Peach+ Get Pimpslapped!

[SymphonicSage12]

Guys, they released the new nightly build. They lowered Peach Bomber's BKB, but increased the KBG.

 

[BeepBopRobot]

It also seems like they forgot to change peach's fair. (or atleast they didnt report that they did)

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Wait, is this about how Fair kills at like 115% now? I don't see it. I usually dont kill with Fair until 130+ damage. :/

 

[SymphonicSage12]

BTW, peach bomber-ing someone offstage+ throwing turnips offstage= epic gimping power.

 

[Meru.]

And? How is it? * PAL user *

@ Beep: SHHHH! Dont let them know Dx

 

[SymphonicSage12]

I don't get it! The fair wasn't made more powerful at all! It doesn't start killing Mario, without DI, from the center of FD, until 131% damage, not 115%. WHAT ARE U NINKOMPOOPS TALKING BOUT YO?

 

[5ive]

Here's a set featuring Painted Ghost's Peach.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN45c-9TQ3s&fmt=18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1rDuKOpyZ4&fmt=18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjnIjjNysEs&fmt=18

 

[Meru.]

^
Wow, that's a great Peach :O How can he land so many Usmashes..? ;p

Oh and, he should Nair out of combos. Peach can Nair out of many combos.

 

[5ive]

^
Wow, that's a great Peach :O How can he land so many Usmashes..? ;p

Oh and, he should Nair out of combos. Peach can Nair out of many combos.

My over aggressive Pikachu probably played a hand in that.

 

[slikvik]

just won a tourney going mostly peach/G&W(some wario). expect lots of vids soon

 

[Meru.]

^
Awesome, that's great! Keep it up ;d

I feel like discussing her moves again. I've already done these:
(feel free to correct or discuss or whatever)

Nair
Pros
- Comes out really quickly.
- Zero lag when auto-cancelled.
- Hitbox lasts long.
- Amazing for edgeguarding.
- Good kill move, especially when edgeguarding.
- Good combo move
- Pillaring is fun and effective.
- Very hard to punish when auto-cancelled well.
- Great-GTFO-me move
- Can eat shields

Cons
- Small hitbox.

Fair
Pros
- Great kill move, her most reliable one, especially since it doesnt stale anymore!
- Very little to no lag when auto-cancelled
- Nice hitbox.
- Okay for edgeguarding.

Cons
- Slow start-up.

Bair
Pros
- Comes out quickly.
- Zero lag when auto cancelled.
- Nice hitbox too.
- Great for edgeguarding.
- Good combo move.
- Has a strong and weak hitbox: the strong one can be used for killing and edgeguarding, the weak one for combo's (Bair > Ftilt is an example)
- Great fot spacing.
- Very hard to punish, especially when auto-cancelled well.


Cons
I cant think of any. If you can, tell.

Uair
Pros
- Good hitstun
- Excellent for juggling and comboing.
- Pretty quick
- Can kill well if you're close to the upper ceiling.

Cons
- Awful edgeguarding move.
- It's pretty bad when close to the ground or when floating close the the ground, especially compared to her other aerials.

Dair
Pros
- Fast and lasts long
- Too good for combo's
- Too good combo starter]
- Very hard to punish
- Good GTFO move
- Wrecks shields

Cons
- ... You cant kill with it? Though that's not really a con, since it isn't meant for killing.
- Can be SDI'ed at certain %.

Ftilt
Pros
- Good range
- Three different hitboxes for three different purposes:
* The close sweetspot hitbox: This one kills vertically well. 13%
* The distant hitbox: Doesn't kill very well, but good for combos. 10%
* The late hitbox: Doesn't kill at all, but awesome for combos. 6%
- Fast start-up (I think 6 frames)
- Good hitstun
- Can repeatedly combo into itself

Cons
- Start-up is good, the ending lag isn't. You can get punished badly.
- Pretty annoying if you get the wrong hitbox.

Examples of combos
- Ftilt repeatedly
- Ftilt (repeatedly) > Utilt
- Ftilt (repeatedly) > Usmash
- Ftilt (repeatedly) > Uair > Uair ....
- Ftilt (repeatedly) > Nair/Bair/Fair
- Ftilt (repeatedly) > Dair ...
- Dthrow > Ftilt (repeatedly) > ...
- Dsmash > Ftilt (repeatedly) > ...
- Bair > Ftilt (repeatedly) > ...
- Uthrow > Ftilt (repeatedly) > ... [ only at very low %'s] [ only vs. heavy or fastfallers ]
- Dtilt > Ftilt (repeatedly) > ...
- Frying Pan > Ftilt (repeatedly) > ...

Dtilt
Pros
- Great range
- Great for combos
- Incredible hitstun
- Good for edgeguarding
- Can spike (but don't count it, happens very rarely)
- Can slide

Cons
- A bit slow
- Slide can also be at your disadvantage if you want to combo

Examples of combos
- Dtilt > Any aerial [ Seriously, the hitstun is really great ]
- Dtilt > Dtilt (> Dtilt) > Ftilt (repeatedly) > ...
- To keep a long story short:
* At low %'s (approx. 50-) Dtilt can combo into almost anything.
* At higher %'s Dtilt still can easily combo into an aerial.
* If the % gets too high, try an Uair or a turnip or just bait them or something.

Utilt
Pros
- Hitbox is insane!
- Good hitstun (again)
- Can kill at higher %
- Pretty quick
- Beats every Dair and almost everything else
- Good combo finisher

Cons
- Utilt has only one purpose: hitting someone who is up you. And well, it fulfills his task well, so no cons for this one. (Though you might say that a con of Utilt is that it has only one purpose)

Examples of Combos
- Dtilt > Utilt [ Keep in mind that Dtilt can slide ]
- Dtiltslide > Utilt [ ... If you don't mind the slide, Utilt is a great option, it has a long slide ]
- Ftilt (repeatedly) > Utilt
- Dthrow > Utilt
- Uthrow > Utilt [ Very low %'s only ] [ Only works on certain characters ]
- Frying Pan > Utilt
- Usmash > Utilt [ Very low %'s only ]

Let's talk about her smashes

Fsmash
Pros
- Unpredictable.
- Can kill well overall.
- Wall of very high priority.
- Can be used defensively, as well as agressively (though it's better defensively)
- Tennis Racket's sweetspot is very powerful.
- Golf Club has great range, while still being powerful.
- Pan can kill decently, but it can also combo at lower %'s and it deals a good amount of damage.

Cons
- Unpredictability can also work in your disadvantage (not a big problem though, don't worry about ;p)
- Tennis Racket sucks if it isn't sweetspotted.
- Pan has poor range.
- A bit slow, making it harder to use agressively.

Examples of combos
- Pan > Any aerial.
- Pan > Ftilt
- Pan > Utilt

It is somewhat hard to combo with it though, since it's unpredictable.

Usmash
Pros
- Very strong when sweetspotted.
- Good combo potential when sourspotted.

Cons
- Good luck sweetspotting it.
- Slower than it looks (hits on frame 14).

Dsmash
Pros
- Quick.
- Good and long-lasting hitbox around her.
- Deals some good damage.
- Great shield-poker.
- Good for stagespiking.

Cons
- Damage isn't so good when you only hit once.

Discuss :D

 

[Roxas215]

just won a tourney going mostly peach/G&W(some wario). expect lots of vids soon

You are my hero!!! Especially if this tourney had marths mk's and zss in them(they are by far my hardest matchups with peach in brawl+) Looking forward to the vids!

Here's a set featuring Painted Ghost's Peach.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN45c-9TQ3s&fmt=18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1rDuKOpyZ4&fmt=18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjnIjjNysEs&fmt=18

Great set. Surprised at how many usmash ghost landed. He was reading QA very well. However i seen very little grab to tilt combos from peach. This is her bread and butter in brawl+ along with sh dair. It completely wrecks the spacies but even agaist middleweights like pika u can get a dthrow to maybe 1 or 2 ftilts and "insert combo here" depending on the opponents di. I still think pika's thunder setups are a bit ridiculous and a little to easy to get but meh shouldn't complain when chars like fox and squirtle exists lol.

 

[Airgemini]

Is it me or is the sweetspot of her Racket just a taaaad bit harder to hit with? :o

 

[SymphonicSage12]

I think the main reason why I have trouble hitting with the sweetspot of her racket is that the tennis racket's range is always greater than I think it'll be. I mean, it's a small tennis racket, but it can hit people a decent distance away. Like wtf.

 

[mountain_tiger]

Hey guys, I don't have Brawl+, so can I ask some quick questions?

1) How much does more hitstun benefit Peach?

2) Has DSmash been buffed much?

3) Have they fixed her airdodge yet? (It's not fair that she gets 10 frames less invincibility than everyone else...)

 

[THO]

Hits stun is good for peach, it ensures at least one aerial out of down throw until and some times up to killing percents. Also, peach combos like a beast, she doesn't have as solid death combos as CF (he has the knee) but she can get in a good 50-70 damage combo each stock and if your lucky a fair to lead into an edge gaurd.

Down smash is much better, usually several hits of it get in and the improved range make it better for punishing people who like to roll behind you. Also the range makes it good enough where you can be out of grab range and still hit with it on alot of characters.

I don't know about her airdodge, but i'm still petty sure its awful.

 

[BeepBopRobot]

Well its not that her airdodge got buffed, but everybody (besides peach) got a nerf on the invincibility of the airdodge to even it out.

 

[THO]

For some reason I can't find a link to these vids from the Apex tourney.
Here they are.
Dark Peach vs. Yes! MM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIRWPPvgLtk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4lBwqHgdjk
Slikvik vs. Yes! Tourney
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDMgezOJVm8

 

[slikvik]

tourney. SlikVik vs Jcaesar

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJmmGVnsEBg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7jG6y8R61E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCqtFtYG65Y

 

[SymphonicSage12]

New nightly build came out two days ago. Peach's side b buff got readjusted. :-|

 

[crazycrackers]

I think the main reason why I have trouble hitting with the sweetspot of her racket is that the tennis racket's range is always greater than I think it'll be. I mean, it's a small tennis racket, but it can hit people a decent distance away. Like wtf.

It would be easy if it followed a pattern IMHO. Like if you do it three times you would get pan>racket>club. That way it wouldn't be so random.

However, if you get the frying pan I'd recomend trying to hit with the racket sweetspot the next time you do the move. You KNOW that you're not going to get the frying pan again since you can't get the same object twice in a row, and that means you can either get the racket or the golf club. So if you aim for the sweetspot of the tennis racket, you can either:

1) Get the tennis racket. If it hits you get the powerful sweetspot

or

2) Get the golf club. The golf club still has a rather powerful hit, and is just fine not sweetspotted. Win/Win situation

Just my 2 cents.

 

[GHNeko]

oh hey peach mains. just dropping by to say ya'll crazy. D:

Also, if I get B+ character boards on AiB, how many of you would migrate character discussion over there?

 

[Airgemini]

I wouldn't, AIB boards are terrible.
Just my opinion .

 

[Roxas215]

Yea i probably wouldn't either. Just being honest. I only use aib for ladder. Now if we get a brawl+ ladder over there then hell yea!

 

[crazycrackers]

oh hey peach mains. just dropping by to say ya'll crazy. D:

Also, if I get B+ character boards on AiB, how many of you would migrate character discussion over there?

I would do it if other people are willing to. I know thats kind of dumb but the AiB boards just suck.

 

[GHNeko]

Well the thing is, it would be like what happens here on SWF. Alot of people simply come to SWF for a forum or two and a thread.

I come here for the Smash Workshop, Workshop Back Room and the Houston Thread in regional boards.

It would be the same thing with AiB B+ Character board, we'd go there for the character boards and stick to teh workshop for B+ in general. V:

We'd still know all the same people and some AiB players who play B+

 

[crazycrackers]

I'd be willing to participate in that I suppose :3

 

[Roxas215]

Ill give it a try!

finally gotten around to playing the new genesis set yesterday. Im going to get some vids up as i would like other people on this board to critique my peach!

 

[crazycrackers]

sounds good. Also, I've heard Peach's fthrow is being buffed but I also heard it isn't. If it isn't I'd gladly do a trade-off with dsmash PERSONALLY. <3 melee fthrow

 

[GHNeko]

I'd support it out of spite. It's easier for me to avoid grabs than dsmash. Ugh. I hate that move so much.

 

[THO]

Hey, does anyone know any good ways to combo into an upsmash. I figured this is important to figure out considering it kills starting around 90% or so and the earliest kill after it is around 120% and usually higher (unless you gimp them). Just seeing if anyone has any good ideas.

Also, what are you guys doing against Marths? Maybe its just me but this matchup seems very difficult, unless i'm missing something (it seems as bad as it was in Brawl).

 

[GHNeko]

You don't combo into Usmash. :V

It's a situational kill move.

And I feel you on the Marth vs Peach match up. It's the match up I hate so much. >:

Mainly because of that stupid dsmash. Tell me peach mainers, what does marth have to do to win besides camping fairs.

 

[Magus420]

D-tilt probably combos into it on fast fallers. I don't use Peach though.

 

[Roxas215]

Hey, does anyone know any good ways to combo into an upsmash. I figured this is important to figure out considering it kills starting around 90% or so and the earliest kill after it is around 120% and usually higher (unless you gimp them). Just seeing if anyone has any good ideas.

Only legit combo i know is sh dair to usmash however this only works at low percent. You could maybe pull this off at high percent for the kill if the other person di the dair horribly. Also dthrow to usmash on fast fallers works at high percent so u can use this a kill setup.. On platform stages like battlefield and wario ware it's very easy to land a usmash on a missed tech. Usmash isn't a move you combo into rather then a move you bait. When people recover i always throw turnips up in the air and then one towards them. Most likely they are going to air dodge the turnip while getting back on the stage only to meet a sweetspotted usmash.

You don't combo into Usmash. :V

It's a situational kill move.

And I feel you on the Marth vs Peach match up. It's the match up I hate so much. >:

Mainly because of that stupid dsmash. Tell me peach mainers, what does marth have to do to win besides camping fairs.

Umm marth ***** peach. What are u talking about? Dsmash and bair is all we got against marth wall of fairs.

Now if u don't spam fairs then yes the matchup is a bit easier for peach. For one peach is faster on ground and with hitstun she has a solid ground game to go with her superb air game. And the new dsmash does work wonders on marth!

You hating to camp with marth is exactly like me hating to camp against ddd. But you have to do it sometimes lol.



Edit since no one else posted yet i can just edit this post.

Ok what do yall think of the Zelda matchup? I always thought zelda was a pain in vbrawl cause of how she just counters every air tactic peach has. But she wasn't THAT bad because of her horrible recovery and slow start up attacks. Now in brawl+ i honestly feel she is one of peach's worst matchups(along with marth,squirtle,mk,and game and watch)

Zelda got quite a few buffs and with hitstun her usmash is even more **** then it was in vbrawl. Also since she is light you wont be hitting her with peach's crazy combos like the fast fallers. Float dair is just going to get you *****. Also in brawl+ her up b is actually useful and she will be flying all over the place. Plus it seems like there is virtually no lag on it. There were times where i correctly read exactly where she would end up after her up b and she still either attacked right out of it or blocked or spotdodge my attack. You can't punish it. Also Zelda completely wrecks peach's recovery. Its a known fact that peach's fall speed is horrible. Zelda's will just din's fire her all day while she is in the air. Also with no asl virtually every ground move of zelda's will hit peach as she is trying to recover. Also Zelda doesn't need to approach. EVER. I found that you will constantly be switching from offensive to defensive depending on what zelda is doing in this matchup. Honestly if i know before hand im facing a zelda at a tournament im just going zss lol.

Anyway here are some vids of peach vs zelda. The quality isn't the greatest( i recorded it with my camera) But these vids will prove some more insight on my zelda post plus it shows off my peach that i wanted critique for anyway!

Phillyrider(Peach) Vs Rion(Zelda) Brawl 7/10
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ih2eB5zbUc

Phillyrider(Peach) Vs Rion(Zelda) Brawl 7/10(2)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ed9cla96F0

Phillyrider(Peach) Vs Rion(Zelda) Brawl 7/10(3)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_njoNrE_BY

Phillyrider(Peach) Vs Rion(Zelda) Brawl 7/10(4)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teYGuCDNeqI

Out of the 4 i uploaded i won 2 and lost 2. However out of the hour or so that i played against rion i lost more then i won.

Anyway any critique for my peach is welcome! With her new bomber buff im actually using the move lol. The move actually combos if the opponent fails to tech.

Edit again finally got around to updating 1st post. Hopefully yaaay dont mind me using his post. If anyone got anything to add let me know!

 

[crazycrackers]

Zelda can give me trouble but the problem with Peach vs Zelda is that its not actually that bad of a matchup, its just frustrating, so I see Peaches falling apart when put against Zelda. Not really that bad IMO

 

[THO]

In the third vid you seemed to die typically when you run into zelda's forward smash or fair/bair. It seems like it wasn't something the zelda was doing but rather what you were doing. You got greedy when zelda would up-b towards you. The up-b isn't actually setting any thing up on you, its just your trying very hard to punish a move that is very difficult to punish (it may not even be punishable unless he finishes in the air, but i don't really know).
The thing that cost you the most in these matches was not being able to kill till past 140%. This was especially true in the matches you lost (it probably is the reason you lost). You do a great job on the stage, you combo, you get a lot of tech chases off with the forward-b and such but they always hit the zelda the wrong way.
The third match (the one i'm picking on most) shows this very clearly. The zelda tries very hard to stay in the center of the stage, everytime she gets hit away she risks rolling through and behind you in order to get far from the edge. You can see it on every stock, once zelda gets to a high percent she will roll all the way to the center.
What appears to be happening is that zelda is controlling the location of the fighting much more than you are. Maybe this can't be helped. I'm not sure. But it is good to note that you are hitting killing blows they are just from the center of the stage. Perhaps you should try turnip camping until the zelda is forced out of the center of the stage. Eventually she will either come at you or retreat away, either way she's not longer in the center.

I watched your vids and figured i'd let you know what I thought. Hope it helps, buddy.

 

[crazycrackers]

Hit Zelda up a lot. She falls so slowly in the air (like Peach) that its really easy to juggle her/follow her in the air/punish her ADs before she reaches the ground. And Peach aerials>Zelda aerials

 

[THO]

So, word on the street is Peach is a Kirby counter. I was wondering what the peach+ community thinks of this belief.

 

[GHNeko]

Kirby bair says hi.

 

[THO]

hi buddy
I guess i should elaborate, kirby can span back air all day and can't really close on peach, and peach can just float around and wait for kirby to bair too close or to early and punish. they both just wait all match, except peach has radishes, so maybe she has an advantage.