TDB: SEASON 2! LEON (RE4) vs LARA CROFT

[Nova9000]

Zard knows what spinal cords do how...?

@drop kicking

+

=
WINNER OF THIS MU

Mewtwo, on the other hand, nova, is super smart, and will **** zard's neck easily.
Also, mewtwo can use his tail like a kangaroos.
Nuff height my ***.

Zard bites.
As an animal, he aims for the neck.
His jaw overlaps his spinal cord.
M2 has become a Kirby.

 

[xepherthree]

Zard bites.
As an animal, he aims for the neck.
His jaw overlaps his spinal cord.
M2 has become a Kirby.

You're forgetting M2's intelligence.
He wouldn't go AAAAHH DROP KICK into zards mouth.

Spoiler

strategic planning

Edit:
You mean

?

 

[Nova9000]

You're forgetting M2's intelligence.
He wouldn't go AAAAHH DROP KICK into zards mouth.

Spoiler

strategic planning

Edit:
You mean

?

But Zard would. The claws are better than the spheres on M2's hands. Zard's arms are stronger as well. I only thought M2 could pull it by drop kicks and then crushing his skull but only after tanking some scratches. And Zard's jaws are big enough to rupture that cord.

And yea that's Kirby...but I should have said eggplant. A spinal cord injury = vegetable status.

 

[xepherthree]

But Zard would. The claws are better than the spheres on M2's hands. Zard's arms are stronger as well. I only thought M2 could pull it by drop kicks and then crushing his skull but only after tanking some scratches. And Zard's jaws are big enough to rupture that cord.

And yea that's Kirby...but I should have said eggplant. A spinal cord injury = vegetable status.

Mewtwo isn't using his hands o.o
@arms

-compares arms-

IDK. I think they may be even.
Zard's arms are reaaaaalllly short.

Not to mention, M2 could just kick Zard's leg till he falls over then crush him.
You're forgetting how smart M2 is, he wouldn't get bitten like that.

You mean

 

[JOE!]

yeah, mewtwo has the best brainpower out of anyone in this thread (even Sambondreus =O)

canonically, the second spinal cord is used to have more nerve cells in order to facilitate his epic brainpower...I highly doubt with all this focus he will fall into a stupid trap or strategy from Zard.

EDIT:

as for Zamus, what do we know about her electrolaser's strength? Specifically, is there any onther creatures besides space pirates she could shoot in her games, and did they get hurt, or just paralyzed?

 

[IsmaR]

http://metroid.wikia.com/wiki/Ruins_Test

Never got to play Zero Mission, so I'm no other help here.

 

[UncleSam]

yeah, mewtwo has the best brainpower out of anyone in this thread (even Sambondreus =O)

blasphemy.

EDIT:

as for Zamus, what do we know about her electrolaser's strength? Specifically, is there any onther creatures besides space pirates she could shoot in her games, and did they get hurt, or just paralyzed?

The only game she used it in was zero mission, and the part where you get to use it, the only enemies you fought were Space Pirates.

64
(NINTENDO 64!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

 

[Emperor Time]

Can't Zard just rip Mewtwo apart? M2 may be intelligent, but the difference in physical ability is really large.

 

[Nova9000]

Mewtwo isn't using his hands o.o
@arms

-compares arms-

IDK. I think they may be even.
Zard's arms are reaaaaalllly short.

Not to mention, M2 could just kick Zard's leg till he falls over then crush him.
You're forgetting how smart M2 is, he wouldn't get bitten like that.

You mean

yeah, mewtwo has the best brainpower out of anyone in this thread (even Sambondreus =O)

canonically, the second spinal cord is used to have more nerve cells in order to facilitate his epic brainpower...I highly doubt with all this focus he will fall into a stupid trap or strategy from Zard.

The thing is, I think M2 would win if it was all about smarts too. But that spinal cord thing and the way animals go 4 kills is too glaring of a weak spot. M2's head isn't that big, and even if he is smarter than Zard, he can't do squat to avoid getin his head clamped. Zard has tree trunk legs compared to M2, it's just M2s are stronger. Zard has claws to slash at him. And look at how fragile M2's neck is? Too much of a weak point, considering it would be super effective.

JOE! i disagree with the 1st page. Bulbasaur was the best starter, then Squirtle. Ivy had to become gimped to make it to brawl; that's how great (s)he is, along with the other cool nerfed ppl in Brawl. And Xeph,that would make M2 # 129 except not moving.

Where the hell is Kaka-REL when you need him?

 

[REL38]

Where are you guys getting that Mewtwo is Stephen Hawkings, Albert Einstien and Leonardo DaVinci all rolled into one?

None of the Pokedex entries remotely suggest this. He's no genious.
Give me proof.

Mewtwo has shown no expertese in physical fighting.
What's giving him Kick Boxing knowledge?
Nothing.

Mewtwo's bipedal, sure.
But a kick to scales won't do much.

Charizard has claws and teeth, sure.
But they're actually lethal

@Xeph
In relation to Charizard's body, his arms are well sized.
A T-Rex's arms were significantly tiny in comparison to its body.
Charizard's arms are quite well balanced for his size.

 

[Nova9000]

M2 = Lucario w/o any exp. fighting lol.

Unless he uses Metronome...

 

[Diddy Kong]

Dunno, in Pokemon Mewtwo is still better in Lucario in every stat. He's potentally more dangerous physically than Lucario to.

Mewtwo should win this yeah. He can actually move around, Charizard is just a fatso. Mewtwo could jump, kick, low kick and he's got an arm lenght advantage so maybe even straggle? He's got pretty big legs, so kicks will deffinatly hurt. Charizard can of coarse bite, but his claws... dunno if they're that effective. His arms seem pretty small.

 

[Emperor Time]

All those things require M2 to get close. Char's arms aren't that small and he has a freakin' long head...with a mouth...with FANGS....

Char can hit better and hurt more.

 

[JOE!]

yes, the neck is a weak spot, but doesnt Mewtwo's intellect somewhat counter-act that in that he can just see attacks coming, and react quickly to prevent the injury?

Also, M2 is taller than zard, so it would be very obvious if Zard tries for the neck

 

[xepherthree]

All those things require M2 to get close. Char's arms aren't that small and he has a freakin' long head...with a mouth...with FANGS....

Char can hit better and hurt more.

A Char's arms aren't that small

Alright, maybe I was exaggerating with the t-rex reference, but zard's arms aren't that long.

More importantly, look how THIN they are.

 

[Emperor Time]

yes, the neck is a weak spot, but doesnt Mewtwo's intellect somewhat counter-act that in that he can just see attacks coming, and react quickly to prevent the injury?

Also, M2 is taller than zard, so it would be very obvious if Zard tries for the neck

Ok, sure. You can see an attack coming, but that doesn't mean you're physically able to handle it.

 

[Nova9000]

The thing is, M2 is fragile except for his legs and tail. He can have an IQ of Avogadro's # and still die because he couldn't be the fail dragon. Just because you know how he will attack doesn't mean he can do anything about it.

Char and M2 have thin arms. M2 has MK type fingers lol. Zard has Bowser type fingers. Guess who wins if they grapple each other?

Zard is fat but not Yoshi of Sonic where he can't move. And since M2 has no projecties, he has to come into Zard range. Zard's neck has more range than M2's legs.

Think about it. If you have a suicide trigger on the back of your neck and your opponent is going for that area instinctively, it's a good chance that death is going to occur.

 

[Rialdospaldacht]

Would Charizard even be able to reach his neck when he's standing up straight? I think he's too short.

Also, slightly off topic, but who would win between Ganondorfs? OoT would lose to the others, but what about between WW and TP?

 

[Beren Zaiga]

@Xeph: Just to clarify, the T-Rex's arms were **** short. Yet they alone could lift/press 400 pounds. The T-Rex however, is many times larger than Charizard. Therefore it cannot apply to him. Charizard's thin arms make him weak, just as Mewtwo's arms do.

@Topic:

Both their tails however could be used as potential weapons against one another, as both have alot of thickness, thus there is a high probability that both have quite a bit of muscle.

It is shown however that Mewtwo is constantly keeping his tail lifted up, almost effortlessly. This could possibly mean the abundance of muscle in his tail is more than Charizards, whom apparently drags his tail along or only lifts the end off the ground slightly (since his wings cannot support flight, as we have established in past MUs).

Those muscles make Mewtwo's tail able to possibly produce killing force after repeated whacks if he whips his body around.

Charizard however has one weapon over Mewtwo, his teeth. Charizard however has to get in close to use them as well as his arms, which are also shorter than Mewtwo's arms.

Compare the two:

First Charizard.

Then Mewtwo.

What do you see? I see this.

A) Mewtwo's arms are longer than Charizard's This means Mewtwo could block Charizard's arms with his hands if he angled them right, both are of about equal strength due to the thickness of their arms.

B) Both have thick tails, which therefore means they could be used as mid-range clubbing wepaons. Mewtwo's stature however means he would be able to use it more effectively because of his legs as compared to Charizard's. Therefore, Mewtwo's most viable defense is his tail as a melee weapon. He may be extremely intelligent, but in most recent, if not most Dex entries, Mewtwo is described as the most savage of all Pokemon.

Its not too hard to think that using his tail as a whipping/clubbing weapon wouldn't be beneath him.
----------------

I would also like to direct you to something in regards to height.

Here

and

Here

Based on Dex data, which comes straight from the games. Mewtwo according to those is a foot taller than Charizard. The height in the Pokedex describes the height as overall height, therefore including the neck.

Were it not for his long neck, Charizard would be almost two feet shorter than Mewtwo, meaning his body is lower, a strike to the neck with his claws is therefore not possible. The only chance Charizard has at a neck kill is his teeth, and his neck is strong because it's thickness denotes strong neck musculature overall. Mewtwo's only advantage is the length of his arms, which due not provide much due to their comparatively weak muscles.
--------

 

[Nova9000]

@Xeph: Just to clarify, the T-Rex's arms were **** short. Yet they alone could lift/press 400 pounds. The T-Rex however, is many times larger than Charizard. Therefore it cannot apply to him. Charizard's thin arms make him weak, just as Mewtwo's arms do.

@Topic:

Both their tails however could be used as potential weapons against one another, as both have alot of thickness, thus there is a high probability that both have quite a bit of muscle.

It is shown however that Mewtwo is constantly keeping his tail lifted up, almost effortlessly. This could possibly mean the abundance of muscle in his tail is more than Charizards, whom apparently drags his tail along or only lifts the end off the ground slightly (since his wings cannot support flight, as we have established in past MUs).

I thought he could glide? And wouldn't his tail be used for balance? That's what kangaroos do, which is what is lower body is based off of. It dosn't mean that his tail is muscular because it floats. In fact, it looks too big for his height, which would justify why he floats so much.

Those muscles make Mewtwo's tail able to possibly produce killing force after repeated whacks if he whips his body around.


Addressed already

Charizard however has one weapon over Mewtwo, his teeth. Charizard however has to get in close to use them as well as his arms, which are also shorter than Mewtwo's arms.

Compare the two:

First Charizard.

Then Mewtwo.

What do you see? I see this.

A) Mewtwo's arms are longer than Charizard's This means Mewtwo could block Charizard's arms with his hands if he angled them right, both are of about equal strength due to the thickness of their arms.

Lol. M2 isn't going to use his arms in this MU. He has orbs for fingers. Blocking with his arms causes a great chance for his arms to be broken. Remember their elements are what they normally use to attack. Zard has certain times when he does use his body (Fly, Slash) unlike M2 who doesn't use his body at all. That would justify that Zard has more strength than M2.

B) Both have thick tails, which therefore means they could be used as mid-range clubbing wepaons. Mewtwo's stature however means he would be able to use it more effectively because of his legs as compared to Charizard's. Therefore, Mewtwo's most viable defense is his tail as a melee weapon. He may be extremely intelligent, but in most recent, if not most Dex entries, Mewtwo is described as the most savage of all Pokemon.

Its not too hard to think that using his tail as a whipping/clubbing weapon wouldn't be beneath him.

Savage with his power. You can't be a savage without your tools and in RL, he has lower body strength and a tail that's too long. Both could use them mid range but Zard is able to use his effectively. M2 has to try and uncoil his tail to use it to attack. Mind you, he has to maintain balance on his feet as well while doing so, so it's not as plausible as you may make it seem. Oh and I put Alakazam smarter than M2.
----------------

I would also like to direct you to something in regards to height.

Here

and

Here

Based on Dex data, which comes straight from the games. Mewtwo according to those is a foot taller than Charizard. The height in the Pokedex describes the height as overall height, therefore including the neck.

Were it not for his long neck, Charizard would be almost two feet shorter than Mewtwo, meaning his body is lower, a strike to the neck with his claws is therefore not possible. The only chance Charizard has at a neck kill is his teeth, and his neck is strong because it's thickness denotes strong neck musculature overall. Mewtwo's only advantage is the length of his arms, which due not provide much due to their comparatively weak muscles.

So who's side are you on? Leave it to Beren to play Switzerland in a debate...
But just to note, look at M2's feet in your pic. He can be clipped by Zard's tail and fall. Guess where M2's head is when he falls? He doesn't have the arms to keep Zard's teeth away from him, and he can't do the same because Zard has tree trunk legs.
--------

Answered in blue.

 

[Beren Zaiga]

@Nova:
You are completely wrong about his fingers, look at them again. They have length to them, they are not just simply orbs. You ludicrous assumption will therefore be denied and disregarded as such. Mewtwo can block Chiarzard's arms with his, as Charizard must get close to slash him, and what says Mewtwo can't just jump a tail sweep? You?

If he is reduced to fighting like a Kangaroo, he can dodge a tail sweep by swiftly being his legs up briefly.

Mewtwo, being the most Savage Pokemon alive means using his tail to club Chiarizard isn't beneath him.

Its not just his power that he is savage with, he is savage in NATURE, in PERSONALITY.

A person whom is savage is not above using a tactic they don't usually use to surprise an opponent.

The games show that Mewtwo indeed does stand his tail does not float, but wag back and forth when not floating, this includes the Colleseum and XD games, where you could transfer Pokemon from the games like FireRed and LeafGreen, Ruby, Sapphire, and Emerald to the GC into the game via Link Cable. This shows that Mewtwo's tail can indeed be quite muscular.

Just because one uses something for balance doesn't mean it is ruled out as a weapon. Period.

Fine, if Mewtwo's legs are structured like a Kangaroo's, then he can balance himself on his tail then proceed to give Charizard a swift two-legged kick to the shoulders and knock him over. Those wings, and comparatively stubby legs are not going to keep him from falling over, nor his tail.

Since Mewtwo is taller than Charizard's main body, he could aim for Charizard's shoulders and knock him over, a kangaroo's kick is able to send a man flying for a few feet, and can disembowel a human if it doesn't send them flying. That is pretty dang strong. If M2 goes for a neck blow, them Charizard stand no chance if M2 gets off a successful kick to his neck.

 

[Nova9000]

@Nova:
You are completely wrong about his fingers, look at them again. They have length to them, they are not just simply orbs. You ludicrous assumption will therefore be denied and disregarded as such. Mewtwo can block Chiarzard's arms with his, as Charizard must get close to slash him, and what says Mewtwo can't just jump a tail sweep? You?

If he is reduced to fighting like a Kangaroo, he can dodge a tail sweep by swiftly being his legs up briefly.

Mewtwo, being the most Savage Pokemon alive means using his tail to club Chiarizard isn't beneath him.

Its not just his power that he is savage with, he is savage in NATURE, in PERSONALITY.

A person whom is savage is not above using a tactic they don't usually use to surprise an opponent.

The games show that Mewtwo indeed does stand his tail does not float, but wag back and forth when not floating, this includes the Colleseum and XD games, where you could transfer Pokemon from the games like FireRed and LeafGreen, Ruby, Sapphire, and Emerald to the GC into the game via Link Cable. This shows that Mewtwo's tail can indeed be quite muscular.

Just because one uses something for balance doesn't mean it is ruled out as a weapon. Period.

Fine, if Mewtwo's legs are structured like a Kangaroo's, then he can balance himself on his tail then proceed to give Charizard a swift two-legged kick to the shoulders and knock him over. Those wings, and comparatively stubby legs are not going to keep him from falling over, nor his tail.

Since Mewtwo is taller than Charizard's main body, he could aim for Charizard's shoulders and knock him over, a kangaroo's kick is able to send a man flying for a few feet, and can disembowel a human if it doesn't send them flying. That is pretty dang strong. If M2 goes for a neck blow, them Charizard stand no chance if M2 gets off a successful kick to his neck.

*facepalmed many times*

Your first claim lost me. Because I didn't see opposable thumbs now I have ludicrous assumptions? Don't flatter yourself. Take a better look and you'll see both have about the same hand shape with similar distance between them. But when you have claws you can dig into flesh, making it more effective than M2's "fingers".

Next understand something. If M2 is as intelligent and as savage as you exaggerate him to be, then that makes him oxymoronic. M2 is savage because of his mind. His body doesn't do anything. Take a look at M2's attacks in Pokemon:
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Mewtwo_(Pokémon)#By_leveling_up
Not one of those moves imply it being done physically. Heck, even in Melee his trophy said he hardly uses his body and it reflected his moveset in that game.

Now, take away those psychic powers because we enter RL, and M2 is an ugly kangaroo type creature. His savage personality can exist, but he has no effective means to dish his aggression out on a foe as big as Zard. In retrospect, he's a angry creature who has no means to harm anyone. And he's a genius? lol. Again, smarts and anger get you no where when you can't fight.

M2's tail has muscles. So does Zard. Point? He can knock Zard down, but Zard can clip up M2. A knock down isn't too fatal unless he steps on his neck, and even then he has to knock Zard off his feet and he has his wings, tail, and claws on his feet to counter the momentum. A clip up leads to a ripped neck for M2.

 

[Sieguest]

Now, take away those psychic powers because we enter RL, and M2 is an ugly kangaroo type creature. His savage personality can exist, but he has no effective means to dish his aggression out on a foe as big as Zard. In retrospect, he's a angry creature who has no means to harm anyone. And he's a genius? lol. Again, smarts and anger get you no where when you can't fight.

If Mewtwo is supposedly like a Kangaroo, then Mewtwo has very powerful leg muscles, so saying Mewtwo can't fight is also an exaggeration on your part as he can be deadly if that's true.

M2's tail has muscles. So does Zard. Point? He can knock Zard down, but Zard can clip up M2. A knock down isn't too fatal unless he steps on his neck, and even then he has to knock Zard off his feet and he has his wings, tail, and claws on his feet to counter the momentum. A clip up leads to a ripped neck for M2.

Point is Zard has a long open spot, his neck,

Mewtwo doesn't need to knock Zard down to get a kill stroke on his neck, all it takes is one, Kangaroos don't need to knock us down to K.O. us with a kick.... and even then, they don't even hit the neck, because it's not so defined on us.

But in M2 vs Zard, Zard basically has a foot of neck that M2 can strike, and with the force of a Kangaroo kick, that's enough to possibly break Zard's airway, leading to death.

Also, you disregard the point made that Zard, body wise, is two feet smaller than Mewtwo, and Zard has poor arm length, he probably couldn't reach M2's second spinal cord.


Now for the other half of this sketch: If M2 makes a mistake then Zard can make a lethal capitalization...

Zard on offense also can make a difference, Zard can always swing his tail slightly upward, if M2 jumps then Zard can capitalize with a crunch, because realistically speaking, M2 couldn't get enough force to take down Zard by trying to swift kick it in the air...

Also remember that Zard could always catch an offensive M2 in his mouth as well.

 

[JOE!]

ok nova, 2 things:

1) "who's side are you on?" STFU NAO! This kinda arguing is what put the thread into the "lolphail" phase.

2) "Melee mewtwo didnt use his body". Errrr, check again. The only moves he didnt use his body for are as follows: Dspec, Nspec, Uspec, Nair(kinda), Dsmash and Usmash.

Everythign else, more than half his moveset, involved his body.

 

[Sieguest]

ok nova, 2 things:

1) "who's side are you on?"

He said this? oh snap

JOE!'s right, that's exactly the mindset that digs the hole in a discussion...

A productive discussion shouldn't just be about picking a side and riding with it... you have to look at BOTH sides of the discussion so you can really determine what is viable, the pros and cons of each side, and eventually developing a consensus...

Just picking a side and defending it to the death regardless of what the other side says leads to wars >.>

Now for those people who take debate in school and will try to tell me "how come you are forced to take a side in debate tournaments?" You still have to consider your opponent's points and weigh the pros and cons of your side and your opponents in order to develop a response, and remember that you also are forced to argue for the other side at some point, again encouraging the knowledge of the pros and cons of both sides...

TL;DR- Picking a side and locking down on that side isn't the best thing, in essence you shouldn't do that or expect other people to "pick a side".
and with that, I end my rant...

 

[REL38]

My only question is where people assume that Mewtwo is highly intelligent or even normally intelligent.

By being a Psychic?
That would make Lucas and Ness brainiacs as well.

The way I see it.
We have an Alpha male vs a savage

 

[Sieguest]

My only question is where people assume that Mewtwo is highly intelligent or even normally intelligent.

By being a Psychic?
That would make Lucas and Ness brainiacs as well.

The way I see it.
We have an Alpha male vs a savage

It's derived from movies and the show and such like that....
I also think in Pokemon Yellow in the abandoned laboratory there are bunch of books describing the creating of Mewtwo and if I recall one of them mentioned Mewtwo's intelligence.

 

[UncleSam]

1) "who's side are you on?" STFU NAO! This kinda arguing is what put the thread into the "lolphail" phase.

its always been like that... >_>
you didn't see anything

2) "Melee mewtwo didnt use his body". Errrr, check again. The only moves he didnt use his body for are as follows: Dspec, Nspec, Uspec, Nair(kinda), Dsmash and Usmash.

Everythign else, more than half his moveset, involved his body.

uhh by didn't use his body you mean didn't move? or didnt make contact? because that latter has many more moves: side special, forward smash, his throws, I think his pummel.
the rest he mainly used his tail... oh and shadow claw.

63

 

[Beren Zaiga]

Besides, Mewtwo in the Pokemon games is capable of learning a plethora of Physical moves, thus putting your statement into falsehood. Even one of the moves he LEARNS by level up is physical: Psycho Cut, which would likely be done with a sweeping arm motion. Disable is also described as "physically disables one of the opponent's moves".

Also, as Marthage said, if Mewtwo can land a swift kick to the neck, which he can do easily due to height difference, Charizard is likely to die. A Kangaroo's kick is powerful enough to seriously harm it's own predator: the dingo, and on a human in general, it can disembowel us or send us flying a fair distance. A neck structure like that won't be able to stand up to that kind of force.

I am making a scale using their sprites (ones where I can see the tops of their heads and none of them isn't crouching down...or I could use a trainer sprite).

*A hour or two later*

Okay it is done.

The scale is 1 Inch = 1 Foot.

View it here...

Keep it in mind that Mewtwo is only wider because he looks weird when the sprite is stretched vertically, so it was stretched sideways a bit to make it viewable.

There is a simulated height difference between Mewtwo and Charizard.

 

[UncleSam]

couldn't you have just looked up their heights?
Charizard 5'7"
Mewtwo 6'7"

mewtwo is a foot taller.
(lol I'm taller than charizard... by like 7")

62

 

[Beren Zaiga]

couldn't you have just looked up their heights?
Charizard 5'7"
Mewtwo 6'7"

mewtwo is a foot taller.
(lol I'm taller than charizard... by like 7")

62

I just decided to go the extra mile. Thats all.

 

[JOE!]

@melee mewtwo:

the moves you mention sam involve him actually going out to hit the opponent (even having hitboxes on his body if you wanna go that far) Moves like Shadow Ball and Dsmash where the main focus of the attack is the energy he creates (well, now fsmash is a tad iffy, but whatevs) is what we are talkign about.

@intellect:

in all representations of how mewtwo was created, it was stated that he had tremendous brainpower (thus needing a second spinal chord) and an intellect akin to mankind's top minds.

 

[UncleSam]

I just decided to go the extra mile. Thats all.

w/e it's still a foot difference.

@melee mewtwo:

the moves you mention sam involve him actually going out to hit the opponent (even having hitboxes on his body if you wanna go that far) Moves like Shadow Ball and Dsmash where the main focus of the attack is the energy he creates (well, now fsmash is a tad iffy, but whatevs) is what we are talkign about.

it still revolved around psychic **** but w/e.

16
lolwut? 16?
jk its 61

 

[Nova9000]

I have a few things to address, so bear with me:

@ Guest:
M2 could, but he never fights with his legs. Yes he's taller than Zard and he has a glaring weak point in his long neck, but that wouldn't kill him, even if he were to fight with his legs. You forget, Zard has a much bigger torso and has wings to deal with the knockback that we as humans would suffer from. And take a look at this:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/timmythesuk/403782624/
http://www.ludocortex.fr/site/medias/150_mewtwo.jpg
M2 doesn't have the amount of definition that a real kangaroo has, so he would have a fraction of the power that a real roo would. If anything, he would be more inclined to fight with his tail than his legs.

@ JOE!
Check the TDB back room for your first point.
At 2nd point, I worded it wrong. Only moves that used his body in a non-canon way are his tilts, d throw, Uair, Dair, and Bair (Fair maybe). His most powerful moves were from his moves involving his mind.
http://super-smash-bros.wikia.com/wiki/Mewtwo_(SSBM)#Moveset
http://super-smash-bros.wikia.com/wiki/Mewtwo_(SSBM)#Trophy_Descriptions
(smash red)
My fault for wording it wrong, but that is what I meant.

@ Beren
Those moves don't sound like they would translate well into RL.
Again, Zard is bigger than both of them and has wings and a tail to alleviate some of the knockback. Only if M2 knocks him on his back does the situation become fatal. And as I stated above, M2 never used his body is Pokemon fights unlike every other Pokemon in this thread.
I get the height argument. Again, Zard being like 4 ft body and a ft of neck hurts him, but that doesn't mean that he cannot win this MU.

 

[Beren Zaiga]

*Sigh*

@ Beren
Those moves don't sound like they would translate well into RL.
Again, Zard is bigger than both of them and has wings and a tail to alleviate some of the knockback. Only if M2 knocks him on his back does the situation become fatal. And as I stated above, M2 never used his body is Pokemon fights unlike every other Pokemon in this thread.
I get the height argument. Again, Zard being like 4 ft body and a ft of neck hurts him, but that doesn't mean that he cannot win this MU.

Look, wings are built for producing lift force, not counteracting forces applied horizontally, unless he is in the air. When Charizard flaps his wings, forward force is applied to the air they move through, usually in the downward direction, eventually producing lift (If he could maintain full-sustained flight).

if Charizard were to attempt this on the ground after a strike from Mewtwo (If he could knock him over with a Kangaroo Kick) Then the direction the wings produce force changes as well, which would lead to them helping him fall instead of your scenario, because the direction of the force would be directed upward, pushing against any support the tail could provide. The wings aren't designed to produce a backward force, as it would impede flight, sending air upwards and pushing him down.

If that were to happen, it is likely the weight of his main body and torso would end up crushing the hollow bones in his wings (which are needed for any type of flight except mechanical flight by machines) if not break or snap them, especially if he falls on one of them the wrong way.

That would cause him great pain, maybe even could disable his ability to fight overall.

His tail would be fine, as most of it's structure consists of cartilage, like Mewtwo's own tail.

@ Tail: Then Mewtwo's tail will be his main killing weapon, multiple strikes to Charizard's neck will be what he will need to achieve victory. Applying force repeatedly will eventually destroy his airway. Also, hitting Charizard in the neck will likely stun him badly, because of it's length, hitting it squarely in the middle will deal the most damage, which M2 can do due to height.

What happens to you when you get punched or kicked in the neck. You're more than just stunned momentarily. Even though on a bigger scale, this can affect Charizard more deeply. Heck, M2 can even go for a whack at Zard's head or the base where the head connects to the neck.

 

[Nova9000]

Look, wings are built for producing lift force, not counteracting forces applied horizontally, unless he is in the air. When Charizard flaps his wings, forward force is applied to the air they move through, usually in the downward direction, eventually producing lift (If he could maintain full-sustained flight).

if Charizard were to attempt this on the ground after a strike from Mewtwo (If he could knock him over with a Kangaroo Kick) Then the direction the wings produce force changes as well, which would lead to them helping him fall instead of your scenario, because the direction of the force would be directed upward, pushing against any support the tail could provide. The wings aren't designed to produce a backward force, as it would impede flight, sending air upwards and pushing him down.

If that were to happen, it is likely the weight of his main body and torso would end up crushing the hollow bones in his wings (which are needed for any type of flight except mechanical flight by machines) if not break or snap them, especially if he falls on one of them the wrong way.

That would cause him great pain, maybe even could disable his ability to fight overall.

His tail would be fine, as most of it's structure consists of cartilage, like Mewtwo's own tail.

@ Tail: Then Mewtwo's tail will be his main killing weapon, multiple strikes to Charizard's neck will be what he will need to achieve victory. Applying force repeatedly will eventually destroy his airway. Also, hitting Charizard in the neck will likely stun him badly, because of it's length, hitting it squarely in the middle will deal the most damage, which M2 can do due to height.

What happens to you when you get punched or kicked in the neck. You're more than just stunned momentarily. Even though on a bigger scale, this can affect Charizard more deeply. Heck, M2 can even go for a whack at Zard's head or the base where the head connects to the neck.

I agree with all of this. The wing idea wouldn't work and I thought about it more as I was driving earlier. The tail to the neck is also fatal, but so is a neck injury to M2. Zard can still go raging on M2 from a kick in the throat, where as M2 gets a claw/tooth on his head, he;s dead. And what's preventing Zard from knocking off M2 with his tail? Unlike Zard, he has no neck and a blow to his head can topple him, especially since he walks on his tip toes anyway.

A punch to the throat is going to hurt. A hit to the head causes concussions.

 

[Rialdospaldacht]

So at most recent

This is Charizard

this is Mewtwo

Charizard advantages:
arm strength
wings
claws
likely better durability
disadvantages:
bad mobility
long open neck

Mewtwo advantages:
size, both height and weight
better mobility
better reflexes
leg strength
disadvantages:
if not sentient, but still vicious, may not put enough thought into strategy
two spines makes two crippling weaknesses

Both have long muscle tails for use



I took this from a discussion I was having with my sister. We debated whether Mewtwo would be allowed to be sentient, as that would be a huge advantage. It also would be good to know whether we're using game Mewtwo or anime Mewtwo, since their proportions are different.

 

[Sieguest]

Besides, Mewtwo in the Pokemon games is capable of learning a plethora of Physical moves, thus putting your statement into falsehood. Even one of the moves he LEARNS by level up is physical: Psycho Cut, which would likely be done with a sweeping arm motion. Disable is also described as "physically disables one of the opponent's moves".

Only one thing I wanted to point out...

While Psycho Cut is classified as a physical attack, it's move description indicates that the user creates blades of psychic energy to attack the foe...

in essence, that's an unrealistic move using psychic powers...

 

[Beren Zaiga]

Only one thing I wanted to point out...

While Psycho Cut is classified as a physical attack, it's move description indicates that the user creates blades of psychic energy to attack the foe...

in essence, that's an unrealistic move using psychic powers...

Who said that I said he could use it in RL, or are you saying something else entirely?

@Nova: Mewtwo does have a neck, not as long as Charizard's be he still has a neck.

@Rialdo: No, look his arms AGAIN please. While Charizard's arms are somewhat thicker, they are not thicker by much. Look at the Sugimori art of Mewtwo, then compare tot hat of Charizard. They are are almost of completely equal arm thickness. Arm strength my foot (his claws can still do damage though, assuming his gets in close enough).

Mewtwo has been said to be sentient somewhere on Cinnibar in FireRed and LeafGreen, as well as Red and Blue, I believe Marthage spoke of this earlier..

..I just went and checked on Bulbapedia, the Pokemon Mansion journals say nothing of Mewtwo being necessarily super-sentient.

 

[Nova9000]

I said that with exaggeration compared to Zard's neck.
And I thought of another tactic for Zard: Dtilt M2. Since he's shorter and M2 has bad balancing anyway, a bite to his foot knocks out all the kangaroo mess anyway, only leaving his tail to attack with. And since he needs that to balance with a hurt foot....He's going to fall. GGS M2.