The Official Marth Video Critique Thread

[The Marth]

Sorry about the quality, it was actually made on a camera phone.

Yeah, I tend to DS when he's coming with his tornado. It's just that MK was puts a lot of pressure on my shield so I'm always looking to get him before he lands a hit on me, but yeah it's certainly not viable because he goes back and then wacks me when i'm coming down.

I feel my marth gets really pounded when in the air. I'm always coming down with air dodges and MK variates between his Up-b and simply standing there and then Dsmashing me. Should I just try landing away from him? When I do that he usually comes with his tornado, but I guess a counter could solve that.

Counter can work sometimes with the torando, but see ^ because counter is a dash attack, shouldn't be used much. And landing away from MK, usually anybody is a good idea. It gives you a chance to regroup and reset the field.

 

[Steel_Samurai]

I have some vids from a recent local tourny I went to

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5d4jtUj5Wo vs Sai90(diddy) Grand Finals
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1023hIk4uCQ&feature=channel vs Moses (DDD) Losers Finals

Everyones real names are used in the vids but oh well lol

Any critique is welcome and if any of you guys wanna tear me to shreds, go for it

 

[clowsui]

DJ you were playing some scrubby-azz opponents lol
You won 211 $$ though, so you're paying for my entry in the next tourney =)
Either that or you're buying me food LOL

anyways you gave up a lot of stage vs. that diddy...dunno why you were doing that
you also did a lot of random, untargeted moves that cost you like 10-20% each time...which accumulates after a while
i dunno, i'm not good at critiquing but we can just talk about this in like 3 weeks at my place lol

 

[Steel_Samurai]

actually it was $189
161 for singles
plus our team got 56/2=28
161+28=189

And thanks for the critique :D

 

[MikeSanti]

I have some vids from a recent local tourny I went to

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5d4jtUj5Wo vs Sai90(diddy) Grand Finals
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1023hIk4uCQ&feature=channel vs Moses (DDD) Losers Finals

Everyones real names are used in the vids but oh well lol

Any critique is welcome and if any of you guys wanna tear me to shreds, go for it

I want to critique this, but while watching the vids, it seems as if you're sandbagging them. Like clowsui said, the people in the videos are (no offense) scrubbish. For the Diddy match you let the Diddy have lots of space which cost you extra percentage. Occasionally I noticed that your spacing was way off, but when I look at the opponent and how they faired, it just led me to believe that you were sandbagging them almost. I'd like to see a video (or videos) of people with a higher level of skill honestly before I critique that Marth. Gratz on the prize money.

 

[clowsui]

it's clowsui*

htf do people get this wrong all the time >___>;

btw @ the better vids thing we'll have some in 3 weeks

DJ i have the vids of the dittos just haven't cut it up yet/will not have time to
+ i'm pretty sure both of us are way better than that now (lol what i said all the other times :D :D :D notice a pattern?)
if i have time i'll cut it up and post

i will have a camera that we can actively upload w/ so we'll record sometime...

 

[MikeSanti]

it's clowsui*

htf do people get this wrong all the time >___>;

btw @ the better vids thing we'll have some in 3 weeks

DJ i have the vids of the dittos just haven't cut it up yet/will not have time to
+ i'm pretty sure both of us are way better than that now (lol what i said all the other times :D :D :D notice a pattern?)
if i have time i'll cut it up and post

i will have a camera that we can actively upload w/ so we'll record sometime...

WOW I swear I saw clown..rofl My bad though, I'll edit it. Good stuff, 3 weeks.

 

[Asimio]

Counter can work sometimes with the torando, but see ^ because counter is a dash attack, shouldn't be used much. And landing away from MK, usually anybody is a good idea. It gives you a chance to regroup and reset the field.

Alright, thanks a lot for the feedback.

 

[Steel_Samurai]

it's clowsui*

htf do people get this wrong all the time >___>;

btw @ the better vids thing we'll have some in 3 weeks

DJ i have the vids of the dittos just haven't cut it up yet/will not have time to
+ i'm pretty sure both of us are way better than that now (lol what i said all the other times :D :D :D notice a pattern?)
if i have time i'll cut it up and post

i will have a camera that we can actively upload w/ so we'll record sometime...

Yeah, we will get some better vids at your smashfest, we have both improved, IMO as well
and thanks Stafu lol I'll probably have better/closer matched vids in a month, those are just the only recent ones I have right now XD

 

[Chileno4Live]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vt9Ba9fHPUw&feature=channel_page&fmt=18

Please help me improve ^_^; I'm just a beginner's Marth i think, but i really want to get better. So any tips are appreciated. Please no flaming I only want tips and/or compliments lol (if there is 1 >.<)

 

[Fizzle]

Random stuff after watching:

Weave out with your fairs -- i.e. if your sh fair connects then don't fair them again. DI back so they can't punish you.

Don't go for random spikes.

Learn to deal with camping better. There were several times you lost edgeguarding attempts because you weren't ready to shield ROB's projectiles.

Don't go offstage so often when edgeguarding.

More juggling. Get ROB in the air with uthrow/up dancing blade/whatever and keep him there. It's Marth's greatest asset in this matchup.

Train yourself to stop dancing blade after the first hit misses or is shielded.

In general, remember that ROB can swat Marth right out of the air with ftilt and fsmash, so be less predictable with your approaches. Less double fair and more sh single fair. Also it's best to approach ROB by walking rather than dashing. That way all of your shield/dodge options are ready to deal with ROB's camping. Not too bad overall though.

 

[Pr0phetic]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vt9Ba9fHPUw&feature=channel_page&fmt=18

Please help me improve ^_^; I'm just a beginner's Marth i think, but i really want to get better. So any tips are appreciated. Please no flaming I only want tips and/or compliments lol (if there is 1 >.<)

Full critique reserved after Apex.

 

[Chileno4Live]

Random stuff after watching:

Weave out with your fairs -- i.e. if your sh fair connects then don't fair them again. DI back so they can't punish you.

Don't go for random spikes.

Learn to deal with camping better. There were several times you lost edgeguarding attempts because you weren't ready to shield ROB's projectiles.

Don't go offstage so often when edgeguarding.

More juggling. Get ROB in the air with uthrow/up dancing blade/whatever and keep him there. It's Marth's greatest asset in this matchup.

Train yourself to stop dancing blade after the first hit misses or is shielded.

In general, remember that ROB can swat Marth right out of the air with ftilt and fsmash, so be less predictable with your approaches. Less double fair and more sh single fair. Also it's best to approach ROB by walking rather than dashing. That way all of your shield/dodge options are ready to deal with ROB's camping. Not too bad overall though.

Thnx, i'll try to do what you said, your suggestions and tips are very appreciated, thnxx!!!!

EDIT: Also, is my spacing acceptable or not? I mean i'm not sure if i space the correct way lol

 

[phi1ny3]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vt9Ba9fHPUw&feature=channel_page&fmt=18

Please help me improve ^_^; I'm just a beginner's Marth i think, but i really want to get better. So any tips are appreciated. Please no flaming I only want tips and/or compliments lol (if there is 1 >.<)

Roll just a little bit less, like replace half of them with pivot grabs (not seriously, but consider doing something else).
Learn to ff nair a little more, as well as retreat/advance with it.
vary your fairs a little bit, lots of double fair, could use some delayed fairs, SH DB (not a lot though), empty hop -> punishment.
You're off to a decent start, just fine tune it, practice is probably the best remedy, no really unforgivable habits (except maybe the roll back and forth once or twice).

 

[Chileno4Live]

Thnx for your tips and suggestions. I am wondering 1 thing though, am i spacing well enough? Is my spacing decent? Am i doing it right?

 

[SNRLX]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vt9Ba9fHPUw&feature=channel_page&fmt=18

Please help me improve ^_^; I'm just a beginner's Marth i think, but i really want to get better. So any tips are appreciated. Please no flaming I only want tips and/or compliments lol (if there is 1 >.<)

I haven't seen anyone mention it yet, use Dolphin Slash out of Shield.

It's really nice if you notice that the opponent is using the get-up attack from the ledge (which is really a terrid idea, but whatev) since they are near the edge, the knockback from DS will kill at lower percents than you'd think.

tl;dr if they hit your shield, up+b out of it.

 

[Chileno4Live]

Alright thnx i'll keep that in mind. Is there anything else i need to improve or change? When should i use SHDouble Fair and when should i not? When should i use SHFFFair and when not? And when should i use Dtilt? I sorta need to know these questions. So i can have a better picture on how i should play. I'm also watching alot of videos, so i'm definetly improving. Maybe i'll be thinking of switching mains to Marth, but let's first improve lol. Thnx again :D

 

[arcane9211]

I'm hesitant to post here, but I'd like some help with my Marth. I have a tourney on Saturday and was wondering if you guys could offer some constructive criticism.

A couple things I'd like to say first:

1) I rarely ever visit the Marth boards, so there's probably something big I'm missing. Don't be too harsh o.0

2) I don't have any recent videos of me playing someone in person (and probably won't be able to get a video of me vs. someone up before Saturday), so I just recorded myself against a random lvl 9. I know...I didn't want to put a video up of me vs a cpu either, but it's all I've got. -_-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEv-Dk6yO24

 

[Pierce7d]

I'm hesitant to post here, but I'd like some help with my Marth. I have a tourney on Saturday and was wondering if you guys could offer some constructive criticism.

A couple things I'd like to say first:

1) I rarely ever visit the Marth boards, so there's probably something big I'm missing. Don't be too harsh o.0

2) I don't have any recent videos of me playing someone in person (and probably won't be able to get a video of me vs. someone up before Saturday), so I just recorded myself against a random lvl 9. I know...I didn't want to put a video up of me vs a cpu either, but it's all I've got. -_-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEv-Dk6yO24

Space better, and the next time you submit a video of you fighting a CPU, do not edgeugard them or meteor smash (spike) them at all. Computer's recover idiotically, and it's hard for me to get a better grasp on your play if I don't get to see how you fight people at higher percents, because you just gimp idiot CPUs.

You never tippered your Fairs, and didn't space properly. Never do a rising Uair (it can be done, but you're doing it wrong, and you're not experienced enough to use it.) Use Dancing Blade to punish your opponent. Try and hit your opponent's with the tip of your Fair to do more damage.

 

[arcane9211]

Space better, and the next time you submit a video of you fighting a CPU, do not edgeugard them or meteor smash (spike) them at all. Computer's recover idiotically, and it's hard for me to get a better grasp on your play if I don't get to see how you fight people at higher percents, because you just gimp idiot CPUs.

You never tippered your Fairs, and didn't space properly. Never do a rising Uair (it can be done, but you're doing it wrong, and you're not experienced enough to use it.) Use Dancing Blade to punish your opponent. Try and hit your opponent's with the tip of your Fair to do more damage.

Thank you, I'll definitely work on those

I didn't use db as much as usual to punish that match because it's Peach, but point taken.

 

[Pr0phetic]

Well, I'm going to start critiquing vids again, however to kick it off, you get to rip on mine

SSBB - Rukkiko(Marth) vs Phresh(Falco) 1

There's a few more, but everything is processing, so here's an *almost* preview of what to expect. Enjoy!

 

[phi1ny3]

I think there are several habits you need to get going:
you added pressure eventually, and you and I both saw the difference near the end of the match when you were actually using more air game. Get a little more air.
Your rolling was debatable, you didn't get too predictable, but it was a little too much.
pivot grab/grab would've conditioned him to spotdodge less during those "stale wars" where you guys were just shenaniganizing on the ground with spotdodge and such, and doing so would've made your DB more viable since he was shielding quite a bit.
I like your habit of attempting to punish his recovery, that'll come with practice, but I think a good way to "condition him" is to pivot grab him, fthrow -> something to reset the situation, and hopefully, you'll get the smash in when he tries again thinking "I dun wanna get garbed again, I'm gonna wait/retaliate!".
I lol'd at the Shield breaker moment, and at the end the icky DI he did (he was prolly thinking "oos SH bair" or something like that to punish).
Edit: some of the other things were excessive, but those looked like it was just a lack of thick application, I think you'll get the hang of DS and other things.

 

[Kirin]

You spot-dodged too much in the beginning imo. Try perfect shielding some more. Also it seemed to me that you attempted Dolphin Slash out of shield too much when that is easily punishable. You even used it a few times when it obviously was not going to hit, but that's just a reaction I'm sure. I have problems with the same thing.

 

[Pr0phetic]

Btw, im not going to lie, it was Wi-Fi, so pressuring is 10x more difficult, and a little more sluggish. But no johns, I see what you guys mean, and I'll work on it.

Oh, and that DS OoS excessiveness is my slight frustration and jumping the gun reaction. I see I also have to work on reach the ground safely, ZMT pointed that out before.

 

[Steel]

rukkiko you still need a lot of work. you let falco control you WAY too easily and you had way too many random grab attempts and spot dodges when you could have been applying pressure. your offensive game was poor and i saw 0 dtilt. he beat you almost every time up close when Marth should be outspacing him easily. falco can't really do anything when you zone him but you gave him too much space. i also thought his recovery habits were rather predictable but you rarely punished. need to work on better control and sword placement

 

[Pr0phetic]

rukkiko you still need a lot of work. you let falco control you WAY too easily and you had way too many random grab attempts and spot dodges when you could have been applying pressure. your offensive game was poor and i saw 0 dtilt. he beat you almost every time up close when Marth should be outspacing him easily. falco can't really do anything when you zone him but you gave him too much space. i also thought his recovery habits were rather predictable but you rarely punished. need to work on better control and sword placement

What I wanted to hear, yeah I need to work on the Falco match-up.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

rukkiko you still need a lot of work. you let falco control you WAY too easily and you had way too many random grab attempts and spot dodges when you could have been applying pressure. your offensive game was poor and i saw 0 dtilt. he beat you almost every time up close when Marth should be outspacing him easily. falco can't really do anything when you zone him but you gave him too much space. i also thought his recovery habits were rather predictable but you rarely punished. need to work on better control and sword placement

He dtilted once. For some reason I thought it was wifi. You should walk more towards falco. Oh yeah fthrow chains on falco fthrow>fthrow>tipper fsmash. Don't fish for grabs to much. You spot dodge to much.

 

[BacklashMarth]

Rukikko, ffnair is your best friend. Often times if u space yourself at the end of falcos phantasm (assuming hes on the ledge) then u can easily tipper him out of it then finish him off with some edgeguarding pro-ness. Falco should die within 30 seconds of you knocking him offstage if u play your cards right. Falco cant do much from the ledge so u are at an advantage if u just keep fairing and nairing just outside of falcos phantasm range. I noticed that u got hit by a lot of that DAC usmash stuff falco was shelling out and i think maybe wifi was not on your side in terms of shield input so i shall ignore that. Swing your sword more lol. A simple fair wall would have kept falco from gettin in there and DAing or grabbing you. Against the shlazer spam, just duck. He will eventually either a) start shooting lazers from the floor or b) phantasm you. To handle both of these u need to mix in dtilt and some full/short hops. Dtilt should handle phantasm and short hop gets u over those pesky lazers and u can easily hit falco with a fair b4 he puts his gun away. Throw in some dash away to reverse db when and falco are close and u think he will roll behind you.

 

[Pr0phetic]

Rukikko, ffnair is your best friend. Often times if u space yourself at the end of falcos phantasm (assuming hes on the ledge) then u can easily tipper him out of it then finish him off with some edgeguarding pro-ness. I will finish editing this post later when i get home to finish my critique.

I've been critiquing myself aswell, im trying to get a vid of when I'm a little more focused, and hopefully offline, but yea that might be impossible.

I'll be waiting!

 

[BBoyindo]

hmmm...
You need to work on zoning. A lot of the time when falco was at blaster range and SHed you just sat in your shield, waiting. You should approach! once your inside he's cake
Also you need better 0% grab combos like almostlegendary said.
You will spotdodge less automatically if you space well and zone well.
And yes you had too many random grabs, and the thing is, they don't reward you enough.
Too much sitting in your shield in general, it got better later in the match though.

Use DB for punishing only unless you go for DB1 grab or SB or something. You use it at times where a Dtilt would have been perfect. Lets take for example 1:35. You stand away from Falco, and then just start a DB. He rolls around you and KO's you with an Fsmash. If you would have walked up to him and Dtilted, you would have pressured him, outzone him and at the same time you would have been safe. Seriously Dtilt is good. Just punish with DB lol. (This is the most important advice i'm giving you btw, the others are just lil things)

btw i saw you get messed up by wifi a lot man it sucks eh lol.

 

[Pr0phetic]

hmmm...
You need to work on zoning. A lot of the time when falco was at blaster range and SHed you just sat in your shield, waiting. You should approach! once your inside he's cake
Also you need better 0% grab combos like almostlegendary said.
You will spotdodge less automatically if you space well and zone well.
And yes you had too many random grabs, and the thing is, they don't reward you enough.
Too much sitting in your shield in general, it got better later in the match though.

Use DB for punishing only unless you go for DB1 grab or SB or something. You use it at times where a Dtilt would have been perfect. Lets take for example 1:35. You stand away from Falco, and then just start a DB. He rolls around you and KO's you with an Fsmash. If you would have walked up to him and Dtilted, you would have pressured him, outzone him and at the same time you would have been safe. Seriously Dtilt is good. Just punish with DB lol. (This is the most important advice i'm giving you btw, the others are just lil things)

btw i saw you get messed up by wifi a lot man it sucks eh lol.

Aslong as you can see that, your critique is good . I'm guessing this is the final critique, anybody got something needed to be critiqued.

Oh, ima have some more vids up, hopefully it;ll be an improvement.

 

[LuLLo]

Hello people,
I'm pretty new to Marth and have been playing for 2 months or so, yesterday I finally got the chance to record some matches, so feel free to give lots of critique .
The first 3 matches are normal matches (forgot if I won or lost), the fourth match used to be a 3-stock with me only taking 63% or so, but my camera only recorded the first stock.
I know that the Snake isn't the best you've seen, but we're nearly on the same level (me being just a little bit better than him).
Enjoy

Oh yeah, I'd like to receive in depth critique, all videos or just the ones you guys deem good for critique .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATj1Ob6xS1k vs Kodama 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJpSffC4BWw vs Kodama 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRXUqdou9i0 vs Kodama 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sXJUNnAekM vs Kodama 4

 

[3xSwords]

Ok LuLLo, it's clear that you are still not perfectly used to Marth.

General things I noticed: Your spacing is off, you either go in too much (ie all the untipper fairs for hits and on his shield) or you extend yourself too much (ie in a disadvantageous position you try to hit your opponent, end up missing then punished 2:56 and 1:05 in the second vid); your approaches are lacking variety, mostly SH fairs and you seem to use DB also which you shouldn't, use some mixups such as FH fairs, nairs, shield dash, grabs etc. On the subject of DB, stop using down variation, once your friend learns to SDI you will be screwed. And you should also learn to SDI Snake's nair. Also stop using shield breaker randomly. It just doesn't work.

In general, a lot of this stuff is just you needing to know Marth's greatest areas of control and a lot of it comes with exp and not trying to force the issue by getting too aggressive and giving up control. A good example is whenever Snake was able to land a bair or just air dodge right through your juggle attempt. This happened mainly because you second jump and attack. It's better to time your first jump so that you still have time to FF and cover both those options. Hope this helps

 

[LuLLo]

Thanks, I'll try to improve it .
I myself was wondering why I got punished so much for stuff, I'll try to vary in my approaches and use DB more effictively. Good advice .
I would appreciate it if others also critique my Marth, so I can improve on more areas.

 

[Trypt]

my vid

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0u1M9zTtk4&fmt=18

Be brutal!

 

[BacklashMarth]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0u1M9zTtk4&fmt=18

Be brutal!

Too much dair. I will let the rest of the repliers fill in the rest.

 

[Bliss]

Please critique me!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNV9ihdWEoo
I recorded this on an awful 6 megapixel camera so I apologize in advance for the quality. I never really gave brawl a chance after being such a big melee fan and am only just now starting to get into it.

I often have trouble killing and I think I may play too passive.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

Please critique me!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNV9ihdWEoo
I recorded this on an awful 6 megapixel camera so I apologize in advance for the quality. I never really gave brawl a chance after being such a big melee fan and am only just now starting to get into it.

I often have trouble killing and I think I may play too passive.

Try not to roll too much. If you having trouble killing just be patience and don't try to force the kill marth has as a lot of killing options.

 

[Bliss]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0u1M9zTtk4&fmt=18

Be brutal!

Definitely too many dairs. Dair is not too useful besides spiking as it is laggy. Short hop your fairs and nairs instead of always full hopping. Be more aggressive on edgeguarding, wolf is easy to gimp for Marth. For example, at around 2:50 you could have faired Wolf offstage and edgehogged. I guess work on pressuring him spaced fairs/nairs/tilts and avoid dairs.

 

[feardragon64]

Please critique me!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNV9ihdWEoo
I recorded this on an awful 6 megapixel camera so I apologize in advance for the quality. I never really gave brawl a chance after being such a big melee fan and am only just now starting to get into it.

I often have trouble killing and I think I may play too passive.

Try not to roll so much.

Space your fairs better. Your spacing is fine up until you actually throw out the fair. You need to DI backwards because you always land right in front of them. Your opponent could have just shield grabbed you/DS'd. almost every time.

Try not to throw out attacks that have no purpose. I'd say this and rolling would improve your game a lot. Start thinking in your games. Marth doesn't do well on auto-pilot usually.

General mistakes due to spacing. Whiffing a grab when they were a sitting duck. Using shieldbreaker and charging it when they were nowhere near you. Etc. Just keep working on it.