Project M Social Thread

[UltiMario]

RAR was one of the more interesting and certainly useful Brawl mechanics introduced.

I see no reason to remove it, this might be Project Melee, but why remove the few things that Brawl did good?

People complain enough that "L-Cancels are just pointless additional imputs," so how about we keep this instead of adding 3+ additional inputs to do the exact same thing? Making the game harder to play and less friendly for casuals does NOT make it more competitive. It's fine with L-Cancelling because anyone with half a brain can L-Cancel, but doing perfect edgeguards.... not so much.

 

[Ghostbone]

RAR only adds options.

It's one of the few things Brawl did right and taking it away just because it wasn't in melee is dumb....

 

[Grim Tuesday]

If Pichu is put in PM, I would still use Agility to the ledge mixed up with RAR.

 

[JCaesar]

Yeah RAR makes it easier to egdehog, but edgehogging is also considerably less powerful than it was in Melee due to the much shorter occupancy time (and even if we figure out how to change this, we aren't going to make it as absurd as it was in Melee).

It's also kinda nice that even the lesser characters can do a quick edgehog now. In Melee it seemed like the characters who were already high/top tier had the best edgehogging options, on top of being the best characters. RAR balances that out in a way, at the cost of a little variety and tech skill (though certain characters still have faster edgehogs).

But you can't ignore the other options RAR adds to the game. RAR is not solely used for edgehogging after all. That's just one thing of many which you can use it for.

 

[Ecks]

Ha, did you guys know that RAR was in the original Super Mario Bros? I just noticed the other day. :D

Edit: At least the snes remake, don't remember the nes one.

 

[UltiMario]

Yeah, Mario can Reverse Jump in SMB for the NES. It doesn't slow down his momentum either, it's done a lot for showing off in speedruns/TASes.

 

[Juushichi]

I love being able to RAR (as a brawl player hurr) and it just makes things more seamless. Why should I have to go through a bunch of **** if I just want to approach with Mario/Sonic's bair? (for argument's sake)

It was one of the most frustrating things I encounter when I do play Melee. Even that aside, you can RAR any aerial. So that alone throws in options for mixups and such. There are all kinds of uses for this and it's subtle.

What kind of mofo is going to seriously go: oh the only reason that link was able to edgeguard that fox because being able to RAR that nair. This game is too easy.

Ffs

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I literally got told the other day that Link being able to take on Falco is not Melee.
I lol'd.

 

[GHNeko]

youngling is my favorite person for like the past 3 pages. 40PPP too.

****ing lol'd.

People also need to get out of there with that "REMOVE RAR OMFG EZMODE EDGEGUARD" nonsense.

lmao ridiculous.

Pros of RARing in P:M >>>>>>>>> Any pitiful con you can muster up.

 

[MonkUnit]

I also found another reason why I love RAR. RAR wavedash makes your wavedash go about 2x the distance. Ganon can uthrow -> RAR bair/uair. Toon Link can RAR bomb throw to get more distance. And much more. <3 RAR. One of the things brawl had that went well. LOL

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

LOL brawl SUX GUZY RITE?

 

[Slashy]

Can you guys bring back announcer canceling? Basically in Melee if a sound is loaded on the CSS and another sound is loaded, the original sound is interrupted and the new sound is played. In Brawl the new sound is overlaps the original sound.

 

[MonkUnit]

LOL brawl SUX GUZY RITE?

Never said brawl sucked.

 

[Vigilante]

Never said brawl sucked.

I say it often. Indeed, Brawl eats babies. But that is not the point.

The announcer cancel said earlier is merely an aesthetic thing that does nothing for gameplay. I think they'd rather put their minds on something more useful.

 

[Slashy]

I say it often. Indeed, Brawl eats babies. But that is not the point.

The announcer cancel said earlier is merely an aesthetic thing that does nothing for gameplay. I think they'd rather put their minds on something more useful.

There was just a big discussion about MENU STYLES. I think aesthetics matter.

 

[slimpyman]

it would be cool if they somehow setup a folder stucture on installation, and we could use mp3s in the stage folder.... converting to brstms, and renaming is a pain in the nutsack. and the sound is very hit or miss.... ooooo if it was as easy as clicking and dragging mp3s into a specified folder. nm. sounds too good to be true ;-)

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

Brawlbox makes BRSTM making a lot faster and easier.

Don't forget Crowd cancelling.
When you use Sheik on the ground, Use her UpB straight up and then fast fall asap.

I wish there was a way to put that in. It was funny when I first discovered it.

 

[MonkUnit]

There was just a big discussion about MENU STYLES. I think aesthetics matter.

Currently, gameplay edits > aesthetics.

 

[Rikana]

Can we implement slashy canceling in the game?

 

[Krautrock]

Can you guys bring back announcer canceling? Basically in Melee if a sound is loaded on the CSS and another sound is loaded, the original sound is interrupted and the new sound is played. In Brawl the new sound is overlaps the original sound.

Are you actually serious? If for some bizarre and perverse reason this matters to you at all, figure out how to do it yourself. The team has better things to do.

+1 for slashy canceling

 

[Slashy]

I didn't mean it as a priority at all. I meant in general.

 

[Krautrock]

Regardless, there's no reason for them to change it. And no, "because I want it that way" is not a sufficient reason.

 

[Dragoon Fighter]

When are you guys going to have your website back up?

 

[Revven]

When Dantarion actually knows what is wrong.

 

[GHNeko]

Hey.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfIyCqntSUY&feature=channel_video_title

This is the greatest thing ever.

I'd love for this to come back. LOL.

 

[BinAly]

When Dantarion actually knows what is wrong.

So there is actually something that he doesn't know how to solve.

 

[GaretHax]

So if you all are working on AI have you found what makes the CPU's learn? Ala this - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4HvhIPOz4I&feature=channel_video_title
After about ...far too many... hours playing the lv 9 cpu sheik rarely tries to side-b grab the ledge anymore, falco shl and jump cancels his shines on occasion, falcon moonwalks and wavedashes everyonce in a while, and I have seen more than a handful of L-cancels that can't be linked to the CPU just trying to sheild before I hit them. Also fighting a Zelda with an advantage in priority etc.(all the other little frustrating advantages lv.9's have) can be unpleasant at times T.T

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

Ummm..... that was posted in 2008.
It was proven later that Brawl's AI doesn't learn.

 

[Dantarion]

The AI doesn't learn.

 

[GHNeko]

MAKE THEM LEARN!

 

[Slashy]

Will Kirby get his suicide throws back?

 

[MonkUnit]

Eldiran tried coding the suicide throws for Brawl Minus Kirby, but it failed. He was unable to make it work. I think it is because you can't go from ground -> air while still throwing? Either way, seems unlikely that it will be coming back due to coding issues.

 

[NeoZ]

MAKE THEM LEARN!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Transparent.gif?

 

[GaretHax]

Ummm..... that was posted in 2008.
It was proven later that Brawl's AI doesn't learn.

If they don't learn why do they start doing things differently @.@ huh, when was that proven and where, I would really like to read it(or whatever they found)

 

[BinAly]

Eldiran tried coding the suicide throws for Brawl Minus Kirby, but it failed. He was unable to make it work. I think it is because you can't go from ground -> air while still throwing? Either way, seems unlikely that it will be coming back due to coding issues.

Also, the less 'Suicide Maneuvers' the better.

There is a problem with Brawl's Control-Port Priority. If you die simultaniously with an enemy, the player with the smaller port number will always win.

This mean that Kirby would lose if he was in a higher port.

 

[Shadic]

The inside of the AI files have nothing on AI learning. Also if AI had the capability to learn, it would wreck how replay files work, as the only thing they hold in the replay file for the CPU is the RNG seed read in behavior to make sure the AI syncs properly, iirc.

 

[Slashy]

I thought the evidence that the AI doesn't learn is the fact that the replays don't contain AI button inputs

 

[BinAly]

For the AI to learn, it would need specific code, and a way to store player's behavior, and none of those are present anywhere.

 

[Ecks]

Is it even possible to make the AI learn? That seems way out there to me.

 

[GaretHax]

I thought the evidence that the AI doesn't learn is the fact that the replays don't contain AI button inputs

I think thats what Shadic just said XD. Huh that is interesting and I suppose it makes sense if thats how it works. I have had a few replays in which cpu's peformed different actions than when I played them, but I think that was mostly due to my trying to save replays of various strange glitches. Odd, what causes the AI to psuedo-learn then? Or is there no reason other than coincidence and my own attention-span, or lack thereof, for the perceived changing of timing and strategy of Brawl Cpus? (Such as occurences of; WD-ing, shl's, no more suicides, etc.)
I mean if the codes aren't there then... well the codes aren't there XD

@ Ecks Below me, weird my cpu's don't airdodge much, if at all, anymore. Not even for the attempted momentum cancel. Reguardless though lol I suppose it's all moot, if there just plain old isn't a code for anything of the sort then its probably not there lol.

@Sneak LOL, you can ask those poor souls on F-smash about my connection. I tried that and no thank you haha. I one of those unadapting people who can hardly stand the miniscule lag of an hdtv. But thanks for the tip man ^_^