Official Pikachu Stage Discussion - Rainbow Cruise

[Zylar]

Yeah, run at the sound of this name at tourneys XD

 

[1nconspikuous]

about the jab lock, any vids?

 

[KayLo!]

about the jab lock, any vids?

Courtesy of the ever-so-talented Stealth Raptor from the jab lock thread....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8R-LIyGnzxs

 

[K 2]

What rating would you give this stage?

1-4 = terrible, ban worthy. Is it worth a 3?

 

[Zylar]

Well... Who are the characters that we CAN play on here?
So far, all I heard was G&W, and he's high up the list.

Maybe answering that question can decide if it is a 1, 2, or 3 (I don't forsee a four. -.-')

 

[K 2]

now wait just a minute...lets be calm about this. we know this is a bad level. but is also a bad level for another char and would that work in pikas favor? thats what we need to be asking.

Do NOT EVER PLAY HERE: Snake/Marth/Olimar/DK/Tink/Mario/Luigi(duh its named after him...lol)

Lets think about some chars who might hate this stage:

Gaw/Peach/DDD/ROB/Lucario

GaW: I have a lot of experience vs this one. And experience has taught me that this level is great for fighting gaw. His usmash CANNOT kill you when the house is standing and when you are on the bottom floor. His dsmash can be teched since you will more than likely be hitting the cieling and the floor before you go off the stage. It makes gaw have to fight a close up battel...which make this way in pikas favir since we have the better ground game. I like this level against the 2d dude.

Lucario: The reason i say we may want to choose this against lucario is that they love to use their airiels and the cilieng can help keep their game on the ground which benefits us greatly. plus you can always stay near a pillar if lucario has a charged shot.

DDD: Almost the same reasons for DDD. The wall of pain is harder to pull off here. DDD's airiels are done here when the mansion is up. ALso his waddles less effective here due to a cieling and pillar(s). DDD has to stay grounded for the waddles to go farther.Combine that with a shorter horizontal kill range from the stage i like this so a fsmash can kill easier.

ROB: just speculating but his projectiles are hurt way more than ours here. i may be wrong though. discuss this.

Peach: seems like a good idea. lol. we can juggle her easier here which helps a lot.

Zy, should we start here?

 

[Zylar]

Zy, should we start here?

0_o' Totally forgot about that post.

But yeah, it seems logical this way. Unless, of course, there are other stages we do better on that CP these characters.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Pros
Large stage so pikachu will survive longer than normal
Bottom pillars don't collapse unless the top one of that side does, so you can use the pillar to refresh moves (use jab to hit the pillar, it's fast and you don't use it besides jab lock)
U-throw and U-tilt on the ceiling can create opportunities for QAL and jab lock.
Ceiling makes comboes really easy.
If a camper is here and you are winning, stay on the other side of the pillar, it will block projectiles that aren't ROB's laser.

Cons
Thunder isn't really effective unless house is destroyed
Ceiling eliminates QAC game because you can get caught on the ceiling and punished
Pikachu will have LOTS of difficulty killing because of the huge dimension
Pikachu WILL be outcamped by several characters (Listed on the first page)
Reliable kill methods do not work (U-tilt to thunder or U-smash to thunder)

Overall: One of Pikachu's worst stages, you should normally ban this stage, and only counterpick here if you know your opponent sucks on this stage and you know that matchup on the stage really well. There are almost always better choices against every character.

Overall, i would say 2.5

 

[KayLo!]

If a camper is here and you are winning, stay on the other side of the pillar, it will block projectiles that aren't ROB's laser.

Or Din's Fire. Din's Fire (and Zelda in general) will destroy you on this stage, especially because she can choose to explode it sooner or later to mess up your shield/spotdodge timing.

I would give LM a 3 in general. If you're superior at teching and know how to jab lock and/or QAL well, that might change to a 4, but honestly.... just ban it. It's not worth the trouble, and any characters we have an "advantage" over on this stage can be taken somewhere else just as easily.

 

[neji32]

now wait just a minute...lets be calm about this. we know this is a bad level. but is also a bad level for another char and would that work in pikas favor? thats what we need to be asking.

Do NOT EVER PLAY HERE: Snake/Marth/Olimar/DK/Tink/Mario/Luigi(duh its named after him...lol)

Lets think about some chars who might hate this stage:

Gaw/Peach/DDD/ROB/Lucario

GaW: I have a lot of experience vs this one. And experience has taught me that this level is great for fighting gaw. His usmash CANNOT kill you when the house is standing and when you are on the bottom floor. His dsmash can be teched since you will more than likely be hitting the cieling and the floor before you go off the stage. It makes gaw have to fight a close up battel...which make this way in pikas favir since we have the better ground game. I like this level against the 2d dude.

I agree this is where I always CP gnw.

Lucario: The reason i say we may want to choose this against lucario is that they love to use their airiels and the cilieng can help keep their game on the ground which benefits us greatly. plus you can always stay near a pillar if lucario has a charged shot.

No. Only cp this against luc if you have an advantage. Killing luc here will be soooo hard and he will eventually get strong enough to throw kill you. Then lucarios will run out the clock here. Bad idea to cp this is your pika. And they can still Utilt lock and do massive aerials

DDD: Almost the same reasons for DDD. The wall of pain is harder to pull off here. DDD's airiels are done here when the mansion is up. ALso his waddles less effective here due to a cieling and pillar(s). DDD has to stay grounded for the waddles to go farther.Combine that with a shorter horizontal kill range from the stage i like this so a fsmash can kill easier.

NOOOOO very bad idea. The small platforms stop chain grabs cause for some reason the land on top of them if you Fthrow. Horizontal kill will only happen if there off stage or at the very side. They can tech the fsmash. vertical kill.......dont tty it. the ceilings too high and DDD is waaaaay to heavy. This is a stage DDDs will cp.

ROB: just speculating but his projectiles are hurt way more than ours here. i may be wrong though. discuss this.

his lasers shoot through the pillars....the bigger stage allows for longer survival and getting close to rob will get you punished. its not a good stage to cp rob on but not the worse. Robs will cp this level

Peach: seems like a good idea. lol. we can juggle her easier here which helps a lot.

and her Usmash wont kill as early as well as her frying pan.

Meta knight does well here also. He also has a tornado lock >_<


i give a 3.

 

[K 2]

The only character I would take here is G&W. Until we find a better stage to counter G&W, LM is probably one of your best bets.

 

[Zylar]

Well, a 2 or 3 sounds good. Using this as a cp for G&W seems to be the only decent thing.

 

[K 2]

Official Pikachu Stage Discussion #9: Jungle Japes

Falco...

Pros:

Cons:

Summary:

Rating:

Character Counterpicks:

 

[Stealth Raptor]

pros: the sides are very close allowing early horizontal kills
many edges and platforms = qac fun and SB tricksies.

Cons: the ceiling greatly inhibits vertical KOs.
a bunch of chars have good spiking moves and pika doesnt.

Really i dislike this stage a ton and may switch to banning this over mansion vs a lot of chars. the high ceiling stops vertical kills quite well. i hate this with a passion. pika isnt hurt by the water too much but it can still get them. unless you really like this stage dont go here. and ban this against the chars that it applies to. a big one is kirby.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Pros
Pikachu has many ways to maneuver with the platforms
Very large stage up top so we won't die from attacks like snakes u-tilt
Water effects pikachu less since QA gets you back to the level from the left side
Lots of room to maneuver and QA across
If you T-jolt around the left or right platforms, it goes all the way around, making short ranged characters very annoyed
Able to gimp characters with slow jumps and bad recovery on the left side because of water
Moving water eliminates chances of spikes unless the person has way too godly
Pikachu can use uair to psuedo-spike into the water, which can be devastating
GREAT for camping against non-camping characters
T-jolts will force many people into the water by gimping their DJ. If they up-b to avoid this, smack them with whatever you wish
Hard to get spiked because of water, but watch out for the WATER GOD
Cons
High ceiling basically eliminates all chances of a thunder kill
Loses to campers better than Pikachu (ie. ROB, Falco, Zelda (Din's fire has better range))
Gimping eliminated for the most part because of water
Put in uncomfortable position if hit off on the left side of the left platform. Water can **** you if you don't react as fast as you can
Strong horizontal attacks will still kill you on the right and left sides
WATER GOD will kill you at ANY % if it hits you. Watch for it and try to hit ppl into the water
Skull bash will be punished almost every time if you use it to recover, sides are too small

Overall
I would give this stage a 6 or 7. It's good for pikachu, but can be better for severall more characters.
Summary: Although this stage is pretty good, you need to know it extremely well to use it to its max potential. If the tournament allows it (Which tournaments in FL don't) then you should only really ban it 100% against falco, he is WAY too good on this stage. Other than that, pikachu can hold his ground, and only may be at a slight disadvantage. Adversely, he can CP other people here and totally wreck them.
Characters to counterpick this against: Everybody without projectiles, Snake, DDD (Even though there are better stages),
Characters to avoid playing on this stage: Falco, ROB, Zelda, DK

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

I personally enjoy this stage. It's fun to play on

 

[K 2]

Pikachu can pull some really fancy QA ledge tricks on this stage, given the six ledges. Falco can also do phantasm ledge trips as well though.

The klaptrap comes every 10 seconds and appears at the right when the seconds timer reads 7.

The only thing I dislike about this stage is the high ceiling, which inhibits pika's mainly vertical kill power. Pikachu goes badly on stages with high ceilings (LM, JJ).

 

[neji32]

Pros- QA'ing to each ledge, if you go through someone it stuns them so that they fall in the water and die. Fsmash kills early. Thunder guard kills early.

Con- What everyone else said.

Pick this against Olimar(though delfino is still a better choice, if they ban it then pick japes)
I beat falcos here, falco isn't too hard. DO NOT PLAY A DK HERE!!!!

i give it a 6

 

[Stealth Raptor]

I actually beat Master cheeze's DK the hardest on this stage, but then again the stage ***** him so hard.

 

[neji32]

I played tx3fate here and he ***** there. Down B hits the entire bottom platform. Up B will prevent from grabbing the ledge

 

[Ussi]

if they are using down B, just tjolt?

I use Pikachu or DK on this stage... never Ike... Put CP Ike here >_> Its his worst stage.

 

[K 2]

Seriously, do you guys have any stage you want to discuss? Any stage that you really like or any stage that gives you a really hard time?

If not, I'll just go to smashbros.com and close my eyes and randomly pick a stage for the next stage discussion.

 

[gallax]

this stage is PERFECT for snake. i mean beautiful. pick it everytime as your CP against him. i dont care how good the snake is. it gives pika such a huge adv on this against him.

as for marth...i like this stage as a marth player. there are better stage to play against him.

this stage is also a good CP against gaw and DDD.

 

[MasterCheeze]

I actually beat Master cheeze's DK the hardest on this stage, but then again the stage ***** him so hard.

Haha, usually this stage is better for DK than I showed due to some tricks he can pull, but yeah, that Klaptrap can be pretty bad. It appears under the right platform at x:x7 and the left at x:x4 I believe. Not as many Thunder KOs for your Pikas though. >D

 

[Tagxy]

I always eliminate this stage. Every time. And never play a kirby on this stage, you will be ownd.

 

[KayLo!]

Brinstar. I completely forgot about this stage until someone CP'd it against me in a friendly set recently.... then I realized I had NO idea how to play on it. It's kind of awkward.

Rainbow Cruise and Delfino Plaza are two others I wouldn't mind discussing. They come up pretty frequently in tournies it seems....

 

[gallax]

true that. never play kirby on this.

 

[K 2]

Actually, if you play a really gay and intelligent G&W, this stage can be a pain.

High ceilings + correct positioning + bucket braking = G&W living plast 150% on every stock, at least.

 

[Ussi]

If it's japes can't snake just damage with utilt and kill with ftilt/jab?

 

[K 2]

utilt only does 12 %, and its not safe on the block, unless its at maximum range.

Ftilt does 21% and its fairly safe on the block.

Jab only does 14%.

Moral of the story, utilt doesn't do much damage, but its a good finisher. Snake really doesn't have any reliable ways to rack up damage if ftilt and jab have to stay fresh for killing. His aerials are slow and laggy, so they aren't useful for racking up damage, since Snake will usually get punished for use it. His smashes are useless for racking up damage, and that basically leaves nades, which shouldn't do too much damage if your opponent know how to deal with them.

 

[gallax]

ok...what are we talking about again? listen guys. i main snake. i know his good and bad stages. jungle japes=bad. oyu can only mortar slide in the middle. on the sides you are forced to jab/tilit which is easily spotdodged by pika. you can grab>bthrow towards the side and force ihm to instantly recover with his cypher since if he goes to low he gets powned by the water.

if he even touches the water he is more than likely dead. bad level for snake.

 

[neji32]

Snakes ban this on me >_<

 

[K 2]

Official Pikachu Stage Discussion #10: Brinstar

Brinstar. For Kaylo.

Pros:

Cons:

Summary:

Rating:

Character counterpicks/bans:

Discuss away!

 

[lmntolp]

acid saves you from spikes sometimes

 

[K 2]

not really, Most spikes can spike you through the lava.

Can anyone find out at what percent the lava kills pikachu?

 

[ClobberinTime]

Those annoying round things on the stage floor mess up your t-jolt if I'm remembering correctly and not being stupid.

 

[K 2]

Attack the gooey things to refresh your moves. Just like on LM, the hitbox stays out longer when you hit the gooey things, so beware of that and use that to you're advantage if you want.

I'd assume this stage would help characters with good spikes/poor recoveries, since they can spike you through the acid while the acid helps them recover.

You can go through the bottom stage. This is a really nice mixup, since you can ledgedrop -> double jump -> QAC through the stage.

 

[gallax]

snake is awesome at this stage. he even has a fake c4 plant here.

 

[Zylar]

Care to explain what that means?

 

[Ussi]

I'd say, this stage doesn't affect pikachu, but it affects other characters soo much that it's bad for Pikachu. Pikachu will die super early since the stage is small. Pikachu's good recovery doesn't mean much. And Pikachu doesn't have a spike. The stage just doesn't compliment Pikachu like other characters.