Official "Who is going to return?" topic

[Chief Mendez]

^^^
Shock!

Vaati's the villain in the Four Sword Zelda games, as well as in Minish Cap.

And Geno's a party member in Super Mario RPG, a SNES RPG. I don't know why he's so popular...

 

[MasterGary]

Well it's no surprise I don't know Geno, I must have been like 5? And I've never played 4 swords or the minch cap.

 

[Bowserlick]

Star Fox should at most have 3 characters. Why? Because its characters are not diverse enough to warrant a spot. They can't bring that much new goodness to Smash.

Fox has and is going to stay. He has a great looking moveset and fully represents the Arwing with his special moves. So there is no need for Falco. The Arwing, hero aspect is covered.

What other characters in Star Fox are worth getting in? Really, only two more.

Krystal represents a primitive planet with ancient magic and relics such as the staff. We don't have a "savage" female yet, so Krystal would be awesome. (But her Adventures outfit seems the way to go even though it is not her latest game).

Andross is the other one. We don't have a mad scientist yet. And he curbs out the SF franchise as the villain.

So Fox, Krystal, and Andross could nicely rep the StarFox series as well as adding something to Smash. All this Falco, Wolf talk is boring. They are so similar to Fox.

 

[Chief Mendez]

^^^
I'm with you for the most part, except that I don't really like Krystal that much. But hey, we're supposed to be getting more female fighters, so I wouldn't minds.

And it seems you and I are the only 2 pro-Andross people here. The only argument against him is that he's never actually "appeared" in a game, so they'd have to create a body from scratch.

 

[Stryks]

Dude WOLF is the other one not andross, andross hasnt apepared in a game since adventures, and if u count that game since he only appeared for the last 20 minutes or so... and andross had died 2 times already (3 if u count the original SF) while Wolf is still coming back for more, I understand andross being unique, but cmon claw based moveset ftw, so far no one has used claws as his main weapon in smash...

And how is wolf boring? I can asure you many of the smashers here agree that fighting against wolf is sometimes the best part of a SF game, and what has andross done? U only fight him in the end of the games and isnt as awesome as wolf is....

 

[MetalMetaKnight]

I agree on Krystal being in, but i dont know about Andros.... i havent actually seen him, but i would like to know who he is, and if he looks cool, then i will want him in

 

[Chief Mendez]

^^^

Andross's most common form: 2 hands, and a floating head. He is to Fox as Ganon is to Link. Wolf is not the main villain, or even a sub-villain anymore. The only true enemy in most SF games is the giant, floating monkey head you see above.

Dude WOLF is the other one not andross, andross hasnt apepared in a game since adventures, and if u count that game since he only appeared for the last 20 minutes or so... and andross had died 2 times already (3 if u count the original SF) while Wolf is still coming back for more, I understand andross being unique, but cmon claw based moveset ftw, so far no one has used claws as his main weapon in smash...

Bowser? Anyone who fights with their hands? Claws aren't that different from regular fingers, especially when the thing with claws happens to have human hands.

And how is wolf boring? I can asure you many of the smashers here agree that fighting against wolf is sometimes the best part of a SF game, and what has andross done? U only fight him in the end of the games and isnt as awesome as wolf is....

Andross is the series villain. Does Ganon really do much during most Zelda games?

Wolf could have an original moveset, sure. But it could never compare in terms of unique-ness with a monkey whose hands could warp through dimensions.

 

[Bowserlick]

Lets compare villains!

Mario, a plumber, has to fight a giant love stricken tortoise.

Link, the holder of the triforce of courage, has to slay a desert man who unlocked the secret power of the golden land and corrupted his own form with darkness.

Pikachu must use electricity to combat a pokemon that uses his mind to manipulate the forces around him.

And Fox must battle an evil scientist that fled to a planet in order to mass an army and in the process, corrupt his own being into a moon sized anomaly.

That sounds cool.

But pitting Fox against basically himself (but with a few minor differences) is so cliche and dull and boring. Nintendo is about spicing things up. Andross is the man to do it.

 

[Frigid_Aztec]

Dude WOLF is the other one not andross, andross hasnt apepared in a game since adventures, and if u count that game since he only appeared for the last 20 minutes or so... and andross had died 2 times already (3 if u count the original SF) while Wolf is still coming back for more, I understand andross being unique, but cmon claw based moveset ftw, so far no one has used claws as his main weapon in smash...

And how is wolf boring? I can asure you many of the smashers here agree that fighting against wolf is sometimes the best part of a SF game, and what has andross done? U only fight him in the end of the games and isnt as awesome as wolf is....

I agree, Wolf is the coolest character in SF. He serves as Fox's main rival, and the fights against him are always fun in the games.

 

[Kaoz]

Wolf is way cooler than Anross is, and I think wolf would make an excelent char in SSBB(if he isnt a copy of fox and falco that is), but Andross is still the main evil of all fox games, so maby he could be a mini boss or something in SSBB .

 

[Chief Mendez]

^^^
If Wolf is Fox's main rival, then Falco loses his importance as the 'rival' character. Look, it's either Wolf or Falco. They're both too similar to Fox to justify both of them being included.

I think we all agree Krystal should (though realistically, I don't think she will) get in. So that's Fox and Krystal. Now either you get Falco, Wolf, Andross, or two of them. If you pick two of them, chances are, they won't be Falco and Wolf.

 

[Stryks]

Bowser uses his shell pretty much as his main weapon, wolf would be about 90% claw-based while some would be kicks...

Ganondorf is always the one behind the disaster in hyrule, OoT, WW, and in TP (he used zant as a puppet, but the light world monsters belong to him) now andross is pretty much dead, in adventures general scales was the one controlling the dinosaurs, in assault aparoids where the main enemies, dont know about command but I think his nephew is behind the attacks...

anyway wolf has more fan base, and appeared in sakurais poll, andross did not, hos exactly would u grab andross, and send him fliying since hes so big and always floating? even WITH a body, andross wouldnt please as many fans as Wolf would...

@Boswerlick:

Fox must battle his long rival, Wolf, who has sworn to kill fox, he's a merciless pilot, and leader of the wanted Star wolf team

See anyone can make it sound awesome

Now this is my version: Fox must battle an evil money that fled to a planet cause people thougth he was crazy in order to mass an army and in the process becomes a giant head with 2 floating hands without a body

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

Wolf O'Donnell is to Fox McCloud what Venom is to Spiderman. Sure they have some similar qualities, but they're also totally different in almost every other aspect.

I see Fox as the quick little guy who comes in, strikes, maybe does a combo or two, then runs away trying to avoid damage and too much confrontation. And I see Wolf as the guy who doesn't care if he gets into trouble and has some big muthafukin' fangs to back it up.

And Falco's the guy who is very similar to Fox (similar enough I guess to have a cloned moveset ) and could very well be better than Fox, but is put in second because of his arrogance. Not necessarily a bad guy by any means, but just a little cocky and reckless.

 

[MasterGary]

Falco has the most appealing personality of everybody in the SF franchise. And can all this Andross talk please stop, because even if he were to be in the game, the most he would be is something like MasterHand.

I could see him being worked into the game if they were to give every character there own boss at the end of classic mode.

 

[Chief Mendez]

Dyce: But you forget that Wolf apparently doesn't care about killing Fox anymore. In Assault, they end up helping each other, and in Command...well, lots of stuff happens in Command, some good, some bad.

Also, Falco's already like your Wolf description, Dyce. Falco players don't run away, they get in there, because they have some pretty broken moves powerful attacks, and the extra weight to go along with it.

Bowser uses his shell pretty much as his main weapon, wolf would be about 90% claw-based while some would be kicks...

Why wouldn't he use a gun? What makes him so different from Fox? They're both canines, they're both space pilots, and they both have claws/fangs. Yet none of Fox's moveset revolves around that.

And even if you discount Bowser, what makes a claw so radically new and exciting? Isn't it essentially just hitting someone with your hand? Because Smash already has that covered.

Ganondorf is always the one behind the disaster in hyrule, OoT, WW, and in TP (he used zant as a puppet, but the light world monsters belong to him) now andross is pretty much dead, in adventures general scales was the one controlling the dinosaurs, in assault aparoids where the main enemies, dont know about command but I think his nephew is behind the attacks...

Andross should've been dead after SF, but came back in SF64, where he again should've kicked the bucket. But he came back again in Adventures.

Ganon died in LOZ, but came back in ALttP, where he again died. He then came back in Ocarina, and was sealed away until TP and WW's stories went down.

See a pattern here?

Note: The main enemies in Command are a bunch of fish/octopods. "King Anglar" is the main antagonist.

anyway wolf has more fan base, and appeared in sakurais poll, andross did not, hos exactly would u grab andross, and send him fliying since hes so big and always floating? even WITH a body, andross wouldnt please as many fans as Wolf would...

And I'm sure even before Melee, the Ice Climbers were hugely popular with the fans, right? :/

How exactly would you grab Ridley, since he's at least five times the size of Samus?

Falco has the most appealing personality of everybody in the SF franchise. And can all this Andross talk please stop, because even if he were to be in the game, the most he would be is something like MasterHand.

So...don't use him like that. Give him the body that surely exists somewhere at Nintendo Kyoto, filed away with all the other SF concept art.

Just imagine it...

...yeah. Teleporting hands...anti-gravity jumps...much more original than anything Wolf would do.

 

[Kaoz]

LoL I like the idea of every char having his big boss in the end (I.E. you pass Classic MOde and you get to beat that chars evil boss )

 

[MasterGary]

LoL I like the idea of every char having his big boss in the end (I.E. you pass Classic MOde and you get to beat that chars evil boss )

But I just thought of something. Who would characters like Bowser and Ganondorf have to fight since they are alredy the big boss?

 

[Creo]

They would fight there rivals...Bowser-Mario, Ganondorf-Link or Zelda...

 

[Stryks]

^^^
But you forget that Wolf apparently doesn't care about killing Fox anymore. In Assault, they end up helping each other, and in Command...well, lots of stuff happens in Command, some good, some bad.

He ends up helping him cause he wants HIM to kill fox, seeing how the aparoids may do that, he helps him out, at the end he wants to finish off Fox himself, if someone will probably do it he has no choice to help him...

But I just thought of something. Who would characters like Bowser and Ganondorf have to fight since they are alredy the big boss?

Ganon= Link
Bowser= Mario

at the end of each u c them, posing triumply over the fallen bodys of their enemies, giving one last blow and finishing them off XD

 

[Got Blood?]

So would this mean you'd have to bring back really old character' enemies? This would mean reworking character's enemies such as Pit's and others,right? I wonder who game and watch you fight...

 

[Stryks]

Not exactly it hasnt been confirmed that the guys will have to fight their enemies, but for guys like Pit and Capt. I have a solution:

In SC character would go and fight a certain character, this battle would be named Destined battle, something like this could be added, while kirby fights dedede, pit fights metaknight, this would fit, being both wing characters, and we would have a cinema to go with the battle...

Capt. could go and fight Mach rider, saying stuff like "So.. u think ur faster than me? *battle pose* mach rider- "..." and then u fight

 

[Creo]

I just have to say wow about that cheesy quote of C.Falcon. It wouldn't be Mach Rider...obliviously Sonic!
But that would be a good idea. SC is awesome.

 

[Got Blood?]

So characters would fight off against counter parts in the game? Well I'd rather see Mario face off against someone like Sonic if he were in it.But then where would that put Bowser.So I guess that all could get pretty touchy.

 

[Stryks]

Nah im bettin maybe sonic will be mario, being VG rivals and all, dont get me wrong it would be like this:

mario on classic mode: Mario vs bowser in the end
bowser on classic mode: bowser vs mario in the end
sonic on classic mode: mario vs sonic in the end

this happend in SC2:
Nightmare in arcade: nightmare vs raphael
raphael in arcade: Nightmare vs raphael
link on arcade: link vs raphael

Cmon if capt. can say something like show me ur moves! in mid battle, im sure he would say something like that, and mach rider pwns...

 

[Got Blood?]

I'm thinking in classic mode it would be: e.g.Mario vs Bowser

Adventure Mode: Master Hand

Added mode(?):Mario vs Sonic

Maybe something like that to get the best of each world.

 

[Chief Mendez]

By using his claws he'll become more unique and not just another space animal with a gun, it will bring originality and people wont go off: "ZOMG CLONE!!1!!1one"

But then he'd just be another guy who attacks with his hands and feet.

Claws would do more damage than just ur average punch, if they give wolf some long steel-claws he would be a fast attacking powerful oponent, I know it aint exciting, but would be diferent from ur average fist and kick fighter...

If it's not exciting, then why bother, when there are other, more refreshing (Andross? Dimensional appendages? Mach Rider? ON A MOTORCYCLE!?) things the developers could spend their time on.

Also, steel claws wouldn't fit the character at all.

I believe 64 is a remake of the original SF game, or so I heard a long time ago, thus that part fails, and even if its not, that andross [1st SF] is more like a decoy or something since it doesnt look anything like monkey andross, how he came back in adventures IDK never playe the game entirely...

There are several points that hearken back to the original, but 64 isn't a remake. And you know, Andross didn't look like a monkey in the original because, well, it was the SNES. There were barely enough polygons to support the look he had, let along enough to create a monkey. It's still "Andross" though.

I don't really remember much of Adventures either, but I think he was manipulating the Krazoa spirits to absorb enough energy to return to power (a la Voldemort).

In ALL of those games Ganon aint the same one, u know this ganondorf reincarnates and that cant really count cause it aint a the same person...

Even so, you usually fight a "Ganon" or "Ganondorf", right?

Even though you don't fight Andross in Assault/Command...you don't fight Ganondorf in the Minish Cap or Majora's Mask, do you?

Theyre retros dude, pit, ICs, mach rider, balloon fighter and so on are retros, they dont need to be popular cause they represent the NES era...

In that case, Andross doesn't need to be popular to represent the primary antagonist of the StarFox series.

I hardly think Captain Falcon was popular pre-Smash 64. Same goes for Roy, Doc and Ness. Popularity takes a back seat to series-importance every time.

 

[Stryks]

Ness= popular in japan, and in america before 64
Doc= clone, didnt had time for a more original character
flacon= IDK either
Roy= advertisament for a FE game, he didnt even HAD a fan base...

andross can get in just like that like the retros since, well, he aint retro, hes from the 64 era, hell I dont even consider the SNES era retro...

Anyway Wolf is merciless, the claws would fit him, just like claws fit the merciless Wolverine anyway lets stay on topic already, point is Wolf is mor epopular and has a greater shot...

 

[Frigid_Aztec]

How could Andross get in Brawl? He has no real reasons other then he is the main enemy for the SF series. And didn't he die? He wasn't in SF: Assault at all (although idk if he showed up in SFC, I've never played it).

Plus I doubt that the SF series will get 4 reps, I'd say they will get 3. So thats Fox, Krystal, and Falco/Wolf.

I guess I'm not AGAINST him in Brawl, it just seems extremely unlikely.

 

[Katy Parry]

Zeldas destined battle-Ganondorf or Peach?

 

[Tedius Zanarukando]

I most want Marth to return for Super Smash Bros. Brawl. He was my favorite character in Super Smash Bros. Melee.

 

[MasterGary]

Well we all know that Andross won't be in Brawl as a playable character because he is too big and doesn't even have a body.

END OF DISCUSSION.

Wolf and Krystal actually have a chance, so why not talk about there reason for (not)making it into Brawl?

 

[petre]

Well we all know that Andross won't be in Brawl because he is too big and doesn't have a body.

ARGUMENT FAILURE.

but i have to agree a floating head with hands wouldnt really make a good smasher. then again the last boss of both games so far has been some floating hands, so what would be so different about adding a head? but it wouldnt work as a playable character, imo.

 

[MasterGary]

ARGUMENT FAILURE.

but i have to agree a floating head with hands wouldnt really make a good smasher. then again the last boss of both games so far has been some floating hands, so what would be so different about adding a head? but it wouldnt work as a playable character, imo.

That's what I meant, let me edit my post.

 

[dynamic_entry]

Zeldas destined battle-Ganondorf or Peach?

my lord, you are the biggest zelda tragic!

i would guess ganon.

 

[Chief Mendez]

anyway lets stay on topic already, point is Wolf is mor epopular and has a greater shot...

Fine, I'll stop arguing about Andross. BUT...this doesn't mean I've conceded to any of your points. This just isn't the right thread.

Wolf and Krystal actually have a chance, so why not talk about there reason for (not)making it into Brawl?

Like I've said, Wolf is so similar to Fox. It's not impossible, or even that difficult, to make a unique moveset, but the same applies for Falco. What I'm getting at is that the time spent diversifying what are two (three) very similar characters could (and should) be better spent creating new, original and unique characters. I have nothing personal against Wolf, it's just that there're better options.

Then there's Krystal, who has two great, distinctive features. A) She's female, and B) she wields an as of yet unheard of weapon (in Smash). That's all well and good, and I could see her in. But the only factor against her is her origins in the West. Not only was she created by the cliche' masters at Rare, but she hasn't been handled all that well in her short time in existence. In one game, she's speaking an unknown language, and in the next, she's got herself a perfect british accent...?

Look at Metroid. Sakurai's decided on the "Japanese" Samus (the Prime Samus being the non-Japanese version), as well as the Japanese-originating ZSS. Unless we see some Prime content, this could be pretty telling. Especially when it comes to Krystal. If Sakurai doesn't show favor towards the Prime games, which are much better in every aspect than Krystal's showings, then what are her chances?

 

[Diddy Kong]

But then he'd just be another guy who attacks with his hands and feet.

So far, the only character that focuses all on pure physical power moves is Donkey Kong. All other characters have some other special effects in their moves, but the only one who focuses most on fighting with his fists is DK. Besides, can't the two go togheter? I mean, Fox and Falco also only use their guns in throws and as their B move, why can't metal claws also be included to Wolf O'Donnel's moveset??

 

[Chief Mendez]

^^^
I'm talking in deference to Stryks "90% claw-based" theory. Sure, a claw effect in, say, Wolf's Fair and maybe a tilt or two would be reasonable, but the point I'm trying to make is that even so, it really wouldn't be all that unique. Certainly not moreso than how Andross would theoretically play, or Krystal's unique weapon (Falco's already there, so that's sort of a moot point).

Also, even if C. Falcon and Mario have some neat fire FX, they still physically attack with their feet and hands. Wolf would probably have a blaster/machine gun/whatever, and some sort of strange effect for his recovery, but...well, hopefully by now you know what I mean.

EDIT - Once again, I'm not arguing specifically against Wolf, but rather that there are better characters Sakurai could spend his team's time on.

 

[LukeFonFabre]

So...don't use him like that. Give him the body that surely exists somewhere at Nintendo Kyoto, filed away with all the other SF concept art.

Just imagine it...

...yeah. Teleporting hands...anti-gravity jumps...much more original than anything Wolf would do.

Whoa, that'd actually be awesome if Andross ended up close to that. They do admittedly have a lot to work with concerning Andross, but it depends if Sakurai wants to go with this potential or just fanservice.

Though I wonder if Falco returns, will he just be the same with just a few different moves to differentiate him from Fox a little more, or would they actually give him his own moveset. If it's the latter, they might as well just opt for a new character to replace him really.

 

[roy_owns]

You can't make Falco better than he was on Melee

 

[LukeFonFabre]

I didn't say better, I just change, whether its better or for worse (probably for worse, as they might downgrade him a little).