[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Not so sure if this has already been said, but I know in most of Soul Calibur IV's one player modes, there's a tag team system that is represented by a bar in the bottom left. Switching characters decreases the bar, and you most you can switch up to before your bar's completely drained is 3 times. The bar increases slowly over time, and more so when you land attacks on your opponent (Characters not in play also slowly recover health).

Not only does it keep switching limited, it can still allow for some deadly combos, which the com like to do a lot in the later floors of SCIV's Tower of Lost Souls mode (Especially the second last level).

DBZ Budokai Tenkaichi 2 had a similar system for Tag Team Mode in which you can switch to a different character when the switch meter was full. For weak characters, the switch meter rose quickly (like Hercule), while it rises at a slow speed for the more powerful fighters (such as Broly). Additionally, Tag Team Mode was used for fusion abilities such as Goku and Vegeta's fusion to Super Gogeta.

 

[darkserenade]

You're joking right?

Yeah, that was a joke, but c'mon, Tabuu is so old.

 

[MasterWarlord]

For more bosses for SSB4:

Mario already got it's most deserving boss character, Petey Piranha, in Brawl. However; he could still be a REAL boss in SSB4, not just having a pathetic two attacks. King Boo's also up there, but not on the level of Petey. The Koopa Kids could make a nice boss fight if done correctly, but I don't expect it to happen.

Out of the Pokemon currently known, Giratina in the origin form would be a good way to advertise Pokemon Platinum, and Dark Lugia is a way to represent Pokemon Colosseum/XD as well as the second generation.

For Zelda, perhaps Vaati in eyeball form and Zant? They're the only two possible, though not likely, Zelda newcomers who could be turned into boss fights. Zant could have a really epic boss fight, but Vaati not as much so. Just translate the battle from Twilight Princess against Zant into Brawl and you have a done deal.

Kirby, I'm thinking Kracko or Marx. Marx is the final boss of the most popular Kirby game and has a variety of attacks while Kracko's insanely recurring and would be easy to make compared to some other bosses. Whispy Woods, while more iconic then Kracko, has already been done justice, having been on a stage in every single SSB game.

Starfox, Andross, Andross and more Andross. Just use Master Hand and Crazy Hand and throw his head in the middle with some more attacks, easiest to make boss fight ever. Andross is the only iconic character from the series who could work as a boss.

I can't really comment on Donkey Kong's boss, even ignoring the controversial topic of K. Rool, but that's because I haven't played any recent DK games. Although if there were a boss from the DKC games or DK64, I think Krow would be a decent choice, seeing as you fight him twice with actual notable differences, unlike the repeated bosses in the original DKC.

Ignoring the controversial topic of Ridley on Metroid, Kraid would easily make the best boss and be the most iconic. Dark Samus is possible, but bosses are more easy to implement if they have a massive size. We could also maybe see Mother Brain, but I think Kraid's most likely.

Fire Emblem, if it ever gets a boss, will be the main antagonist from the most recent game or a generic dragon. If it had gotten one in Brawl, it'd be Ashnard on his mount, as the black knight is only as big as the other characters.

If a Golden Sun rep got in, fusion dragon without question. That is all.

F-Zero, not sure. Probably Deathborn would make the most sense, but Mr. EAD could also be used, seeing as he'll never be a playable character, and his size could be exaggerated to be a boss more easily.

Mother. . .

YOU CANNOT GRASP THE TRUE FORM OF HOW DESERVING GIYGAS IS TO BE A BOSS!

 

[ducky285]

Additionally, certain heavyweights were actually faster than some lightweights (such as Ike for instance).

Two words: Donkey Kong

 

[the_Capt_Falcon_Master]

for the DK boss they could use dogodon (the dragonfly from dk 64) or armydillo (also from dk64).

 

[Chaos F-15]

I just want 2 very important things:
1)TAKE OFF TRIPPING
2)Improved Online play
everything else is fine

 

[Roymyboy284]

I was thinking about it, and what if nintendo created a FS level system? This is how it would work. You break the smash ball and go into FS mode. From there, you can either activate the FS, or absorb it. If you choose to absorb the smash ball, you press the button, and then you must wait 5 seconds. During this time, any attack will knock the smash ball out of you. If you absorb the smash ball, you stop glowing and it cannot be knocked out of you. If you get another smash ball, you will have the choice to use a level 2 FS, or absorb the smash ball. The cycle repeats until you have a max FS level of 3. Here's some examples.

Samus:
lvl. 1: Zero Laser
lvl. 2: Gunship Attack
lvl. 3: PED.

Captain Falcon: (In order to land all of his FS's, the opponent must be hit by the Blue Falcon)
lvl. 1: Blue Falcon
lvl. 2: Grand Prix
lvl. 3: Super Falcon Punch(what he does to the giant R.O.B.)

Sonic:
lvl. 1: Super Sonic
lvl. 2: Werehog
lvl. 3: Hyper Sonic

Bowser:
lvl. 1: Koopa Troopa Army
lvl. 2: Koopa Clown Car
lvl. 3: Giga Bowser

Link:
lvl. 1: Ending Blow
lvl. 2: Triforce Slash
lvl. 3: Fierce Deity Link

If you anyone has any questions just ask me.

 

[Chaos F-15]

I was thinking about it, and what if nintendo created a FS level system? This is how it would work. You break the smash ball and go into FS mode. From there, you can either activate the FS, or absorb it. If you choose to absorb the smash ball, you press the button, and then you must wait 5 seconds. During this time, any attack will knock the smash ball out of you. If you absorb the smash ball, you stop glowing and it cannot be knocked out of you. If you get another smash ball, you will have the choice to use a level 2 FS, or absorb the smash ball. The cycle repeats until you have a max FS level of 3. Here's some examples.

Samus:
lvl. 1: Zero Laser
lvl. 2: Gunship Attack
lvl. 3: PED.

Captain Falcon: (In order to land all of his FS's, the opponent must be hit by the Blue Falcon)
lvl. 1: Blue Falcon
lvl. 2: Grand Prix
lvl. 3: Super Falcon Punch(what he does to the giant R.O.B.)

Sonic:
lvl. 1: Super Sonic
lvl. 2: Werehog
lvl. 3: Hyper Sonic

Bowser:
lvl. 1: Koopa Troopa Army
lvl. 2: Koopa Clown Car
lvl. 3: Giga Bowser

Link:
lvl. 1: Ending Blow
lvl. 2: Triforce Slash
lvl. 3: Fierce Deity Link

If you anyone has any questions just ask me.

That's actually a good idea, but it should be like: you have to hold the smash ball for 15 seconds to use FS lvl 2, then another 15 seconds for FS lvl 30. Also, the smash ball can be knocked out of you if you get hit.

 

[Roihu]

No. If there is gonna be more than one FS it should be by using B with a direction.

 

[MasterWarlord]

Multiple final smashes is a good idea, but seeing how powerful the level one smashes are there's not point in absorbing the smash ball. I agree with Roihu, if you can do multiple final smashes it should be B, B side, B Up and B down, like with special moves.

I really doubt Nintendo wants to make 4 final smashes for every character though, especially seeing what they did to Ness, Falco, Wolf and Toon Link. . .

 

[Ilex]

I don't think they have the creativity to make more Final Smashes. I mean, what could Pikachu's other 3 FSes be? FSes are powerful enough as they are so lets not tinker with them anymore.

 

[flyinfilipino]

I don't think they have the creativity to make more Final Smashes. I mean, what could Pikachu's other 3 FSes be? FSes are powerful enough as they are so lets not tinker with them anymore.

100 Volt Tackle, 10,000 Volt Tackle, then Evolution!

100 Landmasters, 10,000 Landmasters, 1,000,000 LANDMASTERS!

 

[Ellio 2 b]

All I want from SSB4 is more characters, and better online play.

 

[FrostFalco]

PIkachu:
Volt Tackle, Evolution, Evoulution Volt tackle.

Fox:
Landmaster, Arwing, Big Arwing

 

[SkylerOcon]

Every characters Final Smash should be a landmaster in SSB4.

 

[Ilex]

PIkachu:
Volt Tackle, Evolution, Evoulution Volt tackle.

Fox:
Landmaster, Arwing, Big Arwing

I would rather see one final smash than those 3.

 

[Roihu]

Every characters Final Smash should be a landmaster in SSB4.

Which is what probably will happen if every character gets 3 FSs.

 

[Pieman0920]

I said POWER and FAST characters when I listed them, not heavyweights and lightweights. And since we're counting transformations, I've got two more fast characters for you, Shiek and Zero Suit Samus. Being heavy in weight doesn't change the play style that much, it's being slow and powerful/fast and weak that matters far more. Dedede's play style wouldn't change if he became light, and he probably wouldn't drop much in tier position, if at all.

Your quote~

...as heavyweight characters aren't in as much abundance as small, fast characters, which is what Dixie would be. Anyway, the post:

Heavyweight =! Power
Fast =! Fast + Small

You honestly think that the developers were looking at a mediocre show to design K. Rool? Rare has more originality then that and isn't so horribly idiotic to base the design off of one of the most horrendous shows untrue to the source material ever made. I have seen a couple episodes of the both the Mario and Zelda cartoons, it lowered my IQ points a fair bit. If you want to know what fans think of them, look no further then youtube poops.

...Rare's not the most original bunch... Most of their characters are animals/objects/mythic creatures with big eyes, human clothes, and for most purposes, cartoony. And look back at the picture I showed you, and see how close they really are, and remember how close their personalities were. I have no idea why you seem to hate that version of Bowser so much, yet love K.Rool despite them being virtually the same thing. (Do you just dislike turtles or something?) Youtube Poops are just harmless fun. You'll find it for basically everything. In fact, the most popular things normally get the most parody.

Since when was the Zelda cartoon good either? "EXCUUUUUSE ME PRINCESS!". While perhaps not as bad as CDI, they're still horrendous, and that's what matters.

....Exactly how old are you? You must be pretty young. Clearly didn't grow up on them, nor at an age to appriciate their camp value. Did you ever see that DK cartoon? What did you think of that? (K.Rool had a rockin air guitar back then)

The main reason I said the ness/lucas FS thing would be so that they'd be attracted away from just making him Giga K. Rool.

That would be worlds better than a PK Starstorm clone.

How will picking thing up with her hair give her anything besides items? Moves from sports are generally just excuses the the core character doesn't have enough good moves. Unless the character actually originates from is most well known from spin offs (Like Waluigi), spin off moves shouldn't be in their attacks. It's an insult to the character, Dixie is no exception. Really now, I've made a K. Rool moveset, let's see you make one for Dixie now that gives her a distinct playstyle, as bickering over who has more potetional isn't getting us anywhere.

It would make a cool extended grab, and seeing as it can be manipulated, can be used in many different attacks. You had to make up loads of K.Rool's stuff, so I don't know why you're ragging on the moves Dixie's picked up from sports games. Plus, the moves used in the spin offs fit her character. (Using boost barrels. Using giant bananas for batting at things)

Since I don't want to really do this, here are some quick B moves and a FS.

Neutral B: Barrel Throw- Dixie Kong flips her hair, and a barrel is seen being held in it. Dixie can walk around with the barrel, though at a slower rate, and has a reduced jump while holding it this way. When thrown, the barrel will roll faster than a standard barrel, but will also be weaker slighty.

Side B: Banana Swing-Dixie will take out a large banana, like the one used in Mario Superstar Baseball, and will hold it mudh like Dedede would hold his Jet Hammer. The move doesn't gain power from holding it longer, nor will it damage her. When released, she will simply swing the bat like normal, but if used against a projectile, she will bat it right back.

Up B: Barrel Blast- Dixie automatically pops into a barrel with a arrow painted on, which starts to spin around very rapidly. When B is pressed again, she will shoot forward in the direction the barrel was. Works like a faster version of the cut item.

Down B: Ponytail Twirl- A chargible move where Dixie pivots back. Can be charged for about as long as DK can charge a punch. When released on the ground, Dixie will spin right or left, depending on the direction, and turn fairly quickly. If a opponent its hit, it won't do much damage, but it will trap the foes, getting multiple hits. If used in the air, it can be used as a second recovery move, though it will only work horizontally, and won't help with any vertical recovery.

Final Smash: Rambi Racing- A tribute to the canceled Donkey Kong Racing, Dixie Jumps up into the sky, and a giant Rambi falls down with her on top. The Rambi is slightly smaller than Giga Bowser, but technically longer. The player can use the Rambi to charge into opponents, and can make the rhino do short hops as well. Is fairly fast, but can only attack at close range, and lasts about as long as other transformation Final Smashes.

And in any case, all this is doing is getting a bad rep for the both of us. Can we please just stop this? Nobody's going to win the argument, and we're mostly arguing over completely pointless subjects that won't affect their chances of getting in, going off on unrelated insiginicant details, like who's more serious (Bowser or K. Rool), K. Rool's origin, which of the two is less generic (Dixie or K. Rool), and so many more things. All it really comes down to in the end is a popularity contest.

Just admit defeat, then it will end. You can try to prove me wrong but, excuse my arrogance, that's not going to happen. You also don't seem to know that popularity isn't the driving force here, marketing is. While doesn't effect everything, it effects the main series quite a bit. >_>

K. Rool has more popularity on message boards, while Dixie has more in real life, generally speaking. But the only time Sakurai listens to the opinions of fans is when he hosts polls, otherwise he doesn't listen to what they think. Guess who are the ones who answer the polls? The ones on the message boards who are so geeky as to actually care who gets into a Smash game, like you and me.

And it seems he answered them by planning to put in Dixie. Your logic here is a bit flawed in this point. (Also, lol marketing is more important than popularity)

 

[mariofanpm12]

Hmm... I wander what new game-changing aspect they'd add (like how they added Final Smashes).

Of course, I still say this thread should be divided into Sub-threads, based on characters, stages, gameplay, etc.

 

[ChronoBound]

And it seems he answered them by planning to put in Dixie. Your logic here is a bit flawed in this point. (Also, lol marketing is more important than popularity)

You keep bringing up the point that Dixie is more likely since she was planned to be playable over K. Rool. However, this point is neglible. She was merely planned to be a part of Diddy Kong. In that poll that you like to cite all the time, all the times Dixie was brought up, she was brought up alongside Diddy, as in a tagteam.

The concept of a tagteam character struck a chord with Sakurai. Sakurai's original intention with Diddy was to have him tag-team with Dixie Kong. Whether she was going to be a clone of him or a completely unique characters remains to be known, and can be only determined for sure via Sakurai himself. However, it is quite the possibility that Dixie was going to be a cloned Diddy in the team mate aspect of Sakurai's planned tag-team Diddy-Dixie combo. There is also the possibility that Dixie was simply going to be a Nana, ie. a nonplayable character that simply followed Diddy around.

It seems Sakurai was quite smitten with the tag-team idea of characters. Another one of the Forbidden 7 was a Pokemon called Plusle & Minun. Plusle & Minun are very similar to one another in terms of physical appearances and I believe have a move called tag-team in their own games. It is likely that they were dropped as a character because like with Diddy and Dixie, he could for some reason, not get the AI to work with the non-human partner.

If you want proof that Sakurai intended for Dixie to simply tag along with Diddy, here it is:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=144627

 

[Roihu]

It seems Sakurai was quite smitten with the tag-team idea of characters. Another one of the Forbidden 7 was a Pokemon called Plusle & Minun. Plusle & Minun are very similar to one another in terms of physical appearances and I believe have a move called tag-team in their own games. It is likely that they were dropped as a character because like with Diddy and Dixie, he could for some reason, not get the AI to work with the non-human partner.

If you want proof that Sakurai intended for Dixie to simply tag along with Diddy, here it is:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=144627

Like hell. He could've if he wanted to. And I'm still sticking to Plusle and Minun never being considered as a playable character.

 

[ChronoBound]

Like hell. He could've if he wanted to. And I'm still sticking to Plusle and Minun never being considered as a playable character.

Sakurai's words. The almighty Sakurai said he could not get it to work, so why doubt him./snicker

 

[SkylerOcon]

Just a technicality, Chrono, but it's never actually been confirmed that Pra_Mai is Plusle and Minun. Anyway, I want a Diddy/Dixie tag-team and K. Rool in SSB4. That'd be pretty cool. I've been a fan of how the IC play just because it's so unique. Another character like this would be awesome.

And then K. Rool could be a heavyweight, a villian, give DK more reps, and he would have a pretty unique moveset. All pluses in my opinion.

 

[ChronoBound]

Just a technicality, Chrono, but it's never actually been confirmed that Pra_Mai is Plusle and Minun. Anyway, I want a Diddy/Dixie tag-team and K. Rool in SSB4. That'd be pretty cool. I've been a fan of how the IC play just because it's so unique. Another character like this would be awesome.

And then K. Rool could be a heavyweight, a villian, give DK more reps, and he would have a pretty unique moveset. All pluses in my opinion.

Then who could it be? The burden of proof is on you to determine who else it could possibly be. Plusle's and Minun's Japanese names are Purai and Maiun and there is a space between the Prai and Mai. see the coincidence, because I sure do. Oh, and if you are going to use the excuse that programmers would not abbreviate character names in the coding, for Mewtwo's victory theme listing, he is referred to as Myu2. Obviously, programmers can be just as lazy as other people.

 

[Pieman0920]

You keep bringing up the point that Dixie is more likely since she was planned to be playable over K. Rool. However, this point is neglible. She was merely planned to be a part of Diddy Kong. In that poll that you like to cite all the time, all the times Dixie was brought up, she was brought up alongside Diddy, as in a tagteam.

I think you're confused. I try not to cite the poll at all, and in fact don't think it really has much going for it in terms of characters getting in. I think it has to do more with marketing, and if you really want my true opinion, I don't think the DK series will get a new rep unless something major happens for the series inbetween now and then. (But if it would get a new rep, it would be Dixie) >_>

The concept of a tagteam character struck a chord with Sakurai. Sakurai's original intention with Diddy was to have him tag-team with Dixie Kong. Whether she was going to be a clone of him or a completely unique characters remains to be known, and can be only determined for sure via Sakurai himself. However, it is quite the possibility that Dixie was going to be a cloned Diddy in the team mate aspect of Sakurai's planned tag-team Diddy-Dixie combo. There is also the possibility that Dixie was simply going to be a Nana, ie. a nonplayable character that simply followed Diddy around.

Why would she be a clone of Diddy in a tag team aspect? That'd be pointless. If it is the case that they would be a tag team, that means there is probably a completely planned out moveset for her, minus something like a down B, and that would really increase her chances. Its also unlikely she'd be like a Nana, as then her data would have been labeled like Plusle and Minum's were, which was together. Even if you are under the impression that Dixie would have been simmilar to Diddy, there's no way their moves would have been all the exact same. They would have been like Sheik and Zelda, and had different movesets.

 

[ChronoBound]

I think you're confused. I try not to cite the poll at all, and in fact don't think it really has much going for it in terms of characters getting in. I think it has to do more with marketing, and if you really want my true opinion, I don't think the DK series will get a new rep unless something major happens for the series inbetween now and then. (But if it would get a new rep, it would be Dixie) >_>



Why would she be a clone of Diddy in a tag team aspect? That'd be pointless. If it is the case that they would be a tag team, that means there is probably a completely planned out moveset for her, minus something like a down B, and that would really increase her chances. Its also unlikely she'd be like a Nana, as then her data would have been labeled like Plusle and Minum's were, which was together. Even if you are under the impression that Dixie would have been simmilar to Diddy, there's no way their moves would have been all the exact same. They would have been like Sheik and Zelda, and had different movesets.

Nana was listed separetely from the Ice Climbers in the game's coding. Are you going to tell me Nana is not a clone of Popo.

Second, pray tell do you by any chance support a fourth Star Fox character getting in.

 

[MasterWarlord]

Sorry, but nostalgia and popular characters being imported into a cartoon series don't do much for me. Nostalgia can only carry one so far. I'm seventeen, so unless you're an adult, I'm not exactly "Pretty young". Sending low blow insults only make you look more desperate.

For video game related shows, I watched the adventures of sonic the hedgehog and ended up getting that donkey kong "movie" that slapped three episodes together into one. I went on youtube to watch the old episodes later on just to relive my memories, but I regognize the quality isn't exactly top-notch, especially with those songs. The Mario/Zelda cartoons I didn't watch/knew existed, which is why they don't have that nostalgic feeling for me, just an insult at a otherwise great series.

While the Donkey Kong Country show was indeed bad, it wasn't nearly as bad as those other two shows in my opinion, as the jokes didn't make me want to vomit like the ones in the other two shows. The characters also wern't horribly out of character constantly like in the mario and zelda cartoons, making the fact that my favorite characters were in it actually mattered. Not that they were perfectly in character by any means, but they were a heck of a lot closer then those other two shows.

 

[flyinfilipino]

How do we know that the Dixie data is left over from the original tag-team idea?

 

[ChronoBound]

How do we know that the Dixie data is left over from the original tag-team idea?

We can infer that. Sakurai said that he was originally planning Dixie through a tag-team. Sakurai never mentioned placing Dixie in as a separate character. Therefore, the burden is upon you to prove to me that Sakurai was at one point planning for her to be a separate character.

 

[flyinfilipino]

We can infer that. Sakurai said that he was originally planning Dixie through a tag-team. Sakurai never mentioned placing Dixie in as a separate character. Therefore, the burden is upon you to prove to me that Sakurai was at one point planning for her to be a separate character.

Oh my gosh, you've got me thar.

 

[ChronoBound]

Oh my gosh, you've got me thar.

Yeah, I kinda did.

 

[flyinfilipino]

Yeah, I kinda did.

Not really. Your 'inference' isn't concrete evidence.

 

[ChronoBound]

Not really. Your 'inference' isn't concrete evidence.

Yeah, it is, because I am using Sakurai's word. What are you you using, doubt?

 

[Roihu]

This thread is always in argument form, isn't it?

 

[flyinfilipino]

Yeah, it is, because I am using Sakurai's word. What are you you using, doubt?

No, you still haven't 'proven' that the data is truly leftover from the tag-team idea. Where is your 'proof'?

@Roihu: YES

 

[Dahlaine]

You all do realize that even more characters also means even harder balancing right?
Not that a fantastic assembly of characters wouldn't be awesome, ofcourse it would. We all know the new Nintendo is a lazy money-grubber and therefore won't really be arsed with too much, they are perfectly aware of the fact that a new SSB would sell like hell anyway.
I'd settle for a solid online mode and a few bits of character swapping/adding.

 

[ChronoBound]

No, you still haven't 'proven' that the data is truly leftover from the tag-team idea. Where is your 'proof'?

@Roihu: YES

Haha. Grasping at straws. The link in the previous page is your friend.

Again, you have no right challenging me to proof. You are simply erratic at the thought that Dixie will play second-fiddle to K. Rool once Smash 4 comes around.

 

[Pieman0920]

Nana was listed separetely from the Ice Climbers in the game's coding. Are you going to tell me Nana is not a clone of Popo.

Second, pray tell do you by any chance support a fourth Star Fox character getting in.

The fact that Dixie still couldn't be a perfect clone of Diddy doesn't really support the fact that they were like the ICs. (And also shows that Plusle and Minum were scrapped early on)

Not really. Four is too much, at this time. I don't see it as a impossibility to have a character replaced though, even if I find it somewhat unlikely.

 

[flyinfilipino]

Haha. Grasping at straws. The link in the previous page is your friend.

Again, you have no right challenging me to proof. You are simply erratic at the thought that Dixie will play second-fiddle to K. Rool once Smash 4 comes around.

Your arrogance amuses many people.

 

[ChronoBound]

You all do realize that even more characters also means even harder balancing right?
Not that a fantastic assembly of characters wouldn't be awesome, ofcourse it would. We all know the new Nintendo is a lazy money-grubber and therefore won't really be arsed with too much, they are perfectly aware of the fact that a new SSB would sell like hell anyway.
I'd settle for a solid online mode and a few bits of character swapping/adding.

Yes, but a lot of children in this thread seem to think Nintendo can make 100 character through the wave of a wand, and that the only reason we didn't get Ashley, Geno, Lyn, Krystal, Cloud, Sephiroth, and Narutc00l is because Sakurai was lazy.

Edit: I'm not arrogant, I simply ride my high horse trampling all the stupid peasants. =)