[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Wizzerd]

That actually made me laugh so much. Thank you. But for the record: Tingle is awesome.

LOL yes, Tingle is the manliest video game character ever.

So?

Never say any character couldn't make it in because of how strange they are. Mario is a plumber who lives in a kingdom with a human population of about 4, where he repeatedly rescues a princess by jumping on turtles. Sonic is a giant blue anthromorphic hedghehog who runs really fast. I could go on.

Or if you were trying to say that we shouldn't have aTingle in because he's stupid, then I disagree. He's just utterly bizarre.

Wizzerd has the best top 10 list, although I had to laugh at freeman's.

Yeah, like Spadefox said, Smash isn't meant to be canon. It's a game where you fight as your favorite Nintendo characters. And thanks.

@ Freeman: Cranky kong (though he is awesome) has no chance. We have squirtle so, i doubt blastoise will be in. Megaman, K. Rool, and Ridley are the only people on the roster who have a chance.

@Wizzerd: I hate Tingle. That aside he has a really good chance of making it in. I say flip Bowser Jr. and Paper Mario. And megaman has a better chance than stafy. The only person I'm not sure deserves to be on there is Animal Crosser. Everyone else on that list deserves it. Pretty good list even though i disagree with the order.

We're running out of discussion ideas so i vote to relook and a previous discussion that got maybe one page worth of discussion.

Character Buffs/Nerfs:
-Yoshi, Side B no longer makes him helpless, Up- B can be aimed at himself so he shoots upwards and then goes helpless.

-Mario, IMprove him in every stat overall, If cape is held he starts gliding like in the game.

-Metaknight, just lower his priority. A lot.

-Captain falcon, Less starting lag and more priority.

I was pretty tired when I wrote that, and I agree that the positions aren't great. As for Paper Mario/Bowser Jr., they pretty much have equal chances: they both deserve it and should really be in. I just had to put in some order, and I just love the Paper Mario series (although that doesn't really have anything to do with it. I think you're right about Megaman and Stafy/Starfy. I disagree with you on the Animal Crossing thing, but we've adressed that a lot and I don't want to drag up the issue again.

Hmm, buffs and nerfs? There was not a good level of balance in Brawl (at least in Melee Fox took some skill to use, unlike Meta Knight). Some ideas for nerfs:

Meta Knight​

• Accentuate his KOing problem. Give Shuttle Loop and DSmash less knockback, and leave only FSmash with KOing ability.
• Less attack speed. Meta Knight should still be the quick swordsman, but it's ridiculous right now.
• Nerf Mach Tornado by a good bit. Give it some lag and less damage, and less priority.
• Speaking of priority, lower Meta Knight's in general.
• Lower the height on his jumps and take away the glide from Shuttle Loop to nerf his recovery.

Snake​

• Less projectiles in his standard attacks, and less range in general.
• Lower the knockback on his Smash Attacks.
• Give him less speed, as he has a illogical amount of it.
• How is he the third heaviest character? Give him slightly above average weight.

Falco​

• Give his DThrow more knockack that is more upwards to make his chaingrab less effective.
• Make his meteor smash harder to hit with.
• Give him less comboability.

King Dedede​

• Like with Falco, more knockback that is more upwards on his DThrow to make his chaingrab less effective.
• Waddle Dee Throw is a bit spammy right now. Give it less speed and range.
• Less distance on his midair jumps and less vertical and horizontal movement from Super Dedede jump to nerf his recovery.

Mr. Game and Watch​

• First and most importantly, nerf his BAir with less speed, priority and damage.
• Lower his speed on his tilts and aerials.
• Priority needs to take a hit as well.
• Lower the vertical distance and horizontal mobility of Fire and remove the invincibility frames.
• Remove Bucket Braking (pulling out your Down B bucket to halt movement when hit off the stage), which makes him like a heavyweight despite being barely heavier then Jigglypuff.

Too lazy to do buffs.

 

[elheber]

You guys have to remember that Geno is a third party character. Although he was in a game from the Mario franchise for a Nintendo console, he was created and is owned by Square. Here's my most likely list:

TOP 10 POTENTIAL NINTENDO NEWCOMERS
10. Jill & Drill Dozer - Excellent moveset potential, but not very popular as of recent.
9. Tom Nook - Best candidate to represent the popular Animal Crossing franchise, but has low moveset potential.
8. Tingle - Popular in Japan and has decent moveset potential.
7. Stafy - Super popular in Japanand has better moveset potential.
6. Ridley - Highly petitioned everywhere, but he's just too huge to be very eligible even as a heavy character.
5. Saki Amamiya - Incredible moveset potential (Falco+Marth?) and highly petitioned in Japan.
4. Isaac - Popular, highly petitioned, and excellent moveset potential, but might be too similar to Ike/Roy/Marth unless he focuses on magic.
3. Ray MK II/III - Incredible moveset potential (Samus+Ike?), popular in Japan, and recently starred in his own DS game.
2. Samurai Goroh - Best candidate to expand the small F-Zero cast and very different (Wario+Marth?) from Captain Falcon.
1. Little Mac - Excellent moveset potential, popular everywhere, and will soon star in a new Wii game.


TOP 5 POTENTIAL THIRD PARTY NEWCOMERS
5. Geno (Square) - Highly petitioned and excellent moveset potential, but hot much history in Nintendo (non-starring role in one game, cameo in another).
4. Tails (SEGA) - If Sonic is in SSB4 Tails is the most likely second representative for the Sonic franchise, plus the developer/publisher has good history/standing with Nintendo, but has relatively low moveset potential (sorry Shadow, you could almost be a pallet swap for Sonic).
3. Gray Fox (Kojima Productions) - Highly popular, an excellent moveset potential (no guns = good), most likely second representative to the Metal Gear franchise, and his creator/owner is in excellent terms with Nintendo and Sakurai.
2. Bomberman (Hudson Soft) - Uber popular everywhere, incredible moveset potential, the developer/publisher in great terms and has a long history with Nintendo, just starred in his own Virtual Console game, and is about to star in a brand new DSi game.
1. Rockman (Capcom) - Even more popular than Bomberman, highly petitioned everywhere in and out of Japan, incredibly uber moveset potential, a long history (especially in handhelds) and friendly relationship with Nintendo, the most likely candidate to represent Capcom (sorry Viewtiful Joe).

EDIT: I originally had King K. Rool, but I guess I accidently erased him and placed Jill & Drill Dozer to fill the void...

King K. Rool is the real #7. He's highly petitioned, decently popular, an excellent moveset (throwing barrels a'plenty), but the DK franchise already has a heavyweight character representing.

 

[WolfCypher]

I think there should be more taunt comments
You should be able to set words to every character's attacks, so when you kill someone with Luigi's Up B it says SHORYUKEN or something

That could potentially be horrible. Imagine every second, every attack initiated, a word balloon appears on the screen. With four player fights, I'd have to turn the game off.

King K. Rool is the real #7. He's highly petitioned, decently popular, an excellent moveset (throwing barrels a'plenty), but the DK franchise already has a heavyweight character representing.

That shouldn't be an issue, really. DK is actually fast for a heavy character, and K Rool can be slower but more durable. Plus, remember back in Melee where all the Pokémon characters had light knockback? Its not a thing if a franchise of characters have one stat similar.

 

[elheber]

Meh, I'm not saying he won't be in. He's about as big as DK and it seems about the same amount of reach, so I consider him to have the same moveset potential as DK. He can still be different, like throwing barrels and such... but I believe he's less likely to be included than Ridley. I'm not moving him above Ridley because the Pokemon in Melee had similar knockback, if that's what you're saying.

 

[Rush4216]

i say someone like ROY!!! YES HE MAKES HIS RETURN WITH A BRAND NEW MOVESET BUT THE SMAE LOOKS!!!!

 

[Red Arremer]

3. Ray MK II/III - Incredible moveset potential (Samus+Ike?), popular in Japan, and recently starred in his own DS game.

TOP 5 POTENTIAL THIRD PARTY NEWCOMERS

Custom Robo is a pretty long-going series already. 2 of the 4 games have been released in the USA, as well (only 1 in PAL tho <.<), so "his own DS game" is a bit clunky because there already were several games with Ray.

Also... Grey Fox before Simon Belmont? WTF. <_<

 

[CVaJJ]

I would hope RayMKII would be bigger than his Assist Trophy size.

I don't know about adding more than one character from the same franchise for third-party companies. It would seem better for them to try and get a different franchise, more so getting another third-party go join in.

Seems smarter to add something like Sonic and NiGHTS rather than Sonic and Tails.

But I would prefer to see more companies participate like Capcom, Namco, and Square.

About the issue of nerfing the top-tier characters-- I would rather them buff other characters than nerf them. Would make the characters a lot more fun.

Examples would be:
Making Zero Suit Samus a lot heavier to last during battle. After all, she is suppose to be like, what, 6' 2"? A woman of that stature should weigh a lot more than other characters that weigh more than her like Lucas, Ness, and Toon Link.

Buffing Samus' Charge Shot knock back back to Melee standards and D-Smash.

Jigglypuff's Rest knockback increased back to Melee.

 

[Serph]

If they were to include a Square-Enix character I'd rather they made it someone the company is actually known for. I know Geno is popular, but he doesn't exactly make for a good SE representative. It would have to be someone from Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest.

 

[elheber]

Spadefox, I would love Simon Belmont (actually, I'd prefer Soma Cruz even more) instead of Gray Fox. But Castlevania is Konami while Metal Gear now belongs to Kojima Productions, and it's Kojima who's in best terms with Sakurai. I'd have Castlevania in top spots if it were SSB:DS or if Geno wasn't requested so **** much. Also, about Ray MK II/III, I specified recently because new or upcoming games have a lot to do with a character's popularity. We all know there's been a lot of Custom Robo games. EDIT: I mean, you could have grilled me for the exact same reason on Little Mac.

As for why Geno representing Square-Enix instead of someone from Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest, well, I don't have great arguments. Even though there were plenty of Final Fantasy games on the NES and SNES, Sony might be considered more of a home to the franchise. The same goes for Kingdom Hearts. I believe Dragon Quest has a better chance... though the fact that the protagonist(s) has no official name might make it harder. I suppose if "Pokemon Trainer" can exist, then so can "Dragon Warrior". Plus, Dragon Quest is insanely popular in Japan, and I believe there'll be some new Dragon Quest games coming up soon for the DS or Wii (as far as I remember).

I know they both belong to Square Enix right now, but the fact that Geno was Square, while Dragon Quest was Enix is really distracting me right now for some reason. Anyway, Serph, I'm convinced... I'd put Dragon Warrior (or whatever his name would be) in front of Tails any day. And if it wasn't for Kojima rubbing up on Sakurai, I'd even put him in front of Gray Fox. Thank you.

 

[Serph]

The most likely character from Dragon Quest would probably be a slime. It's the series mascot after all.

And yeah, the next two main series DQs are coming to the DS and Wii.

 

[Wizzerd]

Third parties? Snake never deserved to be in, although I guess Sonic works although his games have been terrible lately. I agree with Serph, Slime should be a Dragon Quest rep. And Geno is a terrible option.

 

[drag0nscythe]

TOP 10 POTENTIAL NINTENDO NEWCOMERS
10. Jill & Drill Dozer - Excellent moveset potential, but not very popular as of recent.
9. Tom Nook - Best candidate to represent the popular Animal Crossing franchise, but has low moveset potential.
8. Tingle - Popular in Japan and has decent moveset potential.
7. Stafy - Super popular in Japanand has better moveset potential.
6. Ridley - Highly petitioned everywhere, but he's just too huge to be very eligible even as a heavy character.
5. Saki Amamiya - Incredible moveset potential (Falco+Marth?) and highly petitioned in Japan.
4. Isaac - Popular, highly petitioned, and excellent moveset potential, but might be too similar to Ike/Roy/Marth unless he focuses on magic.
3. Ray MK II/III - Incredible moveset potential (Samus+Ike?), popular in Japan, and recently starred in his own DS game.
2. Samurai Goroh - Best candidate to expand the small F-Zero cast and very different (Wario+Marth?) from Captain Falcon.
1. Little Mac - Excellent moveset potential, popular everywhere, and will soon star in a new Wii game.

This list seems bogus to me. Saki is not well known to the masses (even worse that Stafy for crying out loud.) He has only 2 games thus far, neither of which are outside of japan (unless I am wrong and the new one is coming west.) Moveset potential is not a good reason for including a character either. Everyone has good moveset potential.

Jill & Drill Doze, you said it yourself. Not that popular. She also has only one game (from what I have seen.) She is not even close to being more than AT status.

As for Tingle, most of the western world hates him. His fanbase is so split that even mentions him for more than AT would be disastrous. He is also not significant in anyway to the zelda series, just being an annoying character that has appeared a few times (with much loathing with each appearance.)

These three hear deserved their spots as AT's. It was meant for them. Even though i am a great fan of Stafy, I know his playable status is small. I hope for it, but I know that AT is his best chance again.

Oh, Ridley and K rool should be within the top three atleast.

TOP 5 POTENTIAL THIRD PARTY NEWCOMERS
5. Geno (Square) - Highly petitioned and excellent moveset potential, but hot much history in Nintendo (non-starring role in one game, cameo in another).
4. Tails (SEGA) - If Sonic is in SSB4 Tails is the most likely second representative for the Sonic franchise, plus the developer/publisher has good history/standing with Nintendo, but has relatively low moveset potential (sorry Shadow, you could almost be a pallet swap for Sonic).
3. Gray Fox (Kojima Productions) - Highly popular, an excellent moveset potential (no guns = good), most likely second representative to the Metal Gear franchise, and his creator/owner is in excellent terms with Nintendo and Sakurai.
2. Bomberman (Hudson Soft) - Uber popular everywhere, incredible moveset potential, the developer/publisher in great terms and has a long history with Nintendo, just starred in his own Virtual Console game, and is about to star in a brand new DSi game.
1. Rockman (Capcom) - Even more popular than Bomberman, highly petitioned everywhere in and out of Japan, incredibly uber moveset potential, a long history (especially in handhelds) and friendly relationship with Nintendo, the most likely candidate to represent Capcom (sorry Viewtiful Joe).

As for third parties. I hope for more, but I honestly think that the third parties were a one time deal. If I had to say, only 1 or two would be added in addition to them getting Sonic and snake back. That being said, it would be pointless to pull from those two series again. All I can say is that While getting more companies involved would be nice, going for other series from Sega and Kanomi would be their first bet.

EDIT: I originally had King K. Rool, but I guess I accidently erased him and placed Jill & Drill Dozer to fill the void...

King K. Rool is the real #7. He's highly petitioned, decently popular, an excellent moveset (throwing barrels a'plenty), but the DK franchise already has a heavyweight character representing.

This has no real bearing on K rolls chances. He is popular and one of the most requested. He has a good chance of making it.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ I just realize that Wizzerd is close of surpassing my post numbers in this thread. I must be active on this thread again, lol. However there is nothing to talk about that hasn't already been said except that the next Smash might show around 2011 or 2012 since I heard that the new Nintendo Game System is coming around that time, or an upgrade of the Wii. ☆

 

[rockem7]

I agree in full about the megaman/knuckles addition.
Bomberman would also be ftw.

 

[elheber]

drag0nsythe, just because a character is not popular here, doesn't mean it isn't insanely popular in Japan. Saki, Tingle, Stafy, Ray MK II/III are in this group. The only place western audiences know of Lucas is because of Brawl since Mother 3 was never made outside of Japan. Saki (who's game Sin and Punishment is in the Virtual Console), Stafy, and Ray MK all star in at least one game outside of Japan. While Tingle is at least known to the west from his cameos in numerous Legend of Zelda games. But the point is, they don't NEED to be popular here... they need to be popular in Japan. Just like Captain Falcon was popular enough in Japan to be included in SSB64. As it stands, Saki Amamiya is highly requested in Japan, and after doing some research I've found that Sin and Punishment 2 is due out for the Wii this year:
http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3170306
So you might not see the imense popularity here, but it is very popular. Saki stays.

So with that said, and for the reasons stated, Ridley is next most likely to Saki, and then King K. Rool after that. To put those two in the top 3 would mean bumping Samurai Goroh and Ray MK, and I don't see that happening. I also don't know if King K. Rool is as requested in Japan as it is out here.

As for 3rd party characters, I agree that Brawl's inclusion of them was probably a one off shot, and that if they appear in SSB4 there will only be 1 or 2 more and they'd get rid of Sonic. This is only a list what I believe is the top 5 most likely to appear... I don't really think there'll be 5 third party newcomers. If I had my way, it'd only be Bomberman and Rockman. And the Slime from DQ doesn't sound bad either.

EDIT: About the next Nintendo console (or upgrade to the Wii), am I the only one that thinks that Nintendo might put out a HD version of the Wii? The same Wii with the same architecture, but with HDMI for at least a 720p resolution display. Every game you have would just look crisper. Something like this could come out much sooner (like 2010) than the next generation Ninty console, and they already do this kind of thing for handhelds all the time.

 

[n88]

EDIT: About the next Nintendo console (or upgrade to the Wii), am I the only one that thinks that Nintendo might put out a HD version of the Wii? The same Wii with the same architecture, but with HDMI for at least a 720p resolution display. Every game you have would just look crisper. Something like this could come out much sooner (like 2010) than the next generation Ninty console, and they already do this kind of thing for handhelds all the time.

No, you are not the only one who thinks that. I have about a gajillion friends who would get a Wii, but they don't like the graphics. Nintendo could make tons by releasing an HD Wii.

Getting back on topic., I think that there should be some buffing and some nerfing, instead of the radical nerfing described by Wizzerd. I can only pray that in SSB4, Link has some hope of recovering. Also, a Bowser Castle stage is long overdue.

 

[Mythic02]

If they just upgrade the wii, don't forget about adding more memory. They slightly fixed this with the SD upgrade. It would be easier just having a wii with a lot of memory instead.

On topic: Link really does need a chance at recovering. Make his up-b carry him farther and give his bombs more knockback.

As for the bowser's castle. I agree.

Other stages i want: Some arena. With a crowd. One that doesn't change all the time like Poke Stadium.

Another one i would like is one where you play in the air. Imagine starting in a plane 5,000 feet off the ground. Then the hatch opens and everyone starts falling. Everyone would have unlimited jumps but they are all easier to kill. You would have to keep in the middle by fastfalling and jumping. Then you see buildings on the side and you can jump tech and maybe run along them if you fastfall while move into them. At the end you land on the ground in a big city and you play on the buildings until a plane picks you up again.

 

[Pikamari]

That could potentially be horrible. Imagine every second, every attack initiated, a word balloon appears on the screen. With four player fights, I'd have to turn the game off.



That shouldn't be an issue, really. DK is actually fast for a heavy character, and K Rool can be slower but more durable. Plus, remember back in Melee where all the Pokémon characters had light knockback? Its not a thing if a franchise of characters have one stat similar.

I meant a bubble only when you KILL someone with an attack

 

[Wizzerd]

☆ I just realize that Wizzerd is close of surpassing my post numbers in this thread. I must be active on this thread again, lol. ☆

Lulz, I get nearly all of my posts from here and Make Your Move 5.

And @ n88, I don't really support radical nerfing: those were just some ideas for nerfs, and I believe that some characters *should* be buffed too- Link seriously needs a better recovery and the Spin Attack semi-spike and stuff. Sorry, I wasn't so clear about that. Anyways, I would love a Bowser's Castle Stage.

 

[sundayseclipse]

Third parties? Snake never deserved to be in, although I guess Sonic works although his games have been terrible lately. I agree with Serph, Slime should be a Dragon Quest rep. And Geno is a terrible option.

snakes in cuz sakurai is freinds with the creator

by the way i dont wana spend 450 bucks on an updated wii ill wait for the next system(i think its called the wii revolution)

 

[Wizzerd]

It's called the Wii 2. And it's common knowledge about how Snake got in

On-Topic: Jigglypuff should be buffed with Melee-level Rest, comboing ability and a Sing that can actually be useful.

 

[kirbywizard]

On-Topic: Jigglypuff should be buffed with Melee-level Rest, comboing ability and a SIng tha can actually be useful.

As long as they keep her wall of pain, and her air based game, I will agree.

 

[Serph]

I've been playing as Link a little recently, and these are some of the things I'd like changed for SSB4:

- Arrows can be aimed up and down
- Hook/Clawshot does not go flaccid if you miss. It just retracts like in the Zelda games
- Spin attack goes higher and allows for greater horizontal movement
- Slight chance of arrows being either fire or ice. Fire deal extra damage + burnz, ice freeze

 

[Collective of Bears]

A few character changes:

DK
-When Down B is used in the air, he slams down and does a huge slap before initiating the attack.
-Giant Punch no longer makes you helpless

Wario
-Give the mini-Waft some sort of usefullness. Get rid of some end lag so you can combo from it.
-Recovery should sweetspot the edge

New Topic omgwtfbbq

The roster has been talked the hell out of. Let's discuss bosses now.

Zero Two
Giratina
Kraid
Majora's Mask
Zant/Phantom Zant (w/e)
Primal Dialga
Golden Diva
Dyna Blade
Shake King
Metal Gear REX
King Caliente
Crystal King
Giygas

To name some possibilities.

 

[Wizzerd]

A few character changes:

DK
-When Down B is used in the air, he slams down and does a huge slap before initiating the attack.
-Giant Punch no longer makes you helpless

Okay, sounds like a way to give Down B a use in the air.

Does Giant Punch really make you helpless? On that note, there are many attacks like PK Flash and Din's Fire that make you helpless in midair for no real reason. That should be changed.

Wario
-Give the mini-Waft some sort of usefullness. Get rid of some end lag so you can combo from it.
-Recovery should sweetspot the edge

Maybe make the ledge spike stronger. And the end lag completely nulllifies the tripping effect, which is dumb.

Okay. Although Wario doesn't need a buff, and he has good recovery already.

The roster has been talked the hell out of. Let's discuss bosses now.

Zero Two
Giratina
Kraid
Majora's Mask
Zant/Phantom Zant (w/e)
Primal Dialga
Golden Diva
Dyna Blade
Shake King
Metal Gear REX
King Caliente
Crystal King
Giygas

To name some possibilities.

Sounds good. Maybe something like this:

Cortez
Necky
Gohma
Mr. Shine and Mr. Bright
Kraid
Emporer Bulbax
Rival Pokemon Trainer (You fight as Pokemon Trainer in a battle where you and your opponent get new Pokemon when each fails)
Black Knight
Ghost of Starman
Dracula
Original Final Boss

Anyway, as for bosses, they need to all be actually from games (with the exception of the final boss, annd the hands). No more of this "Galleom" and "Duon" crap.

You know what? I'll come up with a boss!

Cortez, the Pirate King​

Cortez stays on the right side of the screen in a walk-off stage the size of where you fight Galleom in the real SSE, except with a pirate ship background. Yarr.

Attacks at 100% Health

Rapier Smash​

Cortez winds up and does a hammering rapier slash ahead of himself. The strike is very powerful, doing 20% and great knockback, with a range of half of Final Destination. However, it has a second of startup lag and two of ending lag. This makes it easy to dodge and punish Cortez.

Hook Slash​

Cortez takes out his hook and slashes it across himself. While the hook does only 15% and small knockback, it also has a very good chance to freeze or cause flower-head, like with Lip's Stick. Very quick too, but it is still dodgeable.

Sabre Thrust​

Cortez thrusts his sabre forwards over the ground. While doing 18% and small knockback, it has a range of half of Final Destination and it is very quick.

Sword Combo​

Cortez does two weak slashes ahead of himself horizontally, then finishes with a hammering slash. The first slashes do 8% and little knockback, with the last doing 21% and good knockback. Good range and speed.

Reanimation​

Cortez crumbles into bones. Then, the bones mysteriously levitate over the ground and reform Cortez a distance away. COrtez will use this frequently to position himself.

Attacks At 75% Health

Weapon Flurry​

Cortez frantically slashes all of his weapons ahead of himself at the same time, doing multiple hits for a maximum of 35%. Does no knockback but Cortez spams this as a damage dealer since it is so fast and it has nice range.

I'll finish this later.

 

[drag0nscythe]

drag0nsythe, just because a character is not popular here, doesn't mean it isn't insanely popular in Japan. Saki, Tingle, Stafy, Ray MK II/III are in this group. The only place western audiences know of Lucas is because of Brawl since Mother 3 was never made outside of Japan. Saki (who's game Sin and Punishment is in the Virtual Console), Stafy, and Ray MK all star in at least one game outside of Japan. While Tingle is at least known to the west from his cameos in numerous Legend of Zelda games. But the point is, they don't NEED to be popular here... they need to be popular in Japan. Just like Captain Falcon was popular enough in Japan to be included in SSB64. As it stands, Saki Amamiya is highly requested in Japan, and after doing some research I've found that Sin and Punishment 2 is due out for the Wii this year:
http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3170306
So you might not see the imense popularity here, but it is very popular. Saki stays.

So with that said, and for the reasons stated, Ridley is next most likely to Saki, and then King K. Rool after that. To put those two in the top 3 would mean bumping Samurai Goroh and Ray MK, and I don't see that happening. I also don't know if King K. Rool is as requested in Japan as it is out here.

As for 3rd party characters, I agree that Brawl's inclusion of them was probably a one off shot, and that if they appear in SSB4 there will only be 1 or 2 more and they'd get rid of Sonic. This is only a list what I believe is the top 5 most likely to appear... I don't really think there'll be 5 third party newcomers. If I had my way, it'd only be Bomberman and Rockman. And the Slime from DQ doesn't sound bad either.

EDIT: About the next Nintendo console (or upgrade to the Wii), am I the only one that thinks that Nintendo might put out a HD version of the Wii? The same Wii with the same architecture, but with HDMI for at least a 720p resolution display. Every game you have would just look crisper. Something like this could come out much sooner (like 2010) than the next generation Ninty console, and they already do this kind of thing for handhelds all the time.

so basically you are saying the world does not matter (specifically the US). That Japan is the only group that matters. Nintendo knows it is a world market now. They cannot just add japan only fan characters anymore. They have to listen to the world. IMO, the only reason why Lucas was added was becuase Sakurai desperately wanted him in. Other than him, I cannot think of any other Japan only characters that were in brawl.

 

[Binx]

They should add the directional airdodges back in, and limit them to one, but reduce the lag from it so that its slightly more noob friendly, they should remove autosweetspots, but keep being able to grab from behind (even though it makes no sense), they should remove tripping or at least add a way to turn it off if you choose, give us a better customizable level options, also they should add in the ability to interrupt initial dash animations with other dashes to allow more freedom of movement. I think they should improve tether recoveries to be able to grapple any spot on any ledge.

They should raise the overall fallspeed and movement speed for most characters to quicken the game a little bit. But once again I'll admit that it could still be slightly slower than Melee to be more accessible. Also they should add megaman and protoman ahah.

They should add the ability to release the edge quicker so that you can still maintain a few frames of invulnerability off the ledge. They should slightly increase the knockback and stun of footstools to make them an effective killing tool, and add the ability to meteor cancel them, and tech them on the stage. They should add a few frames of lag to the end of all rolls (from brawl) to discourage spamming them (because bad players can't seem to hit eachother)

 

[Serph]

I prefer Brawl-style airdodges.

They should remove tripping altogether. Even if you're just playing for fun, I don't see why anyone would want to leave them on.

 

[Lord Viper]

☆ I would rather get rid of random tripping than just get rid of tripping. Like for example, D-tilt's that make you trip, leave them on, items that make you trip, leave them on, however tripping out of the blue when you turn direction or try to use your move, they should get rid of. ☆

 

[elheber]

drag0nsythe, c'mon man. I'm saying they don't NEED to be popular here, and so you can't cross out Saki, Stafy, or Tingle. I didn't say that if they aren't popular here, that they're automatically disqualified; King K. Rool, Ridley, Isaac, and Geno are on my list too, and I consider those more popular in the States than in Japan. Stop putting words in my mouth.

 

[kirbywizard]

What I would love to see is a story were all character are included in the main story line and not just left out. (Poor JIgglypuff I wanted have her beat Tabu)

 

[Mythic02]

The final boss should be Master hand and crazy hand together.

There has to be some guy out there that is pissed off because people keep beating up his hand. There should be some huge entity that forms around the hands. Then the last stage would be a platform that he stands on, and you can actually walk on his body, so you can get to his head and hands and feet.

 

[Leopold222]

A Better stage builder and oh! A character builder 2!!

 

[Serph]

☆ I would rather get rid of random tripping than just get rid of tripping. Like for example, D-tilt's that make you trip, leave them on, items that make you trip, leave them on, however tripping out of the blue when you turn direction or try to use your move, they should get rid of. ☆

Of course. It goes without saying that tripping from moves and items is alright. Just not the random variety.

 

[DekuBoy]

Do we still need to discuss tripping? Next to Ridley's size it's the second most repeated topic.

 

[rockem7]

As for a new stage, I think that an FE style arena would be cool.
It would give the feeling of an actual brutal battle.

 

[DekuBoy]

I want a desert stage from Fire Emblem and an underwater stage for Stafy. I would love to see underwater physics...

 

[kirbywizard]

I loved how the FE stage in Brawl represented three types of areas in the FE series. In the next one, I say they keep castle siege, and add in another level except this one has a forest level, Snow Level, Desert Level, and of course a mountain level. There is so many types of areas in Fire Emblem games.

 

[Collective of Bears]

A Better stage builder and oh! A character builder 2!!

Instead of a character builder, I'd rather have a feature that allows you make customized costumes. Nothing fancy, just something to change basic colors. I've always wanted a purple and black Wario.

 

[sundayseclipse]

who do u think the next boss in the story line well be
somting origonal stronger then tabuu?
btw i think they should add somthing to master hand and crazy hand like have a head of a gentle man. the face is not visible but has a top hat and a glass over one of hte eyes somthing like fancy ppl have