Guide Taj's Character Match-Up Discussion

[KAOSTAR]

by all means experiment.

im sure we won't mine lol. as long as you put at least some thought into it then its worth listening to.

what is orthodox is usually what is effective so far. we all have our little crazy ****.

 

[A Future Pro]

Yeah, thats just a theory, that i've managed to hit at least once.

I got the idea from the future sight video, when Vman did that Shadowball Dsmash thing where he flew across the stage, against that crappy smasher.(Me lol)

 

[Shadow Huan]

i've done a reverse Shadowball grab-BThrow thing before. mad fun. =D

 

[A Future Pro]

Okay my crap idea above, i got home(Finally) and i worked it out. that doesn't work at all.

The shadowclaw would have to be turned into a dsmash or a fsmash, that works.

 

[Shadow Huan]

or a regrab to tack on more %, or even kill if they're damaged enough. It's a fun trick, but it doesn't have really practical uses, at least not at the moment. there's potential to it, I'm sure of that.

 

[DelxDoom]

The only true use I've thought of for Disable is if you're in the air comboing them, to follow it up after a weak Uair, and they're in the air right in front of you in hitstun, and if you want to knock them forward, I sometimes use disable.(I just want to follow that up by saying that that is just a theory, I haven't truly tested it to make sure it's actually going to work, but from what little I have tried it it does seem to work. Not sure if it actually is a reliable combo though, so if other people could test it out, that'd be great)

lol I was into disable a few years ago. you can literally disable them on ground -> disable for knockback -> disable in air for knockback but it's bad lol

you can also dtilt -> if they are in air, disable for knockback and it also hits them far, low damage, and you don't really get anything

D:

 

[Taj278]

Ok, Fox is still a problem. Does anyone have a solution for neutral DI at 0-4% up throw and Smash DI on up tilt/forward air? +1 internet cookie if there are any juggles that are guaranteed on a Smash DIing Fox.

 

[stingers]

you mean smash DI behind you? theorybros says they would have to tech afterwards so just chase it...though if they tech the way they DIed they might go too far.

 

[KAOSTAR]

Ok, Fox is still a problem. Does anyone have a solution for neutral DI at 0-4% up throw and Smash DI on up tilt/forward air? +1 internet cookie if there are any juggles that are guaranteed on a Smash DIing Fox.

which way are they sdi?

so you up throw

they don't di

then they sdi the fair or uair

 

[Taj278]

Correct. They SDI away from you and they always seem just out of range. Depending on where they are on the stage, tech chasing is still an option, but it can be problematic because of the distance or if they move off stage and recover normally. Depending on percentage, they may not even go into tumble after SDIing your forward air/tilt.

 

[stingers]

if you predict it you could djc fair and then dtilt I bet.

 

[Taj278]

Negative, they're already gone by the time you can actually do either of those things.

 

[stingers]

i forgot you couldn't djc the fair. hmm

alright, i think the only optiuon (though its pretty weak) is fair and retreating nair then.

 

[KAOSTAR]

did you try uair from the dj?

 

[unknown522]

taj, if you go to apex, we gotta do pichu vs M2 again.

And me + raynex vs you + axe (pichu + M2 vs M2 + pikachu)

 

[V3ctorMan]

Hey Taj, and Mewtwo forum, I actually took a break from Yoshi.. to record my Mewtwo... vs Axe's Fox....

I hate saying it, but I sorta miss Mewtwo... (I kinda forgot I even had a good one) *sigh* lately this whole Yoshi thing has been getting me a lil down, and I'm doing everything I can to make Yoshi something else... My drive will NEVER die to play yoshi, but I guess I'm starting to hit that frustration stage... but I know I'm a pull through... anyway, Here's something for a bit of entertainment...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPdByVO57VY

Just in case any of you Mewtwo players happened to miss my Mewtwo. <33

 

[KAOSTAR]

@taj-I see your problem with the no di from up throw.

I was playing against some lesser players and I had a harder time with that neutral di. ****! LOL

anything specific you been trying out thats different? I just mean out of all the **** m2 can do. gimmicks tricks anything lol?

@vman-yea cool match. still wave landing on that platform lol.

 

[Shadow Huan]

V-man you missed like 3 D-smash edguard chances! your M2 is still really good tho.

 

[painlord k11]

I used to use mewtwo and thought about maining him.

 

[Taj278]

Ok guys, coming back from Apex I ended up getting a decent amount of Sheik practice. I'll probaby reevaluate my original write up a little bit, but if anyone has any questions about the match-up, feel free to post em now. :D

 

[Shadow Huan]

lol okay. how are you supposed to win the MU aside from don't get grabbed or hit? lol

I dk, I'd say avoid FD it's dumb. no real questions. just keeping the thread alive hahaha

 

[Taj278]

FD works out really well in the match-up vs. Sheik. She can't needle camp platforms and you basically just have a really fun spacing "footsies" game with Sheik. You can slightly outrange her CC downtilt with your downtilt, your tech chase can build up a lot of damage, since your main goal is to force her offstage and influence her up B recovery so you can keep building as much damage as you can. FD helps deny the top platform so you can really focus on getting good grabs and reverse neutral airs to keep her offstage.

Whenever Sheik gets a grab, it is big damage, but you have to kind of treat your percentage like currency, just like in most other match-ups in order to read openings and opportunities. With good DI, taking slaps will keep you alive slightly longer than taking up airs, so you'll most likely live to about 130ish percent after getting slapped with modest stage position.

You're really just looking to space your approach against her aerials, prepare to shield grab her dash attack or away from her dashattack and grab attempts. It can be difficult at times, but once you get the Sheik's rhythm it can be really easy to throw her off with your quick WD tilts between aerials, using shadowballs to force shield/tilts/jabs to encroach the pocket and force Sheik to make decisions, and as long as you're prepared for an approach or a retreat, you can generally punish.

 

[Zone]

Man taj knows his mewtwo Zelda matchup lol just as I thought of something I read a little farther and he covers it. I know what mewtwo I'm not money matching

 

[MookieRah]

So what's new with Mewtwo these days? I doubt it but has there been any significant developments since the late 2006 era of smash? I'm sorta getting back in the mood for smash, and there might be a new smash scene developing near me.

 

[KAOSTAR]

we got flashy and jump off stage alot.

ppl respect us a little now

itd be tight if u came back

 

[Shadow Huan]

Mookie rah might be returning? Raaaaape...

 

[MookieRah]

Nah, if I came back nothing much would change. The reason why I ultimately retired before was because my entire crew quit playing. I tried hanging on for a while without them, but I started lagging behind in skill and never could catch up.

Even if this new scene develops near me, they will be all fresh guys. The only way I could make a come back in this game is if I moved to one of the cities in which there was a thriving high level scene. That's just how it goes.

 

[V3ctorMan]

MookieRah.. - come back! <3... we all need another Mewtwo player... please come back. =p

 

[Shadow Huan]

Yeah we need another mewtwo player! What region are you? The west coast has the east coast outnumbered lol

 

[KAOSTAR]

so the MU chart has this new 5 level system ranging from <<,<,=,>,>> and its also by stage. These are my thoughts but Im having a bit of trouble determining the mid tiers below ganon and above m2. Like I really dont feel too disadvantaged vs samus and IC, but they do in fact have the adv, but I just dont find them "difficult" per say. any suggestions?

Also I feel that the chart is pretty much the same on all the neutrals except on YS I think falco and ganon are decently more difficult making them << MUs for m2.

<<fox
<<falcon
<<puff
<<peach
<<sheik
<falco
<marth
<ganon
=samus
=IC
=mario
=doc
=luigi
=pikachu
=yl
=link
=M2
=yoshi
=zelda
=DK
=GW
=Roy
>ness
>kirby
>bowser
>pichu

 

[SDC]

I don't know about the rest of you guys, but Samus is an absolutely horrendous matchup. I think it's Mewtwo<<Samus, but that's just me. =/

 

[KAOSTAR]

yea I think samus lacks the tools to approach m2. she can out cc his entire game for the most part. but mid range patience works well.

be comfortable in ur shield. U can punish tilts and smashes on ur shield with wd oos into grab. call her approaches and sometimes u can hit her with ftilts, also when u start punishing the samus player they feel as if they are running out of options, they often become a bit more aggressive in which case u can start using dtilt a little more. Dtilt is also not a bad way to counter a tilt if u can space it right, its likely they wont CC.

With practice Missile spam is avoidable, and samus doesnt combo m2 very well and she doesnt combo into finishers unless she is using diar or bomb nair at high percent

samus dies MAD eZ off top. fair from dthrow is usable or WD into fair if u punish samus attacking ur shield. Body bag! lol.

also a little trick. when samus is bomb jumping. charge ur sb. and shoot it above samus. Every samus in the world is gonna try to bomb jump over it lmao=get *****.

samus just requires patients and u must know what to punish. IMO the hardest style samus for m2 is the hugs style samus. The mind games and unpredictable. Its hard to get a read on what they are doing. Robot samus is cake tho. but still slightly in samus favor just so there is no real confusion.

 

[SDC]

Thanks for the tips Kaos

On topic:

Falcon>>>> Mewtwo, lol.

 

[SDC]

Yes double post I know bad me

Really? Nobody has anything? I was hoping to get some advice on the falcon matchup, some new tips, new tricks that somebody has found out, something. Falcon is one of my worst matchups, I was hoping for some help lol.

Does anybody know anything useful here?

 

[V3ctorMan]

I know that Yoshi > Mewtwo..

that's all for now..



if noone replies to you SDC.. I got yo back ^^

 

[SDC]

I know that Yoshi > Mewtwo..

Lies

if noone replies to you SDC.. I got yo back ^^

Help me Vectorman Kenobi, you're my only hope. <33

 

[DelxDoom]

GRAB HIM
honestly it's kill or be killed for both characters, and falcon is so fast, you need to be unpredictable in general. Teleport is decent but can be punished if predicted, so
it sucks

I mean, you have to play reactive to the falcon. if he is aggressive you might be able to catch him in nairs
if he is more conservative, you can start attempting to use shadowballs
get dat grab, make it count
edgeguarding and grabbing and techchasing are all super key in this MU for your offense, but I'm sure your problem is defense, so lol, i mean
you have a few options, they all kinda suck and are punishable. my favorite is RANDOM USMASH, but it rarely works.
eh

roll left, roll right, spotdodge (nottttt recommended), sh nair, sh shadowball charge can catch people sometimes if you are facing away, CC grabs at low percent can at times work but a lot of things will push you away too much, wavedashing away from some of his stuff can work just like w/ any character but watch out for nair since that thing has massive range, teleport can be used like rolls but in the air

 

[황미영]

Don't you also wanna avoid getting grabbed? xD

Falcon can grab to knee on Mewtwo, right?

 

[Taj278]

Yes, Falcon can down throw knee M2 very easily.

I'm pretty sure my rematch with SS was recorded, you should look out for those pretty soon on how to play against Falcon. You can also see my set against GG7 if you want to see how to play against very safe and fundamental Falcons.

 

[SDC]

Yes, Falcon can down throw knee M2 very easily.

I'm pretty sure my rematch with SS was recorded, you should look out for those pretty soon on how to play against Falcon. You can also see my set against GG7 if you want to see how to play against very safe and fundamental Falcons.

Saw the set of you vs gg7, was pretty damn good. =)
Will the rematch with SS be up on the video thread? Plz?


But can't you DI away after the dthrow, and tech away, and just make it in time? It's close, but in my experience, I've done that, and I've avoided the knee. Or was my opponent just not timing it well enough?