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SMASHPOLL: The 2010 Federal Election

Who are you going to vote for?

  • Labor

    Votes: 5 10.4%
  • Liberal

    Votes: 4 8.3%
  • Greens

    Votes: 14 29.2%
  • Democrats

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Australian Sex Party

    Votes: 19 39.6%
  • Socialist Party

    Votes: 3 6.3%
  • Independents

    Votes: 1 2.1%
  • Family First

    Votes: 2 4.2%

  • Total voters
    48
Status
Not open for further replies.

Atticus

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
295
Location
Melbourne
i just want to add my personal opinions about immigration: just because you have the fortunate privilege of being born into a first world society like this one, does not mean you should feel a sense of entitlement to dismiss those who are trying to find a better life here -- it's blatantly selfish and inhumanitarian. we all exist here through an act of immigration, wether it is from yourself or your recent ancestry. why deny candidates and their future children (which are going to be people just like us) their human right? supporting (anti/reduced/moderated) immigration isn't even a christian value (good samaritan act, compassion, love thy neighbour as you love yourself, etc). i hate to draw a religious backup to this debate, but i do so only to demonstrate there are NO grounds, within any ideology (besides protectionist parties like one nation and cdp), behind anti/moderated immigration.

if people think australia can't handle the rate of immigration, consider that australia's rate of immigration uptake has currently been adjusted to be lower than the rate it has been since world war ii. federal projections are now set at 1.2% to make 36 million by 2050. it was at it's peak just after world war ii, and surely enough, it was also the most prosperous era in australian history (we're talking unemployment rates of 2%). we had a very high immigration rate a few years ago when australia's economy was also at its highest since the post wwii bubble. any suggestion immigrants reduce money and/or wealth distribution is completely wrong -- they create money and set up the country to be a bigger and more diversified mass market to trade in.

at some point in the last decade, australians have seemed to become less confident about having 'boundless plans to share,' even the desirability of being big. the rates of immigration have varied only a little for decades. yet in recent times political hysteria about a few boat refugees has threatened to overwhelm australia's successful population strategy: the populate or perish strategy -- a successful approach to multiculturalism, which promised and generally delivered inclusion, respect for diversity and equity, is forever constantly under theat. eastern europeans arriving here in the 50's, asians arriving here in the 80's and middle easterns/indians/africans coming here in the 00's -- all immigration waves are subject to racism and criticism about their value to australia -- yet we all get over our unfounded fears when we actually realize they're going to be just like us -- so stop worrying.
I know this post is like 10 pages old now, but to me this is easily the most insightful and eloquently stated view of the issue in this thread. I think from a wider scope in general, one of the most depressing things about politics is how people vote purely for policies they see as being in their best self-interest, and the immigration issue is one of the primary examples. Instead of only arguing about how allowing a generous number of immigrants is going to impact existing Australians - which, incidentally, will be a positive impact - it'd be nice if more people started putting more thought into how rejecting more immigrants is going to affect those would-be immigrants.

Yes, Australia is a great country, yes, as an Australian you are entitled to enjoy the many benefits of living here, but what gives you the right to exclude others from that same privilege because they had to make an effort to get here instead of being lucky enough to be born here? Particularly saddening is how politics have made a target out of stopping asylum seekers arriving on boats when these are the kind of people who are the most needing of our help. It's utterly beyond me how there can be any kind of support towards mandatory detention for refugee families.
 

CAOTIC

Woxy
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
11,506
Location
Sydney
zz i know what sustainable is -,-
and i approve this 100 years planning ahead. i just said it is hard to do.

and u haven't convinced me that majority of australian land is livable. i know that we lack alot of arigculture areas. since we have been building houses on them. even if it is "livable" people would rather city or something. national broadband could help the population spread out to rural areas. although travelling is annoying. needs better town planning :/
also
The Arid and semi-arid zone constitute over 70% of Australia's land area (James, Landsberg & Morton, 1995) which is a pain. but yeah room to build. but how long til we run out?

i am not saying no to sustainablity at all. I am saying to start small... like with the country then go global.

i didn't say not let people in :/ we need skilled labour to fill our job needs.
arrow - did you read my post properly? why would i argue that the majority of australian land is livable? nowhere have i advocated constructing new settlement areas within australian's undevelopable land. i have been advocating population increase within australia's existing urban areas. that is greens policy and indeed urban planning ideals within all tiers of government -- it's political execution is most complicated due to civilian backlash -- nimbyism (not-in-my-backyard) movement, etc, and is a matter more or less fought in local and state govts.

what you seem to be struggling with is the preconception that population growth automatically equates to the spread of cities and suburbia. i'm telling you, plain and simple, growth is to be only in areas that already established -- building up is a lot more environmentally considerate than building out. it is also economically and socially superior.

"i am not saying no to sustainablity at all. I am saying to start small... like with the country then go global."

do you have any substance behind this? a set of policies to demonstrate this thought, perhaps? sustainability is a definition used all too easily.
 

isthattim?

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 7, 2008
Messages
651
Location
Iso appreciation society headquarters
clearly cao isn't taking into account the HONG KONG method of urban planning. Under this theory an ever increasing number of barges and houseboats make there way into the harbours and waterways of major cities where they can sustain a significant number of pirates. This is good for the economy and doesn't involve taking up valuable agricultural land or valuable sky space which will eventually be necessary for our flying sky farms and flying transport systems.
 

xXArrowXx

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 28, 2008
Messages
2,029
Location
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
more people living in citys would make it crowded obviously i dont know how much crowded. you think it would cause traffic jams? thus more smog. you spend more money in urban areas 2.5 more than rural.
but i dont mind building up so go ahead =P as long as you can with some vision of the future population.

soo population and sustainablity is a global matter. we all should be working on solutions. australia can lead the sustainable movement. once we reached a level the we can start helping other countries out. we should really focus on our selves tho since its about the people that pay the taxes and we consume and make greenhouse gases alot :/ thats what i mean by country.
then people can choose to follow, now its global :/
or people can do alernate system, then we can pick and choose best parts.

i think the term is. small steps lead to big change.
 

CAOTIC

Woxy
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
11,506
Location
Sydney
more people living in citys would make it crowded obviously i dont know how much crowded. you think it would cause traffic jams? thus more smog. you spend more money in urban areas 2.5 more than rural.

it's called mass transit, which denser cities in the world are far superior at establishing -- advanced mass transportation systems in australian cities are stuck in the fetal position. did you know there are more cars in sydney or melbourne, than in tokyo? this is despite tokyo having a population of approxmately 12 million. tokyo and new york (transit-oriented cities with a smaller per capita energy output), are largely smogless by comparison -- have a think.

"you spend more money in urban areas 2.5 more than rural"

wow, when are your assumptions going to end? lol -- i'll reply to this one and expand on the above comment (re: overcrowdness and pollution) when i get outta work.

There's only so much I can put in during work hours, <3
 

isthattim?

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 7, 2008
Messages
651
Location
Iso appreciation society headquarters
what people don't seem to realise is that an almost limitless number of people can live in large floating communities out at sea. this is especially true in areas of north queensland where the reef creates many sheltered areas along the coastline.
The only real hindrance to this form of urban planning is the need for public transport infrastructure to service these floating communities. I suggest we implement a system of public ferries to service these communities allowing for a net decrease in population density around major urban centres as disenfranchised city dwellers take to the sea. much like ishmael in the titular allegory "Moby ****"
 

isthattim?

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 7, 2008
Messages
651
Location
Iso appreciation society headquarters
pro-tip #1: anything published on the internet has an agenda
pro-tip #2: anything published on the internet that looks that amateurish isn't worth reading
pro-tip #3: people on the internet always know less than the experts they are arguing against

learn to not be so easily influenced plz.
 

xXArrowXx

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 28, 2008
Messages
2,029
Location
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
same could be said about other peoples links.

aboringals lol
its more like he doesn't have to convince me since he wants to build up existing cities and towns.
should all move to canberra, it seems well planned out.
 

luke_atyeo

Smash Hero
Joined
May 10, 2008
Messages
7,215
lol no, canberra has the ****test planning ever.

"lets make a major intersection roadway thing only have 1 lane, then lets ignore all the critisim and do it anyway, and then decide to expand it a short while later to have extra lanes, which means its in roadworks construction for 1 year and there are major traffic jams there everyday during peak hours, FOR A WHOLE YEAR, we're so good at planning. why dont we do this over multiple areas in canberra all at the same time"
 

CAOTIC

Woxy
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
11,506
Location
Sydney
well i read some where that it is 2.5 times.. its not an assumption.

and yeah i thought about public transport. thats why i said it was an ok idea. however public transport fails me.

http://www.sos.org.au/new_sustain.html

anything out of water world movie >.> great idea o.o'

Arrow, do you just read everything and soak it up like a sponge, or do you critically analyze the source of your information? You are assuming "the cost of living is 2.5 times cheaper," as the given word, and you can probably demonstrate this through the shallow extrapolation of housing costs of the inner city vs. the outer city/rural, such as:

(for your benefit, I'll use actual SEQ suburb medians for homes)
Outer Brisbane:
- Ipswich, $344,000 homes/$262,000 units
vs.
Inner Brisbane
- Brisbane City, $640,000 homes/$435,000 units

Right. Do you know the reasons why some outer suburban or rural properties are cheaper? It is because they are more undesirable and undeveloped. This isn't even the case for all rural areas, as some outside towns are very expensive (Portsea VIC, Palm Beach NSW, Noosa QLD). What people are really buying into, is some or all of the following:

- Convenient access to high quality services (shops, services, amenities, parks that are better than others)
- Access to opportunistic ways to meet people they want to meet (those of a higher scoio-economic status, tertiary educated, global), through the communities they live in
- Access to schools that perform very well, so that a family's children have the best chance of securing a good future, either by performing well at school or meeting other well-established people.

Why am I saying things you probably already know? Because leading to my next point, the housing affordability issue is simple: you get what you pay for. people buy into expensive suburbs for a reason. Not only is it an investment, you are buying into a higher quality of life. The world's most livable cities also happen to be the world's most expensive cities to love in. This is not a coincidence. And we experience little net hardship, relative to the rest of the world.

If you forcibly move out into a cheaper area, you are basically selling yourself and your potential short. The cost of buying a house outside the heart of the city may be 2.5 x less, but that doesn't take into account various costs that are unaccounted for:
- the increased travel costs (requiring a car and paying for fuel)
- the increased time costs (and time is money and opportunity)
- lower social connectivity (less opportunity to meet people of high socioeconomic status, more likely to associate with those amongst the poverty line)
- lower economic opportunity (access to jobs and a diversified economy is limited; people in cheap suburbs have very low or no incomes)

So before you spout things like out of town houses are cheaper, or something to that order, think of the hidden costs (social, economic, environmental) associated with those who live in the suburbs/rural areas, that are 'affordable.'

Poverty has a high cost. It is expensive to be poor. If you need to understand further, read this supurbly articulated article from the Washington Post:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/17/AR2009051702053.html

To bring high quality goods and services to cheap suburbs, will effectively push up those prices. And that is a good thing. People don't want to live crap lives.

Anyway, If you want a solution to housing affordability, it is simple. Unit construction + a overhaul of planning policies currently in place (that prevent unit construction). Look at those medians I posted for units. Also, the expansion of construction and the industry in general, to deliver housing at a cheaper and competitive rate. Our small markets we operate always make the country expensive, since we don't have an economy of scale and thus, have such few deliverers of essential infrastructure -- a smaller country makes for make expensiver services.

As for your link from Save Our Suburbs -- they are classic NIMBYists, as I referred to earlier -- they do have a very specific agenda and their statements are poorly backed up. If you can highlight to me anything specific in their page which you want to bring to attention, please do so, and I'll happily falsify anything they have to say with substantiated backup -- I deal with these groups time and time again.

Glad we agree with public transport issues and building up.
 

abhishekh

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
266
Location
Cupboard under the stairs
kso I know little about politics and can't vote for a while, but it's interesting anyway.

I kinda skimmed through most of it, but I wanted to know more about the whole "boat people" (I really hate that term) thing.

As far as I can gather (which is probably wrong), it's a bunch of asylum seekers fleeing wars or conflict to come to Australia on boats. Except there's already a large line of people who want to come into Australia for the same reason, except they're doing it the proper way. And because these people come right on the doorstep on Australia, they're effectively "jumping the line". I also know the amount of asylum seekers, coming on boats or otherwise is incredibly small or at least some insignificant number.

That's as far as I know on that issue, how it mostly isn't that big of a deal because not many people are actually coming in.

Also, when people say gay marriage, do they mean gay -marriage- or gay -same thing as marriage but not called marriage-?
 

CAOTIC

Woxy
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
11,506
Location
Sydney
Hey Abhi, thanks for joining in!

It's been covered already, but I'll quickly clarify some things for you:
- There is no proper or improper way of entering Australia, on the basis of seeking Asylum -- it's not illegal and is actually Australia's obligation. As almost all asylum claims are proven to be correct; this means they leave out of desperation and they are able to be granted immediate asylum once they enter Australian territories.
- They don't jump the line, according to Unreon's post. They are processed in detention centres throughout the country, including is deserts and offshore, which is unnecessary. The wait time to get processed usually takes many years, whereas selective migration (through work VISAs, sponsorships, etc) happen instantaneously.

Hope that clears things up.

Gay marriage:
- Liberal = opposed
- ALP = opposed
- Greens = they mean it
- Sex Party = they mean it

 

xXArrowXx

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 28, 2008
Messages
2,029
Location
Brisbane, QLD, Australia
99% of refugee come by plane.. the 1% that do come by boat. all together they aren't sucking up much money. they tend to be more dodgy... ive come to the conclusion that the media has hyped it up for election :/ and they cant hype it down cause they would look bad.
the boat people from indonesia do "jump the line". they are lined up for processing in indonesia but it takes years and years. so they get people smuggled over here. but they dont jump the line in the sense of other refugees and imigrates have to wait behind them, its on a different line.

yeah i know why its higher. the reason you said. good stuff to think about. it was more about the validity of the number 2.5 times. which i think is vaguely correct. but my post before that would have been wrong.

what if the city cant build up anymore? pop cap?
 

swordsaint

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 27, 2008
Messages
4,379
Location
Western Sydney
the 1% that do come by boat. all together they aren't sucking up much money.
This is wrong. A video posted a while back said that offshore processing (or whatever the actual term is, I know what I mean) cost $1 million a day. It's expensive. If however they instead processed and granted asylum in a more legitimate way - treating them no different than anyone else - then the costs would go down. The only reason asylum seekers (boat) are hurting our country is because of the **** way the governments handling it.

That's what I've taken from reading everything here, if I've misunderstood something feel free to tell me because I'm actually kinda interested in this despite not being able to vote. Though even if I could, I probably would just get my name signed off and not vote. I don't know enough to justify any vote I would write down.
 

isthattim?

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 7, 2008
Messages
651
Location
Iso appreciation society headquarters
Imo the amount of asylum seekers entering the country is lower than the amount of children being born into fundamentalist christian families and dangerous cults such as the exclusive brethren and scientology.

These children, when they mature, pose a far greater risk to the australian way of life than the 8000 odd people that apply for asylum in australia, hoping for a life free of persecution (the australian way)
 

unreon

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 21, 2005
Messages
887
Location
Sydney, NSW, Australia
ITT:

Arrow shown repeatedly to have a poor understanding on...all issues, really.
Cao laying the smackdown left right and centre.
isthattim? cracking the funniest **** I've read on these boards.

<3<3 all

Scoot, sadface on the novote considering you are quite sound of mind and deserve to vote more than 80% of the rest of Australia.
 

swordsaint

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 27, 2008
Messages
4,379
Location
Western Sydney
ITT:

Arrow shown repeatedly to have a poor understanding on...all issues, really.
Cao laying the smackdown left right and centre.
isthattim? cracking the funniest **** I've read on these boards.

<3<3 all

Scoot, sadface on the novote considering you are quite sound of mind and deserve to vote more than 80% of the rest of Australia.
Lol, thanks Unny. I'm not saying I won't ever vote once I'm 18, just not yet. Perhaps come next election I'll put some effort in to understanding what's going on a little more to have confidence in a vote. :)

On this topic though, I also disagree with mandatory voting. =/
 

CAOTIC

Woxy
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
11,506
Location
Sydney
^ Shame the ALP and Liberal are pussylicking the most marginal (or perhaps, politically ignorant) state in the country. Oh, Queensland.... <3

Political ignorance only encourages lying, because it suggests votes can be bought cheaply and irrationally by the major parties, as they are forced to respond to a "what can you do for ME?" attitude... then, the major parties permit themselves to throw at you all sorts of empty bucket promises.
 

Aussierob123

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 13, 2008
Messages
2,033
Location
Gold Coast - Australia
Another issue of illegal immigration is the screwing up of the gene pool. The country has to watch the gene pool really carefully, introducing foreigners without the country knowing could affect that.

I'm not saying anything towards the whole immigration thing, I have no opinion, just saying that it's important.

I'll just vote greens. I'm not a fan of either of the two douches or their policies.

Having said that, I think gillard will win.
 

Sieg

Smash Champion
Joined
Nov 3, 2005
Messages
2,991
Location
Dreadzone
Dammit, he has an answer for EVERYTHING.

I'll have to try harder next time.

Legitimate question though, what would you say to the concept of the Liberals only save money and Labour only spends money on stuff. I usually think of it as a cycle of.

Libs get in, save up cash. Get's booted out when nothing really happens.

Labour gets in, spends cash on things etc. Get's booted out once the money has gone.
 

Shaya

   「chase you」 
BRoomer
Joined
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Messages
27,654
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/人◕‿‿◕人\ FABULOUS Max!
NNID
ShayaJP
Liberal's economic policy pertained to 1% GDP surplus.
A lot of governments, especially those moving left tend to have aim towards deficits of 0.1%-1% of GDP, every year.

Worldwide considered "fact" economic macro policy was for deficits of up to 1% of GDP for quite a long time. Australia was one of few countries which proactively did the opposite.

inb4 Toby saying it wasn't Lib policy it was all about 'dem minerals'.
Labour's economic policies would have had us spending more like every other western country in the world, and we would have most likely had just as much trouble as other countries during the global economic crisis if liberal macro policy wasn't in effect. Australians as people save a lot less of their income than other nations as well, standard Labour spending policy during the mineral boom would have caused strong inflation (sustainable at the time though) that would have ***** us even harder.

I'm not sure how much labour has been placing the budget in deficit as a percentage of GDP since their re-election. But some long-term memory in the back of my head recalls Labour's economic/budget goals as always shaky.
 

Shaya

   「chase you」 
BRoomer
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/人◕‿‿◕人\ FABULOUS Max!
NNID
ShayaJP
one hundred million dollars every day
But as you see, I'm too lazy to check what our GDP is...

I'd assume its somewhat around the 700 billion mark; so 35 billion dollars of debt over the year..

so 5% budget deficit...
pretty bad imo...
But most countries in the world who were dealing with the financial crises would have had similar deficits. But it's funny that we're supposedly doing well because of the money saved up by the liberals... but it's all gone (already) and noticeably large budget deficit is still being accrued.
 

CAOTIC

Woxy
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
11,506
Location
Sydney
Whirrrrrr... spent 3 hours listening to Bob Brown speak at a party earlier today -- pretty drained to reply, but it'll come :)
 

redrighthand

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 25, 2009
Messages
129
Location
Melbourne, Australia.
This has been an enjoyable read. I'm a a few years of voting age and am fairly positive i'll be voting greens unless something exceptional changes. They have really solid speakers (well, mostly) and aren't as addicted to attacking other instead of reinforcing themselves.

Nothing's perfect, but I can only pick what I think is best.

There was this greens guy on Qanda a while back, he was really good. Convinced me for sure. Was polite, realistic, courteous towards the other speakers whilst being a strong and intelligent speaker. Let the other Liberal and sometimes Labor pigheaded idiots make a full of themselves before rebutting with something smart, to the point and witty. Usually warm, positive comments too, instead of bashing others.

Pity I forget this guys name.

EDIT:

Win.
Scott Ludlam. WA Greens Senator.

http://www.abc.net.au/tv/qanda/txt/s2945281.htm
 

CAOTIC

Woxy
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
11,506
Location
Sydney
I think the Liberal party misinterprets what is to be the correlation between Australia's wave of economic prosperity and their appointment to running the country's economy. A huge part of Australia's economic performance (and indeed that of all first world developed countries) is intrinsically dependent on the global economy. This is because we have always been a free-trade, capitalist society and always will be. We will be subject to the highs and lows of the global market forces (like the global financial crisis), since we are networked into it.

Labor claims they saved Australia by immediately intervening to put a stimulus package into everyone's pockets. There is truth to this claim, as they effectively reversed the immediate decline in unemployment and consumer confidence caused by the GFC, but the damage that was done to Australia via the GFC was through the complete expenditure of our budget surpluses that ran throughout the entire Howard-Costello era (the surplus isn't exclusively championed because of Coalition practices either, but I'll get to that later). We took a hit -- but not a hit that directly affects the lifestyle of our population (as we never reached a recession) -- it's through debt, and we're expected to pay it later. However, that is a normal and textbook knee-jerk reaction, which makes sense. If you don't intervene as a government, people's jobs will be foregone. The debt isn't ALP's fault -- it's simply using the surplus for its intended purpose, irrespective of which government is in power and/or which government was fortunate to create it:

Before people start worrying about debt, remember this:

- Global economic meltdowns must be prepared for, as they are expected in free-market economies -- by having surpluses to begin with.
- Surpluses exist mainly to prepare for bad turns in the economy or other potential disasters, irrespective of which government is in power. It is basic economic management -- much in the same way you have a personal savings account to possibly prepare for disasters beyond your control.
- In perpetuity, planning every year for surplses serves no purpose.
- In perpetuity, planning every year for defecits also serves no purpose.
^ Thus, both of Shaya's statements about Liberal and ALP's annual budget targets are incorrect (ALP claims to re-establish a surplus by as late as 2013).

When you think about debt, what does it really mean? It means the government is borrowing money, investing it into a weakened Australian economy, to stimulate it. It's not a waste when the money being spent goes directly back to its people. It is best seen as a rebirth, with repayments that have to be made later (presumably by the government that rides the future years of success -- and that historically isn't just tied to Liberal).

What I'm also trying to demonstrate, is that I believe ALP and Liberal should share fairly equal credit in Australia's advancement as a prosperous nation -- it is absurd to think that the Liberal party is the sole reason why we're well off. The institutionalized federal economic pillars that give us our security today, predates many governmental eras. Think about this:

- ALP introduced the Federal Reserve Bank -- it manages interest rates to ensure Australians don't over-borrow and bankrupt banks -- this type of financial regulation was missing in USA's economic policy because America was too lassiez-faire -- and hence several major banks were bankrupted, starting the domino effect which was the GFC. Americans overborrowed, overlent and many lost their homes and businesses. Obama just recently passed the bill for 'Wall Street Reform,' - policy that has protected Australia from that very scenario since our Federation.

- ALP introduced business deregulation in the 1980s; it is a world leader in doing so -- reducing red tape to set up businesses and having the world's fastest response time to setting up a business. Liberal followed course, but went much further, too far in fact, with WorkChoices; That cost them the 2007 election (although people will tell you Howard didn't win because people were 'over' him -- elections are never won because people want change -- elections are won because incumbents screw up).

- The Liberals have currently lost their lost their edge to defend themselves as strong economic regulators, because Abbott-Hockey-Bishop have not had the exposure to economic policy, in the same ways Howard-Costello did. Abbott has currently rejected every single offer for a debate against ALP regarding the economy, because it knows ALP can sell its strengths.

All I'm trying to say is, people fail to recognize the long term impacts of political
economic policy-making. ALP is about as competent as Liberal is in managing the economy. The only standout differences is that ALP are willing to spend to stimulate the economy for the purposes of economic socialism, vs. Liberals firm view of economic liberalism. They are fundamentally different ideologies, but the lines between their beliefs and their actual outputs are blurred -- because they are constant rivals.
 

Dekar289

Smash Hero
Joined
Feb 20, 2007
Messages
6,306
ever thought about being some sort of political journalist cao
or running yourself lol
 

CAOTIC

Woxy
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
11,506
Location
Sydney
I'd first need more life experience before I can run lol, but thanks! <3

PS - There's also political talent out there that is superior to me :c
 

dainbramage

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 18, 2008
Messages
276
Location
Sydney, Australia
but i wont be voting greens cause of the pro-choice
What
The
****?


Also apparently I'm a communist.

1. Socialist Alliance - 24 matches! (http://www.socialist-alliance.org/)
2. Australian Greens - 23 matches! (http://greens.org.au/)
3. Australian Sex Party - 10 matches! (http://www.sexparty.org.au/)
4. Secular Party of Australia - 10 matches! (http://www.secular.org.au/)
5. Australian Democrats - 9 matches! (http://www.democrats.org.au/)
6. Australian Labor Party - 9 matches! (http://alp.org.au/)
7. The Liberal Democratic Party - 7 matches! (http://www.ldp.org.au/)
8. National Party of Australia - 4 matches! (http://www.nationals.org.au/)
9. Liberal Party of Australia - 3 matches! (http://www.liberal.org.au/)



Also also Cao has won this thread several times over.
 
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