Justblaze647
Smash Lord
Yeah... MK's jab out ranges his d-smash + the jab has a fair bit of ending lag...
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Should Metaknight Be Banned? The Poll (LISTEN TO THE SBR PODCAST!)
- Thread starter GofG
- Start date
- Status
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
Luigi's mansion should be banned IMO. <_<
∫unk
Smash Master
lol I can guarantee you I will get it off on you because I've gotten it off on better people (like DSF). I don't even main or play meta really he's just so stupidly easy to pick up and is just a better version of my main.
Theorycrafting is great but some things are just effing hard to get out of. technically you can SDI of most multi-hit boxes in Brawl.
The speed of the d-smash is discussed because it is assumed that it is so fast that you can't beat it. This is obviously not true so I was going a step ahead and suggesting why it does actually connect. honestly why did you even waste your breath with a yuna-like-nitpick.
And I'm not sure if the jab has IASA frames somewhere in there but there's a way to time it so you do d-smash ridiculously fast after the jab. I'm not a meta main or a frame data geek so I wouldn't be able to tell you exactly but it's possible to do it almost immediately after the jab.
name dropper.
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
Junk is right,
its happened to me on multiple occasions
and as for jab, i really wouldnt call it large amounts of ending lag,
its more like pits side b where the hitbox stays out for a long time even after you stop mashing the button
its happened to me on multiple occasions
and as for jab, i really wouldnt call it large amounts of ending lag,
its more like pits side b where the hitbox stays out for a long time even after you stop mashing the button
Justblaze647
Smash Lord
thumbswayup
Smash Master
It already is in MD/VA
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
because of planking right?
dawgbowl
Smash Ace
Many reasons went into banning it, but that was obviously one...
It really is a terrible stage though...
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
Why drop DSF's name?
Just because you may do it on DSF doesn't say anything to prove your point.
here let me show you why such a thing is silly.
I have never gotten Dsmashed after MK has jabbed me.
its basically the same support as you did.
I love it when people call theorycrafting then actas is if they do not do it themselves.
I guess it changes when people drop names or something at which point, lets all use anecdotal evidence to prove our points.
As for those moves that you can SDI out of.
Which can actually be done.
SDI out of tornado, Sheik's Fsmash, Zelda's Fsmash and Usmash.
All of those are not too difficult to perform difficult to perform.
The hitdelay is greater and the hitstun is much smaller.
Bolded part is known as straw mannning.
no one said that the Dsmash could not be beat.
So why did you even waste the time to type that response?
There are no IASA frames and you can only perform the Dsmash only AFTER the jab has finished.
The jab has a good amount of cool down time and due to its multihit nature (as well as the increased hit delay) SDI away before the Dsmash lands is not difficult at all.
your guarantees mean nothing to me. Prove that MK is guaranteed to land a Dsmash after a jab 100% of the time.
infomon
Smash Scientist
Sorry for n00b question, what is "planking"?
You misread what his post meant, it wasn't an absolute "this will work every time". He said you could land a dsmash after a jab, and it wasn't always easy to dodge. Thus he name dropped DSF to demonstrate that it was possible to hit with -- if it were stupidly easy to avoid, DSF shouldn't have been caught by it. "I will get it off on you" is not "I will hit you with it every time".
@infzy: planking is hardcore ledge camping.
Plank is a notorious ledge camper.
infomon
Smash Scientist
oh lol 
thanks.
thanks.
ftl
Smash Journeyman
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
thank you for that vid...
i rofld the whole time...
i rofld the whole time...
Infinitysmash
Smash Champion
Here's a picture for everyone who supports Metaknight so they can add it to their signature if they want:
Ken Neth
Smash Champion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LHAnxaqOltw&feature=related
I can't stand Plank. This vid is what he deserves lol. The ending is too good.
I can't stand Plank. This vid is what he deserves lol. The ending is too good.
At about 6:45 (A little after) it looks like MK does a glide attack that gets shielded. I believe this was one of the moves claimed by M2K to be punishable on shield...but for some reason the ICs seem unable to respond before MK begins barraging them again.
Could it have been a slightly exaggerated weakness?
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
Thats an absolute.
snowaxe
Smash Apprentice
No, why would you. Just because he has a hack does not mean he is banworthy. Smash is that series when its pointless to ban a character. I mean where would it end. Then people would want to ban snake, then ddd, it would not end!
brinboy789
Smash Champion
guys, he just joined, lets be gentle and no flaming please...
∫unk
Smash Master
My statement stands true. You will lose if you play me, and it will be because of your bad DI.
But keep theorycrafting on a internet forum it'll get you far irl.
It might be punishable if the person shielding was moving forward. The IC's were able to grab, but they were pushed back. If they had been running then shielded, it might have turned out much... differently ;d
∫unk
Smash Master
Anther
Smash Champion
Most moves spaced properly, especially ones with longer range aren't going to get shield grabbed all the time. If the Ic had walked forward a little bit and then threw up his shield he would've gotten a grab.
It's not supposed to be super guaranteed ;p.
So M2K's tip thread of "Shield then punish" on the glide attack was just a little understated?
It's "walk forward risk missing getting your shield up in time shield then grab because you pushed into MK's space unless he sees it coming and attacks early wait that's not reliable at all"
So easy!
Ken Neth
Smash Champion
He joined before you did....
>_>
And in my experience it is really hard to punish a glide attack without power shielding it. But then, it's not that hard to PS anyways.
Anther
Smash Champion
Did you just say that spacing to shield a predictable attack isn't easy XD? Getting your shield up within the time frame he has to attack you practically guarantees a powershield everytime too.
brinboy789
Smash Champion
O.o he only has 15 posts. i thought he just joined but w/e. i was just putting up his flame shield for him
∫unk
Smash Master
Yes, the point of this discussion is for how it affects real people playing a real game. Not about what you technically or theoretically can do.
That's not silly that just proves that you've never played a MK that's tried it on you.
I theorycraft? I'm one of the biggest supporters of saying things based on experience and knowledge of a matchup. Please know what you're talking about before you say it.
difficulty is relative I'm sure someone of your debating abilities understands this. And relatively in a match with a lot on a line people screw up.
Please stop talking as if you're the only one that knows how to break down a debate. I can assure you I can break down your argument modus ponen style but I save that for actually useful debates and not one with a random on the internet.
I know weaknesses in my own argument but if you knew a deeper level of philosophy you would know that smart people always know their own arguments but respond the way they do for a certain.
My reason is just to make you realize how stupid big your e-p3nis is. No one cares.
News flash: you don't have the best tech skill in the game. And I know you can SDI out of it. I didn't say you couldn't. I said in a real life situation you might screw up. Which you would do against me.
It doesn't matter if it doesn't work 100% of the time because it will work on YOU, as well as MOST PLAYERS. How do I know? Just from personal experience being on the receiving end and the dealing end of this.
If you're wary of this specific combination all the time then you fall for other stuff easier.
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
we dont care about that right now, personally i dont care if we have to ban more broken characters in order to make the game better in tourneys, but we arent talking about that, we will deal with the issue of banning other characters when that topic comes up, but as of right now we are talking about banning MK, so pls focus on that topic
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
Thanks for proving my argument.
You only get hit by it if you DI badly.
Meanwihle if you DI well you don't get hit.
By the way prove that you WILL win please. Seriously.
Cause dropping names totally supports your argument.
No it doesn't dude. It just says an MK has never landed the Dsmash on me after the jab. it says nothing about the Mk attempting it.
Reading comprehension much?(btw Raven tried it on me and he missed)
You did not theory craft?
You just did in your own post.
Theory?
let alone that you are saying it will work if the opponent DI's badly in your post preceding your most recent one. Contradiction too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowLink84 View Post
As for those moves that you can SDI out of.
Which can actually be done.
SDI out of tornado, Sheik's Fsmash, Zelda's Fsmash and Usmash.
All of those are not too difficult to perform difficult to perform.
The hitdelay is greater and the hitstun is much smaller.
difficulty is relative I'm sure someone of your debating abilities understands this. And relatively in a match with a lot on a line people screw up.
Again where are you getting such ideas?
I am ttacking the fact that you strawmanned and acting as if that answers anything towards the discussion beforhand concerning MK's Dsmash.
*facepalm*
Did you just try to say that you made a bad argument because of that deeper philosophic level?
Stop tossing things out your ***.
Which is why you continue to post.
Don't care? Don't post
Baseless assumptions get you nowhere dude.
you said and I quote
[quote I guarantee I can land it on you[/quote]
you said you guarantee it, does that not insinuate that you will be capable of always landing it.
Newsflash buddy. SDI is easy in this came compared to melee and SSB64.
Yes as you said it requires an error, but it requires a blatant error.
in either case, that does NOT disprove the fact you can SDi and avoid the Dsmash.
if you're going to argue, it'll happen eventually.
Then the Ice Climbers are top tier because they will eventually land their CG.
really? prove you will land it on me most of the time please.
Again, baseless assumptions get you nowhere.
gee how?
OMG PERSONAL EXPERIENCE! MY ARGUMENT IS REFUTED!
no wait, not really since its anecdotal and you said it yourself. proper DI disables it. Considering how long the jab is as well as hit delay and ability to SDi, you have nothing.
Really? Prove this now.
-Jumpman-
Smash Champion
This is the most idiotic **** I've ever seen. If you can hit the jab with MK, you could have used d-smash instead anyway. Dumb idiots.
Anther
Smash Champion
If you guys think MK's jab guarantees a dsmash, that's f'd up. There's this thing called jabs have low hitstun and these other things called a shield or DI.
Some of yall are losing because you're blocking out any sort of hope of learning the game >.>
Some of yall are losing because you're blocking out any sort of hope of learning the game >.>
Mocha19
Smash Journeyman
From what I've seen, that jab is useless..
MK's jab guarantees a dsmash if the opponent tries to attack through it for some inexplicable reason. I figure it's the same lapse of intelligence that causes people to try to attack Zelda/Sheik right out of respawn transform even though they're still invincible. Every time.
I'm definitely more convincing, go for it.
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