Project M Social Thread

[Sanity's_Theif]

Up angled should definitely go back to it's Melee form. The others, while I preferred Melee, I'm cool with. Up angled just looks like he's trying to Utilt, but failing miserably. And now that it doesn't hit people on platforms, it's nowhere near as useful as it was in Melee.

I suggested the animation change a while ago, he should do a roundhouse or side kick

 

[Shadow Huan]

i feel the need to report that ROB's FS froze the game on me while i was messing around in training mode

also i am confused about the decision to have falco more or less EXACTLY like he was in melee, "deluigification" if you will. it seems like avoiding what could potentally be fresh new combos for the same old thing competitive melee players have seen a hundred thousand times. there's also the balance issue on the NTSC dair, i have never heard an argument that convinced me that a dair that spikes for 30 frames on all it's hit boxes is "balanced". the PAL nerf is one of the only nerfs i agree with. it's hard to word that without sounding like i'm ungrateful for the amazing amount of work that has been put into this, i appreciate it immensly and haven't even played regular melee since i got it. just wondering is all


but all that aside, Bowser is utterly amazing, lucario is a blast to play once you figure out his cancel system, marth is back in form (with a more reasonable grab range lol), fox is fox again, the sheik/zelda tandem thing works due to the balancing of sheik and the buffing of zelda, snake and sonic are respectivly better, ganondorf is scary, and falcon is manly again. all of the new levels are great, props to the designers of Dracula's Castle. looking forwards to what is next

also gotta say that if you guys can somehow make an awesome Bowser's Castle level and a powerful bad*** mewtwo i'd be a happy camper lol

 

[The Good Doctor]

Let us please not berate players for their opinions.

How about we ditch the whole "Melee 2" idea and we go for "Brawl 2" Add back tripping and make pokeballs on for tournament play?

Yeah, stupid suggestions happen.

My earlier post about dildos and monkeys was aimed at the people in the comments, not the video. It was my mistake by not being specific.

 

[PEEF!]

also i am confused about the decision to have falco more or less EXACTLY like he was in melee, "deluigification" if you will. it seems like avoiding what could potentally be fresh new combos for the same old thing competitive melee players have seen a hundred thousand times.

I think much of the team was inspired to join/help out because of how amazing of a fighting game character Falco really is. He is very representative of what is good about Melee, and to have a game that attempts to be competitively balanced with Melee falco in mind (and re-created) is a really cool thing. To change him would be to change the project's inspiration, would you agree?

 

[CORY]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=14431152

Sethlon is hosting a Project M only tournament in texas! If you're in the area, make sure to go!

holy **** something in my area(ish)!

 

[Yeroc]

I think much of the team was inspired to join/help out because of how amazing of a fighting game character Falco really is. He is very representative of what is good about Melee, and to have a game that attempts to be competitively balanced with Melee falco in mind (and re-created) is a really cool thing. To change him would be to change the project's inspiration, would you agree?

Considering that recreating Melee Falco was the impetus that actually started this project, I'd say he's probably going to stick around.

 

[Dingding123]

Yeah flaco ain't goin' nowhar.


SO have yall made sufficient progress on any of the remaining characters? (I'm lookin' at the rest of teh pokemanz, MK and ZSS mostly) I'd love to see how those guys will turn out, or at least hear about it from you devs. Screw the rest of them

 

[Vigilante]

Amusingly, cloned Falco plays very differently from Fox and is a completely different experience. Considering Melee Falco was a fan favourite, they didn't really like that he was according to many, butchered in Brawl, me included.

Personally, Melee Falco got me in this Project and I never would have even paid attention to this if they had kept Brawl Falco and would have been like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqANxHKXQLQ

But jokes asideFalco is probably one of the better conceived characters in Melee, and about every Brawl move save for the jab just don't transition well in Melee either. For example, up tilt would have to be sped up so much that it would look unprofessional if it were to be usable.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

Now I've got an image of a sped up Utilt stuck in my head. Thanks a lot.

 

[Shadow Huan]

I think much of the team was inspired to join/help out because of how amazing of a fighting game character Falco really is. He is very representative of what is good about Melee, and to have a game that attempts to be competitively balanced with Melee falco in mind (and re-created) is a really cool thing. To change him would be to change the project's inspiration, would you agree?

i don't know, everyone's got different opinions of what makes melee good lol

i was referring more to the fact that the few brawl air moves he had could work in shine combos imo and give him new options for shield pressure and such. why did his fsmash have to be changed back rather than buffed? it's like changing the animation on ganon's tilts, which they didn't do, they changed the KB angle.

imo a combination of brawl and melee falco with a much greater focus on the melee bird (with the PAL dair) would still be an amazing character, just not almost exactly the same.

for all i know all these things were tested before the change back was made lol, but these are the questions of an inquisitive mind

also lucas is a friggen beast O.o

 

[Vigilante]

Dizziness mind crush.

 

[Shadow Huan]

ninja'd by Vigilante, darn posting things on mobile, the reason behind the utilt makes total sense. was it the same with the aerals?

 

[Vigilante]

It was also agreed that we would do NTSC Falco, so there will never be a PAL D-air on him. It heavily changes how he plays. As for most aerial brawl moves... F-air is a terrible move and serves about the same purposes as N-air, but worse. I could "maybe" see Brawl N-air as an F-air instead, but appart from that, it would just take away from the Falco we all loved in melee.

The problem is that brawl Falco's moves lack distinctive uses. They are used for pretty much the same things, while in Melee, N-air is a huge part of his gameplay. F-air is not the most useful move in Falco's arsenal, but can be used against someone who is nearly out of reach or if you desire a lower knockback. Back air is similar in Braw and Melee, but Melee,s is just much more potent.

Pal D-air at least to me, is an attrocity. I played Falco for a long time, and the lingering spike is part of his combo game. I hope this answers why we considered decloning him but decided not to at one point.

P.S.: We're also balancing around melee top tiers, and we promised to keep top tiers to their former glory except for Shiek's Down throw and infinites.

 

[genkaku]

I've heard it said that the tier list doesn't really matter in melee anymore. Whether this is literally true doesn't really matter, the point is everyone knows all the matchups they need to so it really comes down to viable vs. nonviable.
With this in mind it will be interesting to see how PM plays out, considering that the goal is to make every character viable.
I hope that a tier list won't mean **** and enough good players show up to wreck everyone with everyone, haha.

 

[Sneak8288]

Falco's melee moveset is what made me wanna play the game in general

 

[RaphaelRobo]

If you really think Falco isn't going to be top tier anymore, why not give him a new Fair?

Also, I hate Skyworld. I keep forgetting I have to do an upB away from the stage and move toward the stage to recover on ganon. Stupid upB towards the stage always gets me caught under the edge and killed. If FoD didn't exist, I'd ban that stage in every tournament. Then again, if I can become a super FoD edgecancellling Ganon, all I'd have to ban is skyworld.

Oh, and I hate playing against Ike. It feels like he does everything I can, but better.

 

[FireBall Stars]

If someone is wondering, sideB won't lose its normal frames of invincibility.

 

[Vigilante]

Well, not all moves need to be good, and all things considered, Falco's F-air is still pretty good. It's just overshadowed by the other moves. Falco is like N-64 Fox on steroids, which is why I love him.

 

[Avalancer]

My friend is having trouble with the fact you can't attack from the ledge by pressing B. Isn't there a way to enable this?

 

[Vigilante]

Well, he could press A.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I assume it'll be in the bug fix.

Can one of you guys who's been playing the game longer than me explain how Ganon is as good a character as Ike? I'm having trouble working out how Ike isn't better in almost every aspect.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Try attacking him. ****er can't do much about it.

 

[GunBlaze]

i feel the need to report that ROB's FS froze the game on me while i was messing around in training mode

also i am confused about the decision to have falco more or less EXACTLY like he was in melee, "deluigification" if you will. it seems like avoiding what could potentally be fresh new combos for the same old thing competitive melee players have seen a hundred thousand times. there's also the balance issue on the NTSC dair, i have never heard an argument that convinced me that a dair that spikes for 30 frames on all it's hit boxes is "balanced". the PAL nerf is one of the only nerfs i agree with. it's hard to word that without sounding like i'm ungrateful for the amazing amount of work that has been put into this, i appreciate it immensly and haven't even played regular melee since i got it. just wondering is all


but all that aside, Bowser is utterly amazing, lucario is a blast to play once you figure out his cancel system, marth is back in form (with a more reasonable grab range lol), fox is fox again, the sheik/zelda tandem thing works due to the balancing of sheik and the buffing of zelda, snake and sonic are respectivly better, ganondorf is scary, and falcon is manly again. all of the new levels are great, props to the designers of Dracula's Castle. looking forwards to what is next

also gotta say that if you guys can somehow make an awesome Bowser's Castle level and a powerful bad*** mewtwo i'd be a happy camper lol

I know that feel bro.

However, Melee Falco is (ironically) more varied than Brawl Falco.

 

[Kink-Link5]

What is a feel.

 

[hotdogturtle]

I didn't realize that I apparently press B to do ledge getup attacks in the other games, because I frequently find myself trying it in P:M and having to press A a second later when nothing happens.

 

[GunBlaze]

I assume it'll be in the bug fix.

Can one of you guys who's been playing the game longer than me explain how Ganon is as good a character as Ike? I'm having trouble working out how Ike isn't better in almost every aspect.

Considering both are deceptively quick for their weight class:

Ike wins in range, obvious.

Ganondorf has the power, but of course that's not useful if you can't land a single hit.

My (noob) advice: be rather unpredictable. Ike is less predictable now, but he still has dat lag on his attacks. Capitalize on that.

 

[UTDZac]

Not sure where to leave feedback, but one change I think is necessary for making brawl Peach more like Melee Peach is to change the turnip textures. The current (brawl) style texture makes distinguishing between different turnip types nearly impossible (especially anytime the camera is not completely zoomed in on peach). In melee I could always tell what I was pulling regardless of where the camera was or how zoomed in/out it was (ok maybe excluding max zoom on hyrule but w/e).

Currently in P:M pulling anything other than the O.O face all look the same. I know it's possible to change the turnip textures (maybe make them more bold?) and figured it was worth a shot mentioning it here. I'd like to be able to play with turnips again =D

 

[PEEF!]

Considering both are deceptively quick for their weight class:

Ike wins in range, obvious.

Ganondorf has the power, but of course that's not useful if you can't land a single hit.

My (noob) advice: be rather unpredictable. Ike is less predictable now, but he still has dat lag on his attacks. Capitalize on that.

I don't think that it is about power vs range, as they both have power and range.

I think there is somewhat of a misconception about Ike, that because he has a sword and comes from Fire Emblem, he is "Marthly." This character is not nearly as good at setting up walls (slow fair, short range nair, larger exploitable gaps between "wall attempts," etc.) Ganon on the other hand is deceptively good at walling, so the spacing game between them is intense.

If you are looking for a single advantage that Ganon has, I would point out his on-shield game. SideB is a main threat here because it grabs through shields. Ganons grab game is also really good not even counting SideB. Fair and jab remain amazing spacing tools, and quick uairs prevent many aerials out of shield. This means that if Ganon gets you into shield, you will often have to roll or wavedash out, which of course can be covered with much more reliable and punishing moves by Ganon than Ike has available. (Think Stomp, DownB, SideB, Fair.)

Which brings me to my second advantage, punishment/punishment combos. Ike hits hard, but Ganon has more in the way of really damaging and death inducing combos. I shouldn't have to go into detail. Think electricity and purple.

Ike is good at both of these things, but I think that Ganon clearly is better in both categories. Hope this helps RaphaelRobo.

Currently in P:M pulling anything other than the O.O face all look the same. I know it's possible to change the turnip textures (maybe make the bolder?) and figured it was worth a shot mentioning it here. I'd like to be able to play with turnips again =D

Since I have a reputation to maintain...

Stitchface should be replaced with my face. Its perfect turnip shape already.

 

[GunBlaze]

I don't think that it is about power vs range, as they both have power and range.

I think there is somewhat of a misconception about Ike, that because he has a sword and comes from Fire Emblem, he is "Marthly." This character is not nearly as good at setting up walls (slow fair, short range nair, larger exploitable gaps between "wall attempts," etc.) Ganon on the other hand is deceptively good at walling, so the spacing game between them is intense.

If you are looking for a single advantage that Ganon has, I would point out his on-shield game. SideB is a main threat here because it grabs through shields. Ganons grab game is also really good not even counting SideB. Fair and jab remain amazing spacing tools, and quick uairs prevent many aerials out of shield. This means that if Ganon gets you into shield, you will often have to roll or wavedash out, which of course can be covered with much more reliable and punishing moves by Ganon than Ike has available. (Think Stomp, DownB, SideB, Fair.)

Which brings me to my second advantage, punishment/punishment combos. Ike hits hard, but Ganon, like Melee Ganon, has more in the way of really damaging and death inducing combos. I shouldn't have to go into detail. Think electricity and purple.

Ike is good at both of these things, but I think that Ganon clearly is better in both categories. Hope this helps RaphelRobo.

This is definitely way more helpful than my answer XD

Oh, BTW PEEF, is it true an optional melee .bsrar will be available after launching the final version of P:M? Just saw it somewhere on YT, but I wanted the official word.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I meant character pros and cons, not how to beat him with Ganon, which is what Peef covered.

Thanks a lot for what you wrote. I don't have much experience with Ike yet, so I'm probably overestimating him. When I play him like I play Ganon in Melee, I've found Ike to be slightly more effective. That could just be who I'm playing against, though.

 

[MonkUnit]

Is it true an optional melee .bsrar will be available after launching the final version of P:M? Just saw it somewhere on YT, but I wanted the official word.

There is already a Melee SFX BRSAR available on BrawlVault IIRC. It's not something that is BR only and would be released later, lol.

 

[MK26]

You've been rallying against this for years. SD cards are more durable than you're pretending.

I've been regularly reformatting and defragging my SD card for 3+ years and it still works like a champ.

Its not that it weakens them, its that theres really no benefit to a defrag when copypasting is faster...needing fewer writes is just a side benefit

 

[GunBlaze]

There is already a Melee SFX BRSAR available on BrawlVault IIRC. It's not something that is BR only and would be released later, lol.

I have been unable to find it >_<

 

[JCaesar]

GunBlaze can you please use a more visible font color?

 

[MK26]

You mean there are people who don't ignore other people's default font colours?

 

[GP&B]

Here's the Hit SFX download.

 

[Vigilante]

Ikes who side B too much, I tend to use Down tilt with Ganon to poke him out of it. Side B as Peef said is the more important element he has over Ike.

P.S.: I almost typoed him as Pee x_x...

 

[MaxThunder]

I say someone puts peef's face with different expressions on ALL of the turnips...

 

[GP&B]

 

[JediKnightTemplar]

So I've noticed that Sonic's wavedash looks incredibly illogical given that his airdodge is a backflip. The end result is some sort of weird flail-backflip thing that looks incredibly unnatural, if scooting along the ground while smoke flies out of your feet could look natural to begin with.