Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Will]

...Wait... Ridley? Mega Man? Bowser Jr.? Mii?

Isaac!? King K. Rool!?

DON'T DO THIS TO ME, ARIGARMY!

I'm pretty sure that he was requested to do it or just did it for fun, it's not like they were in the files or anything or else we'd know.

 

[KMDP]

I'm pretty sure that he was requested to do it or just did it for fun, it's not like they were in the files or anything or else we'd know.

I figured, but a man can dream.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't know if there's a Kombat Kraze in Japan, sounds like a tinfoil theory as of now.

I doubt Mortal Kombat enjoys any degree of popularity in Japan. I don't know how well the most recent games sold there, but now I'm curious if any Japanese players entered MKX at Evo at all.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I don't know if there's a Kombat Kraze in Japan, sounds like a tinfoil theory as of now.

It’s more of a hope for me, just because I really want a Street Fighter X Mortal Kombat crossover/Mario and Sonic or Luigi vs Scorpion and Sub Zero

 

[Mc.Rad]

I know I said that we really shouldn't be expecting news this month but.... damn I just want some like... new good info to be revealed...

Like Stage Creator???

Mii Fighter creation???

Anything???

 

[KMDP]

Its a Sakurai famitsu article. Source Gaming translated it as well as included it in their Rate that character for Geno. Either watch that or just Google Source Gaming Sakurai.

Just watched the Rate that Character for Geno.

Sakurai (paraphrased): "The Mii Gunner plays similarly to how I envisioned Geno to play."

With that in mind, we could, in theory, get Geno as a "Special Mii Fighter" (or a Mii Fighter Echo Fighter" XD), where he is a specific build of Mii Gunner (set height, weight and special moves), has a unique voice set and the Announcer refers to him as "Geno". Maybe he also has a Final Smash unique to him to set him apart from other Mii Gunners.

While it's not perfect, it does kill three birds with one stone.

1) Geno becomes Playable, albeit in a roundabout way.​

2) A version of Mii Gunner is playable online (same with other character builds and Mii Fighters).​

3) Development time is saved for other characters.​

​

Granted, I don't put too much stock in this idea (I wouldn't want my characters to just be Mii Fighter builds, no matter how special XD), but it is something we should be prepared for.

 

[Green_Pikmin*]

Just watched the Rate that Character for Geno.

Sakurai (paraphrased): "The Mii Gunner plays similarly to how I envisioned Geno to play."

With that in mind, we could, in theory, get Geno as a "Special Mii Fighter" (or a Mii Fighter Echo Fighter" XD), where he is a specific build of Mii Gunner (set height, weight and special moves), has a unique voice set and the Announcer refers to him as "Geno". Maybe he also has a Final Smash unique to him to set him apart from other Mii Gunners.

While it's not perfect, it does kill three birds with one stone.

1) Geno becomes Playable, albeit in a roundabout way.​

2) A version of Mii Gunner is playable online (same with other character builds and Mii Fighters).​

3) Development time is saved for other characters.​

​

Granted, I don't put too much stock in this idea (I wouldn't want my characters to just be Mii Fighter builds, no matter how special XD), but it is something we should be prepared for.

Prepare for the storm my friend.

 

[KMDP]

Prepare for the storm my friend.

Time to hunker down in the ol' Storm Shelter, then.

 

[P.Kat]

The Brawl VA did a similar thing.

Krystal? *sigh* what could of been

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

On the topic of Xander, I think he went down in Smash Announcer history for doing the entire 50 Facts Extravaganza.

YUP!!!

 

[TMNTSSB4]

The Brawl VA did a similar thing.

I’m glad Mega Man didn’t join Smash without Xander saying his name...wouldn’t have been satisfying

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Krystal? *sigh* what could of been

Man, hearing that without any context is kind of frightening. Imagine hearing that on a loudspeaker cranked to 10 in the middle of night. It would be like the voice of God issuing forth his commandments.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

On the topic of Xander, I think he went down in Smash Announcer history for doing the entire 50 Facts Extravaganza.

YUP!!!

And singing the Pokémon anime theme song

 

[KMDP]

I’m glad Mega Man didn’t join Smash without Xander saying his name...wouldn’t have been satisfying

I dunno, I kind of like "Rockmun".

I wonder if that's the Jewish Megaman?

 

[N3ON]

The Brawl VA did a similar thing.

Ah the Brawl era, where lists had one FE character and three Golden Sun ones. ;P

 

[Arcanir]

Is lycanroc really that likely though? It's kind of the zoroark of Gen 7, Meant to be the next Lucario but never really living up to the hype despite a whole lot of special treatment.

Zoroark in retrospect is really a strange case. Granted, I think it would've been passed over regardless of how popular it was thanks to Gen 6 being on the horizon, but it feels like GF/TCPi wanted it to be big like Lucario, yet didn't quite commit to it or screwed it over entirely.

For example:
-Game-wise, it's distribution method was one of the most needlessly complex as you needed a limited-time event Pokémon from HGSS, a feature that you have to find in the game's biggest area, and then transfer them (using two different DS) and bring them to a specific area that triggers their capture. Compared to other mascots (ex. Lucario only needed you to complete the Iron Island sidequest), they required fans to jump through a lot of hoops to get it, and I wouldn't be surprised if many fans didn't even get their hands on it without trading. In terms of the game's story, N did use one, but it was overshadowed by Reshiram/Zekrom.
-In the main anime, it didn't appear until the last arc of the whole series, other mascots made their appearances at least earlier then the halfway point (if not no more then a third of the way through). It did have the movie though.
-Spinoff-wise, it wasn't really used or promoted that much, the legendaries, the starters, and even Axew had more push.
-TCG-wise, it headlined a set at least.

In the end, it kind of felt half-baked in its execution for the lack of a better term. They handled it in a way that didn't allow for it to latch on to as many fans as it could've, and that caused it to be left behind while other popular Pokémon from its generation (ex. the legendaries, Chandelure) and those outside of it (ex. Kanto Pokémon, and even Lucario) to come in and surpass it. The only positive thing that can be said about its treatment is that TCPi learned from their mistake and were much more efficient with their mascots since then (ex. Mega Charizard X was in Origins, easy to get in XY, and everywhere in the franchise during Gen 6).

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I doubt Mortal Kombat enjoys any degree of popularity in Japan. I don't know how well the most recent games sold there, but now I'm curious if any Japanese players entered MKX at Evo at all.

It’s more of a hope for me, just because I really want a Street Fighter X Mortal Kombat crossover/Mario and Sonic or Luigi vs Scorpion and Sub Zero

Last I checked, the series doesn't appeal to them (can't blame them too much, considering the somewhat cheesy use of Asian elements sometimes).

 

[monadoboy]

I'm pretty sure that he was requested to do it or just did it for fun, it's not like they were in the files or anything or else we'd know.

On the narrator thing, I'm 99.9% sure I read/heard Xander say that they made him name a ton of characters during recording, which would kill like, three birds with one stone. Get the game characters, get the possible DLC characters, and prevents possible leaks.

 

[Deleted member]

Last I checked, the series doesn't appeal to them (can't blame them too much, considering the somewhat cheesy use of Asian elements sometimes).

Gotta love how Raiden's name is pronounced "Ray-den" instead of "Rye-den" because it was made by people who didn't know any better, and now it's too ingrained in the series history to change at this point.

It does give me a nice distinction between Metal Gear Raiden and Mortal Kombat Raiden due to the pronunciation difference though.

 

[P.Kat]

Man, hearing that without any context is kind of frightening. Imagine hearing that on a loudspeaker cranked to 10 in the middle of night. It would be like the voice of God issuing forth his commandments.

I would literally think that the world was ending.

 

[papagenos]

If Geno ended up as like a semi clone of Mii gunner, I aint even mad, i just want him on that CSS haha

I think he has a bit more potential than that, but the idea of "gun for a hand" seems to be what sakurai likes to talk about with him so im pretty sure hes had a Geno moveset planned in his mind for a while.

 

[monadoboy]

Zoroark in retrospect is really a strange case. Granted, I think it would've been passed over regardless of how popular it was thanks to Gen 6 being on the horizon, but it feels like GF/TCPi wanted it to be big like Lucario, yet didn't quite commit to it or screwed it over entirely.

For example:
-Game-wise, it's distribution method was one of the most needlessly complex as you needed a limited-time event Pokémon from HGSS, a feature that you have to find in the game's biggest area, and then transfer them (using two different DS) and bring them to a specific area that triggers their capture. Compared to other mascots (ex. Lucario only needed you to complete the Iron Island sidequest), they required fans to jump through a lot of hoops to get it, and I wouldn't be surprised if many fans didn't even get their hands on it without trading. In terms of the game's story, N did use one, but it was overshadowed by Reshiram/Zekrom.
-In the main anime, it didn't appear until the last arc of the whole series, other mascots made their appearances at least earlier then the halfway point (if not no more then a third of the way through). It did have the movie though.
-Spinoff-wise, it wasn't really used or promoted that much, the legendaries, the starters, and even Axew had more push.
-TCG-wise, it headlined a set at least.

In the end, it kind of felt half-baked in its execution for the lack of a better term. They handled it in a way that didn't allow for it to latch on to as many fans as it could've, and that caused it to be left behind while other popular Pokémon from its generation (ex. the legendaries, Chandelure) and those outside of it (ex. Kanto Pokémon, and even Lucario) to come in and surpass it. The only positive thing that can be said about its treatment is that TCPi learned from their mistake and were much more efficient with their mascots since then (ex. Mega Charizard X was in Origins, easy to get in XY, and everywhere in the franchise during Gen 6).

Poor guy could've at least gotten a Mega, a Z-move, or playable in Pokken. I legit had a dream Zoroark was confirmed for Smash 4 before they revealed the game at E3. Seemed like such an obvious thing at the time.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I dunno, I kind of like "Rockmun".

I wonder if that's the Jewish Megaman?

A Jewish MegaMan game is now needed

Last I checked, the series doesn't appeal to them (can't blame them too much, considering the somewhat cheesy use of Asian elements sometimes).

Even if they don’t appeal to them, it would still be cool

 

[ChronoBound]

Just watched the Rate that Character for Geno.

Sakurai (paraphrased): "The Mii Gunner plays similarly to how I envisioned Geno to play."

With that in mind, we could, in theory, get Geno as a "Special Mii Fighter" (or a Mii Fighter Echo Fighter" XD), where he is a specific build of Mii Gunner (set height, weight and special moves), has a unique voice set and the Announcer refers to him as "Geno". Maybe he also has a Final Smash unique to him to set him apart from other Mii Gunners.

While it's not perfect, it does kill three birds with one stone.

1) Geno becomes Playable, albeit in a roundabout way.​

2) A version of Mii Gunner is playable online (same with other character builds and Mii Fighters).​

3) Development time is saved for other characters.​

​

Granted, I don't put too much stock in this idea (I wouldn't want my characters to just be Mii Fighter builds, no matter how special XD), but it is something we should be prepared for.

These are Sakurai's exact words on Geno:

—What led you to decide to make a Geno costume after all this time?

Sakurai: To tell the truth, it’s because I wanted Geno to be a playable character. He has a gun for a hand, and I think he fits in really well with Smash. During Brawl, I thought it would be great if I could add him, but in the end it didn’t become a reality.

—Because of that, you added him as a Mii Costume this time?

Sakurai: That’s right. He’s very popular. When talking about older characters, Geno always gets a lot of requests. He didn’t appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve something kind of close to that as a Mii Costume.

Nowhere does he explicitly mention that the Mii Gunner is exactly how he envisions Geno would fight. That analysis video by Source Gaming needed to re-check the source materials.

 

[Deleted member]

Poor guy could've at least gotten a Mega, a Z-move, or playable in Pokken. I legit had a dream Zoroark was confirmed for Smash 4 before they revealed the game at E3. Seemed like such an obvious thing at the time.

At least it's still the only Pokemon that gets Illusion. That's something, right?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

A Jewish MegaMan game is now needed

Even if they don’t appeal to them, it would still be cool

True there. However MKX isn't even distributed there, so that doesn't help. Although it'd be priceless to see the JP reaction.

That said, with any luck somebody will make a MM game that has him find Gold Man, for shekel points.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Nothing about what Mii Gunner does seems like what Geno does in Super Mario RPG IMO.

I kinda expect Geno to get the Cloud treatment and have all his attacks directly lifted from his game.

No experimentation, besides maybe timed hits that make your attacks stronger.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Nothing about what Mii Gunner does seems like what Geno does in Super Mario RPG IMO.

I kinda expect Geno to get the Cloud treatment and have all his attacks directly lifted from his game.

No experimentation, besides maybe timed hits that make your attacks stronger.

The Perfect Smash mechanic would be perfect for this, IMO.

 

[Pyra]

Nothing about what Mii Gunner does seems like what Geno does in Super Mario RPG IMO.

I kinda expect Geno to get the Cloud treatment and have all his attacks directly lifted from his game.

No experimentation, besides maybe timed hits that make your attacks stronger.

Please let me Geno Whirl to damage my opponent's right eye more than nine times ninety nine

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Please let me Geno Whirl to damage my opponent's right eye more than nine times ninety nine

In before Geno becomes the next Bayonetta that pisses off the fanbase.

 

[KMDP]

These are Sakurai's exact words on Geno:

—What led you to decide to make a Geno costume after all this time?

Sakurai: To tell the truth, it’s because I wanted Geno to be a playable character. He has a gun for a hand, and I think he fits in really well with Smash. During Brawl, I thought it would be great if I could add him, but in the end it didn’t become a reality.

—Because of that, you added him as a Mii Costume this time?

Sakurai: That’s right. He’s very popular. When talking about older characters, Geno always gets a lot of requests. He didn’t appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve something kind of close to that as a Mii Costume.

Nowhere does he explicitly mention that the Mii Gunner is exactly how he envisions Geno would fight. That analysis video by Source Gaming needed to re-check the source materials.

I feel this is something PushDustIn should answer; since I believe he was the one who translated the relevant article(s), and was also the one who mentioned it in the RTC Video.

Besides, I have to go to bed, unfortunately.

Note: To give context to the argument for PDI, we're talking about whether or not Sakurai based the Mii Gunner on his vision for Geno.

 

[Dracyoshi]

Hypothetically: What if every Mii Fighter were cloned into a new fighter so that you could play them online?
Mii Gunner would be Geno, but what about Brawler and Swordfighter?

I don't expect them to actually do this; it's a very clumsy workaround that's an insult to fans of whatever character becomes a Mii Fighter clone. But if it were to happen, who would be clones of who?

 

[papagenos]

Please let me Geno Whirl to damage my opponent's right eye more than nine times ninety nine

The day Geno gets announced (if it happens) that video will be everywhere and I cant wait.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

These are Sakurai's exact words on Geno:

—What led you to decide to make a Geno costume after all this time?

Sakurai: To tell the truth, it’s because I wanted Geno to be a playable character. He has a gun for a hand, and I think he fits in really well with Smash. During Brawl, I thought it would be great if I could add him, but in the end it didn’t become a reality.

—Because of that, you added him as a Mii Costume this time?

Sakurai: That’s right. He’s very popular. When talking about older characters, Geno always gets a lot of requests. He didn’t appear as a fighter, but I was able to achieve something kind of close to that as a Mii Costume.

Nowhere does he explicitly mention that the Mii Gunner is exactly how he envisions Geno would fight. That analysis video by Source Gaming needed to re-check the source materials.

Doesn't this all kind of suggest we'll be seeing Geno in this game this time? Sakurai favoring him this much for playable spot really suggests me that he's much more likelier than we all think, and a lot people here are kind of sleeping on his chances.

I mean, it's still up to Square Enix to let him be fully in - but IDK how they'd be willing to be dropping the ball on Geno being in such a phenomenal and huge game as Smash Bros Ultimate.

 

[Noipoi]

Please let me Geno Whirl to damage my opponent's right eye more than nine times ninety nine

Gimme Frog coins! Gimme Mario! Gimme Frog coins! Gimme Mallow! Gimme see ya! Gimme Geno! Gimme cookies!

 

[ChronoBound]

This might be an unpopular sentiment, but I feel that Toad has been long overdue to Smash Bros. (really his credentials were strong enough to get him into Brawl, and certainly Smash 4 when he returned to being a playable character in the mainline platformer games). Toad might be the single most iconic Nintendo character that is not yet playable in the series yet. Even if it is through the form of Captain Toad, I do not think the Mario series's representation is "complete" yet without a character that has been a part of the playable cast since 1988. Its even more bizarre when characters with a sporadic appearance in the mainline games (Rosalina) managed to make it in sooner, and it looks like even one-shot Geno will make it in over him.

Captain Toad technically has not been ruled out yet, but they missed a grand opportunity, if he is a playable character, to confirm him last week. To make matters worse, it seems that the stars are aligning for an Ashley confirmation during the week of WarioWare Gold's release.

Its such a shame regarding Toad. Waluigi and Geno have managed to overshadow him due to those two have far more passionate supporters, yet if you were to ask, most would certainly say Toad stands above all other Nintendo characters at this point in terms of history, popularity, and iconic status (aside from maybe the DK duo, K. Rool and Dixie Kong).

I am not sure if Toad (Captain Toad or the classic design) will ever be playable in Smash Bros. It appears Geno is next in line, and most passion now is being driven behind Waluigi for a possible future title. I feel what cursed the character to an eternal NPC fate was his role as Peach's special starting in Melee. If Captain Toad did not have the "inability to jump" as one of his main characteristics I feel many more would be behind his inclusion as a way to include the Toad brand as part of the playable character in the series. As it stands, I think this one characteristic may have been something to which made Sakurai already rule him out right off the bat.

However, assuming the DK series finally gets its due in terms of newcomers this time around, I feel the omission of Toad (Captain, classic, Blue, whatever) might be the only glaring omission left for the series in terms of Nintendo characters. I am personally very happy with the roster, but I just wanted to remark while the topic was on Mario newcomers, that Toad, despite the characters's impressive history and resume, might never make it in.

How do others here feel about Toad and/or Captain Toad?

 

[Deleted member]

How do others here feel about Toad and/or Captain Toad?

Toad is always my favorite character to pick in Mario Spin-offs, so I'd love to have him in, but it's not an absolute deal breaker for me that he isn't in.

 

[KMDP]

Hypothetically: What if every Mii Fighter were cloned into a new fighter so that you could play them online?
Mii Gunner would be Geno, but what about Brawler and Swordfighter?

I don't expect them to actually do this; it's a very clumsy workaround that's an insult to fans of whatever character becomes a Mii Fighter clone. But if it were to happen, who would be clones of who?

That's why it should use Mii Costumes based on already playable characters, and be "off-brand" characters.

Mii Brawler: Lolmerk, Ganondork, Wift Troner
Mii Gunner: Sams, Gee No, Megimern
Mii Swordfighter: Lonk, Merf, Clerd

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

I've never got the hype around Toad or Captain Toad, but I'd be down if either were in the game.

 

[Fenriraga]

The notion that Geno would work as a Mii Gunner clone is baffling to me, I really dunno what SG was thinking with that bit. If an arm cannon was all you needed to classify as a Mii Gunner clone, then Mega Man would have gone VERY differently during 4's development.

Remember when people said Mega Man would just be a Samus clone if he made it into Smash?