Should Planking (i.e. Ledgestalling) be Banned?

[RPK]

Japanese Ledge Grab Rule ftw. That is all

 

[Ravener]

Yes, Planking should be banned because it wrecks the game imo.
Thats all i have to say.

 

[XienZo]

Fastyouwish, Sonic's HA stall is easy negated and really shouldn't be banned. Try this: Spotdodge or Air dodge, Sonic loses a stock, gg.

Dude... I totally didn't know about this until you mentioned it, hehe. Nice!

It just goes to show that the easiest solutions are often overlooked, even by competitive rule makers.

Look, Sonic's HA stall works if you're UNDERNEATH Sonic. The stall doesn't work because Sonic flies upwards, but because even when he goes down, he'll bounce off any wall/ceiling that he's touching, regardless of whether he's even moving in that direction. Try it. It works on the ceiling of Spear Pillar if the target is in the cave UNDER Sonic.

 

[darkNES386]

^To clarify:

Sonic HA is stallable under a stage if he touches any part of the stage as he rises up. That simple.

If Sakurai wanted to be so funny with Tripping, he should have made something where after x number of regrabs in a row the character mis-grabs the ledge and falls.

 

[TLMSheikant]

Camping and ledgestalling are different in every way. Dont even start to compare them. Camping can easily be stopped by PS and smart aggresion. But ledgestalling ur remaining invincible and there is little to no chance of making them stop. The arguments of the antiban side are getting ridiculous.

 

[kigbariom]

I think a limit would settle controversy, I used to do this as Link with the tether grab and there is a pre-programmed limit, I think it's three with tether. But, yeah, I like it.

 

[illinialex24]

Fastyouwish, Sonic's HA stall is easy negated and really shouldn't be banned. Try this: Spotdodge or Air dodge, Sonic loses a stock, gg.

Actually I heard on a few stages that isn't true. He can home on certain parts of the stage and not you if he's stuck under there but if he tries to get back and you do this he dies.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Yep, if the attack initiates while the opponent is in invincibility frames, the HA goes down-right diagonally as if it missed.

Dude... I totally didn't know about this until you mentioned it, hehe. Nice!

It just goes to show that the easiest solutions are often overlooked, even by competitive rule makers.

wrong wrong wrong.
Sonic does not need the opponent to be near him period. You can spot dodge all you want and he will STILL hit the stage.

if Sonic uses the homig attack and there is no one aroud, he will still rise and hit the bottom of the stage.

Misinformation is misinformation.

 

[marth126]

U Just Jump Off And Back Air

 

[illinialex24]

U Just Jump Off And Back Air

Sure that works with Marth and some character like Fox and whatever and possibly even Wolf, but try telling me that Olimar can get back effectively.

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

^To clarify:

Sonic HA is stallable under a stage if he touches any part of the stage as he rises up. That simple.

If Sakurai wanted to be so funny with Tripping, he should have made something where after x number of regrabs in a row the character mis-grabs the ledge and falls.

He did Ike can only regrab the ledge 6 times with aether, the next one just makes him fall to his doom or maybe its the 6th one that makes him fall.

guess sakurai though Ike's planking was broken even though he can be hit out of his recovery from the stage...

 

[LordofDarkness]

Put an edge grab limit. It allows Planking but it doesn't allow excessive stalling.

 

[Kinzer]

Crap, I didn't realise that I didn't make the right reply, nor how old the post was...

...Let me just ask, how much would people suggest we do if we put a ledge-grab limit? How about for stages for more ledges, or Frigate Orpheon lol?

 

[illinialex24]

Crap, I didn't realise that I didn't make the right reply, nor how old the post was...

...Let me just ask, how much would people suggest we do if we put a ledge-grab limit? How about for stages for more ledges, or Frigate Orpheon lol?

Firgate is fine, I think you mean Norfair. Frigate has 1 ledge on the starting, but Norfair has like 10.

 

[furiousduffmanx]

IMO this poll actually is a bit uneven, i hope the community's vote really has an impact in mod's discussions

 

[Matador]

He did Ike can only regrab the ledge 6 times with aether, the next one just makes him fall to his doom or maybe its the 6th one that makes him fall.

guess sakurai though Ike's planking was broken even though he can be hit out of his recovery from the stage...

Same with TL and Link tether regrabs. After the third one, the tether misses the ledge iirc.

 

[Jack Kieser]

IMO this poll actually is a bit uneven, i hope the community's vote really has an impact in mod's discussions

You know, it might be a bit off-topic, but especially considering MLG_JV's re-formation of the SBR, I'd really like to see some prominent SBR-B members come in here and tell us straight if they even care what the results of this poll say and if they care what our opinions are. Like, really how much (because I'm sure they care to some extent, but 1% influence is still a small amount, and it'd be nice to know just how much they care what we think).

 

[rehab]

wrong wrong wrong.
Sonic does not need the opponent to be near him period. You can spot dodge all you want and he will STILL hit the stage.

if Sonic uses the homig attack and there is no one aroud, he will still rise and hit the bottom of the stage.

Misinformation is misinformation.

You have to be a good deal away from him, but once you're out of range, you're out of range, the attack doesn't register and he goes down.

PM?

 

[Zankoku]

You know, it might be a bit off-topic, but especially considering MLG_JV's re-formation of the SBR, I'd really like to see some prominent SBR-B members come in here and tell us straight if they even care what the results of this poll say and if they care what our opinions are. Like, really how much (because I'm sure they care to some extent, but 1% influence is still a small amount, and it'd be nice to know just how much they care what we think).

Yes, your votes will influence how much we look into an issue. For example, if a huge majority wants to do nothing about it, then we won't look into it because the community doesn't really care either. Otherwise we'll definitely discuss it to determine our ruling on the matter.

 

[Jack Kieser]

Much thanks are in order, Ankoku. I can't speak for anyone else, but I appreciate you responding (and so quick, too! lol).

 

[Falconv1.0]

And you wonder why people don't respond to your moronic statements.

You said all people defending it are MK mains and you're calling my statement moronic? It's not stalling, that's my opinion and I've actually been able to argue it.

Now shut the **** up and stop being a troll or I swear to God I will report you.

 

[Brinzy]

lol, Falconv. <3

 

[Kinzer]

You have to be a good deal away from him, but once you're out of range, you're out of range, the attack doesn't register and he goes down.

PM?

...Okay, so I suppose now this is warrented because this was made today...

...Sonic does not need a vessel to Homing Attack stall, all you have to do is not cancel the lag on Homing Attack and make sure he gets halted by an interception, A.K.A. the concrete stage. He bounces up after he collides with something so it's only goes with nature that he stays in place , bouncing nowhere with HA.

 

[Luur3]

I've never had a player plank against me, but after watching the vid, it seems an awful lot like stalling. I would have voted for number 1, but that would be pretty difficult to monitor. I say put a limit, maybe somewhere between 50 and 100.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

Please start testing at the number 56 if you do since our time limit is 8:00.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

...Ok, but how is that relevant to the ledge grab limit rule?

So as long as you don't "strategically" stall 50-70 times and let the Timer run out, there's no problem.

The rule eliminates the need to differentiate between supposedly "strategic" stalling and regular, "non-strategic"(?) stalling. As a general rule, if someone grabbed the ledge 50+ times, they were stalling in an excessive and illegal fashion. There's no ambiguity. Either you stalled (i.e., you grabbed the ledge 50+ times), or you didn't.

I don't understand why a distinction needs to be made for "strategic" stalling vs other kinds of stalling. It is irrelevant.

I was trying to tell someone that stalling for strategic purposes is not illegal, as long as you don't abuse it. If I were pit or Meta Knight and I kept jumping down and up from a ledge to stall, that would be illegal. If I were trying to do that to fake someone out, and after 5 jumps or so I came up and attacked when leased expected, that would not be considered an illegal stall.

 

[XienZo]

I was trying to tell someone that stalling for strategic purposes is not illegal, as long as you don't abuse it. If I were pit or Meta Knight and I kept jumping down and up from a ledge to stall, that would be illegal. If I were trying to do that to fake someone out, and after 5 jumps or so I came up and attacked when leased expected, that would not be considered an illegal stall.

But there's no way you could possibly do that 70 times all in a match.

 

[LoyalSoldier]

Going back to the original Plank vs SM video I notice that Plank did a little more than just cling to the edge. He was flying around under the map. I think that extreme a case of planking should be limited, but strategic planking should still be around.

 

[LuigiKing]

You said all people defending it are MK mains and you're calling my statement moronic? It's not stalling, that's my opinion and I've actually been able to argue it.

Now shut the **** up and stop being a troll or I swear to God I will report you.

No silly, I said all the MK mains were defending it, not that all people defending it were MK mains. Bowyer did *nicely* throw out that he was the oddball along with some other exceptions. I was just observing.

Also, you swore me out for making a pretty passive comment. I don't know what your issue is. I think that planking is ********, you think that running away and abusing the ledge constitutes a great fighting game, we have different opinions.

P.S. - Show a mod our full conversation and I highly doubt they would do anything to me about it. Now stop getting all up in arms and take a chill pill. People like you make me feel better about myself every single day

 

[brinboy789]

No silly, I said all the MK mains were defending it, not that all people defending it were MK mains. Bowyer did *nicely* throw out that he was the oddball along with some other exceptions. I was just observing.

Also, you swore me out for making a pretty passive comment. I don't know what your issue is. I think that planking is ********, you think that running away and abusing the ledge constitutes a great fighting game, we have different opinions.

P.S. - Show a mod our full conversation and I highly doubt they would do anything to me about it. Now stop getting all up in arms and take a chill pill. People like you make me feel better about myself every single day

click on ban by judge ruling. look at the first name. fail

 

[TLMSheikant]

Ok, so i was thinking: IF a limit to the number of ledgegrabs is in place. Would tether rehogging count?

 

[AvaricePanda]

Really, Planking IS stalling for time and it becomes pretty obvious when you sit there for 5 minutes and you're at a higher percent. The people one's planking have no options other than run out the time and lose or try to hit you, get gimped, and lose. Planking is strategic, but that doesn't mean it should be allowed.

And there really is a difference between ledgecamping, which isn't used continuously throughout a match, and ledgestalling, which takes many minutes. It's obvious that people aren't ledgecamping when 7 out of 8 minutes of the game, they're on the ledge planking.

For half the cast, it IS stalling. And stalling in a position where the opponent can't hit you is banned, and it always has been.

The only reason why we shouldn't consider banning Planking now is that it's not winning tournaments. It's not winning really anything. There's only been a couple memorable matches where people planked excessively. Planking isn't a major problem in the community right now, it's not even a problem.

But if it did get to be a problem, the ledge-grab rule would work best. Not only does the timer have to run out and your opponent (should) have to challenge saying you were planking, but you have to go over a very gratuitous amount of ledgegrabs to do so. That way, people can still ledge-camp effectively, but not ledgestall.

 

[illinialex24]

Really, Planking IS stalling for time and it becomes pretty obvious when you sit there for 5 minutes and you're at a higher percent. The people one's planking have no options other than run out the time and lose or try to hit you, get gimped, and lose. Planking is strategic, but that doesn't mean it should be allowed.

And there really is a difference between ledgecamping, which isn't used continuously throughout a match, and ledgestalling, which takes many minutes. It's obvious that people aren't ledgecamping when 7 out of 8 minutes of the game, they're on the ledge planking.

For half the cast, it IS stalling. And stalling in a position where the opponent can't hit you is banned, and it always has been.

The only reason why we shouldn't consider banning Planking now is that it's not winning tournaments. It's not winning really anything. There's only been a couple memorable matches where people planked excessively. Planking isn't a major problem in the community right now, it's not even a problem.

But if it did get to be a problem, the ledge-grab rule would work best. Not only does the timer have to run out and your opponent (should) have to challenge saying you were planking, but you have to go over a very gratuitous amount of ledgegrabs to do so. That way, people can still ledge-camp effectively, but not ledgestall.

Its not putting them in a place where they can't hit you. Any character can come back to the ledge from the a few inches, so they can go through the grab range of most characters. This means that Kirby and Jigglypuff can be punished for planking, its just better for them than staying on-stage if they are leading. MK and G&W on the other hand, now that is messed up.

 

[J-Money]

i got it, ban grabbing the ledge alltogether, bring back the melee days of when you get knocked off the stage, you lose.

 

[illinialex24]

Well there's a huge difference between grabbing the edge and repeatedly grabbing it without being able to be punished for doing so.

 

[Snap(803)]

sound like a plan brah.

 

[Falconv1.0]

Luigi King you called a pretty much true statement moronic, that's trolling.

How many times do I have to say I'm against planking and I think it's one of the gayest things ever, but I'm more against arbitrary bans against things that really aren't in need of banning.

 

[Man of Popsicle]

Brawl is a defensive game... why don't we just allow stalling and institute a longer time limit? Why make people play it a certain way?

And if meta flies under the stage... edgehog the other side.

 

[Falconv1.0]

Brawl is a defensive game... why don't we just allow stalling and institute a longer time limit? Why make people play it a certain way?

And if meta flies under the stage... edgehog the other side.

...Stalling is dragging on the game, not playing defensively. And planking isn't stalling.

So basically why not allow the IDC, because that's stalling. Essentially MK needs a lead for one second and now he can float around forever and ever. Wow, just wow dude.


Some people make my desk hit my head.

 

[Melomaniacal]

...Stalling is dragging on the game, not playing defensively. And planking isn't stalling.

Correction: planking doesn't have to be stalling. But it obviously can be used for stalling, as we all know, and that shouldn't be allowed.