Playing "gay"

[ZelDan]

I've always saw "playing gay" as using a tactic that is effective while also not being fun to watch or is very redundant, basically. Atleast that's how I think others think of "playing gay" as, I certainly don't have such a viewpoint.

 

[KrIsP!]

Something I usually feel as being "gay" is crouch canceling overally. I'm not saying that people shoyldn't be using it (it is big factor in metagame overally) but I found myself getting punished when my opponent CC's my gamestyle >_>

Can that really be called gay? It seems like the term is just being put over anything no one wants to adapt to. I can moreso agree with what Weon-X was saying about certain rewards being much higher than the risks, although I feel like puffs rest obviously has some risk I wouldn't mind if it didn't kill as easily, you'd still tack on over 30% and get the opponent at the edge, but CCing isn't something only one character can do nor does it really change your playstyle, it's just a defensive maneuver and if you just crouch a lot you create openings, it has to be timed with reads.

 

[Jockmaster]

Hmmm... But would a Falco who only uses fair and uair be gay? Probably not.
I'm pretty sure you just meant when it's GOOD, just pointing this out lol

I think playing gay is when you only abuse one or two really good moves.

cmon now man keep up

 

[C.SDK]

I like the way Philip put it. As for "playing gay," I find this train of thought too close to johning. As for a character or move being "gay," it really depends. Sometimes it really comes off to me as johning and sometimes I see merit in their complaint. But I usually try to steer clear from this line of thinking so I dunno.

 

[hungrybox]

this thread disapoints me

 

[Metal Reeper]

"Gay" usually comes out when someone gets ****ed by something stupid

 

[❀W.E.M.P.❀]

this thread disappoints me

qft

The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 10 characters.

 

[JKJ]

this thread disapoints me

Indeed.

Seriously, Falco, Puff, Marth, Shiek, Fox, Peach, IC's, Capt. Falcon, THEY'RE ALL GAY IF YOU WANT THEM TO BE. Saying "rest is gay" is just like saying "Marth's fsmash is gay" or "chaingrabs are gay" or "Auto-combos into knee are gay" or "falco's lasers and spike are gay" or "fox's shine and upsmash are gay" or "Peach's dsmash is gay" or any of that crap. LEARN HOW TO BEAT IT. If the player really is just spamming a few moves, it's YOUR FAULT for not beating them. Playing "GAY" (read: smart) is far more difficult (and better) than going aggro all the time. That is why playing smart wins over aggro rushdown. If aggro rushdown is your style, be prepared to change it against certain playstyles or be prepared to lose. IT'S THAT SIMPLE. QUIT JOHNING, MELEE COMMUNITY.

 

[odinNJ]

stop trying to justify playing puff. if you like the character you shouldnt care if its gay, and you should embrace its good qualities and brag about them and talk about how bad other characters are. Thats the point of melee.

learn how to beat it" is a horrible philosophy to counter people calling moves gay, because that implies that there is a simple easy way to beat things like jiggs bair everytime. which their isnt, because its really good. period.


edit: hbox and mango(back when he mained puff) are too good though.

 

[KrIsP!]

^you contradicted your self few times there. I'm confused, you both put me down and told me i'm right.

 

[EPsilon933]

The homosexual things about this game make it fun

 

[JKJ]

stop trying to justify playing puff.

In no way do I or have I ever played puff; I don't know if this was directed at me or not.

"learn how to beat it" is a horrible philosophy to counter people calling moves gay, because that implies that there is a simple easy way to beat things like jiggs bair everytime. which their isnt, because its really good. period.

A move can be really good (I.E. Marth's Fsmash) but I never implied that the way to beat it is simple or works every time. If there was a simple way to beat any good move every time, this wouldn't be a very fun game, now would it? Every single Fsmash a Marth throws out must be reacted to differently and punished differently. Sometimes, you mess up and you will get hit. That's how it works for everything in the game. I will amend my statement: Learn how to beat it by reacting, reading, and punishing better.

edit: hbox and mango(back when he mained puff) are too good though.

At least we can agree on this.

 

[odinNJ]

the first statement was aimed at puff players who protest his gayness, though few exist XD.

and yes, I like your amended statement, but the point is that the whole learn to beat it thing only works if one of the parties is bad. if both parties are good players there is no way to learn to beat a single move, but there are ways to learn to beat a person

 

[EPsilon933]

Marth's fsmash isn't even that good. When a Marth fsmashes, they have to be thinking about what they do when they miss because they will miss (don't interpret too literally)

 

[ShroudedOne]

learn how to beat it" is a horrible philosophy to counter people calling moves gay, because that implies that there is a simple easy way to beat things like jiggs bair everytime. which their isnt, because its really good. period.

No...it implies that even though a move is really good, it's not unbeatable, and calling it gay instead of finding the solution (there are quite a few) does nothing.

 

[DerfMidWest]

Every character sans mario is gay.
Its not about wining or losing or strategies or bull**** like that.
You can use gay characters in a nomhomosexual way...
Or you can except that they are gay and abuse that fact.

And honestly, people just call stuff gay when it forces them to play differently or in a way that they don't want to. Its just how our community's logic works :3

 

[odinNJ]

No...it implies that even though a move is really good, it's not unbeatable, and calling it gay instead of finding the solution (there are quite a few) does nothing.

but your post implies that there are "solutions" even though the solution will be different everytime dependent on player and situation. No two scenarios are exactly the same. Thus instead of "learn how to beat" a move, one should "learn how to beat" someones playstyle, which, if they are better than you, might be impossible.

For example, Im relatively sure that if someone like m2k were to just space fsmashs against me I would lose, not because I dont know how to beat fsmash spam, but because he will space them so perfectly that I woudlnt be able to do anything at my current skill level.

 

[EPsilon933]

Winning is about doing things your opponent doesn't know how to respond to

 

[DerfMidWest]

In part.
I've always viewed the game as trying to force your opponent to make mistakes.
But doing things they don't know how to respond to forces said mistskes.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

Playing "gay" means playing smart, safe and efficient. The term itself an loser's excuse.

 

[leffen]

Winning is about doing things your opponent doesn't know how to respond to

You win by surviving while killing them. Just because your opponent knows how to respond to an option doesn't mean that its useless...

You win by outsmarting your opponent. At the top level everyone knows each others options (for the most part) so it comes down to mixups, or rock paper scissor with more options and different types of reward for each one.

I hate people who think that you need to force "mistakes", it just shows how stupid and undereducated the community is, game theory wise. Every option has a counter, you just have to know what the counter is and know what and when they use it.
When people forget that everything has a counter is when you start calling things "gay" and you start to put arbitrary limits on yourself that aren't really there. A prime example of scrub mentality.

Playing gay isn't playing smart, efficient or defensive. It is simply a term that is used for a million different things, and you shouldn't aim to fit your play style into such a stupid term, but you shouldn't try to avoid it either. Doing so just limits yourself.

 

[outofphase]

ya all top tiers are broken. if any of the top 8 or so characters were the only one of them in the game, that character would be way overpowered. at the same time, i dont think alot of people got into melee because they were in awe of peach's dsmash's ability to punish ccing so well. when players make effective use of very safe play, the game loses alot of its hype because the risk and reward gets skewed.

 

[Stylez]

I think "op" is a better term for moves that are hard to beat, so people aren't usually referring to a specific move when complaining something is "gay".
And why can't "gay" just mean playing a certain way you don't like? Why does it have to be an excuse for loosing?

 

[S l o X]

i love you leffen lets do a 25*$ mm at apex

 

[Bad Cupboard]

I think a lot of us started and continue to play Melee because it's flashy and technical.
"Playing gay" usually means you play in a non-flashy and non-technical way.
I don't know what we can do about that though, because it's not like we're going to ban back air or something.

 

[rawrimamonster]

I think a lot of us started and continue to play Melee because it's flashy and technical.
"Playing gay" usually means you play in a non-flashy and non-technical way.
I don't know what we can do about that though, because it's not like we're going to ban back air or something.

I'm not so sure it's that as much as... it's just something that counters your style or shuts you down with simplicity. I've played in tournaments and matches where I've dominated the people there, then I get to someone who just has some weird *** janky style...it's not how technical they are or how smart, but they just do weird **** that works. It just counters you as a player and its frustrating because you cant do nothing to change it, they just keep doing it.


Best way I can describe it IN MOST CASES is playing against a scrub who doesn't respond to "mindgames". The type of "gay" like that. I remember way back when in like 04 or 05 simple gimp styles used to be "gay" as hell to a lotta people.

 

[MasterShake]

If somebody jumps off with a move or falls off the ledge and the opponent just grabs the ledge and rolls/lets them die etc.

That's def gay.

Doubly so in a friendly.

 

[Vegard]

You win by surviving while killing them. Just because your opponent knows how to respond to an option doesn't mean that its useless...

You win by outsmarting your opponent. At the top level everyone knows each others options (for the most part) so it comes down to mixups, or rock paper scissor with more options and different types of reward for each one.

I hate people who think that you need to force "mistakes", it just shows how stupid and undereducated the community is, game theory wise. Every option has a counter, you just have to know what the counter is and know what and when they use it.
When people forget that everything has a counter is when you start calling things "gay" and you start to put arbitrary limits on yourself that aren't really there. A prime example of scrub mentality.

Playing gay isn't playing smart, efficient or defensive. It is simply a term that is used for a million different things, and you shouldn't aim to fit your play style into such a stupid term, but you shouldn't try to avoid it either. Doing so just limits yourself.

This is so on point that it needs to be quoted.

 

[R2_GP]

this is not a new term in video games specially in fighters , imo playing gay is just spamming the hell out of one or two moves in order to ensure your win

 

[Kink-Link5]

Low tiers and Falcon are pretty dumb, but playing anything besides as safely/well as you can muster is dumber.

Every character in smash is super homo if you're playing them right.

 

[Brookman]

Gay is a word that scrubs use to denote a superior play style to their own.

 

[Charlesz]

Gay is a word that scrubs use to denote a superior play style to their own.

this.

/thread

 

[Purpletuce]

I think there are two aspects that combine to form the general opinion of Puff being 'gay': Puff can be boring to watch (which is self-explanatory) and Puff is frustrating to play(for some). That frustration is likely because the Puff MU is a very unique one that requires precise and intelligent play, if you run around trying to do fancy tech skill, and don't focus on your defense, you'll form habits, and habits can be rested. Also, when a new player is unfamiliar with the MU, they don't know what to do, for example, If Puff is fighting Falco and lands a low N-air -> grab, you have 8 frames to DI before you no longer have the option to DI, but the average players reaction time is at the minimum 12 frames, usually 15-20. So an experienced player is subject to getting hit by that often. Add in newer players typically having poor spacing, and you'll get eaten up by Puff's spacing.

TLDR: coherent Puff players form one the barrier most players see, where they have to start playing smarter, not faster.

This is around the time when they'll start learning from matches, not combo videos.

AKA Puff beats scrubs.

 

[EPsilon933]

People don't want spacing. They want comboes and tech skill because it looks cool

 

[R2_GP]

Gay is a word that scrubs use to denote a superior play style to their own.

i really don't think spaming bairs is a superior play style

 

[Massive]

i really don't think spaming bairs is a superior play style

I dunno man, Hbox wins an awful lot.

 

[R2_GP]

hbox timing at edged guarding fox's/falco's side b with the rest is sick though lol

 

[KrIsP!]

Hbox doesn't spam though, his bairs aren't wasted they're all placed the same way a doc would work on pill placement. Some hate watching him play but he wins for a reason

 

[ElloEddy]

no such thing as playing gay...its just their smarter and you cant deal with it ...learn to deal with it

but honesty if you play a top tier character (...fox ...falco ...shiek..marth ) you play gay cause those character's have the dumbest broken **** that **** you up

which is why everyone plays them ....ever though about that

and ....your all the mad ones ..when a puff/peach come and **** you up with their 1 or 2 broken moves ....

like -__- i play ylink lol and once you learn a match-up it aint so bad