Official "Who is going to return?" topic

[Yellow Mage]

He said "Top 10 most likely not to make it," and, frankly, I think Falco should be MUCH higher up, Roy should be MUCH lower down, and Shiek changed to "Zelda/Shiek," and the Ice Climbers replaced with Captain Falcon (especially if you're going to have Ness on there).

Personally, I think nine are getting the well-deserved boot:

1. Falco
2. Captain Falcon
3. Mister Game And Watch
4. Doctor Mario
5. Ganondorf
6. Zelda/Shiek
7. Pichu
8. Young Link
9. Mewtwo

But, again, that's just me, and a lot of people hate me for it, BUT I never let that stop me from feeling what I feel.

 

[icymatt]

Even by your odd non-logic, Mr.Game&Watch is in the clearing because all his attacks are from his games.

But again, the only characters with a high chance of getting cut are clones, with the exception of Ganondorf and Falco, who are both super-important to their respective series.

 

[Yellow Mage]

Ganondorf IS an important villan in the LoZ series, but Falco has little more importance than Peppy or even Slippy. Falco is no execption: he is a prime example.

 

[Diddy Kong]

But still Yellow Mage, think about this. Fox and Falco have the same moveset, yet they play totally diffrent, now all clones have this... But Fox and Falco are even more seperate than that. Falco has more importance than Peppy or Slippy, he's the head pilot while Fox is the commander. You could see Falco as being Fox's sidekick.

And I still don't know why you would cut two VERY important character in the LoZ franchise above Young Link, who's just Link but younger. You'd even give Pichu more chance, now I know this is just an oppinion. But why?

You are complaining all the time about C.Falcon and Fox, but Ness had his moves also all made up. Only his Bat and Yo-Yo are true to Earthbound. And even that wouldn't be accurate, because Ness could only equip one of them in Earthbound. 50% of his B moves are all from Paula, except for the PSI Magnet and PK Flash... Who all work diffrently in Earthbound to.

Fox always had his Blaster. The Reflector aka the Shine and his Up and >B are all made up. But they do suit the style of the character and the franchise he's from. C.Falcon used some of his moves from Smash Bros in the F Zero anime, seeing how much the character has devloped since Smash Bros... Taking him out would be just plain stupid.

The only character I truely think who 100% deserves the Boot/ the Axe or whatever is Dr.Mario. All other clones except for him had actually reasons for being in Melee, and they all have posibilities for having their own movesets. Doc might be populair, but that's ONLY because he's SLIGHTLY higher tiered than Mario. I said this many many times before, but Doc is just Mario in a doctor's costume with no importance, no new moveset possibility and he's only defended by people who main him and just simply refuse to play another character... Or just Mario. >_>

 

[Yellow Mage]

True, but part of my logic is seeing whether the charactor was playable or not. Fox you could actually control in his games: Falco was never anything more than an NPC until Melee. And if you're talking about impotance in the actual game, sure, Falco is more important than Peppy and Slippy, but just barely.

That logic also prevails in my Pichu and Young Link above Ganondorf and Zelda/Shiek, seeing how the latter two were never playable either. With the exceptions of G&W and Doc, the top of my list is made of NPCs.

Now, you wonder why I don't want Ness to go if he has all the stuff he never could have: well, why don't I want Luigi to go because he has the Green Missle? Why don't I want Kirby to go even though technically he doesn't even have those powers he got by default? Well, all three of those were in the original, and considering they could fight already, picking up a few extra moves along the way is acceptable. Besides, Ness DID learn everything he did learn from Paula in the first place, anyway.

You say Captain Falcon used his moves from the Anime in SSB. That is incorrect: he used his moves from SSB in the Anime! If you researched which came first, you can understand my dislike for self-fulfilling prophecies.

And, to me, the charactor I truely think who 100% deserves the Boot/Axe is Falco, of course. I'm not going through my long list of reasons again at the moment. But I can say I want him gone for reasons including, but not limited to, the reasons we want Doctor Mario gone.

 

[Thrillhouse-vh.]

True, but part of my logic is seeing whether the charactor was playable or not. Fox you could actually control in his games: Falco was never anything more than an NPC until Melee. And if you're talking about impotance in the actual game, sure, Falco is more important than Peppy and Slippy, but just barely.

Fox, Falco, Peppy and Slippy were playable OUTSIDE the Arwings in SF64

 

[MiraiGen]

Maybe we should stop talking about this.

I think that they're going to do the Switcheroo with Roy and suppliment him for that badass King guy, as well as Samurai Goroh for Gannondorf.

Doc, I think, is gone.

EDIT'D:

You are complaining all the time about C.Falcon and Fox, but Ness had his moves also all made up. Only his Bat and Yo-Yo are true to Earthbound. And even that wouldn't be accurate, because Ness could only equip one of them in Earthbound. 50% of his B moves are all from Paula, except for the PSI Magnet and PK Flash... Who all work diffrently in Earthbound to.

I think when it comes to RPGs and "reality" in a fighting game like Smash, you need to cut them some slack.

Also, correction; PSI Flash had a .001% chance of killing an enemy in one hit. Sounds like PK Flash to me, too.

This is the reason I'm not with YM's "Character should have what they had in the game." There's not enough to work with as far as Nintendo-based games, considering they only really developed a handful of which they could nab characters from.

 

[Yellow Mage]

Now, you wonder why I don't want Ness to go if he has all the stuff he never could have: well, why don't I want Luigi to go because he has the Green Missle? Why don't I want Kirby to go even though technically he doesn't even have those powers he got by default? Well, all three of those were in the original, and considering they could fight already, picking up a few extra moves along the way is acceptable. Besides, Ness DID learn everything he did learn from Paula in the first place, anyway.

Umm. . .besides, I don't like fighting anyway, let's stop before this thread explodes.

 

[Rhyme]

Umm. . .besides, I don't like fighting anyway, let's stop before this thread explodes.

What do you expect, declaring Falco as your "most deserving to get the boot"? If you want to express your opinion, expect a fight. If you don't want to fight, don't say Falco is deserving of being cut over the many other characters on your list or in the game.

 

[cb_marth]

Why does Flaco deserve to be cut? He's one of the best in the game? Yes he's a clone but they can give him new moves can't they. See this is what I mean, opinions like this, they shouldn't be able to be said.

 

[Yellow Mage]

What do you expect, declaring Falco as your "most deserving to get the boot"? If you want to express your opinion, expect a fight. If you don't want to fight, don't say Falco is deserving of being cut over the many other characters on your list or in the game.

So basically, I voice my opinion, and it starts a fight? I basically have to conform to what everybody else thinks?

Wow, the community here is AMAZING, really. . .[/sarcasm]

And in all honesty, they COULD change him, but why waste the effort? All Falco has going for him is popularity, and NOTHING more. He's basically Master Chief, except Nintendo actually owns Falco.

And one more thing: why are we even arguing about Falco when FOX isn't even confirmed??? I don't have anything against Fox (except stuff like his reflector, which can be removed), I'm just saying he isn't even confirmed and we're arguing about Falco. . .crazy.



Quoted from the Kystal (again, Fox isn't even confrimed !! ) thread my arguments on Falco:

I don't want Falco gone because of bad experiences, I want him gone because of logic.

I never had a "bad day" with Falco, per se, nor do I have any grudge against him, but I DO think his popularity is undeserved. I don't try to be different, I don't want him gone because I'm bad with him, I want him gone because his presence in melee was totally inexcuseable.

Not only is he an NPC, but all he CAN be is a clone (or luigification) of Fox, who never even made sense in SSB before Adventures because all he could do was ride a spaceship and shoot at stuff. Fox was given a moveset made up on the spot, and since they couldn't think of more movesets on the spot (after Captain Falcon), they had to give the same moveset to Falco.

But people want him in because they're good with him in Melee! Which makes no sense because Brawl is an entirely different game. For all intensive purposes, let us say Falco DOES make it in, but he had to be nerfed as the cost. All his previous "fans" now hate him because they now suck as him, and then thier eyes "open," more or less, to the truth that Falco never made sense in the first place.

Logic says Falco FTL.

If a charactor deserves to be in, then they'll be a charactor that makes sense as far as thier charactor goes, not as far as "how good they are" in Brawl, because since it isn't released yet, we have no idea, so NOBODY should be judged on how "good" they "can" be rather than how much sense they make.

If the charactor makes sense, they'll likely be in, otherwise, end of story.

Of course, the whole thing about charactors being cut COULD have been only a hoax just to keep us guessing, all along, so nobody knows for sure.

 

[commonyoshi]

Just a random thought that doesn't deserve its own thread: Should Ness have his Thunder Jacket as an official move?

In Melee version 1.0, if you used the UpB to slam Ness straight into the ground, he would have the hitboxes of the attack still around him. It doesn't have to be as strong, but it certainly is an interesting idea.

 

[MiraiGen]

Umm. . .besides, I don't like fighting anyway, let's stop before this thread explodes.

I'm not trying to argue with you. I'm just saying that for Nintendo characters like C Falcon, Team Starfox, Zelda herself, etc etc etc, they need to bull**** their way through the moveset.

Alot of the games Nintendo develops don't leave very much to work with as far as the characters themselves. I mean, how many people said "I'm going to pick Captain Falcon" in F-Zero? No, people said, "I'm going to pick the Blue Falcon," because C Falcon's name was just tacked on because a car needs a driver.

Here's what I mean. Take a look at the list of games Nintendo owns. Going down the list of main characters from games, there's not many to choose from. They probably picked Captain Falcon because he was from a very popular game series (F-Zero X/F-Zero SNES was huge at the time) and he was recognizeable.

 

[smashplayerX]

all the characters from melee cuz you cant take away a character dat people are good wit and make them start all over again

 

[icymatt]

all the characters from melee cuz you cant take away a character dat people are good wit and make them start all over again

And what if the characters play differently? Then they have to start all over again anyway.

People should expect to start over again. It's a new game.

 

[Zink]

YM, the clones were not given identical movesets because of lack of ideas, it was because of time constraints.

 

[Thrillhouse-vh.]

Here's what I mean. Take a look at the list of games Nintendo owns. Going down the list of main characters from games, there's not many to choose from. They probably picked Captain Falcon because he was from a very popular game series (F-Zero X/F-Zero SNES was huge at the time) and he was recognizeable.

while wikipedia is a good info website, it's not fail proof, tht list is missing ALOT.

Here is a better list: http://nindb.classicgaming.gamespy.com/fran/index.shtml

Altough I do admit it has some flaws, it is the most accurate one I've see

 

[Boricua_Bob]

all the characters from melee cuz you cant take away a character dat people are good wit and make them start all over again

Best thing I heard from the whole forum.

 

[Rhyme]

Best thing I heard from the whole forum.

Yes, even though we are discussing who deserves to return the most, since some may not return.

YM, the clones were not given identical movesets because of lack of ideas, it was because of time constraints.

True.

And what if the characters play differently? Then they have to start all over again anyway.

I hope so, part of the fun of the game was when we had no idea what we were doing.

Should Ness have his Thunder Jacket as an official move?

He does, the YYG. I am confused, you mean like, tell people in the guidebook how to do it just like any other attack? Or make it easier to do?

So basically, I voice my opinion, and it starts a fight? I basically have to conform to what everybody else thinks?

Wow, the community here is AMAZING, really. . .[/sarcasm]

Of course, the whole thing about charactors being cut COULD have been only a hoax just to keep us guessing, all along, so nobody knows for sure.

No you don't have to conform to what everyone says, just expect people to get mad. If you were worried that one of your favorite characters was going to be cut you might argue as well. I see what you are saying about no one giving a darn about Falco ever until he rocked the melee scene. But I also feel that they shouldn't even consider ditching a hugely popular character.

I've been in just your situation on my FLUDD Mario thread. I gave half a page, consisting of a whole moveset, and was yelled at by everyone but one person, who later decided against me. I defended my position for over 8 pages, until no one tried arguing with me anymore. So if you believe Falco should be cut, you don't have to give up, just don't expect anyone to agree with you.

Why does Flaco deserve to be cut?

He doesn't.

 

[blh88]

The whole purpose of Super Smash Bros... is to put nintendos most popular characters into an all out brawl. To dump 1 of nintendo's most beloved characters.. ness, is completely ridiculous. The characters in the game are not based on their popularity IN SSB. It is based on their popularity outside of SSB, or Nintendo's way of GAINING popularity for a certain franchise. If mario was a horrible player in SSBM, and nobody used him.. do you think they would take him out of it?

 

[Dr_Twist]

definitly not so that would mean people like fox,mario,luigi,link,zelda they will come back since their popular

 

[100links]

My top 10 of Most likely to be cut from the series:

1. Pichu (Its a given)
2. Dr Mario (Ditto)
3. Game & Watch (maybe a little harsh but meh)
4. Young Link (The only way id like to see a return of Y Link is maybe in his Wind Waker form)
5. Roy (sad but true)
6. Ice Climbers
7. Sheik
8. Falco
9. Mew Two
10. Ness

that is possibly the most ******** thing i have ever read shiek IS zelda... its like taking mario out of his games!
falco...i dont know about him...but...still
mewtwo i know he sucks but isnt he a villan in pokemon? all characters need a villan (well kinda)
and ness? NESS!? WTF!!! hes one of the origanals! (i think i spelt that wrong) THATS ********!

and about the cel shaded link.....a cel shaded thing in a 3d game?

 

[Dr_Twist]

looking at that list makes me say i agree with you 100%

 

[HiddenTiger]

that is possibly the most ******** thing i have ever read shiek IS zelda... its like taking mario out of his games!
falco...i dont know about him...but...still
mewtwo i know he sucks but isnt he a villan in pokemon? all characters need a villan (well kinda)
and ness? NESS!? WTF!!! hes one of the origanals! (i think i spelt that wrong) THATS ********!

and about the cel shaded link.....a cel shaded thing in a 3d game?

Um... actually when you look at the facts, Ness actually has a decent chance of being replaced by Lucas from Mother 3 (the sequel to Earthbound). Sakurai actually was planning on replacing him with the main character of Mother 3 in Melee, back when it was planned for the N64. But since the game was cancelled, he ended up sticking with Ness. Now, with a Mother 3 finally out, and with the main character from that game being so highly requested on the polls, there's really nothing stopping him from doing it this time around. Also, as to what you said about Sheik. While it is true that Zelda and Sheik are the same person, that's only true for one game. Sheik only appeared in Ocarina of Time, and nowhere else. There is no way that Sheik is as vital to Zelda as Mario is to his games. So, if I were you, I'd try actually using your brain before you start throwing around the word ********, because it makes you look like an idiot.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Yeah Ness does has changes to be replaced. But they are very slim. I have heard he appeared as a cameo in Mother 3, which has Pokey in it aswell. I don't think Pokey was planned to be in there if the game was released on the N64. Also since Ness was in Melee and all, and was made far more important in the Mother franchise, I think it would be very stupid if they'd replaced him now.

Sheik will probarly return if she's in Twilight Princess to.

Spoiler

And we already saw Zelda (or alteast a woman with blonde hair) in some sort of brown cloak. Perhaps that is Twilight Princesses' Sheik?

But if she isn't, yes I think she will be cutted from the game.

Mewtwo shouldn't be cutted or replaced. He's still one of the more populair and well known Pokémon. Last I had some friends at my place, and we played some Smash... Or atleast, I didn't actually played I was too good. XD However, they are all alot older than me and never heard of Smash before, yet they all knew Mewtwo.

Mewtwo had 3 anime movies, so replacing him for Deoxys or Lucario because they had movies to doesn't make sence. Since Mewtwo has made way more apperances than all of them.

Sakurai loved the Ice Climbers, and they are retro characters. They've been revived in Melee. Wouldn't it be a waste of money if they cutted the Ice Climbers now that people can buy the game at the Virtual Console?

Falco has all potential which is needed for having his own moveset, and he's very important to the StarFox franchise. I say he still has priority over other StarFox characters as Wolf and Krystal.

 

[MiraiGen]

Why the **** would they replace Ness now? Who cares if Mother 3 is out? Ness has become a fan favorite. He's a terrific character and wonderfully unique.

I know Sakurai wanted the Mother 3 characters in Melee, but I think it's too late for that.

I'm sure they'll axe clones (And perhaps Switcheroo them), but I doubt they'll remove characters like Shiek. They put alot of work into developing those characters, why would they take them away.

 

[Tera253]

I don't care a whole lot about too many clones, but Falco is one that has got to stay.
~Tera253~

 

[thebasman]

If they take away Ice Climbers, a small part of my sould will die.

 

[T-major]

who should return? all characters from the original 64 smash brothers. infact, mostly all characters from melee as well. only Dr. Mario and Pichu should go (they didn't make sense as charaters)

also, if Luigi comes back (which he most defenatly will) I think they should replace his fire ball, with his thunder attack from Mario & Luigi: superstar saga. I know people will disagree with me on this, but Luigi was a major character in that game, as aposed to just "player 2". giving him a move from a game (even if it's only one) where he had a big role would be great representation (of him, and the game) as well as a cool move.

as for people wanting Ness to be replaced. why would they do that? to my knowledge, "Earthbound" was the only game in the Mother series to be realesed in the U.S, and also the most popular. am I right? Ness is most likely a far more recogniseable character then "Lucas" (who I have never heard of befor) and, I have heard people say, that if they did replace him, Lucas would have pretty much the same moveset as Ness. if thats the case, why replace Ness, with a character that would be the same... seems piontless to me.

 

[LUVTOY77-ROGUE WIREFRAME]

that would seem the same and hasn't been heard of by a whole lot...

 

[HiddenTiger]

as for people wanting Ness to be replaced. why would they do that? to my knowledge, "Earthbound" was the only game in the Mother series to be realesed in the U.S, and also the most popular. am I right? Ness is most likely a far more recogniseable character then "Lucas" (who I have never heard of befor) and, I have heard people say, that if they did replace him, Lucas would have pretty much the same moveset as Ness. if thats the case, why replace Ness, with a character that would be the same... seems piontless to me.

Hold up there. I never said I 'wanted' Ness to be replaced. Ness is my main. I love Ness and I'd hate to see him go. I'm just being realistic. It's very possible that it may happen, sad as it may be.

 

[T-major]

Hold up there. I never said I 'wanted' Ness to be replaced. Ness is my main. I love Ness and I'd hate to see him go. I'm just being realistic. It's very possible that it may happen, sad as it may be.

yeah, it was a bad choice of words. I ment... "incinuated that he might be replaced" ... or something like that. I still don't think Ness has to worry. seeing as "Earthbound" is the only game in the Mother series that was realesed in the U.S (that I know of) he's more recognisable world wide. not to mention that he has been in both SSB games. so he has popularity from that too. logicaly, replacing him with Lucas (who ever that is) wouldn't make much sense. seeing as he is less recognicable then Ness.

 

[thebasman]

If Ness gets replaced, there's a good chance they'll be replacing Marth too, or just eliminating him altogether. That's not the sort of logic I'd like to see employed.

At this point, Smash is successful, not because of the conglomeration of Nintendo characters, but because of the fact that it is a great game. They don't even really need to keep up with recent updates to characters in order to make a good Smash game. Replaced Marth or Ness would be like replacing Jigglypuff with some random, similar pokemon from Ruby version, or something. Smash is able to stand alone, and has it's own reputation to uphold. Smash has helped build these characters (I don't know many people who knew who Ness was, and even fewer who knew who Marth was, before they played Smash) so I think they are related to Smash just as much as they are related to their other franchises, at least in America.

 

[Zink]

Fox confimed.

 

[monty06]

has anyone seen that new brawl video fox looks like a riht gimp init lol. everyone else so ar looks good tho.

 

[cb_marth]

Ness will return it's that simple. They are not going to take out that many characters nor if they were, they would not take out a character that is popular like Marth, or Ness. If they are going to take out any or replace any it will more or less be Mewtwo, Dr., Pichu and maybe Young Link. They want to add to the game not take away from it. Since this game will be online they want a wide selection of characters.

 

[woody72691]

zink r u sure???

 

[Thrillhouse-vh.]

zink r u sure???

you must be the only person alive who hasn't seen the video yet. He appears oin his command look (with friggin sweet boots)

 

[xXICEEPopoXNanaICEEXx]

I havent seen any things about the Ice climbers yet i know their not too popular but still theyre my main and they are adorable ^^ i think it would be horrible to delete the original 12 they should stay

 

[Overdaws]

Call me an idiot but...where is this new brawl video?