Q&A Official FAQ and QnA Thread - Ask Your Questions Here!

[mers]

im pretty sure marth's neutral b has this property and potentially his sideb too. haven't tested it but i'm confident I observed this with his neutral B yesterday.

Ground? Air? Both?

Super curious.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

air. if i get time tomorrow i'll do some tests following the example from that one vid (fox shining bowser after the red shell)

 

[genkaku]

Is it worth training to get perfect shields, or are they too unreliable under pressure?

 

[DtJ Jungle]

It's definitely worth it, especially for falco lasers.

 

[Pi]

Is it worth training to get perfect shields, or are they too unreliable under pressure?

it's worth it
you won't see the 'worth it' part until you get pretty consistent with them though
and not just falco's lasers
i'm honestly starting to PS melee attacks pretty reliably
next step is to dsmash out of them

 

[4 Aces]

it's worth it
you won't see the 'worth it' part until you get pretty consistent with them though
and not just falco's lasers
i'm honestly starting to PS melee attacks pretty reliably
next step is to dsmash out of them

Dumb quesetion, but is there a good way to practice this? Like a trick or a rule of thumb to follow by? Or is it just "press x at right time?"

hey whats up samsh world im new to this board and actully signed up like 2 min ago but i have a question? how can i find tournments in my area? im a decent player not the best but i think it would be fun to try! i appreciate the help guys

Go to the regional zone and find the region that you live in. Then dig around for one. Hope this helps.

 

[X1-12]

Dumb quesetion, but is there a good way to practice this? Like a trick or a rule of thumb to follow by? Or is it just "press x at right time?"

Spoiler

its generally considered easier by pressing R or L

Actually if your a character with a low crouch, it can be made easier by crouching -> powershield, if not you can hold down the R button to almost clicking when you plug it in, however that means you can't lightshield as the game only registers the click

 

[Pi]

Dumb quesetion, but is there a good way to practice this? Like a trick or a rule of thumb to follow by? Or is it just "press x at right time?"

Errr...yea shielding is an important factor in powershielding, but gonna assume you just typo'd.

Ummmmmmmmm

For powershielding projectiles, you have a 2 frame window in which the projectiles hitbox needs to collide with your shields hitbox (shield needs to be fully pressed), while not hitting -your- hurtbox.
For powershielding melee/physical attacks, there is a 4 frame window.

Some tips surrounding powershielding I would say is get comfortable just mashing the shield button down, no hesitation, just one smooth motion all the way down, pretend there is no resistance.

Personally I practiced powershielding falco's lasers by having two controllers, and lasering with my toe.
I would advise you to:
-Not stand still, move around as if you were in a real match, dash dance, wavedash, whatever you would normally be doing, and just powershield out of that.
-Practice holding toward the projectile you're trying to powershield, this provides a slightly bigger window for your shield to interact with the projectile

Also I'd like to mention that powershielding itself isn't going to yield much profit. It's the follow up that counts. So practice flowing out of your powershield as well, like wavedashing or grabbing out of your shield.

As for powershielding physical attacks, I've just grabbed two controllers and practiced powershielding a smash or something. A 4 frame window is rather large, but the hard part is predicting accurately the attack your opponent is throwing out and when.

Some actual notes ON powershielding:
When powershielding a projectile, it neither reduces shieldhitstun, or shielddrop time. In essence you're just reflecting the projectile, that's it.
When powershielding physical/melee attacks, it does not reduce shieldhitstun, but it does allow you to perform any A (and B too? not sure) move as soon as you release shield.

 

[Orion*]

if i have a ntsc memory card, but a pal cube/game

will i be okay, or will i have to unlock everything all over again >.>

will my memory card even work in the first place? LMAO

 

[4 Aces]

Spoiler

its generally considered easier by pressing R or L

Actually if your a character with a low crouch, it can be made easier by crouching -> powershield, if not you can hold down the R button to almost clicking when you plug it in, however that means you can't lightshield as the game only registers the click

Um, yeah...when I put x, I meant x to mean "preferred shield button," rather than the x button itself. Wow...that came out really badly. Should've reread my post. X.X

Anyway, how does having a lower crouch make it easier?

Errr...yea shielding is an important factor in powershielding, but gonna assume you just typo'd.

Ummmmmmmmm

For powershielding projectiles, you have a 2 frame window in which the projectiles hitbox needs to collide with your shields hitbox (shield needs to be fully pressed), while not hitting -your- hurtbox.
For powershielding melee/physical attacks, there is a 4 frame window.

Some tips surrounding powershielding I would say is get comfortable just mashing the shield button down, no hesitation, just one smooth motion all the way down, pretend there is no resistance.

Personally I practiced powershielding falco's lasers by having two controllers, and lasering with my toe.
I would advise you to:
-Not stand still, move around as if you were in a real match, dash dance, wavedash, whatever you would normally be doing, and just powershield out of that.
-Practice holding toward the projectile you're trying to powershield, this provides a slightly bigger window for your shield to interact with the projectile

Also I'd like to mention that powershielding itself isn't going to yield much profit. It's the follow up that counts. So practice flowing out of your powershield as well, like wavedashing or grabbing out of your shield.

As for powershielding physical attacks, I've just grabbed two controllers and practiced powershielding a smash or something. A 4 frame window is rather large, but the hard part is predicting accurately the attack your opponent is throwing out and when.

Some actual notes ON powershielding:
When powershielding a projectile, it neither reduces shieldhitstun, or shielddrop time. In essence you're just reflecting the projectile, that's it.
When powershielding physical/melee attacks, it does not reduce shieldhitstun, but it does allow you to perform any A (and B too? not sure) move as soon as you release shield.

Um, yeah...when I put x, I meant x to mean "preferred shield button," rather than the x button itself. Wow...that came out really badly. Should've reread my post. X.X

Good post though. Didn't know that powershielding keeps the same shield hitstun. But how does powershielding a physical attack let you attack immediately if the shield hitstun is the same? Wouldn't dropping the shield afterwards be just as fast/slow as dropping the shield without powershielding?

 

[X1-12]

err basically if the projectile is going to go over your head then you can actually PS it with the back of your shield if you end up pressing R too late, if you were standing the projectile would just hit you instead

Good post though. Didn't know that powershielding keeps the same shield hitstun. But how does powershielding a physical attack let you attack immediately if the shield hitstun is the same? Wouldn't dropping the shield afterwards be just as fast/slow as dropping the shield without powershielding?

I believe you have the same length stun BUT you can cancel it immediately into an attack, or if you are hit again in that stun you auto-power shield that attack, hence why if you PS a fox drill, all the hits get PSed

 

[genkaku]

Why do I keep hearing about 69%?

 

[Pi]

Good post though. Didn't know that powershielding keeps the same shield hitstun. But how does powershielding a physical attack let you attack immediately if the shield hitstun is the same? Wouldn't dropping the shield afterwards be just as fast/slow as dropping the shield without powershielding?

I believe you have the same length stun BUT you can cancel it immediately into an attack, or if you are hit again in that stun you auto-power shield that attack, hence why if you PS a fox drill, all the hits get PSed

pretty much this but to phrase it differently/go into more detail;

When we talk about shield hitstun, we are talking about the ammount of time you are -stuck- IN your SHIELD, meaning the shield is still there, out, and are -stuck- in it, unable to perform actions.

Now, when you release the shield button, let's say you just pressed shield, then let it go, you are now in the 'shield drop' animation. You can visually see this, it lasts 16 frames (for samus, maybe diff for other chars? idk), and you are only able to jump out of this animation. Pressing DOWN during the shield drop animation will make you spot dodge, the side directions won't do anything, and UP will make you jump, also you can't grab out of the shield drop animation.

Now, when you powershield a melee/physical attack you are able to perform A/B moves (jabs, smashes, falcon punches, whatever) during the shield drop animation, to cancel it.

Why do I keep hearing about 69%?

it's a sexual position (69) & generally produces giggles when heard by middle school children

 

[nekokatsu]

i post a topic about this and i got a two differents answers, one in the topic, and one via PV

could someone explain me, the rules of autocancels in melee, please!!! xDDD
i started to think about this a few weeks ago, when i was watching hitbox info of Zelda.
and it was like, i understand and WTF!!!!

B-Air

Total: 35 i understand
Hit: 5-8 ohh didnt know
IASA: 33 ohh i see
Auto cancel: <4 25> WTF!!!!! xDDDD
Landlag: 18 aaa ok
Lcanceled: 9 aaaa ok

Shield stun: 18 aaaaaa ok
Shield hit lag: 8 AHA
Advantage: +1 wtf again but i think i get it.

--weak hit--
Shield stun: 11
Shield hit lag: 5
Advantage: -3


hope u can help me =). xD

blowtoes said : The rules of autocancelling are, if you do an aerial, and it completes its entire animation in midair, you'll land with the same amount of lag you would normally with an empty jump. No Lcancel required. (i think this is the rule of brawl xDDD)

i apologize to JUNGLEFEVER, but this topic its not closed xD, 2 different answer and i didnt found enough info about this, and i didnt noticed the Q&A topics for noobs xDDDD

thks to X1-12 for his answer. =)

 

[john!]

i think it's like this:

every move has IASA frames (interruptible as soon as...) where you can input another action before the animation is over. for example marth's dtilt, you can dtilt to another move before the dtilt lag ends. if your aerial has IASA frames then you can land on the ground without lag during these frames.

correct me if i'm wrong magus magus420 namesearchlol

 

[X1-12]

I am 100% confident in what I said, just to sum up


auto cancelling is landing near the start or end of an aerial causing you to land with very little lag (less than L cancelling)

autocancelling happens, for that move you posted, before frame 4, or after frame 25



IASA has nothing to do with landing or autocancelling, it just means you can input another aerial attack after frame 33

 

[Tamoo]

yeah IASA doesn't have to do with landing, it's the frames within which you can cancel the animation of the move into a different animation, like marth's downtilt to run, jab, another dtilt, anything other than shield iirc.

 

[X1-12]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oatgmFmqKx0#t=0m10s

dr peepee doesn't fastfall the b-air so that it autocancels

 

[CloneHat]

An easy way to define auto-canceling is that it's when your aerial ends before you hit the ground.

 

[X1-12]

when this happens, it is auto-cancelling, but thats not the whole definition

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Oh, I always thought autocancelling was how blowtoes described it.

 

[Geist]

My definition was closer to the Barwl definition. :[

I honestly didn't know you could autocancel in early frames though.
It cancels before the hitbox even comes out so it's not like it's practical knowledge lol.

 

[Charlie G]

OK

cos the search function is useless, and the stickies of information are hopelessly outdated, could someone please link me to a thread / post explaining shield drop / isai drop in detail?

 

[Kanelol]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=273161

bam son

 

[nekokatsu]

I am 100% confident in what I said, just to sum up


auto cancelling is landing near the start or end of an aerial causing you to land with very little lag (less than L cancelling)

autocancelling happens, for that move you posted, before frame 4, or after frame 25



IASA has nothing to do with landing or autocancelling, it just means you can input another aerial attack after frame 33

i never doubted you =). i just seemed to me, that not so many people knew about this.
other Q about autocancel, if i wanna autocancel i dont have to input L right?, cuz if i input i L cancel instead of autocancel, or if L cancel in the frames of an autocancel the game just autocancel anyway?????

after readng this, i think is the key to speed up slow characters. falling with the lag of a normal jump. its awesome. =)

 

[X1-12]

you don't have to press anything to auto-cancel, hence the name, if you input L nothing will happen, except perhaps accidentally shielding

 

[X1-12]

OK

cos the search function is useless, and the stickies of information are hopelessly outdated, could someone please link me to a thread / post explaining shield drop / isai drop in detail?

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=274206&page=6&highlight=dashdancedan

more stuff about shield drop/shai drop/buffer sheild drop

 

[KAOSTAR]

i never doubted you =). i just seemed to me, that not so many people knew about this.
other Q about autocancel, if i wanna autocancel i dont have to input L right?, cuz if i input i L cancel instead of autocancel, or if L cancel in the frames of an autocancel the game just autocancel anyway?????

after readng this, i think is the key to speed up slow characters. falling with the lag of a normal jump. its awesome. =)

most auto cancels are situational.

shffl and mixing up aerial times is much more important.


alot of times you won't want to aerial that early or not fast fall.

situational tho.

 

[Pogogo]

I still don't understand l cancelling. Don't most aerials end before you hit the ground? For example, with jiggs.

Here's my problem. Because were noobs, my friends and I will just shield grab everything thats not a bair or a well spaced attack. We don't l cancel. Teach me in simple terms to pillar with falco, because that looks amazing. Or just how to fair a shield and not get grabbed. Keep in mind I do not l cancel.

Cause I'm just spamming bairs and ftilts at the moment, which is just crappy. When i try to l cancel i just shield and get grabbed.

Its not that were inexperienced. We play this game every chance we get for hours at a time. Also, we think brawl sucks.

 

[KAOSTAR]

you shouldn't even be playing vs people.

practice l canceling.!!! you want to short hop and do an aerial, then fast fall. L CANCEL!

you want to be able to do this rapidly.

learn to do that before you do anything else.

 

[mers]

You just have to learn to L cancel. It's that simple.

 

[Pogogo]

This is still unclear. How can I tell if I've l cancelled? How can I tell if I need to?

 

[A Pimp Named Slickback]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4n4s5yB7ZkE

 

[4 Aces]

pretty much this but to phrase it differently/go into more detail;

When we talk about shield hitstun, we are talking about the ammount of time you are -stuck- IN your SHIELD, meaning the shield is still there, out, and are -stuck- in it, unable to perform actions.

Now, when you release the shield button, let's say you just pressed shield, then let it go, you are now in the 'shield drop' animation. You can visually see this, it lasts 16 frames (for samus, maybe diff for other chars? idk), and you are only able to jump out of this animation. Pressing DOWN during the shield drop animation will make you spot dodge, the side directions won't do anything, and UP will make you jump, also you can't grab out of the shield drop animation.

Now, when you powershield a melee/physical attack you are able to perform A/B moves (jabs, smashes, falcon punches, whatever) during the shield drop animation, to cancel it.



it's a sexual position (69) & generally produces giggles when heard by middle school children

Ah, alright. I get it.

 

[nekokatsu]

most auto cancels are situational.

shffl and mixing up aerial times is much more important.


alot of times you won't want to aerial that early or not fast fall.

situational tho.

yeah i know, but im a Bottom tier user (Zelda) so, if i want to win i need to master all the techniques, also we dont know how autocancel will work for Zelda, after all, shield game and Oos works better for Zelda than for every other charater, and i think not every one knows about that fact.

 

[KAOSTAR]

yeah i know, but im a Bottom tier user (Zelda) so, if i want to win i need to master all the techniques, also we dont know how autocancel will work for Zelda, after all, shield game and Oos works better for Zelda than for every other charater, and i think not every one knows about that fact.

whatever man. no johns.

learn the basics or fail to improve.

zelda doesn't have the best oos game either. and people know how auto canceling works for lots of characters.

 

[Stratocaster]

i still don't understand l cancelling. Don't most aerials end before you hit the ground? For example, with jiggs.

Most short hopped aerials do not end before you hit the ground, jiggs is more of an exception than the norm. Besides that, try try short-hop double bair with jiggs and you'll find you hit the ground before the end of the second bair iirc. Try short hop aerial dair with captain falcon for a good example of an aerial that has a lot of lag and won't end before you land.

here's my problem. Because were noobs, my friends and i will just shield grab everything thats not a bair or a well spaced attack. We don't l cancel. Teach me in simple terms to pillar with falco, because that looks amazing. Or just how to fair a shield and not get grabbed. Keep in mind i do not l cancel.

In simple terms:
short hop (release X/Y before leaving the ground)
dair (down on the c-stick or down+A)
l-cancel (press L and release before the lag is over)
shine (down b)
repeat

how to not get sheild grabbed without l-canceling is like asking how to shoot without a gun. L-canceling is the tool to not getting shield grabbed. It is vital.

cause i'm just spamming bairs and ftilts at the moment, which is just crappy. When i try to l cancel i just shield and get grabbed.

Try not pressing L/R completely down. To l-cancel the only input required is a light press of L/R within .3 seconds before reaching the ground. Make sure to release the button after you hit the ground or you will shield and get grabbed like you said. To make use of the l-cancel, after you do it you should either run away, jump, attack (jab probably) to avoid the grab. You can't l-cancel and then do nothing. To practice l-cancel start with bowser's bair or link's dair and then try it with different characters until you can shffl all of fox or falco's aerials. Do that on your own time when you aren't playing friends.

This is still unclear. How can I tell if I've l cancelled? How can I tell if I need to?

You can tell with Link's dair or Bowser's bair really clearly because theres an obviously shortened landing lag. For other characters such as sheik, its more difficult to tell because the # of frames cut off is not as much. As you play more, you'll get a sharper eye for how things should be, and you'll be able to tell if you miss an l-cancel. As for how you can you need to: there is NEVER a time not to l-cancel. If you're falling to the ground while doing an aerial you should hit L/R every time. ITS MUSCLE MEMORY FOR EVERY GOOD PLAYER. Trust me, no one thinks about when to l-cancel. Its a habit. Just like typing. Do you think "where is the 'A' button" every time you press it or do you just think of the word alligator and press the letter 'A' twice because your fingers are trained to? Its like breathing. Do you think "should I breathe in this situation?" NO! Always breathe, don't think about it. Always l-cancel. Never think about it again.

its not that were inexperienced. We play this game every chance we get for hours at a time. Also, we think brawl sucks.

Brawl does suck

 

[gm jack]

L cancelling is a pain, and takes a lot of time and effort to be consistent, but it is necessary for high level play.

 

[KAOSTAR]

to simply avoid shield grabs you just land outside their grab range.

to avoid getting ***** for doing an aerial you make sure to l cancel.

 

[genkaku]

I'm a mid-tier user, Jigglypuff.
Oh, wait.