[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Gallowglass]

The Ultra Hand reminds me of the next version or at least a super move of Master Hand and Crazy Hand. Like both would go in to the background with the item and begin reach out trying to grab the player.

@KumoOso
I really like your item selection they seem to be really fun to use in smash. Even the Boot.

I don't know if this would work but maybe implementing the original card game that Nintendo started with as an item would be fun. I don't know enough to elaborate on it.

 

[Cyn]

To make the Ice Flower different, how about you have it shoot ice balls?

thats what it does in New Super Mario Bros. wii

 

[OfTheEarth]

I'm probably in the minority but I want Ninten playable. Everything else is just a bonus.

i love you
but i think maybe jeff or poo or paula would be better
because they'd probably be different you know?

 

[Thirdkoopa]

@Koops: Have you ever actually met anyone who doesn't think SE is a big enough company to have something they own in Smash?

Not actually met but I've seen posts saying that before. ;_;

- Warrior [of Light, I guess]
- Black Mage
- Onion Knight
- Cecil (FFIV)
- Terra (FFVI)
- Chocobo
- Mog/Moogle (FFVI/General Reoccurring)

I cut it down to what is possible. I'm rather ill-knowledged on DQ to so I'll let Starphoenix fill in that one. I can probably fill in a lot of other square-enix holes.

 

[Big-Cat]

thats what it does in New Super Mario Bros. wii

Exactly. Also, is that a female Blanka for your avatar?

 

[Cyn]

Exactly. Also, is that a female Blanka for your avatar?

why yes it is, just changed it a few mins ago.....you like?

 

[Big-Cat]

It's something. Part of me wants to believe that she does not have actual chest hair.

If you want, I can go look for this picture of girl Remy I found a while back.

 

[Cyn]

yes the chest hair is a little unsettling, but if it wasnt there then i probably couldnt use it as my avie

 

[Big-Cat]

I'm thinking about changing mine to Juri. What do you think? I'm going with El Azteca Fuerte over at SRK once a good picture is released.

 

[Cyn]

I'm thinking about changing mine to Juri. What do you think? I'm going with El Azteca Fuerte over at SRK once a good picture is released.

sounds good to me, just need to find a really good image. im kinda used to the one you use now though.

 

[Big-Cat]

My avatar now has off screen Korean sideboob.

 

[Cyn]

i cant remember who asked me, but last week someone asked me what m-308 looked like and here he is

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

You people and your avatars. I don't like the one Twizzlers has right now.



@Koops: I was hoping for "here's my take on each character" rather than a list truncating. And I wouldn't consider White Mage and Gilgamesh to be no-chancers (even though White Mage would probably have a team-up with Black Mage). You should look into SE's history with picking characters for playable cameos.

 

[Cyn]

i m already tired of it and it will be replaced tomorrow

 

[augustoflores]

i cant remember who asked me, but last week someone asked me what m-308 looked like and here he is

ouch, it was me... i played it using your link... first level, hard; it wasn't until after i got tired of dying by one measly hit that i figured i had the power of gravity... the fact you said m-308 can control gravity i never even bothered to try out the ability... my usage of the gravity was a fluke... then i found out on my own how the F^ck i did it by experimenting commands... i lasted up until 1-2 i got bored of dying... i get bored easily by the way its not the game's fault.

i think he's to bulky.

 

[Starphoenix]

So no one thinks I am joking about Slime being able to lift and throw things, watch this video. Between 4:20-4:36

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2FY6ADAe1M

 

[Arcadenik]

That's cool. So, Slime can lift and throw stuff without arms. But you know what Sakurai said... no arms = not playable. Personally, I like the Slime-riding-on-Chocobo idea better. Why represent only one half or the other half of Square Enix when you can represent both halves?

 

[augustoflores]

how about assist trophy? there is no shame with that... same goes for you!!! (pointing at starfy)

(currently expecting some starfy people to back him up)

 

[Pieman0920]

That's cool. So, Slime can lift and throw stuff without arms. But you know what Sakurai said... no arms = not playable. Personally, I like the Slime-riding-on-Chocobo idea better. Why represent only one half or the other half of Square Enix when you can represent both halves?

Technically chocobo doesn't have arms either. :embarrass

While I know the idea is fairly popular, does anyone honestly expect the Chocobo/Slime thing to really pan out. We really have never had two characters from different series in one fighter, and certainly not two third party ones. I guess there is nothing saying that it can't happen, but it seems very unlikely overall.

Anyways, I don't like it when people change their avatars. Its scares and confuses me to no end.

 

[Starphoenix]

That's cool. So, Slime can lift and throw stuff without arms. But you know what Sakurai said... no arms = not playable. Personally, I like the Slime-riding-on-Chocobo idea better. Why represent only one half or the other half of Square Enix when you can represent both halves?

Than by that estimation Ivysaur never should have been included... (I have a feeling I know what will come next.)

 

[Arcadenik]

Oh, I really hope Starfy is playable in SSB4. I think this franchise deserves a playable character. I mean, this franchise has had five games since 2002 and it finally became international with the fifth game in 2009. If we are getting new franchises (franchises created in the 21st century) with playable characters in SSB4, I expect it to be Starfy and Golden Sun. As for 20th century new franchises, I expect Punch-Out (Little Mac) and Mysterious Murasame Castle (Takamaru).

 

[Arcadenik]

Than by that estimation Ivysaur never should have been in... (I have a feeling I know what will come next...)

Oh, I didn't know Ivysaur had no limbs.

Besides, Ivysaur uses vines as "arms", they are more like tentacles to me but whatever works.

Technically chocobo doesn't have arms either. :embarrass

Chocobo uses wings as "arms" in the Chocobo series so....

 

[Starphoenix]

Oh, I didn't know Ivysaur had no limbs.

Besides, Ivysaur uses vines as "arms", they are more like tentacles to me but whatever works.

You know what I mean.

I established already that Slime can pick up items, what more is needed? His advantage in comparison to Mr. Saturn (who was being referenced in the no arm/no playability statement) is his gelatinous body and using the creativity in that to develop throws and standard moves.

 

[Cyn]

ouch, it was me... i played it using your link... first level, hard; it wasn't until after i got tired of dying by one measly hit that i figured i had the power of gravity... the fact you said m-308 can control gravity i never even bothered to try out the ability... my usage of the gravity was a fluke... then i found out on my own how the F^ck i did it by experimenting commands... i lasted up until 1-2 i got bored of dying... i get bored easily by the way its not the game's fault.

i think he's to bulky.

yeah but if they update him to look more like the cover then he won't look as bulky.

And yeah the NES game is kinda hard, if you use the NEScafe emulator (versus vNES; it gives you an option via yin yang symbol) there is an option for game genie and you can give yourself an edge and possibly play through all the levels

 

[Arcadenik]

You know what I mean.

I established already that Slime can pick up items, what more is needed? His advantage in comparison to Mr. Saturn (who was being referenced in the no arm/no playability statement) is his gelatinous body and using the creativity in that to develop throws and standard moves.

I get that but would Sakurai think the same way about Slime like you do? I don't know how to answer that...

 

[Starphoenix]

I get that but would Sakurai think the same way about Slime like you do? I don't know how to answer that...

If the issue is creativity what makes Slime so extraordinary? Look at Mr. Game & Watch, R.O.B, Ivysaur, and Capt. Falcon. These characters, on their own, had little to no "fighting" potential. Yet, they are very much compatible with Smash. With Square contributing to Slime's development I do not see how creativity would be a problem?

 

[augustoflores]

i recently downloaded M.U.G.E.N and i am wondering if someone could if not should make a smash style freeware... i am currently trying to make Slash-Beast playable... not working out, but HEY!! in the time between the time a smash style mugen is made and ssb4... maybe slime will be put up for consideration seeing its obvious usage in japan in the future.

what do you think, phoenix?

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

@Starphoenix: I'd imagine most people's problems with Slime by himself stem from Dragon Quest. It'd be kinda weird to see that series appear over Final Fantasy, at least by western standards.

Also kinda interesting that the Famitsu Top 50 Characters poll had only two from Dragon Quest while Final Fantasy had like 17 total. Not that that's directly related to this, but it does give the impression that even the Japanese are more passionate about FF than DQ.


@Pieman: If not Slime, try Mog. My main thought behind the ChocoSlime idea was that a Chocobo by itself is kinda plain compared to a Chocobo with a rider. Slime just pulls off the "best of both worlds" bit that'd probably make Japan explode.

 

[Big-Cat]

@Starphoenix: I'd imagine most people's problems with Slime by himself stem from Dragon Quest. It'd be kinda weird to see that series appear over Final Fantasy, at least by western standards.

That's what I'm thinking. Combine that with the fact that both characters in ChocoSlime come from two separate SE series and would likely create big money issues (are both characters worth individually half as much as Sonic or something else entirely?), I don't see much for Dragon Quest.

I think it would be possibly just the Chocobo with the Moogle as an Assist Trophy, and the FF protagonists as trophies.

 

[Starphoenix]

@Starphoenix: I'd imagine most people's problems with Slime by himself stem from Dragon Quest. It'd be kinda weird to see that series appear over Final Fantasy, at least by western standards.

Also kinda interesting that the Famitsu Top 50 Characters poll had only two from Dragon Quest while Final Fantasy had like 17 total. Not that that's directly related to this, but it does give the impression that even the Japanese are more passionate about FF than DQ.

The reason there are more Final Fantasy characters than Dragon Quest is truly because the Dragon Quest series is very poor at developing memorable and iconic characters. There is barely any other option for Dragon Quest representation outside of Slime. Slime is the mascot of the series because no one else is, if that makes sense? Doesn't take away from the characters popularity (seeing as how Slime/s did place fourth in the poll after all.) That is establishing more of the basis on why there are more FF saturation in the Famitsu poll.

Yes it would appear bizzare to some for Dragon Quest to crossover in place of Final Fantasy, but as I have stated many times before my logic for this is for future marketing between Nintendo and Square. Nintendo is investing a lot of resources into establishing the Dragon Quest series in the West. Final Fantasy has made its home on Sony and Microsoft platforms while Dragon Quest has had (as of late) major sequels cemented on Nintendo platforms. The game series alone can push hardware sales in Japan, why not the West? Square wants to become a bigger global company and they see a potential market for Dragon Quest. Problem is they fail to advertise it correctly. Which is why Nintendo is publishing Dragon Quest IX overseas.

To make a long story short, Dragon Quest is becoming a "Nintendo RPG" and as such may make an appearance in a future Smash game over other IP to further the appeal to as many new gamers as possible.

 

[Arcadenik]

If the issue is creativity what makes Slime so extraordinary? Look at Mr. Game & Watch, R.O.B, Ivysaur, and Capt. Falcon. These characters, on their own, had little to no "fighting" potential. Yet, they are very much compatible with Smash. With Square contributing to Slime's development I do not see how creativity would be a problem?

At least they got freaking limbs they can use to punch and kick, pick up and throw items, grab and throw opponents, grab onto ledges, etc. That's the difference. The issue is not the lack of moveset potential or the lack of creativity. The issue is limited physical capabilities. It is like trying to make a Smash fighter out of Magikarp.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

That's what I'm thinking. Combine that with the fact that both characters in ChocoSlime come from two separate SE series and would likely create big money issues (are both characters worth individually half as much as Sonic or something else entirely?), I don't see much for Dragon Quest.

Considering we don't know how much the licensing fees are nor how much Nintendo is willing to pay, you shouldn't think too hard about costs.

Not to say that's a reason to include both series, just that we don't need to worry about the money game specifically.

Yes it would appear bizzare to some for Dragon Quest to crossover in place of Final Fantasy, but as I have stated many times before my logic for this is for future marketing between Nintendo and Square. Nintendo is investing a lot of resources into establishing the Dragon Quest series in the West. Final Fantasy has made its home on Sony and Microsoft platforms while Dragon Quest has had (as of late) major sequels cemented on Nintendo platforms. The game series alone can push hardware sales in Japan, why not the West? Square wants to become a bigger global company and they see a potential market for Dragon Quest. Problem is they fail to advertise it correctly. Which is why Nintendo is publishing Dragon Quest IX overseas.

To make a long story short, Dragon Quest is becoming a "Nintendo RPG" and as such may make an appearance in a future Smash game over other IP to further the appeal to as many new gamers as possible.

Keep in mind that Konami didn't go for its most Nintendo-centric series/character, they picked their most popular. Or rather Kojima did because he thought it'd be totally sweet, but Konami obviously supported it. And Nintendo hasn't seen a single MGS game on any platform since 2004, so there clearly wasn't some sort of promotional bonus on their end.

Square-Enix loves pushing its most popular stuff. Final Fantasy is about as popular as it gets. Unless you get Dragon Quest's head guy (Yuji Horii? no idea) to do what Kojima did, I wouldn't expect Slime outside of a team-up (which is still pretty out there). And even then that's assuming SE doesn't go "Slime? Why not Final Fantasy?"

 

[Gallowglass]

Now I don't know about slimes from Square but slimes would be a great generic monster in Adventure mode. They've been shown in Zelda games throughout in all shapes and colors. If you want a playable one then the ones in Majora's mask would work better (still no limbs) but they can hold the item inside their body and have it come out when they use it. For example they could have the beam sword and it would be in inside but when he uses it the blade would thrust out from him.

Are we on the kick of crazy wtf characters that would have no chance of appearing? I got quite a few to list.

 

[Cyn]

I don't really see the slimes thing working out. But perhaps if you are set on some sort of slimy blobby thing as a playable, then what about introducing "A Boy and his Blob" as a playable character. It's a classic NES game that has been re-made into a current title for wii so it isn't entirely unknown.

Think about the possibilities with that freaking blob turning into everything with those magic jelly beans.

 

[augustoflores]

oh right!!! how will slime grab the ledge? psychic abilities? teeth? tongue? slime hands?... yeah i went too far.

 

[Pieman0920]

@Toise: Well technically Chocobos have worked fine in their own series, so I'd think it'd be no stranger than having Yoshi on his own...which they already do

On the topic of slime's moveset pottential, I don't particularly find the idea good, but I think its clearly possible for a Slime to be given his basic moves, grab things, and all that jazz. He's a blob after all, and thus can morph. If he needs to "run" he can just roll into a ball. If he needs to grab a ledge, he can just stick to it like a wad of bubble gum sticks to your desk. If he needs to grab someone, he can either turn into a hand, or gel onto them like a Likelike sort of does. Really, I don't see much of a problem as far as this issue goes.

 

[Gallowglass]

In reality any character can be made playable with enough thought. This is obvious with C. Falcon, Fox, Falco, Zelda and Rob who had no actual movesets before their appearance in Smash. Even characters like Samus and Peach had no hand-to-hand combat until smash.

 

[ElPanandero]

I don't really see the slimes thing working out. But perhaps if you are set on some sort of slimy blobby thing as a playable, then what about introducing "A Boy and his Blob" as a playable character. It's a classic NES game that has been re-made into a current title for wii so it isn't entirely unknown.

Think about the possibilities with that freaking blob turning into everything with those magic jelly beans.

I brought this up a while back, but apperently despite bign on the wii, since the NES release, A boy and His Blob has been bought up by a third party...meaing little to no chance....unfortunate I know...I would've liked to see him

 

[Arcadenik]

These suggestions could work, Pieman. I am not sure if Sakurai sees it that way like some of you do. Also, just for the record, I'm not against the idea of Slime becoming playable in Smash. I was only doubting how Slime would realistically function as a Smash fighter, seeing how he is just a blob of slime without limbs to use for punching, grabbing, etc.

I just came up with an idea for a Final Smash for Slime. He could grow bigger like Jigglypuff's Final Smash and become King Slime, complete with a crown, and he moves around the stage, pushing the oppponents away. I think it would be funny to see Chocobo riding on top of King Slime, you know, the opposite of Slime riding on Chocobo.

 

[Pieman0920]

@Rapier: Not quite true. Some things simply can't work, such as Diskun.

@Arc: He may. Its wouldn't really be the first time a glob like fighter was in a fighting game. Just look at Arakune....though I suppose Arakune has a bit more going for him in terms of powers.

For those who actually know enough about Slime though, if he were to be on his own, what exactly would his specials be?