Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Mutsukki]

Don't forget Sakurai bias.

No, please forget that.

 

[Rigumaro]

The main problem with this kind of mindset is that it assumes people need or want to be saved, before they ever ask. Which is an attitude that occurs for one of two possible reasons: people can't take care of themselves so one must step in, which shows a lack of respect and often leads to that superiority people tend to think Team Fake has, or...it is self-serving, and is only done to prevent oneself from becoming overhyped.

If it truly is from a place of caring, it will most certainly not be construed as such. We're not talking about a parent and child, here--we're all equals as Smash fans, no one more superior than another. So it invariably comes off as an insult, because the people that are being "helped" don't see themselves as needing it.

Again, I want to be clear: I am not definitively Team Real or Team Fake. I'm not attacking anyone or trying to, but am merely stating my opinion and analysis of these kinds of behaviors and their ramifications. Take what you will from this.

Well, I've seen some replies like yours, and I have to say, I apologize if I felt entitled to say wether people need to be helped or not. Guess this the lesson I learned today.

On the other hand, I'll just say this: I personally liked that there were people trying to prove it's fake. At first I couldn't believe this leak; it was too good to be true. Later on, as I learned about more details, I started getting excited, and actually believing it was real. If it had been just that, I would still believe it, and would have gotten disappointed in a few weeks. I am actually grateful to the people who found out the empty battlefield banner and pointed out the inconsistencies, because that's what I personally took as proof that it was fake. Hell, even seeing that proof was a huge bummer by itself, I can't imagine multiplying that by 10 from being disappointed during a direct.

Another thing I've been seeing, is that we're adults and we can take disappointment. Well, obviously we can. When I talk about crushing disappointment, I don't mean crying, ranting mean tweets to Sakurai, or having a hissy fit on the internet. We're not babies. I mean stuff like having your mood ruined for the day, or even week. Having the excitement for waiting for the game worsened, hype going from a 10 to an 8. Worsening the experience. Sometimes people are going through rough times and cling to their passions in order to cope and stay strong (That is my case). And I'd say most of us are very passionate about Smash, otherwise we wouldn't be here discussing in cyclical conversations and over-analyzing everything we can find.

So again, sorry if I projected my own feelings into the whole community. We're all different and we should respect everyone's ways to enjoy things.

 

[Pyra]

it is pretty funny how the whole point of incineroar's design is a dirty wrestler, someone you'd love to hate, and it actually garners hate

Okay, but hear me out.

Incineroar is a heel.

You know who else is a heel?

Ergo, the reason Incineroar isn't in, is because he's the Grinch himself.

I'll take questions from my patreon patrons.

 

[Vycoul]

I don't exactly condone the aggressive posts against Incineroar, at least sprinkle some more humor in there, but calling them "disgusting" is an overreaction that I cannot take seriously at all.

Like, there are a lot of disgusting things in the world, if you think someone being a little tactless with their jabs at a character you want is one of them, you really live a great life and haven't seen much.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I hope Luigi's new FS is somehow connected to Super Paper Mario, seeing how focal of a character he was in the game's story (that is if he's even getting a new FS).

Normally I would doubt that, but Peach's description and Memories imply that she may get a FS based on Super Princess Peach, so who really knows at this stage?

 

[Tew]

So, I have been lurking in this thread for quite a while and I will go right back to it, just gonna share a random thought/idea. But before that: Right now I am on Team 50/50 and the idea is just a random thought, that I don‘t believe myself and is more meant as a joke. Though just incase it somehow ends up true, I can go back to this post and pretend to be a somewhat credible leaker for the next Smash ^^.

Prediction: 01.11.2018/1st November: Smash Direct, reveals *all* 7 Grinch/Banner Characters. Sakurai says this the final roster. Grinch Banner is seen at the Nintendo Live event and other events after the Direct.
06.12.2018/6th December: Game Awards: One day before Smash U Release a trailer pops up starting with Incineroar, making him look like a secret final reveal, but there is one more in the trailer: Sora.

 

[Luigi The President]

Alright lads, to everyone who was offended(?) by the Incineroar jokes, I apologise. I was just trying to get some laughs. I don't really care for the cat, but I don't mean any harm.

You're good buddy I appreciate them being funny

 

[larlargaming]

Nintendo is inevitably going to have to reveal the final Smash Direct before the game's release worldwide on December 7th, and while this leak may have removed the element of surprise from the most noteworthy aspect (the fighters), these are the following things we still do not know.

• The remaining 5 stages if the CoroCoro information is true (which corresponds to the five newcomers, ironically)
• Any remaining Assist Trophies
• If regular Trophies still exist and how you can get them
• Any Stadium Events
• Spirits Mode (obviously!)
• Any bonus content, such as a historical retrospective on the 20 years of the franchise (it'll be 20 in 2019)
• Lastly, if push comes to shove, announce the first DLC fighter

The fact that Spirits Mode, of all things, has not been fully spoiled should still be a net positive for Nintendo and Sakurai, since they could promote the hell out of this mode.

Only question now is... when will they do this? I know people say between the 5th and 12th of November, but I think it may be a week after that before the American Thanksgiving and Black Friday holidays.

nah, i dont think during that time. honestly, the game might be fully leaked (if people get their hands on it) if this direct was somehow around thanksgiving

 

[Noipoi]

Alright, i'll crawl back to my desk so I can keep drawing that huge anime poster. Hopefully when I get back it won't still be-
"**** on Incineroar and all who love him O'Clock".

 

[Jetsurge]

Damm Etika wasn't faking he actually had a mental breakdown and is in a mental hospital now.

I feel so bad for him his whole channel and source of income are now gone out of the window and now we probably won't see his reactions of the final characters.

 

[Z25]

I don't exactly condone the aggressive posts against Incineroar, at least sprinkle some more humor in there, but calling them "disgusting" is an overreaction that I cannot take seriously at all.

It’s really not when we’ve had like 10 people on here ****ting and harassing fans of a character. That is not acceptable no matter what.

 

[ExitWound]

View attachment 172453
Found this on /v/. What the f*ck is going on?

Sakurai: "i have one final announcement"

The Grinch Steals the Show!

 

[Nekoo]

Oh... I didn't realized that.

My problem with this is that the argument is basically "This isn't really how it looks. It's just distortion from Snapchat and motion blur."
Okay if that is the case then why does the character banner part of the leak also have the same altered areas? pic.twitter.com/q0QRgflHfr

— Trisepta (@Trisepta_777) October 27, 2018

 

[Robertman2]

Team Zinith is essentially the equivalent of the Libertarian and/or Objectivist position...

so it's the position that makes no sense?

After criticism from President Trump, Ben Shapiro goes on Fox News to defend his decision to join Super Smash Bros.

ben has to own the libs like corrin, yoshi and all anime characters

 

[AugustusB]

I refuse to draw this.

What about Stone Cold Geno IF he is announced then?

That would be really funny.

Just pointless fun, I think you know that, but just making sure for others lol

 

[Heartz♥]

Incineroar's signature move is literally T-Posing at enemies at high speed, much of this hate is undeserved.

I was gonna leave, but this made me stay.

 

[Luigi The President]

Oh... I didn't realized that.

My problem with this is that the argument is basically "This isn't really how it looks. It's just distortion from Snapchat and motion blur."
Okay if that is the case then why does the character banner part of the leak also have the same altered areas? pic.twitter.com/q0QRgflHfr

— Trisepta (@Trisepta_777) October 27, 2018

Am a little confused what am I looking at

 

[Darkurai]

Oh... I didn't realized that.

My problem with this is that the argument is basically "This isn't really how it looks. It's just distortion from Snapchat and motion blur."
Okay if that is the case then why does the character banner part of the leak also have the same altered areas? pic.twitter.com/q0QRgflHfr

— Trisepta (@Trisepta_777) October 27, 2018

I think this confirms more or less that the differences between the leak and the official background were an intentional design change.

Obviously whether or not that design change was because Nintendo wanted something a little different or if it's because the leak is fake is up to us to decide for ourselves, but I'd say we can conclusively say this is not caused by image smearing or motion blur.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Damm Etika wasn't faking he actually had a mental breakdown and is in a mental hospital now.

I feel so bad for him his whole channel and source of income are now gone out of the window and now we probably won't see his reactions of the final characters.

Fudge...

And to think most people here are too busy freaking out over that mean one, Mr. Grinch. Being in the funny farm is not funny at all.

 

[TheKnight]

Hello, everyone.
I am sorry for interrupt the conversation. You all probably dont know who I am since I have been a guest that has been looking at this topic as a guest. I have been here since this thread was started to see people like Zinith become the unofficial pet with his love of Boshi. I have seen the low and ups , stuff like when the topic was separated into the general discussion thread and the leaks thread. The reason I decided to make an account was just to share a few opinions. I hope no one minds my interruption and I apologize in advance if it does.

I wanted to say that I dont think it is fair to compare this to the ESRB leak. It is a different situation, in that one we had many images that showed stuff in the game and we even got a video of gameplay. I think that saying the two are the same basically ignore what makes the grinch leak and the ESRB leak special. The grinch leak has stuff proving to be related to someone that works on the graphics design field, an amazing possibility and an empty background. The moment you treat the two as the same is the momento people start bringing up irrelevant points like "this is like the Little Mac situation". I humbly request the people of this thread to try to separate the two. Dont compare them, measure them on their own merits.

The second thing, I want to bring up is that I understand that people usually have a mentality of either or. I know that people want to see the info of insiders and Verge about Incineroar as a threat to the leak but it isnt. There is a chance that both can be true since this isnt necessarily the whole roster. Just as posible, they could both be fake. Verge didnt have the whole roster, but it doesnt mean that the information he gave was wrong. Just because there is information that can be contradictory, it doesnt necessarily mean that it is contradictory. I think the positions of people like Vaanrose and Zinith are the most healthy ones. Dont try to prove that a leak is right or wrong. Analyze everything, be curious, share your knowledge and let people come to their own conclusions. The truth will eventually arise (sooner rather than later in this case).

Finally, I want to recommend people to consider what they share. There has been a lot of misinformation spread especilly today when people lied about the words of Serebii and Vergeben, or when people brought up points that have aready been proved fake like the gem situation with Megaman. What is worse is that fake stuff and real stuff is constantly posted ad nauseum. I believe it would help the thread if it didnt have to constantly stop to repeat what is being said especially when it happens with the next page.

Anyway, I apologize once again for interrupting the discussion. I have read many times how people here are curious about what guests have to say so here is a ex-guest sharing his thought.

Welcome to the discussion! Posting a bunch of immediate assumptions about things is pretty much how Smash speculation goes. And you're certainly right that this is a different situation than the ESRB leak. A lot of people also are looking to be definitively on team "real" or "fake" when it's perfectly fine to be on the fence, because no one really knows anything for sure anyways.

 

[Saelind Genesis]

Alright, i'll crawl back to my desk so I can keep drawing that huge anime poster. Hopefully when I get back it won't still be-
"**** on Incineroar and all who love him O'Clock".

I still love you Noi

 

[NineS]

View attachment 172453
Found this on /v/. What the f*ck is going on?

Well, you know what this means.

The Grinch confirmed for Smash.

Seriously though, why does he have Grinch posters...?

 

[Darkurai]

Am a little confused what am I looking at

He's saying that the differences in the image from what we've seen in an official version can't be due to camera quality or motion blur because the differences are identical between two different pictures.

 

[StarLight42]

It has been a while since I posted here helping with the ESRB leak from Smash 3DS. Hi everybody

So here's something you can try with the background if you have photoshop, and understand what happens to the image because of the low quality and artifacts caused by the recording.

Let's compare the clean background with the leaked background. Look at the spots marked in red, which are (at least to me) the most suspicious spots in the image.

View attachment 172360

Now, let's apply a filter to the clean background: Filter > Noise > Median.

See what happens to the waterfalls if I increase the value of the filter:
View attachment 172363

The waterfall from the right tends to dissapear, just like in the leaked image.

And this is what happens to the castle area:

View attachment 172364

Doesn't it look a lot more like the leaked image? I just played with the "median" filter in photoshop, that's all. You can try!

So, yeah... My point is that we have been look at the same exact background all the time, but it has been severely modified because of quality and artifacts stuff. Don't forget we are looking at the screenshot of a video in motion of a draft print.

(If you want the same result, apply Median 19 for the waterfalls and Median 28 for the castle area).

I knew it! All that overanalyzation wasn't worth it.

 

[greenluigiman2]

Seriously why do people hate Incineroar so much?

Is it his design? He isn't particularly bad looking. He looks fine.
Is it the fact he was once the gatekeeper for speculation for about a month or two? Not a good reason to dislike any character.
Is it you want another Pokemon? That's fine, but it isn't like he is a out there choice "stealing" a slot from another popular Pokemon.

Just very strange if you ask me. I am indifferent about him overall, but the vitriol he gets is perplexing.

I don't hate Incineroar and I don't care if he gets in or not, but I'd rather have a Pokemon that's not a freakin' fire type. There are so many fire based moves in Smash already plus a fire type Pokemon in Charizard, but Pokemon has so many other types that could bring something more unique to the table.

 

[Zinith]

so it's the position that makes no sense?

No, it's because it's a mindset based on Arguments from First Principles rather than getting a certain outcome...

 

[Flyboy]

Okay, but hear me out.

Incineroar is a heel.
View attachment 172461

You know who else is a heel?
View attachment 172457

Ergo, the reason Incineroar isn't in, is because he's the Grinch himself.

I'll take questions from my patreon patrons.

AH **** ME HOW DID I NOT MAKE THIS CONNECTION FIRST

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

What about Stone Cold Geno IF he is announced then?

That would be really funny.

Just pointless fun, I think you know that, but just making sure for others lol

Who would be Hulk Hogan?

 

[-crump-]

Seriously why do people hate Incineroar so much?

Is it his design? He isn't particularly bad looking. He looks fine.
Is it the fact he was once the gatekeeper for speculation for about a month or two? Not a good reason to dislike any character.
Is it you want another Pokemon? That's fine, but it isn't like he is a out there choice "stealing" a slot from another popular Pokemon.

Just very strange if you ask me. I am indifferent about him overall, but the vitriol he gets is perplexing.

Just gonna throw my hat in the ring:
I hate Incineroar’s design, and I have ever since it got leaked in the first place. I genuinely think it’s one of the ugliest Pokémon in recent memory, and an extremely disappointing place for Litten to end up in, considering I like both it and Torracat. I also don’t want it in Smash because it feels like a random choice; Incineroar is not iconic like the Gen 1 Pokémon or all that heavily marketed like Lucario and Greninja. Even among the Pokémon it would feel out of place imo

That said, I’ll try my best to be happy for fans of Incineroar when it gets revealed. Plenty of people didn’t like it when Isabelle was announced, so I know how it feels when people kick and tear at the character you were most excited for.

 

[Deleted member]

I bet you the people on team fake put the milk in the bowl before the cereal.

Spoiler

And the people on team real probably consider a hot dog to be a sandwich

 

[TyrantLizardKing]

Man I’ve never cared to see Incineroar in but now I think he should just to finally shut down all this supposed gatekeeping. Even us Lucina fans never had it this bad, like come on people it’s a fictional character. Grow up.

 

[TheKnight]

Well, you know what this means.

The Grinch confirmed for Smash.

Seriously though, why does he have Grinch posters...?

On Reddit where I believe it was originally posted, it's explained. It seems like London Comic Con is promoting The Grinch movie on their guidebooks and badges and whatnot. It seems to just be a hilarious coincidence. https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/9rntyw/spotted_a_certain_someone_at_nintendos_london/

 

[Cheesehead302]

I'm kinda enjoying thus far the uproar of this leak

Beside the fact that still to this day this leak devide our community in such way make this more surreal to me. That madman who leaked that just wanted to watch the whole world burn !

UpROAR? Pun intentional or unintentional?

 

[Confirmation]

This sounds like a perfect reason to hate him tbh

 

[Luigi The President]

He's saying that the differences in the image from what we've seen in an official version can't be due to camera quality or motion blur because the differences are identical between two different pictures.

Are the two pics of the same leaked banner?

 

[Garteam]

so it's the position that makes no sense?

ben has to own the libs like corrin, yoshi and all anime characters

"Listen up gang, if the free market dictates that the players want more anime swordsmen, then Sakurai should add more anime swordsmen. By setting up quotas for characters from certain franchises, you are promoting roster socialism. My waifu is a doctor."

 

[Nekoo]

I bet you the people on team fake put the milk in the bowl before the cereal.

Spoiler

And the people on team real probably consider a hot dog to be a sandwich

Both of these are Heresy. That's why Team HHhhhmmm is the best.

He's saying that the differences in the image from what we've seen in an official version can't be due to camera quality or motion blur because the differences are identical between two different pictures.

Yup, I think we can throw all "motion blur" things out of the windows, the Background is INDEED different

 

[AugustusB]

Who would be Hulk Hogan?

Oh dang...I could see Mach Rider being Hogan. Just doing the poses alone would be great to see.

 

[vaanrose]

My version of the leaked character banner is clearly lower quality than the one other people have been using. Can somebody get me the original image without all the extra artifacting from the constant reuploading?

 

[Jedisupersonic]

This is my constant reaction to all the fighting (like everywhere in regards to this discussion) now, since it's gotten pretty repeitive