Project M Social Thread

[Strong Badam]

I'm not trying to insult you... but you are aware I am talking about recreating the extended grapple trick that was already IN MELEE, right?

And once you activate the the extended grab in melee, every grab thereafter has the triple range extension. So it wouldn't be that broken tbh if it was available the entire time in melee and was never abused to a "game breaking" extent. Also, without homing it would be worse than its melee incarnation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJCEiQ84RAw

^Here is a link demonstrating the melee extended grapple. As you can see, its main use would be to simple grab quicker at shorter ranges since it has the same frame data as the regular grapple (without the homing it can't tech chase or mind game).

i'm fully aware of what I'm talking about.
the extender is performed by holding l/r, grabbing, pressing up, down, up on the dpad, then hitting a to grab.

it /does/ change the grab box in the middle of a grab, which is extremely DIFFICULT TO CODE.

k.

 

[L/A/W]

why do you care so much about the extender?
hardly ever used and not really worth the trouble. especialy with more important things that need to be done
also strongbad that's not the only way to extender

 

[[TSON]]

small things make the biggest difference.

see: landing detection

Additionally, melee yo-yos (not sure about 64 ones, I haven't check recently) had an interesting property where they could hang right off the side of the stage directly on the ledge while charging (effectively preventing anyone from grabbing the ledge). You can see this strange technique by standing right in front of the second pair of white traingles near the the ledges on FD. Brawl, on the other hand, fixed this flaw but it would be cool if it was brought back in P:M because I think it has some applications to be explored as an edgeguarding tactic.

...um

you do realize that brawl didn't remove that, right? you just have to aim it.

 

[L/A/W]

landing detection isn't very small lol
and it's absolutely more important than the extender will ever be

 

[FireBall Stars]

I agree

after all, if samus is buffed, she won't need an extender. As she never needed at all.

In the case of the grab, she just needs a less laggy grab.

 

[hotdogturtle]

then you have samus players grabbing the air in between stocks to charge up their grab range....

But would that really be any different than Melee? You could activate the extender in the air in Melee too...

Now I agree that a one-time extender defeats the purpose (and yes I understand that it's nearly impossible to code), but this particular reason you gave for shooting down the idea doesn't seem very valid.

 

[Sora-kun]

Who cares =O He's a dev and he can't code it so his excuse could be "it isn't the color pink and it isn't useful for bringing samus pizza." and we'd have to accept it.

 

[I R MarF]

i'm fully aware of what I'm talking about.
the extender is performed by holding l/r, grabbing, pressing up, down, up on the dpad, then hitting a to grab.

it /does/ change the grab box in the middle of a grab, which is extremely DIFFICULT TO CODE.

k.

Alright. I gotchya now. I was a bit confused before because it seemed like you treated the whole samus grapple extender as a new idea and as broken (despite it already exists), but now I understand you were talking about the coding aspect. (Though hotdogturtle's point still leaves me a bit confused) Anyway, my bad.

@L/A/W

Well, the main reason I asked is because I wanted to know if it was possible to add. I also think it is one of the most under estimated/ sparsely known techs in the game especially considering its applications. Mind games, tech chases, faster grappling, etc. I bet if someone took the time to truly abuse it and evolve it into their samus tactics it would nestle nicely in Samus's meta game.

@[TSON]

O really? I didn't know that. I'll have to try it now.

 

[smash Your m0m]

y not jus have samus grab like olimar? his grab is quick and not that punishable....is there a way to shorten the time of a missed grab??like the time it takes her extener to come back?

 

[FireBall Stars]

y not jus have samus grab like olimar? his grab is quick and not that punishable....is there a way to shorten the time of a missed grab??like the time it takes her extener to come back?

Yes, brawl+ reduced the lag after missed grab for samus, link, toon link, zss, Ivysaur, Yoshi and lucas. They're still punishable (as they're ranged grabs, can't be fast as normal grabs) , but not extremely punishable as before.

 

[Sora-kun]

y not jus have samus grab like olimar? his grab is quick and not that punishable....is there a way to shorten the time of a missed grab??like the time it takes her extener to come back?

"is there a way"?
Brawl+ said hi? .-.

 

[leafgreen386]

Who cares =O He's a dev and he can't code it so his excuse could be "it isn't the color pink and it isn't useful for bringing samus pizza." and we'd have to accept it.

Yes, because that's the thought process we use to make all of our changes obv

 

[Deleted member]

He can curl it around the side the opponent isn't on, trickier that way but meh........that wording kind of confusing so idk

I get what you're saying.

That takes even longer to perform than a normal recovery. You'd run the risk of them hitting you with an aerial if you did that.

 

[Sora-kun]

Yes, because that's the thought process we use to make all of our changes obv

eh, sorry? i know it changes wouldn't be made to the game without a valid reason. i was just kidding.

 

[Gindler]

I get what you're saying.

That takes even longer to perform than a normal recovery. You'd run the risk of them hitting you with an aerial if you did that.

If that's the case....Don't chase someone under the stage to gimp them with ness if you're gonna end up gimping yourself.

 

[Sora-kun]

If that's the case....Don't chase someone under the stage to gimp them with ness if you're gonna end up gimping yourself.

unless it'll look cool.

lol i've killed myself so many times trying to finish a combo with an offstage down air <_>

 

[genkaku]

unless it'll look cool.

lol i've killed myself so many times trying to finish a combo with an offstage down air <_>

Better yet, missed sacred combos. Those are their own special brand of failure.

 

[Gindler]

unless it'll look cool.

lol i've killed myself so many times trying to finish a combo with an offstage down air <_>

Better yet, missed sacred combos. Those are their own special brand of failure.

Ha, silly me. Both good points

 

[Strong Badam]

I get what you're saying.

That takes even longer to perform than a normal recovery. You'd run the risk of them hitting you with an aerial if you did that.

this is known as a character weakness. this doesn't randomly occur; it's a constant risk known to the player and he can decide to take it or not. the fact that some other chars may not have this risk/weakness is irrelevant. our method of balance will likely not sacrifice character variety, as it would be counteractive to making a deep competitive game.

 

[~tgm_Zeej]

I'm not even sure Ness needs a huge amount of buffs. With B+ 7.0 stats and melee style electric hitlag, fair should be at least five different kinds of ****.

 

[Sneak8288]

ness is prefectly fine the way he is imo

 

[ValTroX]

SHeLL, is there any way we can get screens of Marth's range change? I would like to see it.

 

[Shell]

I don't have any before/after screenshots right now, but it looks very similar to melee range.

There will likely be one or more streams this weekend for you to see him in, and if not, I can grab some BBox screenshots. It's easier to see in motion, anyways.

 

[DaiAndOh]

Throwing 2 cents on hype building here.

How about making a trailer for each character? Obviously when they're done. Just a minute and a half of so. Kind of like the original trailer from Shanus, just dedicated to each character.

I also typed Sheamus originally in my post .

 

[Sora-kun]

Aside from range and neutral B, what else does Marth need?

 

[I R MarF]

Aside from range and neutral B, what else does Marth need?

Good question; I think his side B still needs fixing (as a recovery) and he doesn't have melee throws yet.

 

[Wind Owl]

No one has Melee throws yet.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

IIRC, the only weight independent Dthrow is Snake's Dthrow.

 

[I R MarF]

Hmm... so how is Snake doing anyway?

 

[Strong Badam]

Aside from range and neutral B, what else does Marth need?

he has range

he needs tweaks on all of his specials other than counter

and throws, which may or may not be possible to 100% replicate.

 

[Dark Sonic]

Aside from range and neutral B, what else does Marth need?

Side B recovery.

Reverse up B animation.

 

[AeonClock]

Super Smash Flash 2 ***** Project M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1BYUL8-Gbg&feature=player_embedded

But seriously, will Marth still be able to footstool spike?

 

[Shell]

We do not have the capability to code "True Spikes."

With that in mind, yes, you should be able to footstool -> dair meteor.

 

[AeonClock]

Well that's unfortunate -.-
Good to hear he still can though.

And about the models and such, if I'm not mistaken Samus is a lot bigger in Brawl. I don't know if this has been discussed before but will she have her Melee model back or is she staying with Brawl's?

 

[hotdogturtle]

Nobody is changing models (officially anyway), but they resized all of the characters to be smaller.

 

[FireBall Stars]

Hmm... so how is Snake doing anyway?

This, any news about snake?

 

[OverLade]

Snake is awesome. Obviously.

 

[FireBall Stars]

That's not news RedHalberd. :/

 

[Gindler]

So footstooling is actually staying?

 

[Revven]

Yes but it's on its own input (utaunt in the air) you may change your controls to set it to a jump button you do not use (or any button really).