Snake Q&A

[SamuraiPanda]

The metagame has been the same since Abit_Rusty's guide.... the only thing that has changed is a new use or two for certain things, how efficient we are, and random bits of data (how long c4/mines last, etc.)

His metagames basically been the same for 6-7+ months..... unless something game-breaking is found, nothings going to change.

His metagame is perfect.

You seem to be misunderstanding the concept of the Snake metagame. The metagame is not defined, or confined, by the ATs your character possesses. Rather, the metagame of a single character is defined by efficiency, strategies, and various other aspects. Claiming that Snake's metagame is stale/perfect or anything of the sort is completely and utterly incorrect. Snake is constantly evolving and changing at the highest levels of play, although the changes aren't just simple things that many people can catch.

 

[Panix]

Eh, I'm leaving snake boards. Im just going to watch from the background now.

 

[SuSa]

You seem to be misunderstanding the concept of the Snake metagame. The metagame is not defined, or confined, by the ATs your character possesses. Rather, the metagame of a single character is defined by efficiency, strategies, and various other aspects. Claiming that Snake's metagame is stale/perfect or anything of the sort is completely and utterly incorrect. Snake is constantly evolving and changing at the highest levels of play, although the changes aren't just simple things that many people can catch.

I stated it's "basically been the same" as no metagame is always the same, always.

The small changes haven't (and aren't) exactly "game breaking" otherwise they wouldn't be small-behind the scenes stuff that few, if anyone, notices.

No metagame is set in stone and there are multiple ways of playing a character, however there are only a few "efficient" ways for Snake that I can think of. There aren't countless efficient ways of playing him (I can think of way more for Sheik).

However me saying "perfect" was defiantly wrong, however you must remember such a term is purely opinion and shouldn't be taken as fact anyways. His metagame may be "perfect" to me, but horrible for someone else.

 

[UltimateRazer]

Snake boost grabbing is so hard with wiimote lol. I did it. Any help on pivot boost grab though?

I just need the input

 

[Zivilyn Bane]

Alright, i'll try to play peach for a while. Float is too good.

Edit: *Needs to make this Snake related* Grenades.

EDIT EDIT: Havokk, have you heard of a town called Porterville in California?

I'm from Porterville! Why the mention?

 

[Princz15]

Can some one help me on what to do on the ROB match up? I hate this match up with suck a freakin passion. I would sooooo rather face d3 despite he having the match even more than rob in his favor. I cant do **** against ROB i hate him with such a passion and i always end up losing to one

Help?

 

[napZzz]

lol, you said your only wiimote had broken.

me bought another one now boi >:|

 

[Tub]

Eh, I'm leaving snake boards. Im just going to watch from the background now.

then you can consider yourself fired from the Snake Testers.

I'll get to work by tomorrow.

*invite sent* please post your info in the Snake Testers thread.

Snake boost grabbing is so hard with wiimote lol. I did it. Any help on pivot boost grab though?

I just need the input

run right > c-stick down > left+Z
(oppisite when running left)

Can some one help me on what to do on the ROB match up? I hate this match up with suck a freakin passion. I would sooooo rather face d3 despite he having the match even more than rob in his favor. I cant do **** against ROB i hate him with such a passion and i always end up losing to one

Help?

go to the ROB boards, find the snake matchup area, it will show you exactly what a ROB does for most situations, then you'll have the upper hand. (I know it helped me a ton!)

 

[Ken Neth]

I already did the testing on the jab/powershielding stuff. Can I be a snake tester?

 

[Tub]

I already did the testing on the jab/powershielding stuff. Can I be a snake tester?

of course! just post your info in the Snake Testers thread...
*sending invite*

 

[theONEjanitor]

Can some one help me on what to do on the ROB match up? I hate this match up with suck a freakin passion. I would sooooo rather face d3 despite he having the match even more than rob in his favor. I cant do **** against ROB i hate him with such a passion and i always end up losing to one

Help?

don't try to camp Rob. stay in his face. Like seriously stay up in his grill the whole match...you can't grenade camp ROB. use SH dair because ROBs aboslutely love to spotdodge. do not ever initiate a ground attack on a rob. if you are standing next to a rob, shield or sh dair...almost every rob instantly spotdodge d-smashes just out of habit. shield a lot. Don't try to punish a nair, it has no landing lag, just block...see if your opponent likes to nair then block or nair then jab and react accordingly. jump and upb instantly when you get knocked off. rob is one of the best edgeguarders in the game. mortar slide works well against rob...space some fairs, rob is a huge hurtbox, f-tilt has stupid range on him, and so does boost grab.
almost all ROBs play the same, just figure out that playstyle and you'll have the upper hand on 90 percent of ROB players
mainly you have to stay in his face but be patient and reactive to ROB's predictable playstyle
i used to have trouble with rob, but the main thing I realized is that I can't play my normal nade camping game. i have to stay in his face.

 

[Ken Neth]

LOL, you shouldn't use dair that much. It is so punishable, and honestly, any good player is going to pick up on it after getting hit once or twice. I use ftilt a ton lot in this matchup. Just shield the dsmash and punish the lag with a ftilt.

Avoid getting hit off stage against ROB. He can give you a ton of damage from just a simple bthrow to reading your jump/dodges with a fair. ROB can also gimp snake pretty easily if you don't know how to avoid it.

His nair is also somewhat difficult to avoid due to it's lingering hit box and kills relatively well if you are recovering high. Expect a nair if the ROB is coming up after you. If you get hit near the ground though, it is extremely DIable. I have lived a fresh nair at 180%...

I can add more later if it's wanted.

 

[theONEjanitor]

it depends on the player.
lots of ROB players immediately spotdodge whenever you get anywhere near them...obviously if during the match they stop doing that then you should change your tactic...but if you can get a rob to stop spotdodging, then **** that's an accomplishment lol

but you can almost always tell when rob is going to spotdodge...and dair is snakes best "anti spotdodge" move so...but personally I just block, as you say. But If you can deal an extra 10-20 damage why not.

oh and where I said "fairs" i meant ftilts :-D

 

[IxxI]

I'm from Porterville! Why the mention?

OMFG. Porterville, California?
PORTERVILLE, CALIFORNIA.

Are you absolutely sure?
Because if your from there, there's a tourney in Hollywood video somewhere this week or next week...
And maybe I can play you sometime?

 

[xsephirot]

run right > c-stick down > left+Z
(oppisite when running left)

uhh, the Z (grab) for the wiimote is generally set at A+B which is often hard to do. I find it much easier just to shield grab even if running up to some1. Well unless you have the dpad left/right set to grab which I have mines set as jump since sometimes doing certain combos it is hard or awkward to hit the C button.

 

[HizoSturm]

can snake chain grab with his down throw?

 

[SuSa]

Only if you read your opponent and tech chase them....It's not a chaingrab because your opponent has options.

Roll Left
Roll Right
Stay Put
Get Up
Get up attack

If you can predict what they'll do, you can boost grab them (far-rollers), dash grab them (short-rollers) (if they roll away from you), shield grab (SOME) get up attacks, and get ups, you can ftilt them if they stay put (or utilt) and against a few (I believe) you can try to jab > grab.

 

[Darkshadow7827]

Can you be punished for sticking after a powershield? I usually don't have the reaction time to stick after a powershield, but it seems like there's some lag since Snake does a lil pose when he tags. Also, no one answered my question about his weird costumes i've seen in some vids (will not post the link up again, since it is a pointless question). Thanks.

 

[Black_Heretic]

that depends on the attack you powershielded, some moves have less lag than others and can possibly hit you during that animation

and its texture hacks

 

[jmon3y]

Hey all, first post!

I've mained Snake for about 1/2 a year now and I want to advance my snake game, but I am not sure how to do b-reversals and boost grabs. I've seen a few Ultimate Razer tourney vids and noticed that he b-reverses his grenade pulls and it changes his DI while getting back to the ground. Btw, Ultimate Razer, I love your playstyle, haha props. Can someone explain the controller input or put up a detailed how-to video of this?

Also, I tried doing the boost grab by using DACUS without the "up on joystick" portion, but I can't get it to work, not very consistently at least- it ends up in just a dash or normal dash grab...people have posted how it's slightly harder to time, but if you can mortar slide, it should be easy. I can mortar slide just fine, but I can't boost grab very well- any tips?

Thanks

 

[SuSa]

It doesn't change his DI, it changes his momentum.

DI is only read on the last frame of hitstun, after hitlag, after being hit by a move.

Boost Grabbing is a DACUS without the up on the joystick, and FASTER then performing a DACUS. It's pretty hard to do when first starting out.

If you can mortar slide, it's easier. Not easy.

To B-reverse tap B then hit the other direction (towards your characters
back). (This works with any B moves)

 

[IxxI]

Susa, can I still call you Havokk?
Your still Havokk in my heart. <3

Screw that guy in San Diego.

 

[misterpimp5757]

wat stages to ban/cp/strike for pit?

Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Yoshi's Island
Lylat Cruise

Counter Picks
Brinstar
Castle Siege
Delfino
Frigate Orpheon
Halberd
Jungle Japes
Norfair
Pictochat
Pokémon Stadium 1
Rainbow Cruise

using that list please....and the pit knows arrow looping too.

 

[-Ran]

wat stages to ban/cp/strike for pit?

Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Yoshi's Island
Lylat Cruise

Counter Picks
Brinstar
Castle Siege
Delfino
Frigate Orpheon
Halberd
Jungle Japes
Norfair
Pictochat
Pokémon Stadium 1
Rainbow Cruise

using that list please....and the pit knows arrow looping too.

Ban Japes or Norfair.

Starter wise, try to narrow it down to Battlefield or Lylat. Fd has too area overall.

 

[TwentyTwo]

Where you been Ran? On a break or something?

In any case it's good to have you back

 

[Ken Neth]

I would avoid Lylat vs pit. Pit can just ledge camp his up air. It goes through the stage and hits anything close. Get it down to BF or SV.

 

[napZzz]

I need stages to ban and take ness to please. Theres this local ness I play alot who's very good, and our matches seem to be dependent on stage. Although I dont get to face him much...but :S

 

[-Ran]

Where you been Ran? On a break or something?

In any case it's good to have you back

I had quit Smash. Sold all my stuff associated with Smash [Controllers, Wii, etc] and moved on with life. Long story short, I had a full emotional plate due to my girlfriend leaving me at start of December, finding out she was cheating on me for the entire time, and basically just using me as a vacation. I was pretty torn up about it, but I didn't want to show it. I acted as if it didn't hurt, and moved on with life. This caused me to severely overreact to a situation that developed during Final Smash V, when my car pool dissolved and no one wanted to leave their car pool to ride with me. So I drove the nine hours solo, and the whole way I felt betrayed. Someone claimed that I was **** talking people when I got there [I had been telling people why I drove alone, and that I wasn't pleased about having to do so... but I wasn't saying anyone sucked.], and from there further drama occurred...

I hadn't played Smash since Jan 12th, till about last week. Lol.

Ken Vs Pit, I recommend keeping a C4 on the edge whenever he starts pulling that. It'll limit him to only being able to use one side of the map, and thus make him extremely predictable.

Nappy We have a phenomenal Lucas player over here in Louisiana [Pierre]; though Ness and Lucas aren't the same by any means, I'd strongly recommend avoiding Smashville. The platform gives them too much utility. Vs Ness, I'd make sure to ban Pirate Ship, since it removes their gimpability if you feel that they'll take you there. The High ceiling is hurtful to Snake as well on that level. My view would be against Ness [and most characters] is to keep it to Neutrals. Snake seems to do the best on those .

 

[SuSa]

Susa, can I still call you Havokk?
Your still Havokk in my heart. <3

Screw that guy in San Diego.

You can, but know that you may confuse newer people.

wat stages to ban/cp/strike for pit?

Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Yoshi's Island
Lylat Cruise

Counter Picks
Brinstar
Castle Siege
Delfino
Frigate Orpheon
Halberd
Jungle Japes
Norfair
Pictochat
Pokémon Stadium 1
Rainbow Cruise

using that list please....and the pit knows arrow looping too.

Ban Norfair or Japes, try to take him to Smashville or Brinstar

I need stages to ban and take ness to please. Theres this local ness I play alot who's very good, and our matches seem to be dependent on stage. Although I dont get to face him much...but :S

I'd say avoid smaller stages. A lucky PKT2 and you're dead, same with a tipped bat.

 

[HizoSturm]

just tried some testing on snake's taunt. all three taunts do 2% but have good knockback

 

[noahbaby94]

I've been trying to get a mortar slide to work I can do a contact slide at full speed and a no-contact slide at 2/3 what is the best way to practice?

 

[-Ran]

Practice. That's all you can do. Create a long map, and just practice going back and forth. After you get that down, then work on doing it from a crouch, from running, and from the middle of attack chains, etc.

 

[-Ran]

Real men don't spot dodge. I'm curious if anyone is willing to compile a list of moves that Snake's jab beats or cancels. Dunno if anyone ever got around to doing it. I'm not just talking about just projectiles either.

 

[SuSa]

Real men don't spot dodge. I'm curious if anyone is willing to compile a list of moves that Snake's jab beats or cancels. Dunno if anyone ever got around to doing it. I'm not just talking about just projectiles either.

If you know how priority works, you can simply figure that out.

Frame Data:

Our Jab is slow for everything but the first Jab:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=225125


If you read my Metagame thread ever and kept updated:

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=6574674&postcount=159

Our Jab pretty much sucks anyways. The only good thing about it is Jab 1 > Buffered ftilt

And even then the range is worse.....


Matchups to bother jabbing in:

Captain Falcon
Diddy
G&W
Ganondorf
Ics
Jigglypuff
DDD
Kirby
MK
Peach
Pit
Ivysaur
ROB
Samus
Wolf
Yoshi
ZSS

 

[TwentyTwo]

EDIT: Wow. lol, someone made a thread about it, I thought I was special when I first did it today

 

[IxxI]

LOL, today at school there was a kid talking sh** about me in Brawl; how I suck and whatnot. I took my wii today, and played him. He now owes me $300. It was originally $50, but he said double or nothing after I won the first match. I won. Then he said triple or nothing which brought it from $100 to $300. He gave up afterward. He owes me $300 before December or it is doubled =D

Anyone have experiences like this?

Can someone post a video of boost pivot grabbing? I need to know if I'm doing it right...

 

[HizoSturm]

LOL, today at school there was a kid talking sh** about me in Brawl; how I suck and whatnot. I took my wii today, and played him. He now owes me $300. It was originally $50, but he said double or nothing after I won the first match. I won. Then he said triple or nothing which brought it from $100 to $300. He gave up afterward. He owes me $300 before December or it is doubled =D

Anyone have experiences like this?

ummm irrelevant....

 

[SSJ5Goku8932]

So, does attaching a C4 to oppenent have pontential to be a great thing?

You could stick one if they shield, and you could make them fall under pressure.

 

[IxxI]

So, does attching a C4 to oppenent have pontential to be a great thing.

You could stick one if they shiled, and you could make them fall under pressure.

Of course its a good thing.

 

[-Ran]

It's a good thing, but most tournament environments are loud and played on very small tvs. It's very hard to keep track of the C4 during many, many exchanges of it from player to player.