Legend of Zelda The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword - NO SPOILERS, USE THE SPOILER THREAD PLEASE

[Luigitoilet]

don't take things so seriously? are you insecure about something? or maybe offended? if you're offended by something you read on the internet my suggestion is to just sign off permanently lol

99% know what I meant

Don't post like this.

 

[Boofy!]

Don't see what was so bad about that but whatever

 

[Luigitoilet]

A post solely meant to smugly imply "oh I've offended your delicate sensibilities? WELCOME TO THE INTERNET...and also you're probably gay" is in bad taste, and also slightly off topic.

 

[Jonas]

Villains aren't "supposed" to look like anything specifically. Where is the manual you are getting this information from? If people only created things based on what is "supposed" to be, art would be completely pointless and self-defeating. It would be manufacturing, not creating.

The villain could also be a cute little bunny, but it would hardly make sense or fit the theme of the game. Ergo, the villain is supposed to at least look different from a bunny. Likewise, the villain is not supposed to look like a complete tosser if the audience is expected to take him serious as a villain.

Now, I don't care if the people who designed the characters think of themselves as "artists" or whatever, but Ghirahim's design is obviously a result of way too many crazy "creative ideas" and a lack of understanding of what makes characters visually appealing.

 

[Luigitoilet]

Are you a visual designer by any chance?

 

[Jonas]

No, so that obviously means I'm ignorant and have no right to question the garbage that the geniuses at Nintendo have "created."
Honestly though, it would be like asking me if I'm a movie director if I complained about a bad movie.

Btw, I wouldn't be surprised if Aonuma or Miyamoto had a lot of influence over the character designs. Aonuma and Miyamoto aren't visual designers either.

 

[Luigitoilet]

Jesus, you are defensive.

I'm asking because you mentioned visual appeal in a broad sense, as in, beyond your individual taste.

"an understanding of what makes characters visually appealing" what is that, exactly? Does it mean "an understanding of what I like in a character design" or are you speaking objectively? The way you phrase it makes it sound like you know your stuff- some set of rules that merit "good visual design" that somehow go beyond individual taste. That's the only reason I asked.

In this case, you're implying that the "correct" visual direction is "masculine/heterosexual". I'm merely questioning the way you worded your argument. You're literally saying that a homosexual-looking character (no, I don't know what that means, maybe you can help me out and elaborate what you meant by "a complete tosser") has no capacity to be threatening. That is pretty offensive, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you just couldn't articulate your problem with Ghirahim's design in a more mature and accurate way.

I don't know the theme of Skyward Sword as I haven't played it, so I can't argue how Ghirahim fits into it at this moment. However, as of now he's by far the most emphasized character in the promo material which leads me to believe that the philosophy behind his design is going to be apparent throughout the game. He does not feel out of place, considering the way the rest of Skyward Sword's world looks.

Also, what does "too many 'creative ideas'" mean exactly? Should they have canned some designs on the basis that "these are too unique...we need something more samey and familiar..." or on the basis that "these are way too homo...let's get some testosterone in here"?

I'm not going to speculate on who designed Ghirahim as that is irrelevant.

 

[Ganonsburg]

Jonas has either never watched Monty Python, or forgot about the rabbit that bites people's heads off. Just saying.


I have to agree that Ghirahim looks menacing. I wouldn't want to meet him. He looks like he has evil in his eyes. Like a snake. Snakes aren't very buff or manly or anything, but you certainly know that they're dangerous, and they look deadly all the same.

 

[Spire]

In absolute brevity: I love Ghirahim.

 

[Jonas]

Luigitoilet,
I have to admit that I was probably trying to speak for everyone, when I was only really speaking for myself. I still think Ghirahim looks absolutely ridiculous though

Regarding the "gay look," I can see how I might have come off as offensive, but my point was that Ghirahim, with his make-up, hair style and fashion sense, to me looks like something straight out of a pride parade. It's something that I feel just doesn't work when he's supposed to be "lord of the demons."

Jonas has either never watched Monty Python, or forgot about the rabbit that bites people's heads off. Just saying.

Lol, I love those guys
I realize it's probably just a witty comment, but I still have to point out that Monty Python is comedy, and that the mismatch between the rabbit's appearance and its abilities is played for laughs.

 

[Spire]

What's a demon?

 

[Jonas]

Something that doesn't look like this:

 

[etecoon]

as someone that has played video games for nearly 20 years and now watches a lot of anime, I can't say that an effeminate villain is anything new to me or that it bothers me at all. that's...what japan does, ganondorf is the anomaly

that being said I don't particularly like girahim's design and it's not just that he's androgynous. that and I'm also suspicious that he's going to pull a zant and disappear halfway through the game. nothing about him seems compelling as a villain to me so far, but then nintendo has hardly shown anything. that being said, two of my three favorite games in the series don't feature a strong villain so it's not damning to my hype of the game at all

 

[Spire]

Hahahahaha that's exactly what I wanted in response. +rep

ninja'd so bad

 

[Vinylic.]

I don't get the "ninja" thingy.

 

[Jonas]

It's like when you respond to someone and a ninja cuts you off and posts something before you can post your reply.

 

[Glöwworm]

I don't get the "ninja" thingy.

HAHAHAHAHA

Also, I dunno what you guys are talking about villains having to look like demons or monsters or whatever. REAL villains look like this guy:

Top hat and dat moustache? So classy.

 

[Vinylic.]

If link had a moustache...

 

[Luigitoilet]

Well this is interesting, considering what we're talking about right now

http://wii.ign.com/articles/118/1184014p1.html

Ganon will not be in Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword, says Zelda series producer Eiji Aonuma.

"Ganon typically appears in a Zelda game when the story is centered around the Triforce," said Aonuma in an interview with Nintendo Power (obtained by Nintendo Charged). "This time around, the Triforce sort of takes on a different meaning and plays a different role in the story. So because of that, Ganon will not appear."

He'll be replaced by the wan-faced wizard Lord Ghirahim, who has popped up in recent trailers. The gaunt villain was purposefully designed to contrast with Ganon's "very masculine, powerful, evil" characteristics.

When asked if Ghirahim reminded him of David Bowie, Aonuma agreed that there were similarities; to contrast with Ganon, he was given a "unisex-like, genderless feel".

Aonuma also said the game will shake-up the increasingly-familiar Zelda formula. Typically, "the Master Sword has been something that Link seeks out, finds, and uses to destroy Ganon," said Aonuma. "This time around it's more centered on the creation of the Master Sword - the way it was born, so to speak. Link kind of forges it along the way. It's more centred on that, which is a different pattern than we have had in a lot of ways."

A few details about how Zelda will be portrayed were also released. This time around, she'll be a "great childhood friend" of Link's, and not a princess "in the traditional sense". But as always, she'll have a "tremendous fate placed on her shoulders".

He also confirmed that the game takes place before Ocarina of Time, but would not commit himself to saying that it was chronologically the first Zelda game.

So, yeah. Awesome!!!!

I wonder, does that last sentence mean to imlpy that Minish Cap is still earlier? Isn't that one earliest so far?

 

[Vinylic.]

Don't know but, No Ganon means more challenges.
More challenges equals best zelda game you've ever played.

 

[Luigitoilet]

huh?

what does that mean? "No Ganon means more challenges"?

 

[Clownbot]

I wonder, does that last sentence mean to imlpy that Minish Cap is still earlier? Isn't that one earliest so far?

Could have to do with future installments for all we know.

 

[Vinylic.]

Since ganondorf is not in the game, difficulties on playing through the game seems to have a much higher chance of having some game overs. I mean, If thats how I wanted to predict correctly. :V

 

[Luigitoilet]

I don't see the correlation between those things. What makes you think that no Ganon present in the story will make the game more difficult? I hope the game is more difficult, but I don't think Ganon's prescence has a real tangible effect on the gameplay difficulty really.

 

[Vinylic.]

I just thought of it that way.
I haven't played Oot and Wind waker for years...

 

[ZIO]

Hmm.

Well, clearly you've never played the DS zelda games. Only saving grace to those games are Lineback and Princess Zelda from Spirit Track (good characters). Bad games.

We've seen ganondorf so few times in the series, anyway. Like, he wasn't so prominent until OoT. He was referenced in the manual to ALttP, but never shown in game. And played a major role in WW. Then he took backseat to Zant as a major antagonist until, like, the very end.

So, like, wut?

 

[Vinylic.]

The wut part completely lost me.
But yeah, Haven't played DS zelda games because I had no money.

 

[Luigitoilet]

Hmm.

Well, clearly you've never played the DS zelda games. Only saving grace to those games are Lineback and Princess Zelda from Spirit Track (good characters). Bad games.

We've seen ganondorf so few times in the series, anyway. Like, he wasn't so prominent until OoT. He was referenced in the manual to ALttP, but never shown in game. And played a major role in WW. Then he took backseat to Zant as a major antagonist until, like, the very end.

So, like, wut?

Whaaaa?

Ganon is the final boss of LttP. He is extremely significant throughout the last 2/3rds of the game.

The games where Ganon hasn't appeared:

Link's Awakening
Zelda 2
Majora's Mask
Minish Cap
Four Swords
Spirit Tracks
Skyward Sword

He also does not really appear in Phantom Hourglass's main plotline iirc. And he does not appear in the individual Oracle games, but if you link the games together and beat them both he is the true final boss.

So far, in my experience, the only games in that list that are more difficult than the norm is Zelda 2 and Majora's Mask. I can't speak for SS yet of course, and Spirit Tracks technically IS difficult because it's so terrible I'd rather smell balls than play it.

 

[ZIO]

I think you missed the part where I was talking about GanonDORF. Not Ganon.

 

[GwJ]

Ganon and Ganondorf are the same person.

And I'm not sure that "unisex, genderless" were the right words to describe Debbie by Eiji.

 

[Glöwworm]

I think people use "Ganondorf" and "Ganon" interchangeably to talk about this guy:

Though, yeah, Ganondorf and Ganon are technically different. Ganondorf is the human form and Ganon is the beast form of him but they're the same person essentially.

 

[GwJ]

It's the same being though. When you think of the context of Ganon and how we see different bodies and forms of him, we need to talk about him in terms of his being, not his physical body. Ganon and Ganondorf are the same being.

 

[Glöwworm]

It's the same being though. When you think of the context of Ganon and how we see different bodies and forms of him, we need to talk about him in terms of his being, not his physical body. Ganon and Ganondorf are the same being.

but they're the same person essentially.

haha, I was making edits after originally posting. Maybe you didn't catch that part. I was just going over the technicalities. But yes, in the sense of a being, they're the same person.

 

[GwJ]

Yeah I missed the edit. But yeah, I was just clarifying. I rarely refer to a specific bodily form of Ganon anymore unless I'm talking about a certain game specifically. Otherwise, it's just the Ganon entity.

 

[Jonas]

I think people use "Ganondorf" and "Ganon" interchangeably to talk about this guy:

I use "Ganon" as a short-hand for "Ganondorf" (especially when talking about Smash). It's not really because I'm confused about who's who

 

[Glöwworm]

I use "Ganon" as a short-hand for "Ganondorf" (especially when talking about Smash). It's not really because I'm confused about who's who

Good. Now don't ever make the mistake of calling him "Gannon."

 

[Jonas]

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Ocarina of time, the game that introduced them, referred to the beast form as Ganon and the human form as Ganondorf.

I don't think they are entirely the same entity. Ganondorf had gone made with power and gave in to the corruption of the triforce of power. Though the Ganondorf personality made up some of it's consciousness, it's more of a force than an individual.

 

[Luigitoilet]

I think this conversation is completely silly.

 

[GwJ]

Ocarina of time, the game that introduced them, referred to the beast form as Ganon and the human form as Ganondorf.

I don't think they are entirely the same entity. Ganondorf had gone made with power and gave in to the corruption of the triforce of power. Though the Ganondorf personality made up some of it's consciousness, it's more of a force than an individual.

Are you comparing it to like If Ganondorf is the normal form, and Ganon is kinda like a 'possessed' form?