The Official Falco Video Critique Thread!

[Pi]

Posting for my friend since he might more readily take advice given here than from me:

Plup (samus) vs. Fearz (falco)
3 (samus) vs. Fearz (falco)

i told him to stop lasering for like 2 weeks cause i punish him a lot for them, and to bait some UB's
but overall he doesn't listen to me so i leave it to you respected falco's of the falco board

 

[Druggedfox]

To be fair, it's totally understandable to feel more pressure against people around your skill level; against people worse than you you don't have to worry at all because you know you'll win. If they're way better than you then you're not expecting yourself to win anyway; playing without expectations is significantly easier than with them. That leaves people at your skill level... where the outcome feels totally up in the air, yet you still feel the expectation to beat them.

 

[KingClubber]

Posting for my friend since he might more readily take advice given here than from me:

Plup (samus) vs. Fearz (falco)
3 (samus) vs. Fearz (falco)

i told him to stop lasering for like 2 weeks cause i punish him a lot for them, and to bait some UB's
but overall he doesn't listen to me so i leave it to you respected falco's of the falco board

He needs to learn the basics..... He could have kill you a lot faster if he knew there was 1 simple attack that could kill you when your high in damage.


Why does all these new falco players skips the basics, and go straight for advance tech's? It's doesn't make any sense. I keep seeing them do things i struggle with, but in the end i know i could beat them because the don't seem to know what falco can do other then advance tech's.

 

[Pi]

i agree, he lacks fundamental knowledge
for a while too, i thought shffling aerials was enough
given that i was samus, this didn't work out in my favor for very long and once i realized this i had to fine tune my playstyle and put more emphasis on approaching smartly, and safely
polishing my edge guards and combo's
and perfecting my defense & counter approach game

i think he's still in the phase of 'omg look how flashy i can be'
in fact i know he is

so how do i break him out of this? what falco things can i have him work on that will help him improve?

 

[Moooose]

just play more. if he has the mindset of playing to learn he'll stop getting hit by dumb stuff eventually. then he'll win.

 

[Pi]

just play more. if he has the mindset of playing to learn he'll stop getting hit by dumb stuff eventually. then he'll win.

it's been like this for too long, we play all the time and have been for like 2 years now
it went from us going even to me winning every single match vs. any of his characters
he says he wants to get better but when i give him advice he just brushes it off because he doesn't think i'm that good, i think

if you can, could you just critique the video and i can pass the information along? i really think it would hold more merit if i could tell him some notable falco's from the boards said he's doing it wrong

 

[Wenbobular]

He can't ledgehop laser for beans, tell him to stop doing them if he can't even get them to Samus's dash attack height <___<

Also he missed a Dair -> anything combo, pretty mad basic

Also is this guy Bone what are these charged Fsmashes at the ledge and why is he trying to shine you off Fountain (unless I'm missing something here Fountain has a pretty high ceiling does Samus just super float to her death <_<)

Other than that, I thought he played like not terribly vs you even though you seem to eat a bunch of Dairs for no reason ... he doesn't get up-b'd out of shield ever time he hits your shield so he must be doing SOMEthing right there unless you're just mistiming it somehow but maybe that was just the first game where he didn't get hit by it a lot who knows

My conclusion is that Samus is a weird character and he should get out and play spacies before he winds up like me and only knows how to fight Luigi and Falcon <_<

 

[Moooose]

i watched some of him vs you. his on stage game is fine. some small issues but whatever. main thing is he needs to work on edgeguarding/recovering. samus cannot get back from the ledge at high percents, if you space bairs and mix in empty sh's.

 

[Rubyiris]

Now you're just asking to get made fun of, bro. C'mon, step it up!

Why is that being asked to be made fun of? Honestly that's fairly common in competitive environments. When you're against someone closer to your skill level you feel more pressured to do well and win, because you have something to prove.

@DruggedFox: The way I feel about established players is a little different. It's not necessarily that I expect to lose, it's just that I've spent most of my smash career playing against people significantly better than myself, so it's gotten to the point to where my play style just naturally does extremely well vs very good people.

 

[Pi]

He can't ledgehop laser for beans, tell him to stop doing them if he can't even get them to Samus's dash attack height <___<

Also he missed a Dair -> anything combo, pretty mad basic

Also is this guy Bone what are these charged Fsmashes at the ledge and why is he trying to shine you off Fountain (unless I'm missing something here Fountain has a pretty high ceiling does Samus just super float to her death <_<)

Other than that, I thought he played like not terribly vs you even though you seem to eat a bunch of Dairs for no reason ... he doesn't get up-b'd out of shield ever time he hits your shield so he must be doing SOMEthing right there unless you're just mistiming it somehow but maybe that was just the first game where he didn't get hit by it a lot who knows

My conclusion is that Samus is a weird character and he should get out and play spacies before he winds up like me and only knows how to fight Luigi and Falcon <_<

i've been playing fox vs. him recently just because i know he doesn't like fighting my samus and i develope some bad habits by fighting him so much, one of which is that i don't UB OoS vs. him every time i should because i can win without it and i don't like doing it (johns i know), so i'll try to WD out instead.

i watched some of him vs you. his on stage game is fine. some small issues but whatever. main thing is he needs to work on edgeguarding/recovering. samus cannot get back from the ledge at high percents, if you space bairs and mix in empty sh's.

i'll let him know

 

[ZetTroxX]

I can has decent Falco

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSNdDh_tBa8

 

[TheDekuNut]

0:06- 0:53 you are a bully

 

[trahhSTEEZY]

I can has decent Falco

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSNdDh_tBa8

your waveshines arent cute at all

work on em

 

[ZetTroxX]

My shines aren´t cute?

You mean they´re too short, or too slow?

 

[trahhSTEEZY]

they seem to be too short

nvm i was just noticing one small part, ignore me =D just gotta play against DI now

 

[Bones0]

Why is that being asked to be made fun of? Honestly that's fairly common in competitive environments. When you're against someone closer to your skill level you feel more pressured to do well and win, because you have something to prove.

Wow, sorry, I completely misinterpreted your post somehow. I definitely agree with you. lol

 

[Wenbobular]

@ 3
If you can get away with up-b OoS you should spam it on him so he doesn't develop the bad habit of trying to pressure Samus's shield like a moron xD

 

[Rubyiris]

Rubyiris (Nyan) vs GamerGuitarist7 (gay standard falcon)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EY7o_deaHw

@Bones: Don't worry. Everyone does that.

 

[Pi]

@ 3
If you can get away with up-b OoS you should spam it on him so he doesn't develop the bad habit of trying to pressure Samus's shield like a moron xD

Fair enough.

I've discovered one of his biggest problems is he is not humble.

He thinks he's good but I know for a fact he doesn't understand the game on the level you need to in order to improve.

 

[mers]

My shines aren´t cute?

You mean they´re too short, or too slow?

You also leave the ground, which is probably part of the issue. Airdodge 1 frame sooner.

 

[Bones0]

Fair enough.

I've discovered one of his biggest problems is he is not humble.

He thinks he's good but I know for a fact he doesn't understand the game on the level you need to in order to improve.

From personal experience, I think the best way to help players who are a little stubborn when it comes to accepting advice is to just keep abusing their mistakes until they either accept that they AREN'T playing "correctly" and change it up or give up. A lot of players who get stuck in the typical scrub mentality only see the light once they get completely destroyed over and over. Unfortunately, if they are really that stubborn they won't improve and will usually give up. :/

 

[Wenbobular]

Most people start to understand how bad they are when they learn just how deep the rabbit hole goes

Those who don't are usually morons

Or like, Smash prodigies I guess but that's usually not the case haha

 

[Winston]

From personal experience, I think the best way to help players who are a little stubborn when it comes to accepting advice is to just keep abusing their mistakes until they either accept that they AREN'T playing "correctly" and change it up or give up.

God I wish this worked for me ><

 

[ChivalRuse]

At this point, tech skill shouldn't be a problem for any player who wants to be competitive at this game. Therefore, I don't understand why "mistakes" (i.e., inferior decision making that consistently leads to getting punished, even inadvertently) are something worth talking about. You don't beat someone by making fewer mistakes than they: you beat them by observing, understanding, and punishing better than the other player.

 

[Druggedfox]

God I wish this worked for me ><

**** them harder :D

 

[Pi]

From personal experience, I think the best way to help players who are a little stubborn when it comes to accepting advice is to just keep abusing their mistakes until they either accept that they AREN'T playing "correctly" and change it up or give up. A lot of players who get stuck in the typical scrub mentality only see the light once they get completely destroyed over and over. Unfortunately, if they are really that stubborn they won't improve and will usually give up. :/

I 4 stock him at least once a smashfest
and do not lose games to him.

I've decided to just troll him until he get's pissed and listens to what I have to say.

& I'm only doing this because when asked if he wanted to get better at the game, he replied with a yes. And was open to receiving advice from me, which I refused to give him while he's stoned since I feel it would be a waste of my breath, but aside from that when I am able to catch him sober and give him advice, he either fails to implement it, or gives up after it does't work once, or takes offense to what I've said and chooses to defend his actions.

I've decided to either force him to either not want to play the game with me, or to get better himself

 

[Rubyiris]

At this point, tech skill shouldn't be a problem for any player who wants to be competitive at this game. Therefore, I don't understand why "mistakes" (i.e., inferior decision making that consistently leads to getting punished, even inadvertently) are something worth talking about. You don't beat someone by making fewer mistakes than they: you beat them by observing, understanding, and punishing better than the other player.

Characters like Peach make this argument flawed to some degree.

Peach is a character that really can win just by making less mistakes than characters whom die relatively easily.

 

[Bones0]

Yeah, I think the whole discussion of playing to make less mistakes is basically what Mango was talking about in his podcast with some players playing "***." Players who wait for their opponents to make a mistake and don't actively try to outplay their opponent can do REALLY well in tournament. The problem is, like Mango said, they will eventually cap out when their opponents get good enough that they aren't making enough mistakes for waiting around to be the dominant strategy.

 

[Pi]

^nice interpretation
i hadn't thought about that reason but seems sound

though i don't forsee any 'cap' to a player playing 'gay' in that sense
someone's got to approach, and if it gets predicted they'll get hit
likewise for the aproachee

 

[Veetaak]

Yeah, I think the whole discussion of playing to make less mistakes is basically what Mango was talking about in his podcast with some players playing "***." Players who wait for their opponents to make a mistake and don't actively try to outplay their opponent can do REALLY well in tournament. The problem is, like Mango said, they will eventually cap out when their opponents get good enough that they aren't making enough mistakes for waiting around to be the dominant strategy.

I think that's partially the reason to why Mango bodied M2K's marth with his falco on their first match at genesis 2. Mango just stomped on him the entire match and made little to no errors and I think that caught m2k off guard

 

[KingClubber]

..................................That would explain a few things.....

 

[00000001]

Help a scrub falco, point out how I suck! For real, I need some polish.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpgtuMKL1kc&feature=player_profilepage#t=297s

uhh, I need help against puff!

 

[KingClubber]

Timing - Just need practice on timing your attacks, and movements the combo's will fall in place after much practice.

Speed - You play very slow, stop standing around waiting for you enemy to do something start dash dancing, and dash jumping you got to keep your momentum up. Practice tech skills if he's not going to attack but keep on your toes for when he does.

Me personally spend 2 hours a day practicing my tech skills n movement in practice mode since i never have anyone to play anymore.

To Many Missed Tech's -

8 missed tech's vs Falcon
4 missed tech's vs Jigg's

I would like to say more, but after reading the last few pages i have to start rethinking my play style.

I can't tell but is this another case of skipping the basics?

 

[00000001]

Timing - Just need practice on timing your attacks, and movements the combo's will fall in place after much practice.

Speed - You play very slow, stop standing around waiting for you enemy to do something start dash dancing, and dash jumping you got to keep your momentum up. Practice tech skills if he's not going to attack but keep on your toes for when he does.

Me personally spend 2 hours a day practicing my tech skills n movement in practice mode since i never have anyone to play anymore.

To Many Missed Tech's -

8 missed tech's vs Falcon
4 missed tech's vs Jigg's

I would like to say more, but after reading the last few pages i have to start rethinking my play style.

I can't tell but is this another case of skipping the basics?

I can agree, I'm missing basics. I don't get to play against non AI opponents often but no johns.

 

[KingClubber]

=_=

Wave dashing is a thorn in the soul of my tech skills.

Once again my skills in wave dashing have died.

I know wave dashing isn't an *required* skill but i feel like it is for Falco players.

So what do i do?

 

[ShroudedOne]

Characters like Peach make this argument flawed to some degree.

Peach is a character that really can win just by making less mistakes than characters whom die relatively easily.

As a Peach main, I automatically take offense, but I understand what your saying. But you can always play safer...I mean, shouldn't mistakes be punished?

 

[Wenbobular]

=_=

Wave dashing is a thorn in the soul of my tech skills.

Once again my skills in wave dashing have died.

I know wave dashing isn't an *required* skill but i feel like it is for Falco players.

So what do i do?

Wavedashing is pretty required nowadays ... if you can't wavedash the rest of your tech skill is most likely also not up to snuff

And what do you mean what do you do <_<
Practice wavedashing

 

[Bones0]

^nice interpretation
i hadn't thought about that reason but seems sound

though i don't forsee any 'cap' to a player playing 'gay' in that sense
someone's got to approach, and if it gets predicted they'll get hit
likewise for the aproachee

Well the idea behind the cap is if you're waiting for someone to make mistakes and they aren't making any. Sort of what someone was talking about above when they referenced M2K's Marth. His Marth, while obviously amazing, has the tendency to rely on waiting for his opponent to make mistakes. He would rather dash dance and wait for them to misspace something than approach in a way that makes it so they can't escape. Mango bodied him because Mango isn't going to miss L-cancels and get shield grabbed or misspace a nair and whiff on his shield. He took the game to the point where waiting for those mistakes won't work. If M2K was dash dancing because he actually is predicting something it would be a different story, but I feel like most of the time dash dancing is an attempt to bait a mistake. Do I think people should never bait mistakes with dash dances? Obviously not, and I don't think Mango would suggest that either. What IS a problem is when your gameplay revolves around that style of waiting and reacting, though.

As a Peach main, I automatically take offense, but I understand what your saying. But you can always play safer...I mean, shouldn't mistakes be punished?

You can play safe, but at the end of the day you have to push the offensive. Games won't be won by simply outspacing your opponent if you never hit them. That being said, I would hardly consider playing aggressively exclusive to certain characters. I think Fox has more leeway in terms of how hard he can push aggressive moves than Peach can, but just go back and watch Armada in GFs. He doesn't do a lot of waiting around for Mango, and I thought he played just as aggressive, if not more so, than Mango. It just doesn't always look that way because Peach is so much slower.

I could just be talking out of my ***, though. I'm not good at this game (yet :D).

 

[FoxLisk]

bones i dont think youre talking out your *** but i also think mango was way more aggressive than armada. i think armada was putting on a lot of offensive pressure, but i think mango was doing it to a much greater degree. however, i think mango did way too much of it so your analysis of what makes sense to do is pretty legit.

 

[Aldwyn McCloud]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2MkfdwgwNI

All right, here it is ^^

To bring things back up from the other thread I really had no idea of what was going on haha. All I was doing was just looking at him and trying to hit him. Same goes for my counter picks. I picked stadium because I thought it had the right combination of close blast zones and room for spam and because it's a stage I like in general. Since it didn't work out as good as I was hoping, I went battlefield again because it's another one of my best stages. Overlord was insisting on this too (you can see that in the camera part in between 2nd and 3rd match), hence my pretty face as I was like "HELL YEAH battlefield" :°D. On a side note, you might have noticed I only started grabbing near the end of the 2nd match. This is because one of the commentators suddendly mentioned me not grabbing armada enough and I was like "yeah I got it" and started grabbing from there on :°D.