Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[TheCJBrine]

"Hi I'm Daisy!" should've been her stage entrance.

 

[StrawHatX]

It all gets answered in there lol. Though, just to throw it out there, Sakurai did choose Cloud in 4, not Square.

And now Nintendo is picking the Square rep. Unfortunately I feel like Geno would have to be a Sakurai pick if he was to get in.

 

[Yoshisaurus Rex]

"Hi I'm Daisy!" should've been her entire voice lines

That’s better.

 

[Deleted member]

To make more money directly from DLC and indirectly by marketing active game franchises?

I dunno, I think they're going to announce Gex at The Game Awards alongside a Gex reboot exclusively on Switch.

 

[Noipoi]

This voice line simply isn't in the game and I'm pretty broken up about it

Daisy doesn't meme?
Time to get Galeem'd.

 

[Luigi The President]

Care to give me a tldr? I don't really wanna read through another thread.

Here's some points for Geno.

Spoiler

So, Geno would be one of the few Squenix reps who are genuinely Nintendo exclusive. His inclusion would benefit Nintendo-he's only appeared on Nintendo consoles.
The issue with Sora is that he'd be promoting a game coming to Nintendo's direct competitors, which comes out in January. Sora's definitely still in the running but this is a bigger issue than people say imo.
Geno also has appeal to both Western and Japanese audiences. I can dig up quite a few polls that prove this. Europe is a weird territory for Geno, I'll admit. DQ only has Japanese appeal, let's be real. DQ is 100000% more well known than Geno, lemme make that clear, but it's about the global appeal with this specific point.
Also, Geno would be incredibly easy to license from what I understand. Sora has numerous issues-the scale of which depends on who you ask, really. DQ has a whole ****house of issues, especially the music. Geno's just Geno. Really comes down to Squenix saying "eh you can have him".

If you have any more points, let me know-I'd love to show why I think he isn't dead haha

 

[AndreaAC]

That’s better.

xP And this should have been her victory theme.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Brawl will always be the Smash game with the most characters and absolutely no quality control.

View attachment 178057

This ****'s hilariously terrible. There's like 5 good movesets not counting vBrawl in this entire pack.

Simon has seen some stuff

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

While I love Geno, I personally don’t think the “advertising direct competitors” means anything.

We got Snake when MGS4 was coming out on PS3. We got Cloud when FFVII never came out on a Nintendo console. We got Ryu when SFV was coming out PS4 exclusive.

It comes down to legacy and demand. Well, and the power of friendship(!) in Snake’s case.

 

[KingofKoopas]

I'm gone for a few minutes and the Sora debate happens again?

 

[alemerltoucanet]

Care to give me a tldr? I don't really wanna read through another thread.

the most valuable points imo:
Geno's rights are already being used, we know this since the token.
Obviously fan demand.
His big main "enemies" in this:
The rights for Dragon Quest rep would be a pain to get, especially since music is included.
Nintendo wouldn't gain too much from Sora from a marketing standpoint as it would be encouraging others to get his game that's over on competing consoles.

(Sorry if this isn't a lot, just naming off the top of my head And I'm busy arm lol. ^^")

 

[Paperchampion23]

Project M was going to add Skull Kid.

They had cool animations and stuff.

Now the only Skull Kid mod I can find for Brawl is some weird Skull Kid-over-Toon Link mod that keeps some of Toon Link's moves and has a weird model.

cries

My only hope is a more dedicated team puts on amazing mod work for ultimate. The switch is already exploitable.

 

[NineS]

Here's some points for Geno.

Spoiler

So, Geno would be one of the few Squenix reps who are genuinely Nintendo exclusive. His inclusion would benefit Nintendo-he's only appeared on Nintendo consoles.
The issue with Sora is that he'd be promoting a game coming to Nintendo's direct competitors, which comes out in January. Sora's definitely still in the running but this is a bigger issue than people say imo.
Geno also has appeal to both Western and Japanese audiences. I can dig up quite a few polls that prove this. Europe is a weird territory for Geno, I'll admit. DQ only has Japanese appeal, let's be real. DQ is 100000% more well known than Geno, lemme make that clear, but it's about the global appeal with this specific point.
Also, Geno would be incredibly easy to license from what I understand. Sora has numerous issues-the scale of which depends on who you ask, really. DQ has a whole ****house of issues, especially the music. Geno's just Geno. Really comes down to Squenix saying "eh you can have him".

If you have any more points, let me know-I'd love to show why I think he isn't dead haha

okay, but you haven't given any ponts as to why 2B or Gex won't be in
plus, if you're talking about global appeal, DQ still has plenty more points than geno, no offense. i like the guy, but we can't overstate geno.

admittedly though, i am skeptical of sora being the Squenix rep. however, i'm also skeptical of it being Geno.

 

[doomedtacox]

I dunno, I think they're going to announce Gex at The Game Awards alongside a Gex reboot exclusively on Switch.

Gex?

 

[Luigi The President]

While I love Geno, I personally don’t think the “advertising direct competitors” means anything.

We got Snake when MGS4 was coming out on PS3. We got Cloud when FFVII never came out on a Nintendo console. We got Ryu when SFV was coming out PS4 exclusive.

It comes down to legacy and demand. Well, and the power of friendship(!) in Snake’s case.

Cloud is a different case. He wasn't promoting direct competition. FFVII remake isn't even out yet; he was just there as Cloud, not promoting a rival company.

I think the issue comes in when you factor that Nintendo is choosing here.
Snake got in due to Sakurai. His close friendship with Kojima is entirely why Snake's here. And that was before the age of DLC; DLC which Nintendo selected, with 5 coveted slots, you get me here?

Now Ryu, I can understand. Problem with Ryu is that, well, he was announced EIGHT MONTHS before SFV's release.
With Sora, if he's indeed the first DLC character announced-which, if we're even entertaining the Squenix character due to Verge, is something we must go with as well-he'd be promoting a game that either came out, what, a mere month before his reveal, OR, a game that comes out a month after.

I hate to sound like I'm moving the goalposts. I hope you get where I'm coming from.

okay, but you haven't given any ponts as to why 2B or Gex won't be in
plus, if you're talking about global appeal, DQ still has plenty more points than geno, no offense. i like the guy, but we can't overstate geno.

admittedly though, i am skeptical of sora being the Squenix rep. however, i'm also skeptical of it being Geno.

I want to re-emphasize I mean global appeal for the Smash fanbase, which is what Ultimate has been targeting. You get me? For DLC, I can't imagine them not wanting at least one core fanbase pick because said pick likely placed very well on the Ballot-the best illustrator of what Smash fans /want to buy/ character-wise. Geno would be one of these picks imo.

Also I want KAINE and Gex thank you very much Nines

 

[Deleted member]

Gex?

Wait...did you only just notice I've been talking about Gex this whole time? Your first response:

To make more money directly from DLC and indirectly by marketing active game franchises?

was to a comment about Gex. I guess you just saw "Ge" and assumed I meant Geno?

 

[alemerltoucanet]

And now Nintendo is picking the Square rep. Unfortunately I feel like Geno would have to be a Sakurai pick if he was to get in.

Nah, I think Nintendo would. He's got a ton of fan demand and he is from their own series, Mario, just under a different holder (Square). And his rights are being used in the game we know via his token, so there is that as well.

 

[Luigi The President]

Nah, I think Nintendo would. He's got a ton of fan demand and he is from their own series, Mario, just under a different holder (Square). And his rights are being used in the game we know via his token, so there is that as well.

I mean the different holder part is something you're really underselling imo. That's a big issue for Geno.

 

[StrawHatX]

While I love Geno, I personally don’t think the “advertising direct competitors” means anything.

We got Snake when MGS4 was coming out on PS3. We got Cloud when FFVII never came out on a Nintendo console. We got Ryu when SFV was coming out PS4 exclusive.

It comes down to legacy and demand. Well, and the power of friendship(!) in Snake’s case.

It doesn’t mean anything. Just compare Geno and Sora and what it would mean for Nintendo and Square.

If Geno gets into Smash:
Nintendo - gets Geno in Smash
Square - gets Geno in Smash

If Sora gets into Smash:
Nintendo - gets Sora in Smash and possibility of KH ports in the future
Square - gets Sora in Smash and advertises the KH series to people who haven’t played it

It’s not really a hard decision. Now I don’t know how likely Sora is. I’ve heard Disney is apparently hard to deal with, but I have a hard time imagining why Disney would not want Sora in Smash considering how extremely popular it is and that KH3 is in the horizon.

With DQ it’s extremely popular in Japan and it’s average everywhere else. KH is extremely popular everywhere. Geno is a fan favorite from an old SNES title. There is a vocal fan base that want him in the Smash community and the rest of the community has heard about him because of it. Outside of the Smash community most don’t know who he is. Everyone knows Sora and can at least recognize Slime.

 

[NineS]

Nah, I think Nintendo would. He's got a ton of fan demand and he is from their own series, Mario, just under a different holder (Square). And his rights are being used in the game we know via his token, so there is that as well.

Being under a Nintendo franchise doesn't make him all that more likely.
This is a Nintendo pick. They will not do things the way Sakurai has. Of course, Sakurai still likely gets some say in it.

Truthfully, the only way Geno will really make it in is if Nintendo is taking the ballot as reference for some of the characters, and if Sakurai wants Geno to be the Square Enix rep more than other characters. We know Sakurai wants/would like Geno; we don't know how badly or how much he wants Geno to be in Smash compared to say, someone objectively far more iconic such as a DQ rep. Let alone, taking Nintendo into account overall makes him far less likely.

Geno is possible. But he's looking unlikely.
Sora may potentially promote Nintendo's competitor, I agree. Which is why I don't believe he's the most likely rep.
But Sora is also far more iconic and would make everyone more money overall, competitor or not.

 

[doomedtacox]

Wait...did you only just notice I've been talking about Gex this whole time? Your first response:


was to a comment about Gex. I guess you just saw "Ge" and assumed I meant Geno?

Ok well I've never even heard of Gex so I can guarantee they won't choose him lol.

 

[monadoboy]

A bit off topic, but what's everyone's thoughts on the Detective Pikachu Movie trailer?
I actually liked it. Didn't think I would.

To me, the trailer felt more "Pokemon" than Let's Go.

Because, you know, not ignoring 90% of the franchise.

 

[Luigi The President]

It doesn’t mean anything. Just compare Geno and Sora and what it would mean for Nintendo and Square.

If Geno gets into Smash:
Nintendo - gets Geno in Smash
Square - gets Geno in Smash

If Sora gets into Smash:
Nintendo - gets Sora in Smash and possibility of KH ports in the future
Square - gets Sora in Smash and advertises the KH series to people who haven’t played it

It’s not really a hard decision. Now I don’t know how likely Sora is. I’ve heard Disney is apparently hard to deal with, but I have a hard time imagining why Disney would not want Sora in Smash considering how extremely popular it is and that KH3 is in the horizon.

With DQ it’s extremely popular in Japan and it’s average everywhere else. KH is extremely popular everywhere. Geno is a fan favorite from an old SNES title. There is a vocal fan base that want him in the Smash community and the rest of the community has heard about him because of it. Outside of the Smash community most don’t know who he is. Everyone knows Sora and can at least recognize Slime.

Sora being in Smash doesn't suddenly open up the way for KH ports. That's just silly. KH ports are opened up /if Squenix wants them/ and if Nintendo consents to this. It doesn't come as a favor for putting one character in Smash.

By this logic, Squenix also advertises SMRPG to those who haven't played it.

 

[alemerltoucanet]

I mean the different holder part is something you're really underselling imo. That's a big issue for Geno.

Okay, that really is true. Though, however, they (like I stated) do have his rights in the game already, and Square & Nintendo are under good terms as seen with all of the FF support coming to Switch, plus Cloud's back (still with only two music tracks and no assist,so RIP). For the most part, I just think it boils down to if Nintendo did at all pick him or not out the characters they chose for Sakurai

 

[doomedtacox]

Sora being in Smash doesn't suddenly open up the way for KH ports. That's just silly. KH ports are opened up /if Squenix wants them/ and if Nintendo consents to this. It doesn't come as a favor for putting one character in Smash.

By this logic, Squenix also advertises SMRPG to those who haven't played it.

Why would they care about advertising SMRPG?

 

[Will]

It doesn’t mean anything. Just compare Geno and Sora and what it would mean for Nintendo and Square.

If Geno gets into Smash:
Nintendo - gets Geno in Smash
Square - gets Geno in Smash

If Sora gets into Smash:
Nintendo - gets Sora in Smash and possibility of KH ports in the future
Square - gets Sora in Smash and advertises the KH series to people who haven’t played it

It’s not really a hard decision. Now I don’t know how likely Sora is. I’ve heard Disney is apparently hard to deal with, but I have a hard time imagining why Disney would not want Sora in Smash considering how extremely popular it is and that KH3 is in the horizon.

With DQ it’s extremely popular in Japan and it’s average everywhere else. KH is extremely popular everywhere. Geno is a fan favorite from an old SNES title. There is a vocal fan base that want him in the Smash community and the rest of the community has heard about him because of it. Outside of the Smash community most don’t know who he is. Everyone knows Sora and can at least recognize Slime.

It's not always about the sales and the promotion.

The only promotional grab in Smash 4's DLC was , and that's always been Fire Emblem (and to an extent Pokemon)'s thing.

 

[Luigi The President]

When the resident Annoying Geno Brigade comes into this thread to yell at people per their daily quota

(do not hurt me i am also an annoying geno fan we live in harmony)

 

[NineS]

It's not always about the sales and the promotion.

The only promotional grab in Smash 4's DLC was , and that's always been Fire Emblem (and to an extent Pokemon)'s thing.

Agreed, though I think we can agree Corrin was a Nintendo-choice and less so a Sakurai choice.
Sakurai made Corrin the way he was (a far cry from every other sword fighter and unique) because he didn't really have too much of a say in the matter.

It's safe to assume Nintendo's picks will be promotional and sales-based judging off of what they've done in the past, whereas Sakurai is less about the money and more of what would be fun and what would work.

 

[Will]

It doesn’t mean anything. Just compare Geno and Sora and what it would mean for Nintendo and Square.

If Geno gets into Smash:
Nintendo - gets Geno in Smash
Square - gets Geno in Smash

If Sora gets into Smash:
Nintendo - gets Sora in Smash and possibility of KH ports in the future
Square - gets Sora in Smash and advertises the KH series to people who haven’t played it

It’s not really a hard decision. Now I don’t know how likely Sora is. I’ve heard Disney is apparently hard to deal with, but I have a hard time imagining why Disney would not want Sora in Smash considering how extremely popular it is and that KH3 is in the horizon.

With DQ it’s extremely popular in Japan and it’s average everywhere else. KH is extremely popular everywhere. Geno is a fan favorite from an old SNES title. There is a vocal fan base that want him in the Smash community and the rest of the community has heard about him because of it. Outside of the Smash community most don’t know who he is. Everyone knows Sora and can at least recognize Slime.

I don't understand the "recognizability" thing in your last paragraph. I mean, let's look at Geno's critera:

1. If you're heard of Smash and play Smash, you probably know Geno
2. If you already bought the game, the first statement applies

The only way I could think about how being recognized would draw people in is if they go "oh boy i cant wait to buy this 69.99 + 4.99 game to play as sora specifically" followed up by "300 dollars to play this game outside of my ps4! it's sora, so i'm dumb and blind and rich so it's worth it!", and that's ****ing dumb unless Sora was the main protagonist.

 

[Pyr]

If a rep comes from SMRPG, clearly it should be the best character in the game.

Spoiler: Hint: It's not Geno

He's best husbando don't @me. Forgive me Geno

 

[KingofKoopas]

I feel lazy and exhausted tonight all i want to say is Mickey Mouse's ears.

 

[The DanMan051]

Being under a Nintendo franchise doesn't make him all that more likely.
This is a Nintendo pick. They will not do things the way Sakurai has. Of course, Sakurai still likely gets some say in it.

Truthfully, the only way Geno will really make it in is if Nintendo is taking the ballot as reference for some of the characters, and if Sakurai wants Geno to be the Square Enix rep more than other characters. We know Sakurai wants/would like Geno; we don't know how badly or how much he wants Geno to be in Smash compared to say, someone objectively far more iconic such as a DQ rep. Let alone, taking Nintendo into account overall makes him far less likely.

Geno is possible. But he's looking unlikely.
Sora may potentially promote Nintendo's competitor, I agree. Which is why I don't believe he's the most likely rep.
But Sora is also far more iconic and would make everyone more money overall, competitor or not.

That still requires SE to agree to it. And I don't see why they would agree to having a one-off character from a 22 year old game as DLC when there's dozens of other choices that are far more recognizable and more likely to sell.
The Mii Fighter costume was small fry, and the fact it got it's own little splash screen and individual announcement kinda implies to me that it was far from the easiest to get (compared to every other 3rd party MF costume being revealed as part of a batch).

 

[Luigi The President]

Why would they care about advertising SMRPG?

SMRPG is on the SNES Mini. It's their game. The SNES Mini came out a mere year ago.
EDIT: This is complete misinfo, and I apologize.

Though, they'd still be advertising their character.

That still requires SE to agree to it. And I don't see why they would agree to having a one-off character from a 22 year old game as DLC when there's dozens of other choices that are far more recognizable and more likely to sell.
The Mii Fighter costume was small fry, and the fact it got it's own little splash screen and individual announcement kinda implies to me that it was far from the easiest to get (compared to every other 3rd party MF costume being revealed as part of a batch).

I don't think that really implies anything.
I think it implies Sakurai wanted to recognize how popular Geno was. Because he outright stated he's aware of Geno's popularity and wanted to throw his fans a bone. That's...kinda all it seems to imply.

 

[StrawHatX]

Sora being in Smash doesn't suddenly open up the way for KH ports. That's just silly. KH ports are opened up /if Squenix wants them/ and if Nintendo consents to this. It doesn't come as a favor for putting one character in Smash.

By this logic, Squenix also advertises SMRPG to those who haven't played it.

Of course it doesn’t. But Nintendo and SE are getting along now and Nintendo is getting a lot of FF ports. You don’t think they would love to get some KH games coming to the Switch? Which would benefit both companies?

There’s a lot of people who only play on Nintendo consoles that haven’t touched a KH game. Putting Sora into Smash and then getting KH games on the Switch would probably make them interested in trying them out.

Geno can’t do anything like that.

 

[Will]

SMRPG is on the SNES Mini. It's their game. The SNES Mini came out a mere year ago.


I don't think that really implies anything.
I think it implies Sakurai wanted to recognize how popular Geno was. Because he outright stated he's aware of Geno's popularity and wanted to throw his fans a bone. That's...kinda all it seems to imply.

Dude, Nintendo owns the game, just not the character.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Id like to see the story of Ganons childhood as the only male in a female race

 

[Luigi The President]

Of course it doesn’t. But Nintendo and SE are getting along now and Nintendo is getting a lot of FF ports. You don’t think they would love to get some KH games coming to the Switch? Which would benefit both companies?

There’s a lot of people who only play on Nintendo consoles that haven’t touched a KH game. Putting Sora into Smash and then getting KH games on the Switch would probably make them interested in trying them out.

Geno can’t do anything like that.

I think that Sora being in Smash and KH ports are two entirely different deals. And to our knowledge, there are no KH ports coming to Switch right now. We are basing this argument off of ports that don't even exist yet.

Dude, Nintendo owns the game, just not the character.

Dudette, but thanks, I was misinformed. Le take the L epic dance.

 

[KingofKoopas]

Id like to see the story of Ganons childhood as the only male in a female race

lucky *******...

 

[alemerltoucanet]

Of course it doesn’t. But Nintendo and SE are getting along now and Nintendo is getting a lot of FF ports. You don’t think they would love to get some KH games coming to the Switch? Which would benefit both companies?

There’s a lot of people who only play on Nintendo consoles that haven’t touched a KH game. Putting Sora into Smash and then getting KH games on the Switch would probably make them interested in trying them out.

Geno can’t do anything like that.

What Geno can do is bring in sales from all of his amazing fans though, and encourage people to try out his game via a SNES Classic or something lol. XD

 

[Will]

Id like to see the story of Ganons childhood as the only male in a female race

Gossip over who the daddy is because it's either the really old ass man before him or some hylian joe.