The Official Rate My DK thread

[Ragnar0k]

Jmex I watched all your videos. I'll just give you some general advice I might go into detail later.

Save down smashes until 80+, use up tilt instead at lower %'s. It covers the same general area but with less lag and greater followupability. Use dsmash as a punisher when they're in kill %'s.

Less dair and fair onstage, they're good every once in a while but you used them too much.

When you're hanging on the ledge to edgeguard someone ledge hop/drop bairs away from the stage, it's extremely good. Or just up ledge stall depending on how close they are.

This is probably the most important thing so take it seriously. Don't airdodge into people on the ground. I saw you take so much unnecessary damage trying to airdodge into lucario when you could have just fallen to the ledge right next to you.

Stall in the air with side b over lucario's aura sphere instead of air dodging through it.

I liked the lagless up b recoveries onto platforms, it seems like you thought about too late after you had already taken too much damage though.

I might have more later if I remember any.

 

[D0N]

I dont really have much to add to what's been said. Just if your ever in a situation where you feel like you've airdodged into your opponent to much or theyre waiting to punish you for it, side-b works sometimes. They ussually try to hit you right when you land and youll be hanging in the air, so depending on the hit box of the move they use they could whiff and you could punch/f-smash.

Also if your u-tilt juggling at low percents it ussually only works twice at most. After that you should follow with a sheild grab (they can't do much about it in the position theyre in unless its wario) or an up-b.

 

[NatP]

Bah, I'm sorry about that. I was posting videos on the g&w board too. >.<
Here are the actual videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtrcEuEGmJA&feature=channel_page
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N-G8YfuvH8&feature=channel_page
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sS45y3AHB3k&feature=channel_page (the wario video again)

 

[daisho]

Here you go NatP.

First video

Usually starting up the match by running up to snake and downbing works.

:05 Something to avoid when recovering is airdodging into your opponent. You decided to star the match out that way, never do that again.

:10-:12 Two laggy moves in a row neither with combo ability

:35-:37 you did it again

:40 If you grab snake walk to the edge and D throw him. From there it is quite easy to gimp his recovery

:46 Pointless down Smash

:52 Had you jumped off to gimp him you wouldnt need to worry about the nade.

1:23 bair please

1:28 if you want to headbutt in that situation do it before you land. The way you did it you had landing lag which he could have punished AND headbutt lag which he did punish.

1:36 Im not sure about the first but definitely the second up b break was needless.

1:48 I understand you were going for the kill but at 86% up smash probably would not kill snake... though it might i don't know. But what im saying is you used a really laggy move thats impossible to space well since you have to be right next to them to use it. Had you just grabbed him and d throwed you probably could have gotten a kill.

1:54 D smash won't kill him. Don't use it especially against a grounded snake since his f tilt is amazing at punishing.

2:03 I assume you meant d throw. Either way, walk a little further. You should practice at percents to get a feel for how long you can hold them for.

2:13 You hit him with the down air and still got punished. Was it worth it? You could have done a less laggy move that has more combo possibilites.

2:35 daishochasing here would have been a great option for racking up damage.

2:44 I don't agree with that down smash. I think a tilt would have worked better to stop his f smash because if the down smash missed you die.

2:58 Could have punched for the kill.

Overall in this match the only tilt you did was 1 d tilt. You did not use f tilt or u tilt once the entire match. You used Up b just once (though it is less useful in the snake matchup). You need to rely less on downsmash and more on your tilts. Against a better opponent you would have been punished much more and much worse.

If you would like I will do another one, simply post.

 

[jaggedShrapnel]

Rate it up boys.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4srqc3gZ30g

This isn't my top level of playing, but I don't believe I have a recorded match that is. I kinda feel bad posting this video because I feel like I've improved a bunch since then, but what I don't hear won't make me better.

 

[daisho]

jS here you go.

:20 What was the point in that headbutt?

:33 hard to see during a match but you should have up b ledgestalled.

:58 F smash at 6% I guess you could have set up an edgeguarding situation but still, was it really worth it?

1:00 Youve held that punch for a while now and your stock is almost over. You should use it.

1:03 Again with the headbutt stall. Its only useful for staying above the opponent. When you are level with the stage it is almost always a bad idea.

1:24 was that headbutt a mistake?

1:38 Headbutt stall again.

1:46 Staying in shield for so long usually gets you punished.

1:55-1:57 Headbutt stall worked the first time. Notice how you are not level with the stage here. The second one you are level with the stage and you got punished.

2:06 headbutt stall again this time above stage level.

2:10 Not a great time to use your punch , i guess you knew he would cancel it but got the timing wrong. In that case you should have waited and punished with something easier to time.

2:16 Ive seen this a couple of times. You approach with a single bair. Approaching with SHDbair is often better.

Overall. I didn't see much up b. I didn't see any SHDbair. I saw too much headbutt stalling. Headbutt should be used about once or twice a match to stall. You used it at least five times and its not even that great of a tactic. Also, you hold your punches for too long and imo don't use them correctly. One time you used it to punish and the other you used it after a prediction. It is great for both of those but even better if you think the opponent will attack if you time the SA it will always hit.

 

[jaggedShrapnel]

I was just experimenting with headbutt in that match, I actually hardly ever use it unless I have enough time to take advantage of a trip, whether it be accidental or by dtilt. Occasionally I'll SHbair to headbutt, as it frequently mindgames the opponent into unshielding, which follows up with them getting stuck in the ground.
I will agree with you that I need to learn to better utilize DK punch and grounded UpB.

Now that I think about it, this really was a bad video to post. Let me try to find a better one for you.
Edit: Eh, I don't really have any good gameplay videos up at the moment. I'll get some for you today and post back tonight.

 

[NatP]

If you could review the other two I'd appreciate it.

EDIT: Ok, I shouldn't have used dair there, I understand. But when I'm directly above a snake that's the move like to use even if it is laggy. What move should I use then? The one thing that comes to my mind is airdodging but thats even laggier. Also daisochasing is? I'm not a very techincal DK.

 

[Jmex]

@ Daisho

First let me thank you for the extensive review you gave me. Watching my match with some critiques really made me think wtf was I doing at that time?

1st vid:

I lol'd really hard when i was spot dodging and down smashing. I honestly dont remember what i was doing. I think I gave up midway through the match because i was getting ***** harder by the stage vs. the player. Ill keep everything you told me in mind.

2nd vid:

@ the 25 sec mark I tripped so i couldnt really do much anyway. =\
@ 2:15 - I did have amazing DI there didnt I? *Blush*
@ 2:37 - I honestly forget about grabbing him out of his cypher. I used to do it alot but it eludes me now a days. Ill have to keep that in mind when im fighting other snakes.

3rd and 4th vids:

Ice Climbers are just gay in general. Ill remember all the tips you gave me. For sure ill be using down b, up b, and tilts the majority of the game. Thanks alot man.

The reason I used down smash alot though, is because I just love that move, ill have to break the habit of using it too early if i want to improve more. Thanks alot for the tips.



@ Rag -

Im married to down air and fair. Ill have to get a divorce with them soon though, its just a bad habit that I have to break. Ill def keep all the tips in mind during the next tourney I go to. Also about the air dodging into people. Ive been doing that since Day 1 and i still cant break it. I honestly think I do it because im really anxious and want to finish the match asap. I guess i gotta break that mentality since this is Brawl and patience is the key.

Also, ill be using up tilt alot more often. Ill make that a priority.

Thanks all.

Ill review your matches a little later Daisho, im on my lunch break so i have to get back to work.

 

[daisho]

If you could review the other two I'd appreciate it.

EDIT: Ok, I shouldn't have used dair there, I understand. But when I'm directly above a snake that's the move like to use even if it is laggy. What move should I use then? The one thing that comes to my mind is airdodging but thats even laggier. Also daisochasing is? I'm not a very techincal DK.

For one you could FF bair. You could do nothing. You could Punch if you have one. You could use headbutt to stall.

And airdodging is not laggier than Dair...

Daisho chasing
This tactic is completely based on Cargo Releases. A cargo release is when someone breaks out of an F throw before you throw in one direction. This tactic will not work if your opponent knows what to do, most characters can get out of it but it is very rewarding if you can predict their moves.

When you release someone you get a 1 frame advantage (except mother boys, they are are different story completely). DK has D tilt (frame 6) Jab (Frame 5) Utilt (frame 5) D smash (frame 10) Grab (frame 8) and Up B (SA frames 10-16, attack frame 18). All these moves can be used for this tactic.

If your opponent reacts slowly you can do anything except up B. The first time or two times I recommend using jab or D smash. They may be out of range for U tilt and D tilt is annoying for me at least since I have to crouch first. But save grab for later.

Next time you release they will want to avoid your attack. There is a good chance they will shield. Now is the time to regrab.

Then to avoid the grab they may spotdodge. To counter this you can up B.

They also have the option of rolling. If you can predict their roll behind you then you can SIDE B them. If they roll away you can try to get a down B but that is unlikely.

Things to watch out for: Opponents like marth with his Up B. Characters with faster grabs by more than 1 frame can grab you. Characters with speedy jabs can jab you.

This Technique is not nearly as good as Snakes Techchase but you really should look into it, it is a viable technique.

 

[daisho]

I should have some matches up soon that are good for critiquing... by the time i get matches up I always get better... grrr!!!

But this one please help with... I hate falco.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-E7XOWICMT8

Oh and this one vs snake

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=261OmmjUg80

 

[DKwill]

I should have some matches up soon that are good for critiquing... by the time i get matches up I always get better... grrr!!!

But this one please help with... I hate falco.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-E7XOWICMT8

Okay you won, so thats good ;p But I know what you mean, for the longest time I used to have trouble with falco but now I swear I never lose at that matchup anymore...ever. I like to think of myself as a Falco slayer. ROFL j/k

After watching the falco match I have a few comments. Whenever falco is falling, especially after he double jumps, remember to approach with grounded up-b. Even if he lasers, if you up-b at the right time your super armor frames will protect you and the trade in damage is well worth it.

Also, don't be afraid to edge guard his recovery a little more aggressively. Aside from baiting his jump and immediately b-airing him before his illusion for the easy gimp, there is another way to punish it.

When you KNOW he is going to illusion past you to the stage (above the edge) time a n-air so that it will knock him back. If you time it right, there is no trade and he will be pushed out into the abyss lol. Depending on the stage, if his only way of recovering is an up b at this point, you can still jump and d-air him! (I have pulled this off on Yoshi's Island)

In addition, if you would rather a safer punish, bait the illusion. Make it look like you are going to go out to gimp him with a b-air, but then DI back onto the stage and air dodge. Normally they will get scared and illusion onto the stage, past your buffered shield from which you can d-smash them or grab them depending upon how well they spaced the illusion onto the ground.

I liked your use of f-tilt on falco, I am thinking of using it more after watching this. Also, if Falco is ever caught underneath the stage and forced to use his up b to recover vertically, DK has the perfect tools to gimp him. If you are close enough to the edge, simply run off and b-air him into the stage, easy gimp.

I'm sure theres a lot more to say here, if you have any specific questions I'm at work until 9:00 and will be on the computer until then. hit me up on aim: Smartguy41112 =)

Edit: Also!! Play against someone for practice and have them do nothing but short hop double laser you. Power shield the lasers this way and soon it will become second nature. xD

 

[Jmex]

I should have some matches up soon that are good for critiquing... by the time i get matches up I always get better... grrr!!!

But this one please help with... I hate falco.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-E7XOWICMT8

Oh and this one vs snake

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=261OmmjUg80

Since there wifi matches. Ill wait for some offline matches.

 

[D0N]

Daisho: I watched snake, Ill wath falco later. And like Jmex said, get some offline matches if you can.

Nice use of u-tilt, you seem better than your last vid I watched. You still dont seem to use d-tilt that much, but you used u-tilt when you were right in front of them which is better than f-tilt. Also its putting snake in the air so didnt hurt in this matchup.

When you hit someone at the edge of a platform like at 0:12 and 2:45, some people have a habit of falling on their back. At that point its a free f-smash or down b depending on there % and position. To avaoid being in that position yourself (2:54) throw out a b-air, u-air.

When you get hit, if your not trying to DI for life you ussually airdodge ASAP. It didnt hurt you much here but be careful of this, if your opponent catches on its bad.

You didnt punch much. If snake is busy running and throwing grenades the least you could do is charge it up before you chase.

2:04 - At high percents, snakes look for u-tilts. Try not be/approach him from above unless your going to try to predict it and SA it (hard to time).

There was a lot of uneccesary spotdodging throughout the match like at 0:23, 1:17, 1:42 and at 2:38. You called DK's spotdodge "pretty much useless" before yourself, particularly against snake. I wouldnt say its useless, but I would agree that it should be done sparringly. Part of your spotdoging/rolling may have came from fear of grenades/c4, but some were at times when they were not gonna blow up (1:42). Be careful of them making you defensive when you dont need to be. I hate grenades.

 

[daisho]

Thanks alot D0N. Ill try to get offline matches but i don't forsee any future time when i will be able to.

I started using D tilt more recently

And yes, DKs spotdodge is horrible and its a really bad habit of mine to use it.

I do usually use punch alot, just not every game I guess.

You gave great advice, ill try to incorporate it.

 

[reborn394]

Hello, just want to know how I can improve my DK from these matches:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMYrVY0ZtpI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuCrGnYwSVY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmKCr3bK_CE

Just want some general tips on how I can improve my game.

 

[CELTiiC]

Here are some matches for you guys to help me improve guys (=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGxqEcpLgmk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJ9eX6a1NxI

 

[ZxChrono]

@ Reborn

One thing i saw is that you werent DIing after you got hit or thrown off stage which could have helped you live longer.
Against luigi when he starts spamming fireballs dont forget you can cancel those out with your tilts and bair.
Getting a little too dair happy it worked for you at times but dont make it a habit.
At :16 1st vid when he finishes his tornado near you and you manage to shield it make sure to punish him dont roll away from him.
At 1:54 1st vid if you do a lagless up b onto a stage or platform and hes nearby you can do a dsmash or utilt for a nice follow up. in this case a dsmash would have killed him.
Also try not to have him above you as much unless your going to upsmash, his nair and dair are good against you. I dont see him doing those much when hes above you but thats a general luigi tip.
Practice your grounded upb so you move and dont stay in one spot.

I saw the other vids but i dont have time for pointing out key points in them since i have to go to work but it almost applies to all 3. the major thing is the DI though. still pretty good DK just space with bair more so he doesnt get inside you so easily.

The luigi is playing as if he were mario, hes on the ground way too much. luigi does better in the air and i didnt see him doing the utilt to uair follow ups when you were at low %.

 

[KoSa!]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGxqEcpLgmk

There Wifi, so some of the stuff I'm going to say you might know.

:08 I suggest reverse jumping when you are going to approach since Bairs come out quickly. Also, Uairs I think work good there.
:29 Recover to the edge.
:48 UpB ledge stall.
1:24 Self-explanatory mistake.
2:12 Dumb Dair.
2:56 UpB Brake.

You did some mistakes twice, but I think you know what your doing plus it was a wifi match. And Wolf can be gimped easily with UpB stalling.

I didnt do the second part, I am falling alsleep. But that fox was owning the first couple seconds, no offense.

 

[ZxChrono]

@ hino
dont try to catch wolf with down b at max distance, more than likely if your that far apart hes going to camp you with lazer spam. the rest I think kosa said already. surprisingly hes not spamming you with his bair lol. nice gimp at the end.

oh one thing i saw is that he was predicting the rolls onto the stage. try recovering different ways like DJ->dodge onto the stage, jump over.

on the matchup with fox, biggest thing is stop going for the cargo stage spikes at such low %, especially when you have to carry them for so long.

 

[crifer]

rate my dk^^
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVQj7Edh77k
I hate footstools :/

 

[Imainlowtier]

0:16 Did you mess up a B-air? SHed Fairs are a no go

0:19 Nice grounded up-B

0:25 Shield?

0:47 Nice Down-B

0:51 U-tilt to pressure

1:04 Nice punch

1:37 again the F-Air

1:38 B-air when you DI, don't airdodge

1:50 a ledge Up-B stall might have worked the second time

2:38 Grounded Up-B or U-Tilt

2:55 you did that before, expected

3:04 B-Air, Marth has too much range

3:20 Nice Side-B stall

4:11 another U-Tilt to out range

4:33 Nice, but the same thing 3 times? you did your punch the same
All in all good DK but a few mistakes against this disjoint

 

[CELTiiC]

@ hino
dont try to catch wolf with down b at max distance, more than likely if your that far apart hes going to camp you with lazer spam. the rest I think kosa said already. surprisingly hes not spamming you with his bair lol. nice gimp at the end.

oh one thing i saw is that he was predicting the rolls onto the stage. try recovering different ways like DJ->dodge onto the stage, jump over.

on the matchup with fox, biggest thing is stop going for the cargo stage spikes at such low %, especially when you have to carry them for so long.

Thanks, i'll put that into consideration. I don't know why he wasn't in the air much with Wolf.

There Wifi, so some of the stuff I'm going to say you might know.

:08 I suggest reverse jumping when you are going to approach since Bairs come out quickly. Also, Uairs I think work good there.
:29 Recover to the edge.
:48 UpB ledge stall.
1:24 Self-explanatory mistake.
2:12 Dumb Dair.
2:56 UpB Brake.

You did some mistakes twice, but I think you know what your doing plus it was a wifi match. And Wolf can be gimped easily with UpB stalling.

I didnt do the second part, I falling alsleep. But that fox was owning the fire couple seconds, no offense.

Oh, I came back to win that one (with bad DI at the end) but yeah thanks for the critique.

 

[Commander_Beef]

3/5...
I would say spamming back air is appropriate for the Marth matchup, but I believe you were back airing too many out of habit. Try to break that and mix it up with an approaching neutral air or up air. And you hardly grabbed...there's so many options for Donkey Kong's grab game. Do a grab to an air break to a forward air or do a down throw to a mindgamed dash attack or something of that nature. Upload a couple more videos and maybe my opinion will change Crifer .

 

[crifer]

yeah it was my first match that day^^I know I played not that good :/ but it was a friendly never the less.
but neutral air and uair are easily outranged by marth,
you don´t need to be good with marth to outrange uair and nair,
I think bair greats are great barrier of priority against charactes that have less range or priority.
A missed grab could mean a lot of damage for DK...
but thx for the critique^^

 

[Demp]

Here is some tourney footage of me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emyVKsiH2oU&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvOaJZ8ByLI&feature=related

I did worse in the second match because I tried punishing with smashes way too much. And throughout the match I didn't go for the spikes after cargo downthrows because I was too nervous about SDing (it was an offday for me...).

 

[ZxChrono]

dont be afraid about SDing, go for broke, if you worry about it too much it will throw your game off. NICE, the band was playing lol. he was prep for you going for the spike anyways so dont feel too bad.

MOAR ftilt and dtilt, pimp smack that chu around. when pikachu has you in utilt at low %, use your DJ asap dont try to dodge it going into him, hes most likely expecting that and will punish(usually they go for a dsmash). when pikachu is jumping around spamming jolt in the air, bair those things instead of tryign to PS, hes just trying to waste down your shield. watch out for those upsmash to thunder setups, on those you have to pay attention whether the upsmash is going to kill you or not. if its not going to kill you wait for the thunder and dodge it instead of DI'ng because if you die it your going to get hit by the thunder and die. capatalize when he misplaces a thunder under a platform, sideb and punish.

@ 2:32 DONT GO, ITS A TRAP!!! when they play gay like that just let them sit over there and spam away. although it did surprise him enough to mess him up, revenge gimp ^^.

overall you did will to handle the chu.

 

[Donkey Bong]

old vids, but would still like feedback.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2u0pBt7et0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yF_ZOqDja_I

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5stagodFj8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMDNPxjWMws

 

[Jmex]

@ Donkey Bong

The 1st vid.

Why in the hell did you run up and down b as soon as the match started? he was on the platform? LOL, im assuming you were predicting he was going to fall through?

Your letting snake get too close and your not helping by running straight and him and not doing anything. Against snake, space with Down B, tilts and punch, alot. Dont be afraid to throw out a forward smash here and there as well

The 3rd vid.

You need alot more down b and back air. Stop using forward air on stage.

Overall you need better spacing. At times it seemed like you were just trying to swat at a fly and not even aiming for Sonic. Just be more patient and read the Sonics patterns.

Pro tip about teching on stage. DONT! If at all possible air dodge instead of teching on the stage. Trust me, Brawl teching is horrible and should be avoided if at all possible. It also helps you to speed up your movements as well.

 

[youngrey]

RATE M7H dk

tourney match against hall

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0W8OYLyNoLM

tourney match doubles against champ and endress

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyZRfvA_MD0

tourney match agaisnt pitbl\

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yCn1512P9g

 

[Commander_Beef]

M7H...you were acting pretty stupid on the first video from 2:46 to 3:05 lol. Hilarious how he mine-spammed you.
5/5 because you know how to use side B really well lol, and your aggressiveness seems to always work... I would imagine it all being predictable but hey...anything can work.

 

[youngrey]

thanks commander thats what m7h said

 

[Donkey Bong]

quick question for M7H, why do you mostly use your 2nd jump immediately after jump?

 

[youngrey]

he said he uses 2nd jump right after because he either charges his punch or he just does it instintably, but he said he needs to stop usin the jump right away

 

[Jmex]

Lol. M7H got youngrey as his posting boy. <3

 

[Ragnar0k]

http://www.youtube.com/user/RAGNAR0KiP

There should be a tournament set uploaded against a diddy kong that I'd like critiqued. The second video is still uploading as of right now.

 

[Jmex]

Wow. You ***** that Diddy Rag.

You made good use of the peels too.

 

[Ragnar0k]

Thanks Jmex. Z catching and dropping naners *****.

 

[KoSa!]

^^
Tru Dat!

 

[Big O]

I liked how you used down b with bananas in those matches. The JV 3 stock was cool too.