Beren Zaiga
Smash Ace
I never said anything about that they should be 1 inch tall, I was talking about BS against the ICs in general.
Also, I am calm, and I am collected, unlike what you believe.
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TDB: SEASON 2! LEON (RE4) vs LARA CROFT
- Thread starter JOE!
- Start date
Also, I am calm, and I am collected, unlike what you believe.
REL38
Smash Lord
Me thinks we should all be civil about this.
Gimme a bit longer
I mean, w/e I write is enough to apparently make you guys go 
so why yell at each other x__x
so why yell at each other x__xGimme a bit longer
Beren Zaiga
Smash Ace
Bowser would like a few words with you when you're done.Me thinks we should all be civil about this.
I mean, w/e I write is enough to apparently make you guys go
Gimme a bit longer
JOE!
Smash Hero
lesse:
Nova:
Pikmin are about....2.5-3ft tall if Olimar is 4ft.
muscle degeneration is out, and resting is in.
The whistle only needs to be a sound that comes from his suit, there are a few places where there could be speakers. Hell, maybe even his antenna has something that produces a signal (note that the light-ring comes from it)
Nova:
Pikmin are about....2.5-3ft tall if Olimar is 4ft.
muscle degeneration is out, and resting is in.
The whistle only needs to be a sound that comes from his suit, there are a few places where there could be speakers. Hell, maybe even his antenna has something that produces a signal (note that the light-ring comes from it)
JOE!
Smash Hero
pikmin were allways teh size i just said.
you just said Oli was 4ft, so i just stated how tall they would be compared to oli
you just said Oli was 4ft, so i just stated how tall they would be compared to oli
REL38
Smash Lord
Hmm.
Not sure if I wanna oppose JOE's decision which will inevitably prolong this MU
or
Go with what JOE has proposed.
@___@
1. IC's are still shown to be obese. They have a very wide face which supports obesity.
Mother Boys' facial features go against any sign of obesity. They only have large heads, not wide heads.
Parka's make the body appear larger, but not the head. A wide head makes them fat.
2. Sumo wrestling muscles =/= mountain climbing muscles.
Sumo wrestling requires training from a teacher who gives the wrestler a training regimine, diet and set amount of rest.
Mountain climbing doesn't give you the same thing as sumo wrestling. Not by a longshot.
Different muscles are used and demand different criteria from the climber.
Remember that the IC's aren't conventionally climbing mountains like normal people do. The mountains they climb are layered in a sense that each "level" is a different segment. Kinda like a temple. Similar effect that doesn't require too much physical strain. The fact that they're fat would support them waiting between each "level" to rest for large amounts of time. The fact that they can apparently lift their mallets means they can go club baby seals for food which instigates them staying fat rather than build muscle.
3. Solomar has brass knuckles.
Ever been hit by one?
They shatter facial tissue and bones.
Olimar is a middle-aged dude by his species. He would have a hefty punch alone.
4. lol @ Olimar being classified as a human.
He doesn't follow human classification. His blood doesn't go off of oxygen. He doesn't breathe oxygen. He's a Hocotation which is an alien race of people.
Olimar is not a human, Nova. He doesn't follow the same anatomy as humans do.
5. No mountain climbing gear.
Canon does not support this. Going off the fact that they "climb mountains and thusly require it" contradicts canon. Canon only gives them wooden mallets which can still be conventionally used to climb the type of mountains they climb. This logic limits Mario and Luigi to plumbing gear, gives Peach nothing more than a parasol, gives Falcon bounty hunting gear and gives Link only a sword.
6. Fanboyism = Bias.
I'll admit, Pikmn 2 is one of my favourite games out there. The environment and Olimar's revealed character via logbooks is something I didn't expect from Nintendo.
But that's not fueling my defense of Olimar.
Rather, I truely believe Olimar has better options than two fat kids with mallets.
I'm merely using the knowledge I have from the game and applying it to my rebuttles.
fanboyism in this thread:
The results are self-explanitory.
7. Sound waves are only required to actively swarm the IC's.
Pikmin already follow Olimar. He only needs to emit a frequency that orders them to attack.
This can be recieved from:
a. the lolxygen tank.
b. His "head light" which is used in-game.
8. lololololololololololol
9. The IC's have the appearance of 5-7 year old children.
Not 10 year old children.
Not sure if I wanna oppose JOE's decision which will inevitably prolong this MU
or
Go with what JOE has proposed.
@___@
1. IC's are still shown to be obese. They have a very wide face which supports obesity.
Mother Boys' facial features go against any sign of obesity. They only have large heads, not wide heads.
Parka's make the body appear larger, but not the head. A wide head makes them fat.
2. Sumo wrestling muscles =/= mountain climbing muscles.
Sumo wrestling requires training from a teacher who gives the wrestler a training regimine, diet and set amount of rest.
Mountain climbing doesn't give you the same thing as sumo wrestling. Not by a longshot.
Different muscles are used and demand different criteria from the climber.
Remember that the IC's aren't conventionally climbing mountains like normal people do. The mountains they climb are layered in a sense that each "level" is a different segment. Kinda like a temple. Similar effect that doesn't require too much physical strain. The fact that they're fat would support them waiting between each "level" to rest for large amounts of time. The fact that they can apparently lift their mallets means they can go club baby seals for food which instigates them staying fat rather than build muscle.
3. Solomar has brass knuckles.
Ever been hit by one?
They shatter facial tissue and bones.
Olimar is a middle-aged dude by his species. He would have a hefty punch alone.
4. lol @ Olimar being classified as a human.
He doesn't follow human classification. His blood doesn't go off of oxygen. He doesn't breathe oxygen. He's a Hocotation which is an alien race of people.
Olimar is not a human, Nova. He doesn't follow the same anatomy as humans do.
5. No mountain climbing gear.
Canon does not support this. Going off the fact that they "climb mountains and thusly require it" contradicts canon. Canon only gives them wooden mallets which can still be conventionally used to climb the type of mountains they climb. This logic limits Mario and Luigi to plumbing gear, gives Peach nothing more than a parasol, gives Falcon bounty hunting gear and gives Link only a sword.
6. Fanboyism = Bias.
I'll admit, Pikmn 2 is one of my favourite games out there. The environment and Olimar's revealed character via logbooks is something I didn't expect from Nintendo.
But that's not fueling my defense of Olimar.
Rather, I truely believe Olimar has better options than two fat kids with mallets.
I'm merely using the knowledge I have from the game and applying it to my rebuttles.
fanboyism in this thread:
Blatent Fanboyism is easily noticable.
The results are self-explanitory.
7. Sound waves are only required to actively swarm the IC's.
Pikmin already follow Olimar. He only needs to emit a frequency that orders them to attack.
This can be recieved from:
a. the lolxygen tank.
b. His "head light" which is used in-game.
8. lololololololololololol
9. The IC's have the appearance of 5-7 year old children.
Not 10 year old children.
JOE!
Smash Hero
yeah, ICs are/would be fat. Fat helps out alot in cold weather...still doesnt mean they cannot be "fit" enough to wield the light-ish wooden mallets.
Beren Zaiga
Smash Ace
Been waiting all day to use that.
2. Disagree, the fact that Sumo can be around the area of obesity, and still attain a notable amount of muscle tone and strength, proves they can obtain the toned muscle needed to not only swing their mallets and lift them, but also to climb.
The fact they must swing their mallets to kill seals to eat means that they are doing physical exercise, and thus supports that they can obtain the needed muscle. Lift them or not, it takes an amount of effort to kill an animal with a blunt weapon. Its not going to always be one konk on the head = dead seal.
Eating the fat from the seal, as well as what meat they can get from it can provide the protein need for the body to help strengthen their muscles, thusly, them being fat is not as big a hindrance as you are playing it out to be.
The Parka also protects them from the claws of the Pikmin, at least the majority of their body anyhow. Thick coat = good resistance to tearing.
3. Are you kidding? Just because he is middle-aged by his species doesn't mean he will be doing the same amount of damage as a middle-aged human can with those little arms of his. brass knuckles or not, its not worth going in for a punch just to get knocked over by a mallet, then stomped on by a cleated boot.
Nice try.
5. Wrong, just because it is not canon does not mean it cannot be added, climbing mountains like they do, even if layered, would require some climbing gear other than a hammer. Ergo, the ICs must have climbing gear in order to climb, this also would give them another form of exercise for which to build their muscles between breaks other than killing for food.
6. Couldn't agree more, but I am not an IC fanboy thankfully (<-for reiteration)
9. There are 10 year olds whom are that tall, that right there can disprove your "They are 5-7 years old" bit right there.
One more thing to add, if the Pikmin are 2.5-3 feet tall like JOE! said they would be if Oli is 4" in height, then there is no way he can throw his Pikmin, and the sweeping range the Ice Climbers are capable of with their mallets makes a swarming attack of 10 Pikmin a much less imposing threat.
tocador
Smash Lord
Can kids wield weapons ^^? Or at least have the strentgh to use one, PROPERLY?
Ic cant use weapon, G_G.
Ic cant use weapon, G_G.
REL38
Smash Lord
The fact that sumo wrestlers =/= climbing mountains is where building toned muscle, especially in kids, lacks definite proof that there would be toned muscle under the fat.
Kids are kids. They wouldn't develop that type of toned muscle under the conditions they work under.
The fact that they are fat means they're biting off more than they can chew. They would be focusing on fat to stay warm which equals eating more than necessary. That's keeping them fat with no real need for "toned muscle" other than enough to club baby seals.
Faces are very open to attack. Gnashed eyeballs would cause 5-7 year old kids to cry and scream.
I didn't word myself correctly in regards to Olimar's strength.
A young octopus is not as strong as an adult octopus.
A young crocodile is not as strong as an adult crocodile.
A young bear is not as strong as an adult bear.
A young baboon is not as strong as an adult baboon.
A young human is not as strong as an adult human.
See what I'm getting at here?
Olimar is an adult male of his species. His punch would = strong.
It wouldn't equal that of an adult human, but it could very well equal that of a human ******.
Brass knuckles would make his punch more effective.
Canon is canon. It doesn't matter if it doesn't make sense. They are shown to only climb mountains with their mallets. Giving them climbing equipment is giving them things they
a. never displayed in canon
b. making them a character they aren't.
The IC's are kids that climb mountains. They aren't professional ice climbing champions. Kids possesing such equipment and knowing how to properly use it is unrealistic in itself. Kids don't climb mountains. They only have mallets. You're giving them materials they never had.
Exactly how tall are the IC's, hmm?
Their body proportions lead them to being 5-7 year olds. Using the instance of "some 10 year olds are this tall" only applies to "some".
Which is more plausible.
The IC's being 5-7 year olds due to their height?
or
The IC's being 10 year olds who just so happen to shorter than normal 10 year olds?
Olimar won't be throwing his Pikmin. Not very useful here.
Swinging a mallet gives a lot of cooldown time to regain full control of the mallet.
Pikmin are fast enough to close in during that cooldown time and swarm the IC's.
They can't use their mallets when the Pikmin are in such close proximity. They're on the IC's. They Pikmin would be gnashing at their eyeballs which blind them. The IC's would be frightened out of their minds.
They are still kids.
A kid can act all tough, but when they lose control of the situation, they panic and cry.
The Pikmin gnashing at their faces would toss the cliimbers into a state of panic and fright. They may attempt to flail their arms about or try to smack the Pikmin off, but there's more than just one ready to leap on their faces. This will very well result in them losing balance and falling over. That marks the end of the IC's.
Kids are kids. They wouldn't develop that type of toned muscle under the conditions they work under.
The fact that they are fat means they're biting off more than they can chew. They would be focusing on fat to stay warm which equals eating more than necessary. That's keeping them fat with no real need for "toned muscle" other than enough to club baby seals.
Faces are very open to attack. Gnashed eyeballs would cause 5-7 year old kids to cry and scream.
I didn't word myself correctly in regards to Olimar's strength.
A young octopus is not as strong as an adult octopus.
A young crocodile is not as strong as an adult crocodile.
A young bear is not as strong as an adult bear.
A young baboon is not as strong as an adult baboon.
A young human is not as strong as an adult human.
See what I'm getting at here?
Olimar is an adult male of his species. His punch would = strong.
It wouldn't equal that of an adult human, but it could very well equal that of a human ******.
Brass knuckles would make his punch more effective.
Canon is canon. It doesn't matter if it doesn't make sense. They are shown to only climb mountains with their mallets. Giving them climbing equipment is giving them things they
a. never displayed in canon
b. making them a character they aren't.
The IC's are kids that climb mountains. They aren't professional ice climbing champions. Kids possesing such equipment and knowing how to properly use it is unrealistic in itself. Kids don't climb mountains. They only have mallets. You're giving them materials they never had.
Exactly how tall are the IC's, hmm?
Their body proportions lead them to being 5-7 year olds. Using the instance of "some 10 year olds are this tall" only applies to "some".
Which is more plausible.
The IC's being 5-7 year olds due to their height?
or
The IC's being 10 year olds who just so happen to shorter than normal 10 year olds?
Olimar won't be throwing his Pikmin. Not very useful here.
Swinging a mallet gives a lot of cooldown time to regain full control of the mallet.
Pikmin are fast enough to close in during that cooldown time and swarm the IC's.
They can't use their mallets when the Pikmin are in such close proximity. They're on the IC's. They Pikmin would be gnashing at their eyeballs which blind them. The IC's would be frightened out of their minds.
They are still kids.
A kid can act all tough, but when they lose control of the situation, they panic and cry.
The Pikmin gnashing at their faces would toss the cliimbers into a state of panic and fright. They may attempt to flail their arms about or try to smack the Pikmin off, but there's more than just one ready to leap on their faces. This will very well result in them losing balance and falling over. That marks the end of the IC's.
Beren Zaiga
Smash Ace
Double Post, with a purpose.
This is about the strength of Olimar's punch. F=MA So I went around looking for info on the average human adult and tried to make sure the proportionality is as correct as possible. Being that he is male, I used the Average Human Male for a reference. This take the basic formula for force as its guide, using the weight of the hand as mass.
The height of the average human man is 5.9 feet, and a the average man's arm length is around 2.8 feet in length. That means the length of the human arm is proportional to 47% of that of his height. Lets apply this to Olimar, which we have made 4.0 feet tall.
4.0 * 0.47 = 1.88 or 1.9 feet.
Now lets calculate the velocity that the arm will generate, based on the fact that the average velocity that the arm generates is around 75% the length of the arm.
1.9 * 0.75 = average 1.43 m/s
The average human adult hand weight is around 250-500 grams, for this, I used the maximum and used the average length of the human hand to calculate the proportionality from the wrist to the floor and the length from the floor to the fingertips. The average human male's hand is around 2.0 feet from the ground to the fingertips and 2.8 feet from the ground to the wrist.
2.0/2.8 = 0.71% of the length of the arm to the floor.
Which means that the weight of the hand is around 29% that of the length of the arm.
500 * 0.29 = 145 grams
Here is the same formula using the minimum.
250 * 0.29 = 5.8 grams.
That means Olimar's hand is anywhere from 5.8 - 145 grams in weight. Grams is the basic SI unit for mass, so these numbers will represent the mass.
Fop = 5.8 or 145 grams * 1.43 m/s = 8.3 to 208 N of Force.
That makes Olimar's Punch anywhere from 8.3 to 208 N in strength. That is for a straight arm punch. The Average of the two numbers is: 208 + 8.3/2 = R(Resultant)avg
The R is equal to an average straight arm punching force in the absence of thrown body weight, rotation, and all other factors of a punch. That average is 108.15 N which (using a Newton to Pound Forces Calculator) translates to 24.31lbs of force. The Minimum Pounds Force is 1.9lbs and the Max Pounds Force of 46.76lbs of Force. However if you want to get much more technical, the average weight of Olimar's hand is around 75.4 grams which times 1.43 is 107.822 or 108 N.
How much does it take to break human bone? Around 9lb from a direct hit. A straight arm punch can be dodged or tanked by the ICs due to fat exerting a set amount of resistance force (I like needed information to calculate this.)
So Olimar either has a weak punch, a hard punch, or a devastating punch. I think the median of the three is the most likely. He can break human bone, but only if it is a clean hit and if the resistance force of the fat is not enough to absorb the amount of force needed to keep Olimar from breaking their faces.
This is about the strength of Olimar's punch. F=MA So I went around looking for info on the average human adult and tried to make sure the proportionality is as correct as possible. Being that he is male, I used the Average Human Male for a reference. This take the basic formula for force as its guide, using the weight of the hand as mass.
The height of the average human man is 5.9 feet, and a the average man's arm length is around 2.8 feet in length. That means the length of the human arm is proportional to 47% of that of his height. Lets apply this to Olimar, which we have made 4.0 feet tall.
4.0 * 0.47 = 1.88 or 1.9 feet.
Now lets calculate the velocity that the arm will generate, based on the fact that the average velocity that the arm generates is around 75% the length of the arm.
1.9 * 0.75 = average 1.43 m/s
The average human adult hand weight is around 250-500 grams, for this, I used the maximum and used the average length of the human hand to calculate the proportionality from the wrist to the floor and the length from the floor to the fingertips. The average human male's hand is around 2.0 feet from the ground to the fingertips and 2.8 feet from the ground to the wrist.
2.0/2.8 = 0.71% of the length of the arm to the floor.
Which means that the weight of the hand is around 29% that of the length of the arm.
500 * 0.29 = 145 grams
Here is the same formula using the minimum.
250 * 0.29 = 5.8 grams.
That means Olimar's hand is anywhere from 5.8 - 145 grams in weight. Grams is the basic SI unit for mass, so these numbers will represent the mass.
Fop = 5.8 or 145 grams * 1.43 m/s = 8.3 to 208 N of Force.
That makes Olimar's Punch anywhere from 8.3 to 208 N in strength. That is for a straight arm punch. The Average of the two numbers is: 208 + 8.3/2 = R(Resultant)avg
The R is equal to an average straight arm punching force in the absence of thrown body weight, rotation, and all other factors of a punch. That average is 108.15 N which (using a Newton to Pound Forces Calculator) translates to 24.31lbs of force. The Minimum Pounds Force is 1.9lbs and the Max Pounds Force of 46.76lbs of Force. However if you want to get much more technical, the average weight of Olimar's hand is around 75.4 grams which times 1.43 is 107.822 or 108 N.
How much does it take to break human bone? Around 9lb from a direct hit. A straight arm punch can be dodged or tanked by the ICs due to fat exerting a set amount of resistance force (I like needed information to calculate this.)
So Olimar either has a weak punch, a hard punch, or a devastating punch. I think the median of the three is the most likely. He can break human bone, but only if it is a clean hit and if the resistance force of the fat is not enough to absorb the amount of force needed to keep Olimar from breaking their faces.
JOE!
Smash Hero
huh, beren went a little far here...
now, did you factor in his gloves?
or the fact that ICs will be distracted by 10 pikmin?
now, did you factor in his gloves?
or the fact that ICs will be distracted by 10 pikmin?
REL38
Smash Lord
So . . . does all of that take into account the "brass knuckles"?
Or no?
Also, fat would mostly reside within the cheeks with very little at the lips, nose and forehead.
A straight punch to the forhead or nose, especially with a form of "brass knuckles', would take a great toll on the IC's.
EDIT: Good eye there JOE.
I didn't think about that
Or no?
Also, fat would mostly reside within the cheeks with very little at the lips, nose and forehead.
A straight punch to the forhead or nose, especially with a form of "brass knuckles', would take a great toll on the IC's.
EDIT: Good eye there JOE.
I didn't think about that
Beren Zaiga
Smash Ace
No, it does not take them into account, it is a straight arm punch in the absence of other factors, like Drag, absorption of force due to Fat Resistance Force. How much do Brass Knuckles Weigh, I can't find that anywhere. Air-Drag + Fat Resistance Force will slow down Olimar fist, even if slightly.
Plus, Olimar has no true formal combat training whatsoever, so he wouldn't be likely to think to aim for the nose or forehead. Besides, punching on IC leaves him open to attack from the other, which is the biggest weakness in your scenario where he runs up and punches one.
The fact that there are two of them and that they are a team enables them to be more situationally aware than a single fighter alone, if the other spots Olimar coming in, he/she will alert the other of the impending threat, allowing them to react or they could end up noticing Olimar themselves and react upon that. The Buddy System works wonders in a fight.
Also, we gave Mario a plunger at one point, did we not? That is an example of something the character is shown to not have on their person canonically speaking. Therefore the ICs can have climbing equipment, which would be required to scale mountains of any kind anyhow. Besides, even real life ice climbers have equipment suited for their craft, which is required in order to do it.
The Ice Climbers can and must have climber equipment. Period.
Also REL, you apparently cannot read between the lines of what I was getting at with the Sumo, so I will spell it out for you.
I was using the Sumo as an example of an obese person having toned, developed muscle, the kid I showed earlier whom had all those developed muscles is an example of a kid with good muscle tone or bulk. That therefore mean that the ICs can have that toned muscle from what they do. Ergo, the Ice Climbers can be physically strong as well as fat. Their hammers make them even more dangerous with this.
Rest is assumed, so the idea that they can be physically strong as would be required is plausible. No ifs, ands, or buts.
EDIT: Wanted to tell you what you are saying the ICs are in height.
A Growth Chart for Boys two to twenty years of age in regard to the ICs. If Popo is 5-7 years of age and Nana is the same size as he is, you are placing them at around 3.8 to 4.3 feet tall. Their average height between the two (age 6 or so) is 4.05 or four feet. You cannot prove whether they are 5, 6, or 7 years of age specificly. So you cannot determine their true height.
http://www.keepkidshealthy.com/growthcharts/boystwo.html
That means that the length of their arms in relation to their body are anywhere from 1.8 to 2 feet in length. Their average arm length is 1.9. In other words, at 6 years of age, they are at equal height and arm length as Olimar, the reach their hammers have gives them an advantage over Olimar in reach.
They can out reach Olimar, and because of this, once Olimar comes in for a punch, the IC he is attacking, if they notice him beforehand, can catch him in the head as soon as he is in range. Once he is knocked over, he is vulnerable to a whack to the stomach or groin area, as well as his helmet.
The Pikmin won't be able to help much since at least a couple to a few of them could be killed within that time frame. Making them less of an imposing threat that you, REL, make them out to be.
The Pikmen's height are now assumed to be anywhere from 2.5 to 3 feet in height. Their arm length of 1.2 to 1.4 feet in length. Too tall to reach the faces of the Climbers. This means that the Force they exert is around this
F = M*A, therefore F = 0.4 * 0.9, 1.0 or 1.1 m/s = 0.36, 0.40 or 0.44 N
N -> Lbs F = 0.1 lbs.
In other words, the Pikmen are no threat at all to the Ice Climbers due to lacking necessary force, even if they swung, the Pikmen would be too weak to do much of anything. This means they are an arbitrary factor and are fodder for the ICs.
Plus, Olimar has no true formal combat training whatsoever, so he wouldn't be likely to think to aim for the nose or forehead. Besides, punching on IC leaves him open to attack from the other, which is the biggest weakness in your scenario where he runs up and punches one.
The fact that there are two of them and that they are a team enables them to be more situationally aware than a single fighter alone, if the other spots Olimar coming in, he/she will alert the other of the impending threat, allowing them to react or they could end up noticing Olimar themselves and react upon that. The Buddy System works wonders in a fight.
Also, we gave Mario a plunger at one point, did we not? That is an example of something the character is shown to not have on their person canonically speaking. Therefore the ICs can have climbing equipment, which would be required to scale mountains of any kind anyhow. Besides, even real life ice climbers have equipment suited for their craft, which is required in order to do it.
The Ice Climbers can and must have climber equipment. Period.
Also REL, you apparently cannot read between the lines of what I was getting at with the Sumo, so I will spell it out for you.
I was using the Sumo as an example of an obese person having toned, developed muscle, the kid I showed earlier whom had all those developed muscles is an example of a kid with good muscle tone or bulk. That therefore mean that the ICs can have that toned muscle from what they do. Ergo, the Ice Climbers can be physically strong as well as fat. Their hammers make them even more dangerous with this.
Rest is assumed, so the idea that they can be physically strong as would be required is plausible. No ifs, ands, or buts.
EDIT: Wanted to tell you what you are saying the ICs are in height.
A Growth Chart for Boys two to twenty years of age in regard to the ICs. If Popo is 5-7 years of age and Nana is the same size as he is, you are placing them at around 3.8 to 4.3 feet tall. Their average height between the two (age 6 or so) is 4.05 or four feet. You cannot prove whether they are 5, 6, or 7 years of age specificly. So you cannot determine their true height.
http://www.keepkidshealthy.com/growthcharts/boystwo.html
That means that the length of their arms in relation to their body are anywhere from 1.8 to 2 feet in length. Their average arm length is 1.9. In other words, at 6 years of age, they are at equal height and arm length as Olimar, the reach their hammers have gives them an advantage over Olimar in reach.
They can out reach Olimar, and because of this, once Olimar comes in for a punch, the IC he is attacking, if they notice him beforehand, can catch him in the head as soon as he is in range. Once he is knocked over, he is vulnerable to a whack to the stomach or groin area, as well as his helmet.
The Pikmin won't be able to help much since at least a couple to a few of them could be killed within that time frame. Making them less of an imposing threat that you, REL, make them out to be.
The Pikmen's height are now assumed to be anywhere from 2.5 to 3 feet in height. Their arm length of 1.2 to 1.4 feet in length. Too tall to reach the faces of the Climbers. This means that the Force they exert is around this
F = M*A, therefore F = 0.4 * 0.9, 1.0 or 1.1 m/s = 0.36, 0.40 or 0.44 N
N -> Lbs F = 0.1 lbs.
In other words, the Pikmen are no threat at all to the Ice Climbers due to lacking necessary force, even if they swung, the Pikmen would be too weak to do much of anything. This means they are an arbitrary factor and are fodder for the ICs.
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lol'd
@Olimar having brass knuckles - http://images.wikia.com/ssb/images/c/ca/OlimarP.jpg
He'd have a better chance of ramming them with his helmet than getting a punch in with those arms.
REL38
Smash Lord
It doesn't take a genius to know where to punch a foe. Most people will go for the head. This is made even more obvious with the Climbers having their faces be the only open area.
Olimar lives in an established society. Established societies have violence. He'd know how to throw a punch.
If that isn't good enough, then observe 3 year olds who "fight". The child will aim for the other kids face.
Why?
Because it's a very vulnerable area and open area.
One more.
Throwing a punch is not difficult in the very least.
Any punch to a kids face will lead to them crying or falling down. They're made like that.
The IC's are outnumbered, 11-2.
Those aren't good odds.
A swing of the hammer is easily avoided. Start-up and cooldown lag from the mallet is enough for Olimar to wait, just outside of range, and close in when they've already swung. This gives opportunity for Olimar to command his Pikmn to swarm the IC's. In such a close proximity, they have no use of their mallets due to the Pikmin being on top of them. The Pikmin will gnash at the eyes of a climber which, in turn, will make the climber wail and panic out of desperation. This can very well lead to that climber falling over and dying.
This can very well take 5-7 Pikmin to accomplish.
If seperated into 5 on each, then Olimar can attack a climbers legs to get the job done quicker.
While the other climber is swarmed, the other will likely abandon the hammer and try to swipe the Pikmin off of the fellow climber. Olimar capatilizes and punches the climber in the face. Kids aren't made to take punches well. The climber will be on the ground and Olimar can proceed to
a. Punch the climber in the face, repeatively
b. Have the other Pikmin gnash at the climbers face. The other climber could very well be dead or bleeding to death which leaves the lone climber, on the ground, being swarmed by 10 Pikmin.
A plunger of all things?
I think it was only suggested, but never implemented into Mario's weapons.
He shouldn't have one anyways due to there being no evidence that he weilds a plunger.
Same applies to IC's. They only get what they've shown in-game.
Logic has no weight here. Canon is giving them only a wooden mallet to climb mountains. It may not make sense, but giving them equipment they never goes against canon.
In regards to the muscle, they wouldn't be achieving the results of either sumo or steroid boy.
Sumo's get to where they are due to a trainer. A child cannot accomplish the same results that a sumo does. IC's would lack the appropriate knowledge of the steps required to properly tone muscles like a sumo wrestler does.
That kid has the assistence of an adult who knew how to properly tone muscles in a safe manner that doesn't hinder the boy. The IC's lack the knowledge of how to properly train their muscles in a manner that doesn't hinder them, to achieve tone.
IC's lack the knowledge of how to train themselves to properly obtain muscle tone under their fat.
Olimar lives in an established society. Established societies have violence. He'd know how to throw a punch.
If that isn't good enough, then observe 3 year olds who "fight". The child will aim for the other kids face.
Why?
Because it's a very vulnerable area and open area.
One more.
Throwing a punch is not difficult in the very least.
Any punch to a kids face will lead to them crying or falling down. They're made like that.
The IC's are outnumbered, 11-2.
Those aren't good odds.
A swing of the hammer is easily avoided. Start-up and cooldown lag from the mallet is enough for Olimar to wait, just outside of range, and close in when they've already swung. This gives opportunity for Olimar to command his Pikmn to swarm the IC's. In such a close proximity, they have no use of their mallets due to the Pikmin being on top of them. The Pikmin will gnash at the eyes of a climber which, in turn, will make the climber wail and panic out of desperation. This can very well lead to that climber falling over and dying.
This can very well take 5-7 Pikmin to accomplish.
If seperated into 5 on each, then Olimar can attack a climbers legs to get the job done quicker.
While the other climber is swarmed, the other will likely abandon the hammer and try to swipe the Pikmin off of the fellow climber. Olimar capatilizes and punches the climber in the face. Kids aren't made to take punches well. The climber will be on the ground and Olimar can proceed to
a. Punch the climber in the face, repeatively
b. Have the other Pikmin gnash at the climbers face. The other climber could very well be dead or bleeding to death which leaves the lone climber, on the ground, being swarmed by 10 Pikmin.
A plunger of all things?
I think it was only suggested, but never implemented into Mario's weapons.
He shouldn't have one anyways due to there being no evidence that he weilds a plunger.
Same applies to IC's. They only get what they've shown in-game.
Logic has no weight here. Canon is giving them only a wooden mallet to climb mountains. It may not make sense, but giving them equipment they never goes against canon.
In regards to the muscle, they wouldn't be achieving the results of either sumo or steroid boy.
Sumo's get to where they are due to a trainer. A child cannot accomplish the same results that a sumo does. IC's would lack the appropriate knowledge of the steps required to properly tone muscles like a sumo wrestler does.
That kid has the assistence of an adult who knew how to properly tone muscles in a safe manner that doesn't hinder the boy. The IC's lack the knowledge of how to properly train their muscles in a manner that doesn't hinder them, to achieve tone.
IC's lack the knowledge of how to train themselves to properly obtain muscle tone under their fat.
1. Your statement was ICs are obese because they have wide faces. I just proved you wrong on that. If you want to get textbook,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obesity#Childhood_obesity
They exercise and at eggplant. How the hell do you become obese off of that? If they were so obese how would they climb mountains? Be glad I don't have ET's common sense quote anymore...
2.
What was that in regard to? I never said anything about a sumo but w/e. Have you ever been rock climbing before? I don't think you comprehend how much it takes to become good at it. These two do it very well, so they have to be in some sort of shape. When climbing at that altitude, great strength is needed to perform such feats. This is where rest comes in and become stronger and more fit. And if we go by your LOLogic, then kids that play sports at an early age will fail. Football players and hockey players would start these things in high school. If they climb mountains, chances are they would start young. Matterfact, http://www.climb7.com/
Take a look at the pics on there and tell me they have muscle degeration. I need ET's quote again...
3. Never been hit with brass knuckles before; IRob and run not fight. But I know what they can do and I ask you where in the world does he get brass knuckles from? I'm guessing he stuffs his mittens with hard material right? Oh, and his species looks feeble to me...so I don't but Oli becoming the next Mayweather. Besides, he wouldn't need Pikmin if he was so strong right? ET quote again...
4. Ok, so maybe he isn't human. But how about this? Oli can be a middle aged adult with hie species, but that doesn't make him stronger, smarter, or better than any human. Remember, he's smaller than a newborn baby in his game, so buffing his size can only do but so much. And again if Oli was so "super strong", he wouldn't have to fly off his planet every nite and need the Pikmin to help him fight enemies (that a regular kid would just kill with a shoe).
5. Wait. You want to give Oli brass knuckles and buff him but can't give the ICs gear? Another facepalm for the collection, and it deserves the ET quote. For that one, I'm just going to shout HYPOCRITE and call it a day.
6. I agree with this point. In a way, I was stating it towards everyone, but Oli seems to be your infatuation on this thread. Not that it's a bad thing, because I like Yoshi and Ivy, but don't let that blind people from facts. I only disagree with the fat kids thing, but hey that's what I'm addressing now.
7. I'm not buying anything from the tank happening. Just a question here however...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygI8qBdCkSA
I noticed Oli and Louie aren't talking to each other...I wonder why...and also look at how many Pikmin it took to beat a foe that was just about it's size...
I played Pikmin 1 and it didn't hold my attention very long so I'm asking for clarification. But if you cannot answer or support them, then... ET's quote...
8. Hardy har to you, desu.
9. They can pass as 10 yr olds and you don't know how old they are yourself. So, lets's use common sense...I think I'll have to sig ET's post...
False.
-The tone would come from climbing mountains. They have some fat but they are not obese. They are not sumos so quit comparing the two.
-Gnashed eyeballs would occur to the Pikmin before they occur to the ICs.
-In regards to strength, an adult ant stands no chance against a young anteater.
An adult beetle doesnt stand well against a young meerkat.
Adult trout somehow get killed by young bears.
Since Oli isn't human, you cannot compare strength of two different species and expect the adult to always be the victor.
-Like I said before, if there is a strong enough purpose, a creature will do what it takes. If the ICs have to eat, then they will climb mountans for their meal ticket. Just like Oli had to veer off in space to save his company from being bankrupt. Why do you think IRob? You have to eat right? You have to make money to pay bills right? You have needs as an organism and the ICs are no different. Quit with the kids shouldn't climb mountains thing.
- http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/83/why-do-******-people-stay-there
Please read this. Then imagine the youth of their kind.
SHeltered North American kids do become scared of things like that. But the ICs beat polar bears up. Do you really think a planimal is going to scare them? Hardly. That's like surviving a shark attack and expecting to be afraid of being bit by a stang ray. Stop this madness please...
How does his air go to him?
It can't go through his suit.
It MAY be attached to the metal right but it doesn't have any holes in it.
Explain how it goes into him.
And how his air (our carbon dioxide) goes out?
Through the antena? That would most likely leave it open to air.
Oh and
What can they hit with?
Oh and btw
AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
Beren Zaiga
Smash Ace
Veni Vidi Vici, REL.
REL38
Smash Lord
@Nova
This kid has a wide face, as do the IC's. What is drawn from this?
I'm not saying they're uber fat like this kid, but still obese.
(bolded so you guys don't jump to assumptions)
IC's climb mountains for food in general. They have the ability to wield their mallets to club baby seals and eat them. This is where they'll get most of their fat from. Not from veggies, but from seals. This means they no longer necessarily require to climb the entire mountain, but rather only stay at the low levels of the mountain to kill off seals for food. This adds much, much more reason than climbing the mountain for veggies. They remain at the bottom of the mountain which instigates them having significantly less muscle tone and more fat.
They won't be climbing mountains. They apparently eat seals. No human would climb a mountain to get veggies when there's meat at the base of the mountain.
Kids playing sports at an early age is entirely different.
1. They only do so for a few hours, at best.
2. The actions they perform aren't straining their bodies by too much.
Be sure to read all of the posts. I already explained to Payas that his gloves recieved an upgrade in Pikmin 2 which gave him a harder punch. Gauntlets were out of the question and were reduced to Olimar having a "form" of "brass knuckles" which can very well result in him recieving harder gloves.
"Oli becoming the next Mayweather"
lol
He's not super strong, but his normal punch is increased due to having a form of brass knuckles.
The relation of Olimar's age and strength isn't unknown. His punch was enough to actually hurt the creatures he's faced. From this, I draw that his punch isn't a pathetic punch, but one that actually has force behind it.
Olimar was able to take down these creatures by repeatively punching one. This alone shows that Olimar was able to take down a creature that was his size.
Olimar and Louie don't directly communicate with each other due to neither having headsets. But they communicate via the whistle so the other can follow. The Pikmin were taking on a foe that had girth which made it more difficult to easily take down. Mixed in with the fact that the enemy was shaking them off and they had to jump on to deal more damage. But this is rather irrelevent.
The IC's can very well pass off as 5-7 year old kids. Facial features and even their choice of colored parka indicates them being young.
Emperor Time's post?
I'm sorry, but last time I checked his post only held a small amount of value. When there is lack of in-game evidence, then certain things should be assumed. But there is enough in-game evidence in Ice Climber to draw some semblence of reason behind what the IC's do.
Come up with your own stuff and stop clinging on to what one person said. Using a quote as an example to support your arguement is one thing, but constantly repeating it does nothing to help your arguement other than add redundancy.
_______
Once again, Read all the posts.
Beren brought up sumo wrestling as an example of fat people having muscle tone to pull off strength which is true in sumo wrestling, but depends on a trainer who sets out what the individual should eat, how he should train and to what extents.
Pikmin posses hands that are small, but enough to claw at the IC's eyes. A simple hand swip from a climber wouldn't blind a Pikmin.
Olimar has the strength to take down a wild creature that's just as large as himself with his punches alone.
According to your logic, the IC's would do whatever it takes to get food. I agree with you here. So this eliminates the climbers requirement to scale large mountains as a whole. The IC's encounter seals at the base and low levels of mountains. So if they have food right at the bottom of the mountain, why bother with climbing to the top to get some veggies that won't fill you up?
According to this, the IC's lack muscle tone due to the fact that they will only be at the base and very low levels of the mountain because they already have a much better food source here than they would have at the top of the mountain.
Realistically, two children can't take down a polar bear with wooden mallets at their disposal. It's nigh impossible and will never occur. That is why they go after easier game which are seals.
@Holo
The air he breathes in and out would be transfered to the "metal" that's located at his neck. It can very well have a small series of tiny holes that are in charge of bringing in breathable air and channeling out the air he breathes.
This can be regulated via the two other knobs he has.
Even though the Pikmin have small hands, they can still serve the purpose of clawing at the IC's eyes. A needle looks like a seeminly harmless object, but it can still penetrate skin with ease.
@Beren
Orphans don't come out of thin air. Of course they would have had parents at one time. But canon supports them being out of the picture.
"Steriod Boy" was a joke name. Sarcasm can't be well interpreted over the internet :/
Once again, he had the assistence of a trainer who just so happened to be his father.
IC's have no trainer to properly develop toned muscles, but why would they need toned muscles to climb mountains when they've got food at the bottom of the mountain?
Killing a seal isn't too far-fetched for a child to achieve. Seals aren't that dangerous to humans and are rather easy to kill. A few slams to the head can kill it. It only requires enough force to lift the wooden mallets.
The only excersice their muscles are getting is made up of killing seals. They no longer need to climb mountains because their food (seals) are located at the base and low levels of the mountain. This means they can climb the low levels at their leisure and eat the much more dependable and easily obtainable food source that's at the base of the mountain. This eliminates necessity of muscle tone and only requires enough muscle to kill seals.
The IC's have more range, yes, but any swing from the hammer results in a predictable swing that has plenty of cooldown lag. That is when the Pikmin swarm them.
Pikmin only need to climb to the head of an IC which is only a foot. You're assuming an unknown variable in relation to the Pikmin strength. A swip from a Pikmin can very well equal the swip of a needle. Their claws are sharp enough to cling on to enemies in-game. This means that they have sharp claws to dig into the creatures hide to hand on. Translating this to the IC's means that they don't require a high level of strength when their claws are sharp enough to dig into flesh. A Pikmin can dig their claws into the IC's eyes and cause bleeding which will cause the IC's to go into a panic and wail.
Olimar's punch is resticted to a haymaker due to his helmet. This is why Olimar would focus on attacking the swarmed IC's legs to knock them down. This gives the Pikmin an easier time at gnashing at their faces.
Via the Spicy Spray, the Pikmin can receive an adrenaline rush at the start of the match which can be absorbed through their skin or flowers. This makes the Pikmin quicker and attack harder.
Don't expect me to post anything serious or anything close to a rebuttle for the next few hours. You guys are distracting me from college work that I need to finish before midnight. So go away or Ima find where you live
This kid has a wide face, as do the IC's. What is drawn from this?
I'm not saying they're uber fat like this kid, but still obese.
(bolded so you guys don't jump to assumptions)
IC's climb mountains for food in general. They have the ability to wield their mallets to club baby seals and eat them. This is where they'll get most of their fat from. Not from veggies, but from seals. This means they no longer necessarily require to climb the entire mountain, but rather only stay at the low levels of the mountain to kill off seals for food. This adds much, much more reason than climbing the mountain for veggies. They remain at the bottom of the mountain which instigates them having significantly less muscle tone and more fat.
They won't be climbing mountains. They apparently eat seals. No human would climb a mountain to get veggies when there's meat at the base of the mountain.
Kids playing sports at an early age is entirely different.
1. They only do so for a few hours, at best.
2. The actions they perform aren't straining their bodies by too much.
Be sure to read all of the posts. I already explained to Payas that his gloves recieved an upgrade in Pikmin 2 which gave him a harder punch. Gauntlets were out of the question and were reduced to Olimar having a "form" of "brass knuckles" which can very well result in him recieving harder gloves.
"Oli becoming the next Mayweather"
lol
He's not super strong, but his normal punch is increased due to having a form of brass knuckles.
The relation of Olimar's age and strength isn't unknown. His punch was enough to actually hurt the creatures he's faced. From this, I draw that his punch isn't a pathetic punch, but one that actually has force behind it.
Olimar was able to take down these creatures by repeatively punching one. This alone shows that Olimar was able to take down a creature that was his size.
Olimar and Louie don't directly communicate with each other due to neither having headsets. But they communicate via the whistle so the other can follow. The Pikmin were taking on a foe that had girth which made it more difficult to easily take down. Mixed in with the fact that the enemy was shaking them off and they had to jump on to deal more damage. But this is rather irrelevent.
The IC's can very well pass off as 5-7 year old kids. Facial features and even their choice of colored parka indicates them being young.
Emperor Time's post?
I'm sorry, but last time I checked his post only held a small amount of value. When there is lack of in-game evidence, then certain things should be assumed. But there is enough in-game evidence in Ice Climber to draw some semblence of reason behind what the IC's do.
Come up with your own stuff and stop clinging on to what one person said. Using a quote as an example to support your arguement is one thing, but constantly repeating it does nothing to help your arguement other than add redundancy.
_______
Once again, Read all the posts.
Beren brought up sumo wrestling as an example of fat people having muscle tone to pull off strength which is true in sumo wrestling, but depends on a trainer who sets out what the individual should eat, how he should train and to what extents.
Pikmin posses hands that are small, but enough to claw at the IC's eyes. A simple hand swip from a climber wouldn't blind a Pikmin.
Olimar has the strength to take down a wild creature that's just as large as himself with his punches alone.
According to your logic, the IC's would do whatever it takes to get food. I agree with you here. So this eliminates the climbers requirement to scale large mountains as a whole. The IC's encounter seals at the base and low levels of mountains. So if they have food right at the bottom of the mountain, why bother with climbing to the top to get some veggies that won't fill you up?
According to this, the IC's lack muscle tone due to the fact that they will only be at the base and very low levels of the mountain because they already have a much better food source here than they would have at the top of the mountain.
Realistically, two children can't take down a polar bear with wooden mallets at their disposal. It's nigh impossible and will never occur. That is why they go after easier game which are seals.
@Holo
The air he breathes in and out would be transfered to the "metal" that's located at his neck. It can very well have a small series of tiny holes that are in charge of bringing in breathable air and channeling out the air he breathes.
This can be regulated via the two other knobs he has.
Even though the Pikmin have small hands, they can still serve the purpose of clawing at the IC's eyes. A needle looks like a seeminly harmless object, but it can still penetrate skin with ease.
@Beren
Orphans don't come out of thin air. Of course they would have had parents at one time. But canon supports them being out of the picture.
"Steriod Boy" was a joke name. Sarcasm can't be well interpreted over the internet :/
Once again, he had the assistence of a trainer who just so happened to be his father.
IC's have no trainer to properly develop toned muscles, but why would they need toned muscles to climb mountains when they've got food at the bottom of the mountain?
Killing a seal isn't too far-fetched for a child to achieve. Seals aren't that dangerous to humans and are rather easy to kill. A few slams to the head can kill it. It only requires enough force to lift the wooden mallets.
The only excersice their muscles are getting is made up of killing seals. They no longer need to climb mountains because their food (seals) are located at the base and low levels of the mountain. This means they can climb the low levels at their leisure and eat the much more dependable and easily obtainable food source that's at the base of the mountain. This eliminates necessity of muscle tone and only requires enough muscle to kill seals.
The IC's have more range, yes, but any swing from the hammer results in a predictable swing that has plenty of cooldown lag. That is when the Pikmin swarm them.
Pikmin only need to climb to the head of an IC which is only a foot. You're assuming an unknown variable in relation to the Pikmin strength. A swip from a Pikmin can very well equal the swip of a needle. Their claws are sharp enough to cling on to enemies in-game. This means that they have sharp claws to dig into the creatures hide to hand on. Translating this to the IC's means that they don't require a high level of strength when their claws are sharp enough to dig into flesh. A Pikmin can dig their claws into the IC's eyes and cause bleeding which will cause the IC's to go into a panic and wail.
Olimar's punch is resticted to a haymaker due to his helmet. This is why Olimar would focus on attacking the swarmed IC's legs to knock them down. This gives the Pikmin an easier time at gnashing at their faces.
Via the Spicy Spray, the Pikmin can receive an adrenaline rush at the start of the match which can be absorbed through their skin or flowers. This makes the Pikmin quicker and attack harder.
Don't expect me to post anything serious or anything close to a rebuttle for the next few hours. You guys are distracting me from college work that I need to finish before midnight. So go away or Ima find where you live
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obesity@Nova
This kid has a wide face, as do the IC's. What is drawn from this?
I'm not saying they're uber fat like this kid, but still obese.
(bolded so you guys don't jump to assumptions)
Emperor Time
Smash Lord
Holy freaking walls of text. This will never end.
There goes, my TDB weekend :/
Why u do dis? Why you do dis?
There goes, my TDB weekend :/
Why u do dis? Why you do dis?
How does the air get to him?
Uhh...
What are pikmin made out of? Skin?
That's like slapping someone with skin. It's going to hurt, but it's not going to kill. Why would they go for the eyes? Pikmin are stupid creatures. Good in groups (well in game anyway lol), but they arn't really smart enough to do anything without Olimar. And how will Olimar tell them to go for the eyes?
Uhh REL at least in Pikmin 1 his punches were terrible and it required many to do anything.
Altho I heard it was easier to beat this one boss with punches not pikmin (but the pikmin fight you so
)
JOE!
Smash Hero
They can be fat and still fit, as long as they arent morbidly obese.
Hell, im technically a bit overweight for my size, and can fireman's carry my buddy, who weighs about 1.75x as much as me and slam him. In fact, he's a better example as a heavyweight wrestler who is able to move around and do athletic activities.
his gloves are metal, and he isnt superman here, we are just saying that seeing as he is an adult male, he can hit decently with a good punch.
He needs his pikmin to survive on the planet in order to manipulate the environment, carry ship parts, and make Myamoto more money.
See above.
Oli's gloves are allready metal. We are equating them to brass knux, not giving him something new.
Uhhhhhh....imma let you re-read this and figure out why it makes no sense to the argument.
er, yeah. They dont know what the heck it is. For example, you spend your life in the jungle, and kill leopoards. You move to the forest and encounter a bear. I doubt you wont get scared just because you've handled one thing.
Group mentality always has, and always will be, things are better in numbers. like ants, even if they're dumb they can form groups (like the pikmin).
thing is, can they effectively take advantage of this? not really.
why? pikmin will run straight into battle, groups work together to formulate a plan, even if olimar can command these pikmin he's only been shown to do basic things (attack, move, ect.) and pikmin will just run straight into battle which is clashing with the group mentality.
The group of pikmin isn't an effective group.
Beren Zaiga
Smash Ace
To explore the territory they are in, what do you think they came to the mountain to do? You assume they only went there for food, being Ice Cllimbers (which by definition is "Someone who does the act of ice climbing") they originally came to climb the ice and snow, they need only get enough meat and blubber to make a supply for themselves, which would be preserved by the freezing weather conditions, as such, they would soon have little reason to stay at the bottom.
Next >__>
Contradictory statement in bold.
Horribly wrong, what the hell is wrong with you? YOU CONTRADICTED YOURSELF! ARE YOU INSANE?!/joke
That statement right there means they are exerting themselves for more than killing seals, and killing seals take more to kill with a wooden mallet than a mallet with a metal head. It requires more to kill with a mallet made from a lighter material than metal. They exert themselves, they require an amount of force to kill the seals, which requires exertion, and they explore the higher levels of mountain at their leisure. Ergo, they need muscle tone, and through these practice, would attain it.
Next. >__>
The ICs can just rip them off by then antennae, or kill them by ripping their antennae off entirely. Also, the fact they can kill seals, something typically bigger than a Pikmin, means that the hammers can kill the Pikmin with a single swing by crushing them. The Pikmin are fodder, deal with it. That variable I gave means that they barely exert any amount of force at all, just 0.1 lbs , that is beyond weak. The Pikmin are not smart enough to dodge hammers, so they die easily.
NOW WHO IS THROWING IN UNKNOWN VARIABLES?!
You act as if they will never respond to Olimar, if Olimar takes one down, the other is bound to notice, then take a swipe at him. If Olimar is confronted by one of them, especially after taking one down, he is NOT going to leave the fight without taking heavy hits. Then once the other gets up, Olimar is doomed.
You are relying too much on the Pikmin being a distraction, whether or not they are kept distracted is dependant on how many of the 10 Pikmin are killed. The ICs can kill them with ease, so it is not likely Olimar will get much of a window.
That takes time to kick in, in which time the ICs can plow through the Pikmin then outnumber Olimar 2 to 1.
Failed.
@ REL and JOE!
I'll respond to you two tomorrow. This is making me rather belligerent so I'll respond tomorrow when I can discuss this with a clear head.
But, REL, the ET thing was made to be redundant; look at my sig.
And JOE!, shame on you for responding in my color.
I'll respond to you two tomorrow. This is making me rather belligerent so I'll respond tomorrow when I can discuss this with a clear head.
But, REL, the ET thing was made to be redundant; look at my sig.
And JOE!, shame on you for responding in my color.
REL38
Smash Lord
@Sam
Fat kids have wider faces.
@Holo
Air goes out through one set of tiny holes.
Pikmin are made of something. Their durability has been shown to resist stabs, small explosions and giant swips from enemies. The Pikmin have been shown to survive the swiping of a large crustaceon. What's suggested from this is that their skin is made out of a "bark" like substance that's very resistant to attack.
Pikmin are smart enough to not even bother attacking enemies it knows it can't defeat.
The Breadbug is an amored foe that scavenges for food. No matter what you do, Pikmin will not swarm this enemy. They know enough to not attack because they can't even climb on to it. It's hide is too thick for the Pikmin to climb on top of.
Pikmin are intelligent enough to attack the obvious weak spot on the back of the Hermit Crawmad. Pikmin know enough to attack the most distinct part of the body that's different from the rest of the body.
Pikmin would see that the most distinct part of the IC's body are their faces. They stick out the most. They would go for that area which would result in their eyes being gnashed along with facial tissue.
In regards to Olimar's punch, yes, it is terrible in Pikmin. It has next to no real use and limited to one punch per second. But in Pikmin 2, his punch is about the same until he recieves the upgrade which makes his punch waaaaay more useful in taking out enemies. He dishes out 3 at a time. His punches are enough to take down a lot of enemies in the game.
@Beren
*listens to Pikmin music while writing *
The IC's only go the mountain to obtain food. They club baby seals and reach the top to obtain, guess what, more food. The fact that the soul purpose of the game is to obtain veggies, it can be drawn upon that their goal is to obtain food.
Food that is easily obtainable at the base of the mountain.
It wouldn't be a difficult task to kill an animal with limited mobility. A seal isn't difficult to kill.
The sheer amount of food it offers the IC's is enough to keep them from climbing every mountain. One seal can potentially last them a full day, if not longer. That leaves them with only having to travel to different mountains every once and a while. Simply whacking a seal with a hammer every now and then doesn't mean they have toned muscles. It means they have enough muscles to properly lift and kill their food. This means they stay at the bottom of the mountain to get their food with little to no reason to risk their lives for vegetables, of all things.
Ripping off their flower stems isn't easy.
The Swooping Snitchbug grabs Pikmin and throws them into the ground.
You hold a human up, dangling by their hair/head, and they wouldn't be able to take the pain.
Hold a cat up by their tail and they'll shriek.
Pikmin are able to withstand this.
The Snitchbug has enough force that it slings the Pikmin by their stems and drives them under the ground, with their stem still intact. That shows that their stems are able to recieve massive strain and still remain intact. Increase of their size will make it much more durable.
An IC trying to pull one their stems off won't be happening.
Pikmin may not be dying from a swing. A swing may only disorient one, but it'll be back up and run toward the foe. In relation to their size in-game, they've taken much stronger blows than a mallet swing from a kid.
Pikmin won't need to actively dodge. Olimar will bait them by getting in close and charging his group after the cooldown from the mallet's swing.
Your "equation" is souly based off of visible variables and ends up as more of an "uncomplete" equation.
It doesn't take into account the Pikmin's strength, how fast their swipes actually are and the overall mass (unknown weight) of the Pikmin is guessed.
It isn't a complete equation that displays the true force behind a Pikmin's swipe. Merely an estimate, at best.
What I wonder is how you even got the mass and acceleration in your equation :/
You're understimating the strength of the Pikmin and the nature of children.
Kids are alright as long as they're winning. As long as the IC's think they're fending the attacker off, then in their minds, they're Golden Girls.
But the moment they're attacked, they'll panic.
"Oh Noes! We're bein attack'd! This wasn't part of the plan!"
They don't kill Polar Bears. Kids can't accomplish that. They'd avoid Polar Bears like the plague
(bear with a set of shades = bad news)
They only take down rather defenseless seals that can't really fight back.
They've never had the experience of being attacked. Kids wail and panic if attacked by a dog. Being physically harmed puts them into a state of shock and panic.
When the Pikmin attack, the IC's will instinctively panic.
This throws all options they had out of the window.
Pikmin will draw blood which causes matters to worsen for the IC's as they realize their blood is spilled. From this, a state of shock may insue. This can heighten due to their obesity.
The sudden rush of pumping blood in the face off is bad enough, but actually being attacked will screw with their minds and body. This leads to their death because they simply lack combat experience and are still children.
The moment the Pikmin get in close is where the IC's lose.
An opponent running straight at you?
Run?
That gives the Pikmin time to react to the adrenaline faster. It'll flow through them faster.
Thank You and Good Night.
I'll resume tomorrow with this :3
Fat kids have wider faces.
@Holo
Air goes out through one set of tiny holes.
Pikmin are made of something. Their durability has been shown to resist stabs, small explosions and giant swips from enemies. The Pikmin have been shown to survive the swiping of a large crustaceon. What's suggested from this is that their skin is made out of a "bark" like substance that's very resistant to attack.
waits to see how much flak I'll for this one :/
Pikmin are smart enough to not even bother attacking enemies it knows it can't defeat.
The Breadbug is an amored foe that scavenges for food. No matter what you do, Pikmin will not swarm this enemy. They know enough to not attack because they can't even climb on to it. It's hide is too thick for the Pikmin to climb on top of.
Pikmin are intelligent enough to attack the obvious weak spot on the back of the Hermit Crawmad. Pikmin know enough to attack the most distinct part of the body that's different from the rest of the body.
Pikmin would see that the most distinct part of the IC's body are their faces. They stick out the most. They would go for that area which would result in their eyes being gnashed along with facial tissue.
In regards to Olimar's punch, yes, it is terrible in Pikmin. It has next to no real use and limited to one punch per second. But in Pikmin 2, his punch is about the same until he recieves the upgrade which makes his punch waaaaay more useful in taking out enemies. He dishes out 3 at a time. His punches are enough to take down a lot of enemies in the game.
@Beren
*listens to Pikmin music while writing
*The IC's only go the mountain to obtain food. They club baby seals and reach the top to obtain, guess what, more food. The fact that the soul purpose of the game is to obtain veggies, it can be drawn upon that their goal is to obtain food.
Food that is easily obtainable at the base of the mountain.
It wouldn't be a difficult task to kill an animal with limited mobility. A seal isn't difficult to kill.
The sheer amount of food it offers the IC's is enough to keep them from climbing every mountain. One seal can potentially last them a full day, if not longer. That leaves them with only having to travel to different mountains every once and a while. Simply whacking a seal with a hammer every now and then doesn't mean they have toned muscles. It means they have enough muscles to properly lift and kill their food. This means they stay at the bottom of the mountain to get their food with little to no reason to risk their lives for vegetables, of all things.
Ripping off their flower stems isn't easy.
The Swooping Snitchbug grabs Pikmin and throws them into the ground.
You hold a human up, dangling by their hair/head, and they wouldn't be able to take the pain.
Hold a cat up by their tail and they'll shriek.
Pikmin are able to withstand this.
The Snitchbug has enough force that it slings the Pikmin by their stems and drives them under the ground, with their stem still intact. That shows that their stems are able to recieve massive strain and still remain intact. Increase of their size will make it much more durable.
An IC trying to pull one their stems off won't be happening.
Pikmin may not be dying from a swing. A swing may only disorient one, but it'll be back up and run toward the foe. In relation to their size in-game, they've taken much stronger blows than a mallet swing from a kid.
Pikmin won't need to actively dodge. Olimar will bait them by getting in close and charging his group after the cooldown from the mallet's swing.
Your "equation" is souly based off of visible variables and ends up as more of an "uncomplete" equation.
It doesn't take into account the Pikmin's strength, how fast their swipes actually are and the overall mass (unknown weight) of the Pikmin is guessed.
It isn't a complete equation that displays the true force behind a Pikmin's swipe. Merely an estimate, at best.
What I wonder is how you even got the mass and acceleration in your equation :/
You're understimating the strength of the Pikmin and the nature of children.
Kids are alright as long as they're winning. As long as the IC's think they're fending the attacker off, then in their minds, they're Golden Girls.
But the moment they're attacked, they'll panic.
"Oh Noes! We're bein attack'd! This wasn't part of the plan!"
They don't kill Polar Bears. Kids can't accomplish that. They'd avoid Polar Bears like the plague
(bear with a set of shades = bad news)
They only take down rather defenseless seals that can't really fight back.
They've never had the experience of being attacked. Kids wail and panic if attacked by a dog. Being physically harmed puts them into a state of shock and panic.
When the Pikmin attack, the IC's will instinctively panic.
This throws all options they had out of the window.
Pikmin will draw blood which causes matters to worsen for the IC's as they realize their blood is spilled. From this, a state of shock may insue. This can heighten due to their obesity.
The sudden rush of pumping blood in the face off is bad enough, but actually being attacked will screw with their minds and body. This leads to their death because they simply lack combat experience and are still children.
The moment the Pikmin get in close is where the IC's lose.
An opponent running straight at you?
Run?
That gives the Pikmin time to react to the adrenaline faster. It'll flow through them faster.
Thank You and Good Night.
I'll resume tomorrow with this :3
Almost funny enough to sig . . . . . almost
Diddy Kong
Smash Obsessed
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2004
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- 25,970
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- SW-1597-979602774
If the Ice Climbers can use their mallets then why the hell aren't they winning? Two hammers against a little guy who will desperatly try to punch to defend himself. <_< Dunno who'd win really...
Beren Zaiga
Smash Ace
You are trying to take away a characteristic the Ice Climbers in order to suit your own needs, and it is failing, horribly.
The Ice Climbers climb mountains and ice for a living, that is the trade they have learned to do. When they run out of food at the bottom of the base, what are they going to do if they don't know the area, HMM? What then?
They will need to move to another part of the mountain, which if seals or other kinds of game exist higher up, they will need to venture up there. Ergo, climbing the mountain to know their terrain is vital. If they do not know the area, which they would do by exploring the base as well as farther up the mountain, they could not survive.
Are you kidding? The Pikmin are smaller than them, they are not going to panic at things that are smaller than them. Also, you are underestimating them for the fact they could kick or stomp the little plant animals to death. They can kick, stomp, and smash the Pikmin, whom has the better potential killing power? The Ice Climbers.
You also are under estimating how often they would need to kill baby seals for food, a baby is not as big as an adult seal. They are probably killing Harp Seals due to the climate they would be in.
That is probably only good for one days worth of food, they would have to kill one baby seal everyday in order to keep the supply of food coming. Being 4 feet, they would require more than one swing to kill, thus more exertion, thus more potential to grow toned muscle. Ergo, the Ice Climbers are required more than simply one swing to kill it. Probably several to crush the baby seal's skull.
A wooden mallet does not do as much damage as one with a metal head, ergo it would require more than one hard hit from a wooden mallet to kill the baby seal. Stop acting as if the animal's skull is fragile as something like say...glass?
[/I]
The Pikmin, if they are animals, would have a skeletal system, and because of this, being taller and stronger than the Pikmin, the Ice Climbers can kill them easily. Crush the ribcage with their feet, smash the head with the mallet, smash the ribcage with the mallet from a direct blow, or knock them over then crush their ribcage by stomping it.
Dead Pikmin all around, Olimar is doomed.
Also, about the Pikmin.
http://www.videogamesblogger.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/pikmin-2-wallpaper-big.jpg
The Pikmin's head shape suggests they do not carry a large braincase, or a large brain for that matter. In order to command them, Olimar would be required to give them a verbal command, just blowing a whistle and pointing will do nothing for Olimar, they won't know whether or not he is asking to obtain food, attack, or anything without a verbal command. Just blowing a whistle does nothing for him.
The Pikmin do not have the brain capacity or thought processes to understand or decrypt human or humanoid speech. Period. Also, have Olimar flash a light from his suit will do nothing for him either, as it will only attract the Pikmin to him. Saying that the Pikmin are capable of having the brain capacity and thought processes to decrypt sound frequencies is also ludicrous. Something that requires a leader in order to survive isn't smart enough for that. The Ligth cannot command them either, as that would in fact go against the game series itself.
Ergo, Olimar cannot command his Pikmin, whom are not an effective fighting force anyhow, and even with that steroid spray, you overestimate them in the fact that they are still not smart enough to dodge hammer swings, kicks, and stomps to their ribcage.
If anything, the Pikmin would be scared of THEM, and run away, since they are animals, and what is the first response of an small animal to something of a different species that is bigger than them?
They run away.
Olimar is doomed. Face it. He is done.
GG, The Ice Climbers win due to superior strength, superior numbers, and because they have an actual weapon to aid them. Close in attacks from Olimar will result in him getting attacked and beaten to death by the Ice Climbers.
The Ice Climbers climb mountains and ice for a living, that is the trade they have learned to do. When they run out of food at the bottom of the base, what are they going to do if they don't know the area, HMM? What then?
They will need to move to another part of the mountain, which if seals or other kinds of game exist higher up, they will need to venture up there. Ergo, climbing the mountain to know their terrain is vital. If they do not know the area, which they would do by exploring the base as well as farther up the mountain, they could not survive.
Are you kidding? The Pikmin are smaller than them, they are not going to panic at things that are smaller than them. Also, you are underestimating them for the fact they could kick or stomp the little plant animals to death. They can kick, stomp, and smash the Pikmin, whom has the better potential killing power? The Ice Climbers.
You also are under estimating how often they would need to kill baby seals for food, a baby is not as big as an adult seal. They are probably killing Harp Seals due to the climate they would be in.
That is probably only good for one days worth of food, they would have to kill one baby seal everyday in order to keep the supply of food coming. Being 4 feet, they would require more than one swing to kill, thus more exertion, thus more potential to grow toned muscle. Ergo, the Ice Climbers are required more than simply one swing to kill it. Probably several to crush the baby seal's skull.
A wooden mallet does not do as much damage as one with a metal head, ergo it would require more than one hard hit from a wooden mallet to kill the baby seal. Stop acting as if the animal's skull is fragile as something like say...glass?
[/I]
The Pikmin, if they are animals, would have a skeletal system, and because of this, being taller and stronger than the Pikmin, the Ice Climbers can kill them easily. Crush the ribcage with their feet, smash the head with the mallet, smash the ribcage with the mallet from a direct blow, or knock them over then crush their ribcage by stomping it.
Dead Pikmin all around, Olimar is doomed.
Also, about the Pikmin.
http://www.videogamesblogger.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/pikmin-2-wallpaper-big.jpg
The Pikmin's head shape suggests they do not carry a large braincase, or a large brain for that matter. In order to command them, Olimar would be required to give them a verbal command, just blowing a whistle and pointing will do nothing for Olimar, they won't know whether or not he is asking to obtain food, attack, or anything without a verbal command. Just blowing a whistle does nothing for him.
The Pikmin do not have the brain capacity or thought processes to understand or decrypt human or humanoid speech. Period. Also, have Olimar flash a light from his suit will do nothing for him either, as it will only attract the Pikmin to him. Saying that the Pikmin are capable of having the brain capacity and thought processes to decrypt sound frequencies is also ludicrous. Something that requires a leader in order to survive isn't smart enough for that. The Ligth cannot command them either, as that would in fact go against the game series itself.
Ergo, Olimar cannot command his Pikmin, whom are not an effective fighting force anyhow, and even with that steroid spray, you overestimate them in the fact that they are still not smart enough to dodge hammer swings, kicks, and stomps to their ribcage.
If anything, the Pikmin would be scared of THEM, and run away, since they are animals, and what is the first response of an small animal to something of a different species that is bigger than them?
They run away.
Olimar is doomed. Face it. He is done.
GG, The Ice Climbers win due to superior strength, superior numbers, and because they have an actual weapon to aid them. Close in attacks from Olimar will result in him getting attacked and beaten to death by the Ice Climbers.
you're calling them (Ice climber's) obese.@Sam
Fat kids have wider faces.
I don't think you understand the definition of obese.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obesity
tocador
Smash Lord
These childs REL posted, are in fact obese(or very close to so).
Being obese dosent mean you need to have 100 kg with 10 years, but(ima guess te kids weight) waiting 60-70 kg and measuring 1,40-1,55 metters is what would allready be called obese.
The IMC(indice de massa corporal), the thing you use to see if you are overweight or not, uses the formula: Weight/Hight, and if the result is more than 30 you are obese.
If you want to calculate, put 55-65kg and 1.40-1.55m and most of the time you will get obesity and if not, very overweight(something arround 27-29).
Here is a link if you want to see if you are fat :D. http://como-emagrecer.com/calculo-de-imc.html
Being obese dosent mean you need to have 100 kg with 10 years, but(ima guess te kids weight) waiting 60-70 kg and measuring 1,40-1,55 metters is what would allready be called obese.
The IMC(indice de massa corporal), the thing you use to see if you are overweight or not, uses the formula: Weight/Hight, and if the result is more than 30 you are obese.
If you want to calculate, put 55-65kg and 1.40-1.55m and most of the time you will get obesity and if not, very overweight(something arround 27-29).
Here is a link if you want to see if you are fat :D. http://como-emagrecer.com/calculo-de-imc.html
REL is saying the IC's are obese.
oh btw in english it's BMI.
above 30 BMI and you're obese.
tocador
Smash Lord
Thanks for the name xP! But judging by their appearence, id say there are if not, close to obese, aka 27+ BMI.
Can obese children do this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pF6Gfa63TaA&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pF6Gfa63TaA&feature=related
tocador
Smash Lord
OK, im tired of this vague-info arguement.
Do we have the EXACT WEIGHT and HIGHT(or w/e its called) of the IC's? If not we cant judge them as obese. Beign overweight and obese(1) when in a BMI withing 28-31 its ALMOST the same thing, you cant say someone is obese JUST BY JUDGING SOMEONES FACE APPEARENCE.
Because everyone from 27.6 up allready have a more chubby face, and 27.6 is far from obese. So you cant really make IC's lose just by saying they are obese BASED ON A SLIGHTLY WIDDER FACE.
But i can give you this info, usually people that live in the poles, or extremely cold places, tend to be fatter because of sheer cold. Sure fursuits help, but even with this their body was along the times, "evolved" into automatically having more fat than normal, and when they eat, they tend to store 50%(or more) fat than a normal person would store, because hunting is so extreme.
So, i'd say ic's are automatically a bit fat because of this conditions, BUT, this is normal for them.
Do we have the EXACT WEIGHT and HIGHT(or w/e its called) of the IC's? If not we cant judge them as obese. Beign overweight and obese(1) when in a BMI withing 28-31 its ALMOST the same thing, you cant say someone is obese JUST BY JUDGING SOMEONES FACE APPEARENCE.
Because everyone from 27.6 up allready have a more chubby face, and 27.6 is far from obese. So you cant really make IC's lose just by saying they are obese BASED ON A SLIGHTLY WIDDER FACE.
But i can give you this info, usually people that live in the poles, or extremely cold places, tend to be fatter because of sheer cold. Sure fursuits help, but even with this their body was along the times, "evolved" into automatically having more fat than normal, and when they eat, they tend to store 50%(or more) fat than a normal person would store, because hunting is so extreme.
So, i'd say ic's are automatically a bit fat because of this conditions, BUT, this is normal for them.
REL38
Smash Lord
Ho ho.
Too bad I have a class right now so I can't write a full response XP
I'll give my response to this stuff in about an hour or so.
RL takes priority ya know.
But just to add something of worth, fat isn't too much of a factor for the IC's performance. There are other factors that play a more significant role here.
Too bad I have a class right now so I can't write a full response XP
I'll give my response to this stuff in about an hour or so.
RL takes priority ya know.
But just to add something of worth, fat isn't too much of a factor for the IC's performance. There are other factors that play a more significant role here.