Ranking moves in Characters (Round 21: Discussing Down-Special)

[Bigbomb2]

Link dtilt - would be an excellent tilt except it comes out on frame 11. Unless they are hit by the tip of the sword and then DI away, it almost always will combo into a Fair at lower percents (if all hits connect it does 34%) and upair at medium to high percents. Probably a high C or lower B
Bowser dtilt - High damage, fairly safe on shield, can KO reliably. Can be used in all sorts of ways. Definite B tilt
Ike dtilt - Fast at frame 7, fairly safe on shield if spaced well, reliably combos into Nair or Fair. Is the faster but weaker version of Link's tilt. A solid B

 

[TheHypnotoad]

Robin's dtilt is mediocre, as with all of his tilts. It's fast, but has very little reach. That's really all there is to say about it. Probably C tier.

Rosalina's dtilt is excellent. It's fast, but more importantly, has insanely good range, making it a fantastic poke. Luma can make the range even better. And Rosalina has a crawl, which means it's easier to space the dtilt, although I don't know if this is relevant. A tier, B tier at worst.

Cloud's dtilt is godlike. It's fast, difficult to punish for characters with subpar OoS options due to Cloud moving during the attack, and combos into pretty much any one of his aerials within a very large percent window. Most likely S tier. EDIT: Actually, I change my mind. Probably A tier.

Mewtwo's dtilt is ****ing borked. If there were an S+ tier I would throw it in there without hesitation, that's how good it is. Someone above me already explained it, but there is absolutely no argument for putting this move anywhere but in S tier.

 

[|RK|]

Since Diddy's dtilt will inevitably be S, I'd nominate Kirby's for the same tier or in A.

The main difference between the moves is this - Diddy has a kit that takes better advantage of it. In a vacuum? Kirby's has a little less range, but... has a 30-35% trip chance, one more active frame than Diddy's, one extra frame of endlag, and resets Kirby's profile to it's lowest state (you know, where he can duck KO punch and True Shoryuken).

But of course, it's about two frames less safe on shield. So potentially S, probably A.

 

[arbustopachon]

https://gfycat.com/DamagedCoarseEyas

Zard's d-tilt is a great poke, it has amazing range, deals 10% of damage, sends the opponents at a low angle, has great bkb and is rather safe on shield when spaced properly. Sadly the move does not kill untill very high percents and is not disjointed. It can be used effectivdely to edgeguard tho.

The move hits on frames 9 and 10, the faf is on frame 31. The move also has a windbox from frames 7-8 which helps the move to conect properly. Sadly the windbox also causes stupidly jank stuff when Zard gets grabbed during the move, like sending both zard and the opponent sliding for like half FD. This stupid jank might sometimes save your life and sometimes kill you.

So yeah, zard's d-tilt is a good long range poke. Nothing more nothing less.

 

[MarioMeteor]

Falco's down tilt is a very versatile move and is probably one of his best, due to its high KO power when sweetspotted and high combo potential when sourspotted. The only thing that holds this move back is its subpar range. It should be in either A tier or B tier.

 

[Seraphim.]

Roy's Dtilt is good, being one of his best options for his Neutral/Ledge trap game. The move hits on frame 7, safe on shield and does 11% damage (6.5% for the sourspot). Dtilt also sends opponents at a low angle which setups tech chase situations at mid and higher percents. PP Dtilt is also really good with Roy.

Dtilt itself combos into DED/Dash attack at low and mid percents, Dtilt > Dash attack is also a decent kill setup if you get the untechable reel animation.

Roy's Dtilt may have lost most of it's combo ability from Melee but it's still a pretty good move.

 

[LRodC]

Cloud's dtilt is godlike. It's fast, difficult to punish for characters with subpar OoS options due to Cloud moving during the attack, and combos into pretty much any one of his aerials within a very large percent window. Most likely S tier.

While it's a good down tilt, I don't think it's S tier worthy. It's too punishable for that, and it only combos into stuff at later % if the late hit connects. It is useful, however, and it can also 2 frame. I think it's A tier. I can think of a handful of down tilts that I think are better.

I think Mewtwo, Bayonetta, Little Mac, Diddy, and DK are S tier worthy.

Speaking of Little Mac, his down tilt is flat out one of the best moves in the game. It would be busted on any character with good aerials. Belongs in S without a doubt.

 

[Envoy of Chaos]

Either low A or high B it's a very nice move. Fairly quick, has decent range, can be used as a combo starter a effective mix up if you can drag airborne opponents down to the stage with Nair. It kills and its a good move to shield poke high up shields.

 

[Lavani]

S:
S~A:
A:
D:

Dunno if there are any dtilts that justify another tier below D, but move Palutena's down if there are.

 

[TheColorfulOrca]

- Definitely S Tier. Her fastest tilt (tied with UTilt), and sets up an absurd number of combos. A very important part of her kit (even after the slight nerf).

- While it has a bit of start-up, it has a ton of hitstun, and combos at all percents. It's even a kill confirm at high enough percents (DTilt > Parasol). Unfortunately, it can be teched, but it's still a pretty good DTilt. Around B Tier.

- One of his fastest moves, with a lot of range to boot. Can kill at high enough percents. One of his better grounded moves, probably B Tier.

- Similar to Bayo's, it's pretty fast and starts a large amount of combos. Arguably his most useful tilt, A Tier.

- Starts surprisingly quickly, and deals quite a bit of damage. A staple move for Samus, around B Tier.

 

[Mr Puddles]

Bowser Jr's dtilt is an awesome quick move. It catches people off guard since it comes out quite fast. It's good if you whiff a fsmash, you can immediately dtilt. Or on the landing of a kart dash cancel. It has a bit of landing lag though so I'm going to say it's B rank.

 

[ARGHETH]

- Similar to Bayo's, it's pretty fast and starts a large amount of combos. Arguably his most useful tilt, A Tier.

Considering it starts sooner, ends sooner, and combos into his other moves, I'd say it's inarguably his best tilt.

It has a bit of landing lag

You mean endlag? Landing lag is for aerials.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Ike's Dtilt: Pretty good. Frame 7, solid 8% damage, combos into Nair, Fair, and Bair. Fairly safe when spaced properly. All disjoint. Ike's second fastest move overall after Jab, same start up as Bair but able to act after it sooner. As pointed out before its a faster, weaker version of Link's with more combing out of it while Link's has the situational meteor in it: 8% vs 11%, Frame 7 vs Frame 11. Exact same FAF.

 

[Dee-SmashinBoss]

Zelda Dtilt isnt bad at all.
Frame 5, comboes into many things at various percents, depending on opponent DI can lead to a Fair or Uair or reverse Bair, great for catching the 2 frame window and it shifts her but this surprisingly low.

One problem is the fact that fast fallers at extremely low percents can shield after the first hit, but it's good at many things.
I'd say it fits well in A

 

[Crystanium]

Samus' Down Tilt

Pros

• Only 6 frames! That's faster than the rest of Samus' tilts.
• 12% damage. It's reasonable, as Super Missiles produce 10% damage.
• The hit box covers from the lower portion of Samus' pauldron (shoulder pad) to at least another crouching Samus. In other words, good range.
• Bomb to d-tilt allows for extra safety as the Bomb animation can be manipulated with IASA frames.
• Angle is 80°. D-throw is also 80° and dash attacks launch opponents up at 75°, which means Samus could go for an u-air.
• Useful for hitting opponents at the edge based on the 2 frames.

Cons

• You're better off using jab1 and jab2, since that's faster than jab1 to d-tilt.

I'd say A tier at least until I can see something better.

Mewtwo's down tilt for S tier. It comes out frame 6 with excellent range, it is a main combo starter and spacing tool, and it is a large part of the character's playstyle.

If you think that, then I think Samus' d-tilt should be in S tier for pretty much the same results. Samus' d-tilt in terms of damage beats Mewtwo's by 240%. Mewtwo's FAF is better, however.

 

[Emblem Lord]

D-tilt is basically the inverse of f-tilt in terms of quality among the cast.

There are ALOT of good d-tilts. Ryu has two that are both amazing and honestly neither one of them is S tier.

That should tell you how broken some of the d-tilts are in this game.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

only deals 6 % damage on exclusively grounded targets with a low launch angle but far too much endlag for potential tech chase followups. Only notable for some KO power, killing at about the same range that an Ftilt could - 120% with Mario pushed to a ledge. That's the second strongest Dtilt for killing outright. Jab is the superior attack in terms of frame data and followups. The windbox is the most interesting aspect. It can work as a deterrent against some projectiles like Pacman's bonus fruit and Pikmin Throw, and it can disrupt bad recoveries. The video definitely overstates the usefulness of it but I needed some visual examples of it in action. The only issue I have with the windbox is that it doesn't reach as far below the stage as you might hope. So good ledge snap windows or "magnet hands" generally have nothing to fear. As far as I know, hitting the 2 frame ledge snap window only sustains 1% damage to the victim as they grab the ledge. and the ground target only hitbox won't hit ledge hangers because they're considered "airborne". I would rank this above bottom tier for sure, but not far above. Killing and gimping are not common applications for a Dtilt, but the move fails to work for anything else and is much less safe to throw out than other ground moves like jab or even his dash attack.

Frame 10 move with comparable KO power to some of the weaker smashes in the game. 95% at the ledge, which is only reasonably rivaled by Ganon who needs closer to 125 but kills vertically. Doesn't followup into anything but 14% damage on the first swing is already comparable to some Dtilts that deal 7 then another 7 damage from an air followup at specific ranges. Plus there's a whole second swing. Dtilt 1 to Dtilt 2 is a true blockstring of 25% damage which either breaks a shield or makes people panic. And landing Dtilt at 0-20% can allow both swings to hit for that same amount, with some trip chance for an added 30% grab combo. The first swing can also reach as low as down angled Ftilt below the stage to catch 2 frame ledge snaps. But it's worse at this because 2 less active frames and more endlag allowing them to buffer ledge jump and escape fortress. But if you do manage to land this as an edgeguard, it's fantastic. Great reward on hit or block and the second swing beats dodges to boot.

His fastest move in terms of startup and the endlag is not bad. Basically the same as one of the good dash attacks in the game that doesn't require running and can be buffered (unlike dash options). Useful for getting people back on their side of the stage so he can set up more gordos. Definitely not bottom tier.

8 frame 14% damage vertical kill move that only requires about 10% more than Ganon to kill. Would put on the same tier or a tier above Samus for more reward on hit. Both moves can hit low ledge hangers/2 frame ledge snaps. Gunner's is held back by a short range hitbox for use onstage. Competes directly with Dsmash in startup, damage, and KO power, but Dsmash often fails to link into its second hit while also whiffing at point blank (seriously, it's bad).


My personal favorite move of his. Such a safe, long range poke that many opponents simply have no guaranteed OoS options to deal with repeated Dtilt besides dodge roll or jump to get away from him. Can't kill on it's own but will link into KO punch or rising uppercut.

D:

Dunno if there are any dtilts that justify another tier below D, but move Palutena's down if there are.

I would actually rate as the worst. At least Palutena has 11 active frames for idiots to run into. Plus it's got low endlag compared to the rest of her grounded moveset. If Palutena's could hit below the ledge it would be baller for ledge guarding. WFT's is slow, the hitbox is unacceptable, and it doesn't lead into anything. She wants attacks that push people out like Ftilt, rather than knock them into the air where she's more vulnerable to attack.

Edit: Also forgot whose can kill better than but not

 

[Emblem Lord]

Samus' Down Tilt

Pros

• Only 6 frames! That's faster than the rest of Samus' tilts.
• 12% damage. It's reasonable, as Super Missiles produce 10% damage.
• The hit box covers from the lower portion of Samus' pauldron (shoulder pad) to at least another crouching Samus. In other words, good range.
• Bomb to d-tilt allows for extra safety as the Bomb animation can be manipulated with IASA frames.
• Angle is 80°. D-throw is also 80° and dash attacks launch opponents up at 75°, which means Samus could go for an u-air.
• Useful for hitting opponents at the edge based on the 2 frames.

Cons

• You're better off using jab1 and jab2, since that's faster than jab1 to d-tilt.

I'd say A tier at least until I can see something better.



If you think that, then I think Samus' d-tilt should be in S tier for pretty much the same results. Samus' d-tilt in terms of damage beats Mewtwo's by 240%. Mewtwo's FAF is better, however.

Samus Dtilt is -18 on block.

Nah fam. It's B tier at BEST.

 

[ARGHETH]

If you think that, then I think Samus' d-tilt should be in S tier for pretty much the same results. Samus' d-tilt in terms of damage beats Mewtwo's by 240%. Mewtwo's FAF is better, however.

Mewtwo's ends 19 frames faster though...that's kind of significant.
(Samus' Dtilt has a FAF of 40)

 

[Mr Puddles]

You mean endlag? Landing lag is for aerials.

Thank you. Yes I did, I'll remember that.

 

[TheHypnotoad]

If you think that, then I think Samus' d-tilt should be in S tier for pretty much the same results. Samus' d-tilt in terms of damage beats Mewtwo's by 240%. Mewtwo's FAF is better, however.

I don't think you understand quite how ridiculous Mewtwo's dtilt is. Mewtwo's dtilt combos into freaking everything. You can do dtilt to fair, dtilt to nair, dtilt to uair, I've even seen someone combo dtilt into running up smash. It's one of the best combo moves in the game. It combos at low percents to build damage, and it combos at high percents to kill with fair.

Samus's dtilt does not do any of these things.

 

[FamilyTeam]

Marth, Lucina and Roy's Down Tilt is very good. Very fast, okay damage, good to make people get off of you fast, good for spacing, sometimes I can even use the to extend a string or two. I wouldn't even know where to put them in relation to each other, though. Probably Marth's at first, Lucie's second and Roy's third?

 

[Flamegeyser]

S candidates:
Bayo for ridiculously damaging combo setups as well as kill confirms and safety when spaced.
Diddy for kill confirms, speed, range, and safety.
Mewtwo for obvious reasons.
Ryu for high comboability and 2 frame kill confirms,
Meta Knight for obvious reasons.
Little Mac for obvious reasons.

 

[Geese]

MK's dtilt is very fast and is pretty good out of shield with a 25% chance to trip which will lead to a grab, and even without a trip it is still very easy to follow it with a grab, unless your opponent has a very fast ftilt or jab in which they can outspeed you. One major problem with it however being disjointed, if you are too close to an opponent it will miss then entirely, and even make you be on the other side of them.

 

[Y2Kay]

Greninja down tilt is basically only for kill confirms. Down tilt fair, and Down tilt up smash specifically.

Down tilt is great on big bodied characters and fast fallers if you "perfect" pivot them:

(footage by PHaZeX3R0 )

The move has a small hit box and isn't really safe on shield though. It's worthy of a B+

 

[Airpoizon]

, Probably Marth's at first, Lucie's second and Roy's third?

Eh, I'd put Roys above Lucina. Roys may have a tipper, but it does about 4% more than Lucinas sweet spotted, which is a pretty big difference if you compare the other moves. Also, Roys has an FAF of 22, while Lucina has an FAF of 24. Roys can also set up for tech chases easier by being overall faster and the fact that Roy has a better FAF frame. The only thing Lucina has better is that she doesn't have a sour spot.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

I would actually argue Marth's is the worst of the three. I'm having trouble picturing scenarios where you'd want his or lucina's Dtilt over Ftilt. The tipper range of the move is oppressively small as always, and unlike what Marth players mistakenly believe, you can't bury your sword into a target and expect a tipper, it's the lowest hitbox ID, which is why you don't often tip shields. Roy on the other hand has more than half of the move as a sweetspot rather than 15%. But it also doesn't reach quite as far. The reduced endlag does make it the safest on block, and with no hitbox ID issues to worry about. The 11% hit or the tipper hit should both leave the defender too far to shieldgrab allowing you to continue spamming the move until they roll or get pushed out of range. Marth and to a lesser extent Lucina would totally get shieldgrabbed if they were too close.

None of these are great moves as they lack proper KB scaling and a large hitbox arc, and I think I would rate them all on the same tier in the end. But my order from best to worst would be Roy, Lucina, Marth.

 

[Guido65]

down tilt should be A rank because:

• It is very safe on shield(-1 on shield drop and -8 on oos). Spaced dtilt is incredibly hard to punish.
• It is a combo starter and combos into grab at low %.
• Also it has good range and disjoint.
• Better then marcina and roys frame data wise(it is frame 5 with an faf of 20 vs frame 7 with an faf of 24 and an faf of 22).
• Mii swordfighter's fastest attack at frame 5 and is his best poke.

 

[LancerStaff]

Pit's is alright. It's basically stuck between Corrin and Marth's... Great range like Marth's and comes out fast, but low damage and it's punishable like Corrin's. Problem is that it really doesn't combo into anything... I'm saying B tier.

 

[TheGoodGuava]

I nominate Marth for A/S tier. -1 on shield drop, -8 oos, range makes it nearly unpunishable, sourspot combos into fsmash/grab at lower %s, great for catching 2 frames and leading into edgeguards, the only thing it doesn't do is kill and anti air. Lucinas is only 1 frame less safe on shield and does everything but combo.

Something I noticed nobody mention is the combo potential of the reverse hit of Marcina's up tilt. Marth can notably get 20+ off of it and kill confirm into tipper bair. Marth's also has great kill potential for an up tilt rivaling some up smashes when tippered, the only issue is its annoying as hell to space unlike his ftilt

 

[BunbUn129]

Meta Knight's d tilt is a very good move and like in Brawl is an important component of his ground game. It's safe on block at max spacing, and when shielded he can follow-up with a dash attack/grab mix-up depending on the opponent's reaction. Or he can d tilt again if they attempt to punish. For a character who has few low-committal neutral options, being able to just press a button is nice.

As good as it's frame data is, I don't think it should make the cut for S-tier. The move has poor range (shorter than Galaxia even though it's already shrunk down during the move), and is unsafe on hit at lower percentages if it doesn't trip. It also lacks consistency due to its trip chance; a lot of good d tilts have something that makes them a bit inconsistent, eg. Sheik's d tilt hitboxes having noticeably different launch angles, Mewtwo's sour d tilt having worse combo potential than the stronger hit, etc., but unlike MK's d tilt the inconsistencies are a result of different hitboxes and not a random mechanic.

I'd put MK's d tilt in A-tier.

 

[Funbot28]

Ok so here is the initial list for Down-Tilt:

Spoiler: Down-Tilt

Discuss!

 

[BunbUn129]

I think Ike and DK should be moved from C up to B.

Ike's d tilt has decently fast start-up at frame 8, does 8% which is pretty good for its speed, has ~20 frames of ending lag, and is disjointed. It also sends at the same angle and KB all throughout making it more consistent for combos than, say, Sheik's, MK's, Kirby's, Falco's, etc that are held back by trip chances, varied launch angles, or sourspots. Ike's d tilt is a solid spacing option as it's safe on shield and gives him good reward until mid-percents. Major drawback is that it sends too high up for follow-ups past mid-percents while not being strong enough to KO well, while Sheik for example can set-up other moves with her d tilt as late as ~130%.

DK's d tilt is frame 7, has intangibility for the first 9 frames, with a very good FAF of 23. It's safe on block, is a strong option for footsies as it beats out a lot of things, and can potentially set-up into other moves. While it's better than Ike's d tilt as a neutral option, it's less consistent because of it's trip chance, which is probably the only major drawback the move has. It could possibly be as good as the A-tier d tilts.

Edit: also I think Samus should be moved down to C-tier. Her d tilt has good start-up at frame 6 and deals a very nice 12% damage; however its high ending lag makes it unsafe and combined with its 80 BKB prevents follow-ups. It also doesn't KO well either because of its low 48 growth. Overall it lacks the safety of other d tilts in her tier (eg. Marth, Lucina) and reward (eg. Falco, Ganon), and even in comparison to ones ranked below her like Ike and DK.

 

[Envoy of Chaos]

I'd move up a bit, it's not worthless. If you get the trip it will true combo into Fsmash for a deadly combination and kill confirm as Ness' Fsmash is very strong

 

[Routa]

Well it seems like I missed the F-tilt discussion. Anyways about the Miimes.

Swordspider's D-tilt is his best grounded move. Comes out on frame 5 and faf is 20. Deals solid 8% and can be followed up by Nair/Fair depending from the %s. D-tilt is a excellent follow up after a Jab1 and "ACed" Fair. It is relatively safe (don't know exact numbers) and thanks to its combo potential I would say it is A tier material.

Brawler's D-tilt is pretty much Mario's D-tilt, but with a bit better combo potential. It sends foes upwards which is ideal for a Brawler. Why? Ever heard of PP or Helikick? At lower % he can follow up with Uair and Fair, but later it cannot be followed up with any move, but you can try to catch landing with your powerful Up-b (if chosen). I would personally put it on the same tier as Mario's.

I'm not super into Gunner, but it is pretty much Samus' D-tilt. Like other have said... Put it in the same tier as Samus'.

 

[Guido65]

Well it seems like I missed the F-tilt discussion. Anyways about the Miimes.

Swordspider's D-tilt is his best grounded move. Comes out on frame 5 and faf is 20. Deals solid 8% and can be followed up by Nair/Fair depending from the %s. D-tilt is a excellent follow up after a Jab1 and "ACed" Fair. It is relatively safe (don't know exact numbers) and thanks to its combo potential I would say it is A tier material.

Mii swordsmen down tilt is -1 on drop and -8 on oos.

 

[TheColorfulOrca]

Any reason why Shulk is so low? His DTilt is a useful poke, and better than the other DTilts in D Tier. I say move him up.

C. Falcon's DTilt is good at high percents, since it sends the opponent at a very awkward angle to recover from. It has a bit of utility, so maybe move it up.

 

[TheHypnotoad]

Ike, Donkey Kong, Pikachu, and Dedede should all be moved up one tier.

 

[Ffamran]

Falco's down tilt is a very versatile move and is probably one of his best, due to its high KO power when sweetspotted and high combo potential when sourspotted. The only thing that holds this move back is its subpar range. It should be in either A tier or B tier.

Late reply, Falco's Dtilt doesn't have subpar range. It's noticeably disjointed after his tail's tip. Falco's Dtilt has about the same or even slightly more range than his Ftilt which itself has good range for a melee move.

First, to clarify some things, Falco's Dtilt is both a disjoint and is disjointed. Since he uses his tail to slash people, the move itself is a disjoint as his tail isn't considered a hitbox; it's basically like Ike's Dtilt or any of Ike's moves where he uses Ragnell. At the same time, it's disjointed from the tail's tip. Where his tail ends and where the attack trail is shown is not its maximum range. Its real range, is about a third more than what is shown. Inversely, Fox's Dtilt's range isn't where his tail tip is or the attack trail, but before it. Fox's Dtilt is a disjoint, but not disjointed. Basically, the game lies to you about Falco and Fox's Dtilt range. Much worse on Falco since you can't even see the hitbox and bad, but not as bad for Fox since while he's missing range, it's not a massive blind-spot since it's only his tail tip, the white furred part of his tail.

Spoiler: Falco's Dtilt

From the listed posted, Fox and Luigi should go down, especially Luigi. First off, I'm not a Fox or Luigi expert, so I won't be entirely knowledgeable on them. Luigi's Dtilt is this weird, very short-ranged -- I think it has the shortest range of all Dtilts -- Dtilt that doesn't seem to do anything. It used to have a high, vertical hit angle that Luigi could use to follow up with aerials, but 1.1.0 changed it to a 361 angle making it more horizontal and made it easier to trip with since he isn't popping people up, however, it can't set up as well... I remember someone saying the angle change was a nerf. Either way, Luigi's Dtilt remains situational. It's pretty much this weird move that exists to be weird because Luigi was made to be weird. At the same time, this makes it pretty much a joke move. Luigi's Dtilt could probably end up as a D- or F-tier Dtilt.

Spoiler: Fox Dtilt

Anyway, some other stuff. Ness and Ryu are the only characters with Dtilts that can be repeated. I don't mean like low recovery, I can continuously Dtilt like Diddy or DK's Dtilts, but there's a property? that makes it so Ness and Ryu have lower recovery if they choose to Dtilt again. For Ness, Dtilting again has 5 total frames instead of 13, so the recovery drops from 10 frames to 2 frames. For Ryu, light Dtilting again only has 6 total frames instead of 14, so its recovery drops from 12 to 4. A similar thing exists for jabs where if you hold down attack, some characters will repeatedly jab in place like Capt., (Dr.) Mario, and Fox while others like Cloud and Lucas apparently have lower recovery if they choose to jab 2 to jab 1. Also, Ryu's light Utilt has this property as well. Anyway, keeping that in mind, Ness's Dtilt while not having a lot of range or power, has a lot of speed. It's really a cr.LK like in a traditional 2D fighting game. At worst, probably a C-tier Dtilt and not a D-tier Dtilt.

Links: Ness's frame data: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...9tivelrRJvPl7o1dBhgYo/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=0.
Ryu's frame data: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...GinKOYVI3RnpS43ERGvJM/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=0.

Also, isn't Jigglypuff's Dtilt basically a slower, but stronger Kirby Dtilt? Part of me wants to vouch for Jiggles and PAC-MAN's Dtilt, but I can't explain why.

 

[MarioMeteor]

Late reply, Falco's Dtilt doesn't have subpar range. It's noticeably disjointed after his tail's tip. Falco's Dtilt has about the same or even slightly more range than his Ftilt which itself has good range for a melee move.

First, to clarify some things, Falco's Dtilt is both a disjoint and is disjointed. Since he uses his tail to slash people, the move itself is a disjoint as his tail isn't considered a hitbox; it's basically like Ike's Dtilt or any of Ike's moves where he uses Ragnell. At the same time, it's disjointed from the tail's tip. Where his tail ends and where the attack trail is shown is not its maximum range. Its real range, is about a third more than what is shown. Inversely, Fox's Dtilt's range isn't where his tail tip is or the attack trail, but before it. Fox's Dtilt is a disjoint, but not disjointed. Basically, the game lies to you about Falco and Fox's Dtilt range. Much worse on Falco since you can't even see the hitbox and bad, but not as bad for Fox since while he's missing range, it's not a massive blind-spot since it's only his tail tip, the white furred part of his tail.

Spoiler: Falco's Dtilt

From the listed posted, Fox and Luigi should go down, especially Luigi. First off, I'm not a Fox or Luigi expert, so I won't be entirely knowledgeable on them. Luigi's Dtilt is this weird, very short-ranged -- I think it has the shortest range of all Dtilts -- Dtilt that doesn't seem to do anything. It used to have a high, vertical hit angle that Luigi could use to follow up with aerials, but 1.1.0 changed it to a 361 angle making it more horizontal and made it easier to trip with since he isn't popping people up, however, it can't set up as well... I remember someone saying the angle change was a nerf. Either way, Luigi's Dtilt remains situational. It's pretty much this weird move that exists to be weird because Luigi was made to be weird. At the same time, this makes it pretty much a joke move. Luigi's Dtilt could probably end up as a D- or F-tier Dtilt.

Spoiler: Fox Dtilt

Anyway, some other stuff. Ness and Ryu are the only characters with Dtilts that can be repeated. I don't mean like low recovery, I can continuously Dtilt like Diddy or DK's Dtilts, but there's a property? that makes it so Ness and Ryu have lower recovery if they choose to Dtilt again. For Ness, Dtilting again has 5 total frames instead of 13, so the recovery drops from 10 frames to 2 frames. For Ryu, light Dtilting again only has 6 total frames instead of 14, so its recovery drops from 12 to 4. A similar thing exists for jabs where if you hold down attack, some characters will repeatedly jab in place like Capt., (Dr.) Mario, and Fox while others like Cloud and Lucas apparently have lower recovery if they choose to jab 2 to jab 1. Also, Ryu's light Utilt has this property as well. Anyway, keeping that in mind, Ness's Dtilt while not having a lot or range or power, has a lot of speed. It's really a cr.LK like in a traditional 2D fighting game. At worst, probably a C-tier Dtilt and not a D-tier Dtilt.

Links: Ness's frame data: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...9tivelrRJvPl7o1dBhgYo/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=0.
Ryu's frame data: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...GinKOYVI3RnpS43ERGvJM/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=0.

Also, isn't Jigglypuff's Dtilt basically a slower, but stronger Kirby Dtilt? Part of me wants to vouch for Jiggles and PAC-MAN's Dtilt, but I can't explain why.

I think the only thing that saves Jigglypuff's down tilt from being F tier is that it's decently strong (deals 10% and can KO at the edge) and the low angle it sends you at. Other than that, though, you're better off using forward tilt (or not using any grounded move at all). I think D is a pretty good place for it.

Also, I would move Samus' down a tier. It has too much ending lag for how weak it is.