Legend of Zelda The Milk Bar [Archived]

[Waluigi911]

The great sea was just too big and too empty.

You do realize that's the way oceans tend to be, right? The Great Sea had a heck of a lot more stuff closer together than, say, the Atlantic ocean.

 

[MASAHIROx]

thats one of the dumbest things iv ever heard...WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A VIDEO GAME.

last time i checked video games need to keep you interested and entertained.

the ocean was way too big.

 

[Chief Mendez]

Hey I liked the ocean. The only time it got annoying was when you had to find all the Triforce maps. Otherwise I thought it was brilliant.

Occasional (and masterfully done) storms, an abundance of watchtowers, submarines, and even the occasional enemy kept me busy between each square, which isn't that large of a distance.

Each square?

Yeah, each square. There was something in every quadrant across the entire Great Sea--even if you couldn't fully uncover all of a given island's secrets when you first found it, they were still fun to explore, and even more fun to come back to and complete later.

Seriously, you may as well say "the overworld in the original LoZ was too big and empty."

 

[SuperRacoon]

Hey I liked the ocean. The only time it got annoying was when you had to find all the Triforce maps. Otherwise I thought it was brilliant.

Occasional (and masterfully done) storms, an abundance of watchtowers, submarines, and even the occasional enemy kept me busy between each square, which isn't that large of a distance.

Each square?

Yeah, each square. There was something in every quadrant across the entire Great Sea--even if you couldn't fully uncover all of a given island's secrets when you first found it, they were still fun to explore, and even more fun to come back to and complete later.

Seriously, you may as well say "the overworld in the original LoZ was too big and empty."

Unlike WW, you aren't stuck on a very very large blue plane. In the original LoZ the scenery, you know, actually changed from each square to the next. And loads of secrets were packed in to that little game. Plus, the second adventure in the original LoZ actually changed some dungeons and locations of stuff, instead just changing links cloths, which was totally pointless.

To answer your comment on the enemies and towers and stuff, oh wow cookie cutter towers and gun boats, I don't freakin' care, the AI has always been painfully stupid in the LoZ franchise, I usually just pass them in all the Zelda games anyway and go to the dungeons and the puzzles where the real fun is.

Furthermore, I never said WW was a bad game, I just said that it's not my favorite. Not everyone has the same opinion as you, get over it.

 

[Chief Mendez]

Unlike WW, you aren't stuck on a very very large blue plane. In the original LoZ the scenery, you know, actually changed from each square to the next. And loads of secrets were packed in to that little game. Plus, the second adventure in the original LoZ actually changed some dungeons and locations of stuff, instead just changing links cloths, which was totally pointless.

I don't think I mentioned the new game+ being good or anything.

And hey, there are plenty of secrets in Windwaker, too. So maybe the ocean was a bit bland, as far as looks go (most of the time). I still liked it.

To answer your comment on the enemies and towers and stuff, oh wow cookie cutter towers and gun boats, I don't freakin' care, the AI has always been painfully stupid in the LoZ franchise, I usually just pass them in all the Zelda games anyway and go to the dungeons and the puzzles where the real fun is.

At least it's variety, right? As opposed to just Moblins, Tektites and Zoras?

And again, I don't think I mentioned the AI. It's really stinkin' easy in Windwaker, just like most of the games.

Furthermore, I never said WW was a bad game, I just said that it's not my favorite.

Furthermore, I never said it should be your favorite, or that my opinion was better than yours. I just explained why I like it.

Not everyone has the same opinion as you, get over it.

...Okay but seriously, I apologize for offending you. I don't want to get into a little flame war defending Windwaker here, so let's just forget any of this ever happened, a'ight?

 

[SuperRacoon]

...Okay but seriously, I apologize for offending you. I don't want to get into a little flame war defending Windwaker here, so let's just forget any of this ever happened, a'ight?

Lol this graph is actually really true in general, (Windwaker is Awesome) everyone agrees with that >_0, it's when we get down to the details that there are a few problems.

 

[MASAHIROx]

lol i have no problem with WW...

i just think MM is a better game

 

[SkylerOcon]

Zelda Fanboys will always be at war between OoT, MM, WW, and the original. This is an undeniable fact of life, and in the end should just be delt with. They're all fantastic games and each one could arguably make it into anybody's Top 100 games list. Zelda is awesome, end of story.

That said, I would love to sit here and debate endlessly about which one is the best (OoT and WW tie, in my opinion), but please, don't turn this into a flame war.

 

[ranmaru]

I love OoT, MM, WW, and The original all the same!

 

[SkylerOcon]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H10Tl3sTpWM

For those of you who haven't seen this already, let this be known as the best thing to ever be found by hacking a game. Why didn't Nintendo leave this in as a hidden boss, instead of taking it out and only letting the hackers have fun?

 

[Darkslash]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H10Tl3sTpWM

For those of you who haven't seen this already, let this be known as the best thing to ever be found by hacking a game. Why didn't Nintendo leave this in as a hidden boss, instead of taking it out and only letting the hackers have fun?

Fox:ARRRRRGGG
Falco:NOOOO
Peppy:NOOO
Slippy:NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!
Link:HYA!!!

 

[karthik_king]

OoT for life

 

[Yaya]

http://www.smashboards.com/group.php?groupid=491

I believe I speak for everyone else when I made this group.

 

[EPsilon933]

http://www.smashboards.com/group.php?groupid=491

I believe I speak for everyone else when I made this group.

You're a complete n00b, and so is everyone else for not being able to solve a few difficult puzzles.

Anyways, to celebrate The Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time's 10th birthday, I speed-ran the game in 8:41:45, with no prior practice.

Edit1: You're the only one in that group?

 

[SkylerOcon]

Haven't we all pretty much agreed that the Water Temple is all hype no substance? It's not that hard, guys. Just a lot of going back and forth, which can be a bit confusing, but no hard puzzles. To be honest, I found that the Forest Temple had the hardest puzzles in OoT. After that it was easy.

I love the Water Temple to death though. Probably provides the most fun out of any dungeons in any Zelda game. OoT had the Shadow Link fight, and Morpheous who was (though very easy) an extremely fun boss. Probably my favorite dungeon, after Master Quest Dodongo's Cavern (because I can't even beat it it's so hard.)

 

[A_man13]

Haven't we all pretty much agreed that the Water Temple is all hype no substance? It's not that hard, guys. Just a lot of going back and forth, which can be a bit confusing, but no hard puzzles. To be honest, I found that the Forest Temple had the hardest puzzles in OoT. After that it was easy.

I love the Water Temple to death though. Probably provides the most fun out of any dungeons in any Zelda game. OoT had the Shadow Link fight, and Morpheous who was (though very easy) an extremely fun boss. Probably my favorite dungeon, after Master Quest Dodongo's Cavern (because I can't even beat it it's so hard.)

Amen to the water temple part. The only real hard part of the temple was the Shadow Link fight, but that's due to being super under-equiped (minimal magic for Din's fire, lost goron tunic due to the like like in Fire temple, meaning no hammer, etc.). I actually think water temple was one of the easier ones in the game (just very repetetive), but I love the temple with a passion, so I'm not being fair. I actually struggled more with Shadow and spirit temple personally.

 

[SuperRacoon]

I really enjoyed the water temple too! I love a good challenge in a video game, the Water Temple had it. The Dark Link fight was awesome, sure adjusting the water levels was a little tedious, but over all it was a fun dungeon.

My favorite dungeon of all is the Forest Temple in OoT though. I love how it bends reality with the twisted corridors, and the room that could be rotated before the final boss. Phantom Ganon was a pretty fun fight too. I also really liked the theme, forests tend to be my favorite type of location in video games in general.

 

[Darkslash]

I had Biggorons sword before i started any temples at all. Dark Link is really easy when you use the sword on him. But becuase i strangely have a code of honor when i comes to video games i used the master sword on him(yea sue me).

 

[Minato]

Water Temple is one of my favorite dungeons in OoT. I used to hate it, but once you know what to do, it's not so bad.

 

[kr3wman]

Nothing in Zelda is hard. It's just that everything is a pain in the ***.

 

[ranmaru]

Haven't we all pretty much agreed that the Water Temple is all hype no substance? It's not that hard, guys. Just a lot of going back and forth, which can be a bit confusing, but no hard puzzles. To be honest, I found that the Forest Temple had the hardest puzzles in OoT. After that it was easy.

I love the Water Temple to death though. Probably provides the most fun out of any dungeons in any Zelda game. OoT had the Shadow Link fight, and Morpheous who was (though very easy) an extremely fun boss. Probably my favorite dungeon, after Master Quest Dodongo's Cavern (because I can't even beat it it's so hard.)

The only trouble I had with it at first was where to use the ocarina to raise/lower the water levels. Took me a long time to notice, but that was it.

It was tedious, but it was worth it. I loved the Dark Link fight, and I like the Water Temple more than the Fire Temple, booyah!

Of course, the Forest Temple was my most favorite. Oh! Just remembered, I am borrowing the Zelda Collector Edition or something *Checks*

and, since it is on game cube, I might as well start OoT on it! :3 Oh good times, I wish all N64 games could come on to the GC, or Wii. :3

 

[Darkslash]

Shadow temple had to be traumatizing back then. they got blood every where. a 6 year old would of **** in his pants.
@Sumo 066

They don't make games for the Game cube any more.
If all N64 games went to the VC

we also get this pile of flaming crap going faster out my window than the speed of light

 

[Spire]

Ocarina of Time is the best Zelda game to date. Why? Because to this day, we compare all Zelda games to it. We don't compare MM, WW, TP, etc, etc to ALttP, or LoZ (won't even bother mentioning AoL) because there's no reason to. In trying to discern which title is simply the best overall, we must challenge a game by comparing it to other titles in the series. In the grand scheme of all things Zelda, OoT introduced so many more concepts than any other title in the series (with LoZ and ALttP being the only moot games). Furthermore, it not only brought forth ideas never-before-seen, but executed them [near]-flawlessly.

There are elements in MM, WW, TP, ALttP, and the rest of the titles that I tend to like more than some of those present in OoT, but overall, OoT has so much more greatness going for it. There's a reason that it has - to this day - been regarded as the best game of all time, sweeping perfect awards from critics everywhere.

Even Miyamoto and Aonuma have stated (very recently, as in their latest interviews, Aonuma's which is in NP) that no Zelda has surpassed the greatness of OoT, and perhaps the only impetus to continue working on the Zelda series is to create a game great enough to best OoT.

Majora's Mask introduced a "time-trial" like game mode, based around inverse elements to OoT, blanketing the world in a shadow not seen before in the series, one of seduction, and the dark side of humanity and to the individual (hence the counterpart lives of the denizens of Hyrule); based around masks, unlike any other game.

Wind Waker introduced sailing, cel-shading, and a much more improved combat system.

Twilight Princess introduced [like said before] "pseudo-realistic" graphics, an ENORMOUS Hyrule, but not much more than that.

A Link to the Past introduced the idea of parallel worlds, the gathering of certain items from dungeons to obtain the Master Sword, and other such things, Kakariko Village, Lake Hylia, Hyrule Castle, the [Gerudo] desert, and many other landmarks, and quite a number of other recurring elements.

What did Ocarina of Time introduce? The first 3D rendition of Zelda, Z-targeting, Time travel, the ACTUAL sages, Ganondorf, Zoras, Gorons, Kokiri, basis of "temples", enhanced menu system, complex puzzles, explorable water (which WW didn't even have, strangely...), horseback riding, many sidequests, and much, much more...

Why did I not include such things as the Rito? Because they've certainly not had as huge an impact as comparative races - the Gorons and Zoras (and to a lesser degree, the Kokiri) have had. Sailing on a boat is just an interpretation of horseback riding (especially given the appearance of The King of Red Lions, who resembles an animal).

I could go on, but I am done for now.

Thank you for reading.

 

[Waluigi911]

Some of that wasn't introduced by the Zelda series... like cel-shading.

 

[Spire]

Some of that wasn't introduced by the Zelda series... like cel-shading.

Introduced to the Zelda series, not by.

 

[Darkslash]

You could also say the wii version of TP added motion sensitive actions as well. It also had a feat of having 2 of the largest bosses in Zelda History in the same game. It also has A HECK LOT of references to the other games, even Wind Waker which we theorize that its taking the same place as Twilight Princess.

But really which game had lock on targeting systems in a 3D game. Before you had to fix the camera and it seemed Mario 64 had this problem. But Ocarina fixed that by adding Z targeting.
I'm sure Z targeting was introduced by Ocarina of time in general.
Heck I think Z targeting sounds better than L targeting.

 

[Spire]

...even Wind Waker which we theorize that its taking the same place as Twilight Princess.

Again, that is not a theory, it has officially been stated many times by Aonuma.

Yeah, I missed a few things here and there like the motion-sensor controls. Ocarina of Time still stands as the best - even Miyamoto and Aonuma think so (again, just read recent interviews with them regarding Zelda, especially the one with Aonuma in the latest issue of Nintendo Power).

 

[SkylerOcon]

You could also say the wii version of TP added motion sensitive actions as well. It also had a feat of having 2 of the largest bosses in Zelda History in the same game. It also has A HECK LOT of references to the other games, even Wind Waker which we theorize that its taking the same place as Twilight Princess.

No, the Wii version of Twilight Princess did not have Motion Sensitive actions. It had intense waggle-action, which pretty much guarantees ****er's cramp after ten minutes of playing the game.

References to other games don't matter.

Big bosses are cool, but nothing will ever beat Ocarina of Time Ganon.

 

[Chief Mendez]

Big bosses are cool, but nothing will ever beat Ocarina of Time Ganon.

lolwut?

...Anyway.

@Spire: That's probably true for most people, but I've since judged each Zelda game against Windwaker. The primary reason I don't like TP is because the characters are so boring and expressionless.

 

[SkylerOcon]

Silly Chief. We all know that Shadow of the Collosus has exemptions on the 'how epic is this boss' rule, seeing as it's a game made up entirely of Bosses.

 

[Spire]

Big bosses are cool, but nothing will ever beat Ocarina of Time Ganon.

I love how Morpheel, the largest of all Zelda bosses couldn't even hurt you.

 

[Darkslash]

No, the Wii version of Twilight Princess did not have Motion Sensitive actions. It had intense waggle-action, which pretty much guarantees ****er's cramp after ten minutes of playing the game.

hmm played for 2 hours straight. Never got Cramps. Maybe becuase i play the game by swinging my arms?

References to other games don't matter.

It gives a sense of continuity. the 5 Call of duty Games only 2 and 4 where somehow connected becuase of a Captain price. The other 1&3 were just random games, and 5 is just a game on its on little pacific island.

Spoiler

and Commissioner Gordon telling Russians to show no mercy and Jack Bauer needing recon planes.

Big bosses are cool, but nothing will ever beat Ocarina of Time Ganon.

I found TP Ganondorf more challenging and easy at the same time, while OoT Ganondorf was just annoying and easy but made hard becuase of blasted Anolog stick. Ganon was just plain stupid in OoT and Ganon in TP ran in circles.

But OoT was the Better game i'll say that. No game has been compared to like crazy.

Plus is it okay to call Zelda "Introduction to RPG's" Call me crazy but some one said that.

 

[Spire]

Plus is it okay to call Zelda "Introduction to RPG's" Call me crazy but some one said that.

No, that's not okay. Zelda really isn't much of an RPG at all.

The original RPG was Fire Emblem, followed by Final Fantasy.

 

[Chief Mendez]

Dragon Warrior was the first mainstream RPG. If you want to get technical Adventure was sort of an RPG, and pen and paper RPGs had existed for years before even that.

And technically Zelda's an aRPG, but only in the loosest sense of the term.

 

[SuperRacoon]

And loose it has to be. Considering that it has virtually no elements of elements of an RPG, the only role you are playing is that of Link, no healer, no thief, just the warrior, and Link offers you no customization in terms of stats or even equipment, by which I mean that the upgrades available to you are set in stone, no picking and choosing, making it more like Metroid, (an adventure game) as opposed to final fantasy, (which offers you a wide array of jobs to pick from, and gear to equip.) The Legend of Zelda does not use an EXP system (practically a staple of RPG). Combat does not use dice to determine potential random things that may occur (such as a miss, or a critical hit), of course, some role playing games such as Paper Mario, do not use dice in the combat system, but they do use other key RPG elements. Somehow, there is a belief that medieval-fantasy

Spoiler

you know with elves and castles and swords and ****

= RPG, this is not the case. As pokemon has entirely different type of fantasy world, and KOTOR is set in a sci-fi setting, and earthbound is, in many ways, representatives of modern America.

In fact, the only true RPG thing even used in the Legend of Zelda is the concept of quests, both main and side quests, keep in mind, quests do not necessarily need to contain a dungeon.

So yeah, 1 RPG element. It's not really an RPG

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Zelda 2 was an rpg....kinda.

Lawl lets rant about Bosses.


Bosses are to simple, they've been doing the same thing in term of bosses for awhile...with few exceptions.

All bosses should have like 6 different moves instead of the alternating 2-3.

I mean look at beast Ganon...he just charged and teleported.
He should've used some magic...seriously...where were my Firebats? Or my Invisibility...or SOMETHING other than charging.

Dark Lord Ganondorf......im sorry but Ganondorf without magic...does not feel right to me, I felt like this in WW too.
See im fine if it's primarily fighting....but he has to at least use magic somewhere in it to mix it up.
IMO.

Phantom Zelda.... 3 moves.... A fourth 1 couid've made this more frantic, added more pressure to us and make it more enjoyable.


OoT
Ganondorf, 3 moves, Giant Orb....normal orb, Ground punch.
Needs more sustinance, also why the hell did your Magic not refill like your health did at the beginning?
There should've been more pressure, it's too slow pace.

Ganon......>.>....aww come on...sure the setting and mood was good.
But like...the actual fighting? Lawl worthy.... Shoot him in the face, or roll through his legs.


OoX Ganon....this wasn't so bad, you were pretty much constantly moving.

FSA Ganon.....eh this wasn't bad either.

Zelda 1..... ummm confuzzling...

Minish Cap...Vaati's a tool.
The Giant slime was lawl worthy.
Ice boss enemy...eh.

Alltp.
Twin Rova pissed me the hell off...because I kept forgetting to move...multi tasking ftw.

I demand bosses who all have at least 1 powerful hit.
Unless that boss is a speedster who will slash you to pieces in 5 seconds...than mini weak hits is cool.

 

[Greenstreet]

So I finally faced some demons and played TP. Yeah I know, late as all hell...

I just need to say one thing:

Spoiler

What the heck Midna? Way to be lame and destroy the **** mirror!!

Never burn bridges!!

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Funny how wolf Link works better than were-hog.

 

[Spire]

So I finally faced some demons and played TP. Yeah I know, late as all hell...

I just need to say one thing:

Spoiler

What the heck Midna? Way to be lame and destroy the **** mirror!!

Never burn bridges!!

She does say that they may see eachother again, so obviously the mirror is not the only connection between the two worlds. Yeah, it's a direct doorway, but remember - the Twilight Realm is a parallel "blanket" realm to Hyrule, coexisting in the same space, but in another dimension (which is why Zant was able to cloak Hyrule in it). The Twilight is not some type of climate change, it's the atmosphere of a disparate world from Hyrule, and having seen Hyrule's earth shrouded in this foreign atmosphere, it is obvious that the world has been consumed by that which binds the Twilight Realm together - changing the characteristics of the land, the air, and all of the denizens into their Twilit forms.

Now, back to Midna's action. She burnt the bridge between the worlds so that neither would endanger one another again; so both Hyrule and the Twilight Realm could regroup, rebuild, and reestablish a proper rule. Look at it this way - the Twilight Realm is an offshoot realm of Hyrule, existing as Hyrule's shadow. Both realms are run by monarchies, with the Princesses (Zelda and Midna) assuming the throne, but lusting, outside lunatics (Ganon and Zant) thwarting the order of both worlds to claim the throne.

Zelda ≥ Midna
Ganon ≥ Zant
Link = Solitary; as he is the link between both worlds

You cannot have shadow without light, correct? Therefore, the Twilight Realm is inherently dependent on Hyrule (the independent factor), as it is known as the world of light. Well, naturally, this is how the worlds have been established, however, Ganon recognizes this, and with the use of Zant as a puppet, sets out to reverse this equation. He wants to shroud Hyrule in Twilight so that nature would read the relationship as, "Hyrule is dependent on the Twilight Realm because without shadow, there would be no distinction of what light actually is, and therefore, shadow must come before light, hence, the Twilight Realm is superior to Hyrule." However, while this may be slightly true, nature's course of action titles light to be superior, as seen through the conflicts between Link and the forces of evil. The hero of light always conquers the shadows; Hyrule will always be superior to the Twilight Realm.

SO, with that being said, the Twilight Realm will never be completely separated from Hyrule, as it depends entirely on it. Without a world from which shadows are cast, it cannot exist. All that exists in the Twilight Realm is created from shadow rather than light. Light shapes and forms everything within Hyrule - breathes life into plants, animals, rock, water, fire, and all of the elements that compose that world. The Twilight Realm is inversely structured.

Hmm... Twilight Realm parallel to Hyrule? Reminds me of another parallel world...

 

[TheLinkus]

I have TP, but have resolved to finish Oot and Majora's Mask before I play it. I really love those games; and I think this will be my favourite tread from now on. For those of you who like the music, go to this website, you can listen to them or download them. (I hope someone hasn't already posted this link)

http://www.zreomusic.com/index.php