The 2006-2008 Tier list

[Magus420]

The only things that matter in a frame perfect match are how good/flexible your infinite ledgestall is vs edgestealers, if you have an instant invincibility move and its range/possible KOability, and your walking speed (when dealing with the top 3). That leaves Fox/Bowser in God tier, Falco in Top, and everyone else in Can't-Beat-Any-Of-The-Above tier.

 

[Knifey McStab]

The only things that matter in a frame perfect match are how good/flexibile your infinite ledgestall is vs edgestealers, if you have an instant invincibility move and its range/possible KOability, and your walking speed. That leaves Fox/Bowser in God tier, Falco in Top, and everyone else in Can't-Beat-Any-Of-The-Above tier.

what about sheik, mewtwo, and ganon infinites?

 

[Brookman]

Magus just provided a feast of shut the **** up. I suggest everyone has a healthy serving and talks productively about something that actually matters.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Well all this talk of perfection is pointless. So far in the meta game the closest to perfection right now that is being played is Marth with Fox behind him.

 

[Cort]

Bowser for god tier? o.o

 

[brawlpro]

Bowser for god tier? o.o

will be rare...

 

[Cort]

According to Magus, in a perfect frame by frame game he would be, which sounds stupid but is interesting to think about.

Gay strategies will always dominate.

 

[ZoSo]

Gay good strategies will always dominate.

I always knew Bowser was secretly broken.

 

[Cort]

Gay and good are synonymous in the world of competitive gaming. Everyone should learn this.

 

[Magus420]

what about sheik, mewtwo, and ganon infinites?

Those 3 are missing a 1 frame invincibility/attack which is required for onstage. They can be forced onstage out of their stall with a hog where they will take damage and then lose by percentage.

Now back to crap that actually matters =)

 

[ZoSo]

Why walking speed?

 

[Magus420]

That matters mainly for comparing Fox & Falco. Fox has a walking speed advantage and thus can keep Falco within range of his shine (has the range advantage here too) while being out of Falco's range. This would force Falco into a run to keep his shine in range where he can no longer execute it in 1 frame so this makes Fox have control over Falco at all times onstage so perfect Fox > perfect Falco.

 

[ZoSo]

The extent of your knowledge on this subject is very entertaining.

 

[KevinM]

So if i play a frame perfect Bowser i can be unbeatable.. Ownage

 

[Brookman]

I don't care so much about walking speed, but I think the question everyone wants to know: What makes bowser so good?!?!

 

[KevinM]

I don't care so much about walking speed, but I think the question everyone wants to know: What makes bowser so good?!?!

KevinM (ten chars)

 

[Magus420]

Basically. He has an inf ledgestall that can defend against stealers by landing on the edge if necessary, the inv instant up-b hog at the edge to hog others, and the required 1 frame inv move onstage. Fox/Falco's stalls are vulnerable as they can't act out of it after a hog. If he does nothing but ledgestall he can't lose, though he doesn't necessarily win against those 2 either. He can get reliable %/stock advantage on the non 1 framers to always win though as he can simply walk towards them forcing them to the edge (hit on getup or hogged -> hit if they can stall) or jumping (once you're forced into the air you are guaranteed to be caught by something by the time you land), and eventually getting a safe hit since they have no way of attacking him safely.

 

[Brookman]

*pisses on tier list*

I knew I was going somewhere with fox's shine invincibility!

 

[x4FoSho4x]

My tier list would be

Top tier
Marth
Fox

High Tier
Shiek
Falco
Peach

and dk moves to mid tier.


Everyone in NY thought that the tier list was changed because a smasher said so and everyone believed him. It was excepted that Marth was now top tier in NY until I checked this thread and told everyone about it. lol.

When will it be decided?

 

[BigRick]

Everyone in NY thought that the tier list was changed because a smasher said so and everyone believed him. It was excepted that Marth was now top tier in NY until I checked this thread and told everyone about it. lol.

Bleh, you guys should check stuff out next time... there might never be a new tier list.

Magus' frame info is awesome btw...

 

[NJzFinest]

Everyone in NY thought that the tier list was changed because a smasher said so and everyone believed him. It was excepted that Marth was now top tier in NY until I checked this thread and told everyone about it. lol.

When will it be decided?

EVERYONE in NY? Ummm.. :/

 

[Binx]

What I meant by wiggle out is after Marth Uthrows you can recover and shine before he can grab you if you are fast enough, Ive seen it done. Not at certain percents though, I think you need to be above 20 for it to work, although for frame perfect control it could maybe be sooner. And yeah escaping a grab with enough button presses could be done at zero I think, however against a frame perfect thrower it would be different anyways.

Also infinite ledge stalling is banned in tournament play isnt it? So that is not a viable strategy, thus once again lifting Fox to the top. However I beleive that a perfectly controlled IC could maybe beat fox because damage against nana doesnt count, you could have her cover you at all times and vise versa with perfect pivots and such.

 

[Aesir]

THis one time in training mode I was fox my friend was marth we did it at 1/4th speed and I shined out at 7 LOL

 

[Emblem Lord]

This is all moot anyway.

Have we forgotten that ledge stalling is banned?

 

[Eggm]

Oh snaps, EL got you guys. xDD

Anyways the Teir list should just be updated.

Top Tier :
Marth
Fox
High Tier :
Sheik
Falco
Upper Tier :
Peach
Ic's
Falcon
Samus
High Tier :
Jiggs
Doc
Mid Teir :
Mario
Gannon
link
luigi
m2
dk
Then the rest. xD

 

[Cort]

Since when is ledge stalling banned?

You can always ledge hog someone who is ledge stalling. The reason why Fox/Bowser are good in that sense is because of what they can react with to someone who attempts to do this.

This one time I got m2k's shield down to a red m&m. Then he said "hold on lemme get my shield back" and proceeded to ledge stall with sheik for a little while. It made me laugh because I let him rather than risking taking damage from his stupid explosion.

 

[Eggm]

Ledge stalling is banned if its not used for recovery purposes and used to stall the match and win by time last i checked..

 

[Emblem Lord]

Stalling is banned.

Eggm why do you have two high tiers in your list.

And Shiek's ledge stall isn't that difficult to stop. You can edge hog her.

 

[Cort]

Ledge stalling for recovery purposes?

The only king of stalling banned is the kind that someone can't do anything about, like a jigglypuff rising pound in the top right corner of the screen for a few minutes.

You can ALWAYS ledge hog someone who is ledge stalling, thus forcing them off.

edit//

Cort 28633 (1:16:45 PM): ...am I wrong or something?
Cort 28633 (1:16:50 PM): no one can ledge stall indefinitely
Cort 28633 (1:16:53 PM): you can always hog them while they attempt to
Cort 28633 (1:17:01 PM): so if you just stand there and let THEM ledge stall forever
Cort 28633 (1:17:04 PM): YOU'RE the one stalling
IAMINTERFACE LOL (1:17:08 PM): lol

edit2//

Cort 28633 (1:19:36 PM): it wouldn't be bannable.
Cort 28633 (1:19:52 PM): it's just a gay strategy that only works in frame by frame perfectity

 

[Brookman]

ledge stalling isn't banned. Since we're talking about hypothetic perfect play (I think we're still on that topic?) Who is to say that edge stalling would be banned at frame perfect play?

Why isn't just running around avoiding someone considered stalling a match?

 

[Emblem Lord]

Because that is very easy to stop. Alot easier then edge hogging a ledge stall. And some ledge stalls are actually somewhat difficult to stop.

 

[Cort]

you space yourself from the ledge and poke at them until they get hit after using their double jump and they're put in a tight situation.

under frame perfect situations ledge stalling is pretty broken and is actually stalling to a gay (good) degree

no johns @ difficult ledge stalling stops. just poke and edge hog those mofugras.

I recall a match at Cat 2... HugS vs Zang. The match started off with close to 2 minutes of ledge stalling by hugs as zang shot lasers on the other side of FD, nonstop.

 

[Brookman]

Anyway, since we've established that EL is wrong and ledge stalling isn't banned let's continue to talk about all the arbitrary things we were talking about.

 

[StripesOrBars]

Falco should still be above Shiek.

 

[Emblem Lord]

No, he shouldn't.

 

[JBM falcon08]

i concur with EL, besides falcon shouldn't be so low

 

[Brookman]

Falco should still be above Shiek.

No, he shouldn't.

i concur with EL, besides falcon shouldn't be so low

So far EL has 1 supporter, that makes his point more valid. By point I of course mean spam. spam spam spam spam.

If you're going to ****ing post what you think at least have the decency to post why you think so. Otherwise we just have everyone running around posting like doodah, and then nothing actually gets discussed.

 

[Cort]

I htink Roy is better than Marth.

His fire stuns and MArth doesnt have fire.

 

[Brookman]

pichu is better than marth too. I have proof:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Q0B2HNOA0K0

 

[Emblem Lord]

Shiek does better in tournies.

Happy?