Some rules I followed to get better, by LunInSpectra

[EdreesesPieces]

This is a great post. This is not being over analystical, great palyers just basically think through all this stuff real quick. The more experience you have, the quicker it is for you to think about your best possible reaction or approach.

 

[LunInSpectra]

I was thinking about making a thread based on mindsets. But the idea isn't completely ready yet. I know that many mindsets are based upon extremetized aspects/qualities/emotions. Like:

Very Patient
Very Defensive
Very Aggressive

Make them really:

Frustrated
Intimidated


Anybody think of anything else?

 

[Scamp]

Take what you want from this thread, you don't ever need to follow or listen to advice or suggestions.

Do what works best for you? Of course you should do that.

But I would advise to look closely and think about what Lunin is saying. There's no greater (and unnecessary) wall to have to overcome than un-learning bad habits.

 

[Pikaville]

This stuff makes sense but, the best way to play is by instinct and i think most will agree with me.You do think of what youll do before hand but its very fast,sub-conscious and based on experience(usually)This thread is interesting,ill have to think about this some more.

 

[Sensei]

Interesting read, even though I knew most of the things on here. But I do agree that expericence will get you better quicker than thinking about all of this stuff first. These thoughts and actions should come naturally overtime. Mindgames > Tech Skill

 

[SM3EsH]

hmm
i hope, for my enjoyment that is...it took you forever to make this, and everybody thinks negatory of it
but in all seriousness, i'll give you props just cause you decided to take YOUR time...i hope, to make this long priece of information to read.
but, i believe realistically, no...

 

[KILLA.FOR.CASH.]

this is awesome. you put some of my own thoughts into words & expanded on it... i gotta show my friends this.

 

[Scintillatedseed]

Very well written, I can see somebody's been inpsired by the 7 habits of highly effective people.

 

[Zoap]

Case Constructions

The amount of case constructions you have determines the ability you have to play against new players comfortably. You construct cases to mentally minimize the possible actions your opponent can take. Here’s an example:

Rey double-jumps as Jeff is standing there
Jeff knows that Rey can only:

1) Come down with an aerial
2) Firefox or illusion to another part of the stage
3) Waveland
4) Land
5) Airdodge

Jeff will now be a statistician and remember what Rey did when he double-jumped. (You don’t actually have to use a log or count…but if you can that will be amazing). Mostly at this point, you should remember the primary action Rey will take (coming down with an aerial), and the secondary action (wavelanding). You can then minimize it even More, because Rey will either Come down with an aerial or waveland. What move counters both of them? Possibly the raptor (Falcon’s forward+b).

Apply the best move for the situation or use it by chance/prediction. I minimized the actions to 2, which means the lowest chance you have to get him is 50% (assuming you do the right moves). It would just be a little hard, if Rey did an airdodge to avoid the raptor or knee, because he never did that at all in the match until then. That’s why you work on spontaneity.

See right here is where lunin is wrong because when rey jumps he will do lots of lasers like always

good guide rey

 

[LunInSpectra]

Very well written, I can see somebody's been inpsired by the 7 habits of highly effective people.

OH MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PROPS!

Yeah, I wrote this and not a lot of people appreciated cus they said they were too stupid to actually pick it up

ROFL

 

[v3x?]

You know i actually think this is pretty great - and rather than everyone calling it too much to take in i think they should actually go play 3 or 4 matches trying it... Just to see if it helps you

But i guess what you've effectivly done, is explain in words just how much Smash is becoming a game of chess - that main aspect of play, mindgames is the single most important thing in chess - and its taking over Smash as well... I imagine before people had any plans to take this game seriously, the player who could just pick up the game easier would win. Or whoever picked the character with the easier, more powerful moveset. (I am of course talking WAY before anyone could do anything advanced lol)

However over time people have come to hone their mind skills, and effectivly manipulate other people into doing what they want. Essentially, its almost cheating someone into their own death, or a way of mild hypnosis... no wait thats not right lol more just iliminating what they should do, i just making them see the easier option a lot clearer.

Much like chess. =/

 

[Wave⁂]

wooooowwww....that was...really good. must've taken a long time.

 

[Tinman]

It's all subconscious and instinct, to me.

 

[Rei]

Well done, Lunin.

Imma take my stab at the practicality debate, though, in saying this:

Reading, thinking in words, and thinking are three different creatures. To use this isn't to preach it in your head before battle, but to not get caught in the "melee haze." That fog over thinking when you're playing. It's a matter of paying attention. Most people run through a mental gauntlet of specific move combos that are almost preordained... and that's where the thinking part comes in. Aiming for your opponent with a f-smash instead of Shufflin a nair and wavedashing back to.. do something else flashy and gay.

A good 50% of this happens subconciously simply because of operant conditioning (Did I take my first college psych classes or what! Woooooo!). Pidegons pressing the red button for feed, kids over using Marth's F-smash. Pidgeons not pressing the green button because of the shock, kids not using the F-smash anymore because it gets Shield-grabbed. It just depends on how dense you are.. if you're the ********, emaciated pidgeon or the the well fed one.

Not to put words in his mouth, but as a means of clearification, I think Lunin isn't preaching you sit there and "Hmmm... Why?" during the match. That's inpractical. More so, to keep a light bulb, even if dimly lit, so that you're not another starving pidgeon.

 

[Sizzle]

Well done and very informative.

 

[Tempest0538]

Considering how rarely I play other people, I feel this will help jump-start my mental game at least a little bit. Pretty well done.

 

[D1]

Thats exactly how I think when I play smash or at least try to at all times...if I I'm playing at my best at least.

Good ish Lunin that was a great read!!!

 

[Jonkku]

good stuff.. helped me alot. my mindgames was like dd and then djc'ed bair but now i know how to react on (almost) everything my friends do. thank you.

 

[Gimpyfish62]

best topic ever, but mainly due to the best responses ever LOL

 

[Sora Keyblade Master]

Anyone whos came this far in their gameing career in smash bros, And they still need things like this to help their gameplay, They cant call themself professionals, The way you put this, sounds as if all professionals play alike. Which is obviously not the case, you can be a professional and not know how to wavedash or do L-Cancelling, That has nothing do with how good u are, Ive seen my best friend play against a so-called professional, who use all of the tatics from this site, And my friend Ko'ed em ease. But yet this site says all of the profesionals know how to wavedase ? clearly thats only a matter of opinon, Just as this topic.

 

[mathos]

Haha every professional knows how to wavedash or else they have no idea how to play this game competitively. There's no arguement there.

 

[NJzFinest]

good read

 

[Sora Keyblade Master]

Haha every professional knows how to wavedash or else they have no idea how to play this game competitively. There's no arguement there.

-.- If that helps you sleep at night

 

[darkatma]

Anyone whos came this far in their gameing career in smash bros, And they still need things like this to help their gameplay, They cant call themself professionals, The way you but this, sounds as if all professionals play alike. Which is obviously not the case, you can be a professional and not know how to wavedash or do L-Cancelling, That has nothing do with how good u are, Ive seen my best friend play against a so-called professional, who use all of the tatics from this site, And my friend Ko'ed em ease. But yet this site says all of the profesionals know how to wavedase ? clearly thats only a matter of oppion, Just as this topic.

lol sorry dude, if your best friend pwned a 'pro' with ease, then that guy isnt a pro. He may call himself one, but in actuality knowing advanced techs doesnt mean you know when to use them. Which leads to the point of this whole thread, telling us that pros know when and how to use the right moves. Btw, wavedashing and l-canceling do haveta do with how good you are. You will never become good enough with CF if you can't l-cancel, for ex.

edit: Mathos is right, all the pros KNOW how to l-cancel and wavedash, even if they don't use them. This is because tourney experience dictates that they will encounter those techniques vs other people, in ourder to be top, you must beat the top. and the top uses every advantage availabe. Look at Aniki. He is a pro link, he always l-cancels, but he 'never' wavedashes. He knows how to wavedash.

 

[DarkMaggot]

if you get to a point where you think your a pro and you cant get any better and too cocky to learn and take advice from others u'll get beaten all the time and shouldn't call yourself a pro

 

[Jeveras]

if you get to a point where you think your a pro and you cant get any better and too cocky to learn and take advice from others u'll get beaten all the time and shouldn't call yourself a pro

quoted. for. truth.

 

[Sora Keyblade Master]

lol sorry dude, if your best friend pwned a 'pro' with ease, then that guy isnt a pro. He may call himself one, but in actuality knowing advanced techs doesnt mean you know when to use them. Which leads to the point of this whole thread, telling us that pros know when and how to use the right moves. Btw, wavedashing and l-canceling do haveta do with how good you are. You will never become good enough with CF if you can't l-cancel, for ex.

edit: Mathos is right, all the pros KNOW how to l-cancel and wavedash, even if they don't use them. This is because tourney experience dictates that they will encounter those techniques vs other people, in ourder to be top, you must beat the top. and the top uses every advantage availabe. Look at Aniki. He is a pro link, he always l-cancels, but he 'never' wavedashes. He knows how to wavedash.

No thats just my point, They guy did know how to use them all very effectively, I mean obviously he wasa pro, it wasa tournament, and he ko'ed alot of other people, but since my friend ko'ed him with ease, that no longer makes him a pro ? Hmmmm... You stage a very legitiment point, But basicly what your all saying is, if a professional gets koed by someone who cant wavedash, there not a pro anymore ?

 

[Brookman]

this is interesting, my hair is itchy. dynamic huh?

 

[Jeveras]

No thats just my point, They guy did know how to use them all very effectively, I mean obviously he was pro it was tournament, and he ko'ed alot of other people, but since my friend ko'ed him with ease, that no longer makes him a pro ? Hmmmm... You stage a very legitiment point, But basicly what your all saying is, if you a professional gets koed by someone who cant wavedash, there not a pro anymore ?

ko'ing a lot of people doesnt make him a pro either. his opponents could have been extreme noobs.

 

[Sora Keyblade Master]

ko'ing a lot of people doesnt make him a pro either. his opponents could have been extreme noobs.

You can use all the johns you want, you still didnt answer the qusetion.

 

[ZoSo]

You can use all the johns you want, you still didnt answer the qusetion.

Your question implies that the player you're talking about was a pro, which he wasn't. He didn't cease to be a pro; he never was a pro in the first place. Being able to use advanced techs does not make you a pro.

 

[Sora Keyblade Master]

No, i said he knew how to use them, and very effectively.

Um... i thought thats what a professional was ? so ill ask a better qusetion. whats make you a professional, because i thought that, was the reason the thread was made.

 

[Jeveras]

You can us all the johns you want, you still didnt answer the qusetions.

johns? when was i johning at all? i simply stated the possibility that his opponents could have been noobs. what tournaments do you attend? if they are local tournaments, especially ones not listed on smashboards, chances are that there won't be many good players (or any at all). i want to see a video of you actually playing, show me how you beat a "pro" without advanced techniques. everbody knows they are required at higher levels of play. the reason for this is that you must use every technique to your advantage if you are to be the best, advanced techniques will open up a whole new world of options. you are telling us what you believe is "pro" and "effective", which doesnt mean much. how about giving us some proof? videos? unless you can provide proof, your talk means nothing.

 

[Sora Keyblade Master]

johns? when was i johning at all? i simply stated the possibility that his opponents could have been noobs. what tournaments do you attend? if they are local tournaments, especially ones not listed on smashboards, chances are that there won't be many good players (or any at all). i want to see a video of you actually playing, show me how you beat a "pro" without advanced techniques. everbody knows they are required at higher levels of play. the reason for this is that you must use every technique to your advantage if you are to be the best, advanced techniques will open up a whole new world of options. you are telling us what you believe is "pro" and "effective", which doesnt mean much. how about giving us some proof? videos? unless you can provide proof, your talk means nothing.

Thats the entire point, there could be thousands of possibilitys. So trying to pick out possibilitys are nothing but johns, you can do that with anyone. the same can be said about videos of people playing." oh he could have been fighting a noob " " it could have been staged" there all johns. you been at this site longer than i have, you of all people, should know a john when you hear one.

And No i dont have time to make screen names to try and make myself look good, I do that when i actually play. Between blanceing school work, and job hours, their just isnt enough time in the day. not mention makeing a whole another email adresss just to do so. And ive been to plenty of tournament and never lost a single one for that matter. More than what you can say. Have you been to any tournament ?
Ive been to 15 tournaments Statewide
Local Gamestop, Game crazy, Fx, Eb ect Tournaments held by people and so on.

I dont have any proof so whats the point of me saying it ?




And as far as makeing a video goes,
1. what is that suppose to prove ?
2. What am i? Suppose to Astound you are you something ?

 

[Brookman]

lol you don't know what a professional anything is apparently. ZoSo is synonomous with professional.

 

[Jeveras]

Thats the entire point, there could be thousands of possibilitys. So trying to pick out possibilitys are nothing but johns, you can do that with anyone. the same can be said about videos of people playing." oh he could have been fighting a noob " " it could have been staged" there all johns. you been at this site longer than i have, you of all people, should know a john when you hear one.

And No i dont have time to make screen names to try and make myself look good, I do that when i actually play. Between blanceing school work, and job hours, their just isnt enough time in the day. not mention makeing a whole another email adresss just to do so. And ive been to plenty of tournament and never lost a single one for that matter. More than what you can say. Have you been to any tournament ?
Ive been to 15 tournaments Statewide
Local Gamestop, Game crazy, Fx, Eb ect Tournaments held by people and so on.

I dont have any proof of so whats the point of me saying it ?




And as far as makeing a video goes,
1. what is that suppose to prove ?
2. What is am ? Suppose to Astound you are you something ?

ah, the local gamestore. go to a real tournament, one held by people on smashboards. there is a BIG difference in skill. please. you and your cocky attitude would get *****. do you really believe that the guy was a pro? especially since he got demolished by somebody who hasnt a clue of what advanced techniques are. with your little knowledge of advanced techniques, you base your "facts" on opinions. you are biased. does it really matter how many tournaments you've won? anybody can win a random tournament. if you have been to so many tournaments, how come nobody has heard of you? go prove yourself in a REAL tournament. please do not make automatic assumptions about advanced techniques if you really do not have any idea how to use them, or recognize how efficient they are when used.

 

[Sora Keyblade Master]

Who is Zoso ? Anyway I find what you all say very comical, since obviously everything you all say, is a matter of oppinion. Its not like it something that can be proven. Anyway when ever brawl does release. If its friendcode you all can,just add me, and see first hand.

 

[pirkid]

agreed karthik...
but thinking ahead isn't too bad either.
i just don't think that people sit there with some kind of a spreadsheet anayzing video or just watching video to get better *cough*lunin*cough*

it's all about the player style...
if you don't have your own style, then you do have to take these things into consideration because you don't have the experience behind the style... making the need for this,,,

i predict this thread will be locked >.>;;

EDIT: also, remember that alot of things can happen in 2 sec... you can doubleshine, then wavedash and get grabbed... that alot in 1 sec, if say falco is coming bac down from an u-smash at 60%, then you on;y have 1-2 sec to react.i doubt you are gonna think "well, he can do this.. but then again... blh blah...." they are gonna play it safe or take a big risk, and that depends on the stock and %

not locked yet

Trying to think too much can lose you the match, especially if your playing a beginner who acts on pure instinct.


And, if you are thinking these habits,
so is your opponent...
Gotta remember that.

 

[ZoSo]

No, i said he knew how to use them, and very effectively.

Um... i thought thats what a professional was ? so ill ask a better qusetion. whats make you a professional, because i thought that, was the reason the thread was made.

Well, you thought wrong. Admittedly, the definition of a "pro" is pretty vague, but I can guarantee you that there's more to it than being able to use advanced techs.

Jeveras is right. Beating local players that nobody has ever heard of in tournaments won't make you a respected figure in the community.

 

[NJzFinest]

And ive been to plenty of tournament and never lost a single one for that matter. More than what you can say. Have you been to any tournament ?
Ive been to 15 tournaments Statewide
Local Gamestop, Game crazy, Fx, Eb ect Tournaments held by people and so on.

I went to some local/gamestore tournaments in the past and won too ..... it just that everyone at them were noobs and my Mew2 ***** them these tournaments mean nothing.