ahead of myself. First let's talk about Shieldbreaker's new properties.
- Charges faster then in Melee.
- Is now a very long stab instead of a double handed overhead slash.
- Does slightly more damage now uncharged but less damage fully charged then in Melee.
- Since shields lose energy faster Shieldbreaker is actually effective at breaking shields now.
- An uncharged Shieldbreaker will take out a lot of shield energy.
- Fully charged Shieldbreaker won't take out a shield at full power, but it will still take out a massive amount of energy.
- Shieldbreaker does 8% damage uncharged, 13% damage when charged up for any amount of time except to full, and 18% when fully charged. It will do 22% of damage when fully charged and you hit with the tip of the sword.
- When fully charged Shieldbreaker hits at the tip it does HUGE knockback. More so then any of Marth's other moves. It kills Mario at 45% at the center of FD.
- Shieldbreaker will push Marth forward in the air which aids in his recovery. A full charge will give him a HUGE boost forward in the air.
- Shieldbreaker has 3 main weaknesses. The first is that when perfectshielded it will do no damage to the shield and Marth is left wide open. The second is that it's unsafe on block. The third is that although Marth is fairly quick to attack, an opponent could react to his stance when he draws his arm back and then spotdodge or perfectshield, if the shieldbreaker is overused.
Credit goes to Demonstormkill for confirming this.
So just from reading that it can be seen just how different Shieldbreaker is now. Now it's actually useful...for..well..breaking shields! In a game that is so defensive and shielding is being abused to the fullest, it's exciting to have a character that can counter this type of gameplay. In case you didn't know, when your shield breaks you are left defenseless for several seconds. Also as I side note, I said Shieldbreaker is unsafe on block, but I'm not entirely sure you see. It has a lot of range and I'm not too sure on the amount of shieldstun it has. Plus it has IASA frames on it when Marth has pulled the sword almost completely back to his side. At that point you can cancel into any action, so he might be able to up b to stuff any attempts to punish him. I'll need to test this or someone else can test it and then post about it. I would really appreciate it and I would give you credit when I edit this post with the info.
Anyway, it's obvious that Shieldbreaker has the potential to really alter Marth's metagame, but let me go further into an explanation about why I think it's so good. Well, for one thing, it's very high reward. If you break a shield at a moderate percentage, then it's a free kill for you. And the benefits aren't just in terms of getting an easy kill. There is also the effect it has on an opponent. Once you start using that Shieldbreaker, they have to make a choice about how to play you. They can try to be more aggressive since your usage of Shieldbreaker allows you to punish their defensive play. This is risky vs Marth especially if they become reckless. Marth excels at space control and setting the pace of the match, so blindly rushing Marth won't work. Intelligent aggression would do better, but even still they will have to find ways to deal with his range, speed, and safe zoning game. They can also take the option of still being defensive, but shielding less and relying more on spotdodging and rolling. This is ok, but can become predictable when overused. Dancing Blade trumps spot dodging and Marth can fair camp to circumvent the effectiveness of rolling. Again, this makes things harder for your opponent and easier for you if you play patiently.
Now I just said that Shieldbreaker is high reward which is true. But it takes more then high reward for a move to be good. It's all about risk reward ratio. Ideally you want low risk with high reward. Well, to be honest I think that Shieldbreaker is low risk unless Marth doesn't space it well. Even if they block, since it has a lot of range, your opponent can't punish with anything too threatening. They might get a grab off or maybe an aerial. But nothing serious. If you mess up your spacing then it's very high risk, but as long as you space fairly well you shouldn't be taking a lot of damage even if it's blocked or dodged. Now if it turns out that Shieldbreaker really IS safe on block, then there will be no question. It will be very low risk with very high reward.
Ok, so now you know why it's so good. But now the question is how do you setup for easy Shieldbreaker usage to get that wonderful reward of a free kill? Well, it's all about conditioning and playing on habits. First off you would have to actively attack your opponent's shield and space well so that you tip your attacks. I'm not saying being reckless and just go all out. Play your normal game of course. But everytime your attack chips at your opponents shield be aware of it. Make it a point to put pressure on your opponent's shield. If your opponent is at say 60% and they are shielding, well you know you can get an easy grab, but instead why not do a tipper d-tilt? This way you are safe and working towards that reward. Also when you want to get that reward, you might want to grab less in general. If your opponent notices that you simply aren't grabbing them, they will be more likely to abuse shielding since it's not like you are really stopping them. This is called conditioning. You are using your own actions to make your opponent act in a way that you can easily read them and play off of them to control the match. In this case you are drawing out their shields, by not directly punishing them for shielding with grabs.
You also should be paying attention to certain situations where you opponent likes to shield. Do they shield after an airdodge? Do they shield after they roll or take a hit or tech in place? Do they shield after they attack a shield themselves? Do they abuse shield approaches? These are the things you need to keep in mind so when you have an easy chance to unleash that Shieldbreaker you can go for it.
I'm going to give a rundown of some basic Shieldbreaker tactics.
SH Fair to Shieldbreaker - This is good if your opponent has been conditioned to expect SH double fair. Thinking they can shield a second fair you punch through their shield with your neutral b.
SH Fair to reverse Shieldbreaker - Good for opponents who roll after the first fair but learned to shield after a roll to block an attempt to punish on Marth's part. You Fair then click the analog stick in the opposite direction then neutral b. Also you can do this if you SH fair on a shield but overshoot your opponent. He will quickly turn around with that piercing stab.
Dancing Blade to Shieldbreaker - Risky but still pretty nice. When your dancing blade is blocked stop the combo and then do a Shieldbreaker. Don't abuse this a lot. It's just a surprise to pull out every once in a while. Also you can mix-up between that and grabbing, d-tilting, fairing, or restarting the dancing blade. They can do stuff to stop you so it's not guaranteed, but if the DB was spaced well it will be hard to punish you.
Credit goes to meepxzero for posting his own Shieldbreaker strats.
Also, I tested the killing power of fully charged Shieldbreaker on King Dedede in the middle of FD. He dies at 59% with no DI. So I'm guessing at around the late 60's to early 70's he will die even with good DI.
So basically if someone has decent damage on them and their shield gets broken, they are dead. Also if you break Jiggs shield she automatically dies off the top.
Alright, so that's it guys.
Discuss.
