[NSW] Western Sydney Dramacraft: The home of drama!

[Pirate.]

pretty sure Tedeth made that joke to me in real life S.D, while ILag was sitting next to him, lol.

Why isn't there buffering in melee... makes me have to pay attention and actually learn move timings when switching from brawl. (not actually a question).

Why arn't we discussing stages? Was that sposta happen or no?

 

[tedeth]

When I actually started practicing melee it didn't take me too long to get used to the buffering system. Play a few matches and you'll get used to it.

 

[Pirate.]

Its mainly precise input stuff like... link being airborne for 32 frames off a shorthop. his bair having 36 total frames, but IASA frames on frame 30. so, in order to sh-> bair -> dj -> something... have to be like frame perfect precise . Also approaching/retreating nairs seem much more difficult. I'm sure i'll pick it up again with more practice. Good whine by me imo.

Is there anything happening this weekend?

 

[S.D]

How does everyone know so much about frame rates and buffering and stuff?

I just press the buttons and watch the manz fell down XD

EDIT: Mike, you're probably having trouble because melee has these things called "hit stun" and "shield stun" something it's inbred offspring Brawl doesn't understand. Brawl would be 1000 times better if you couldn't just f smash anything OOS

 

[unreon]

Its mainly precise input stuff like...

It's just called doing stuff ._. "look, the move finished. I should jump now." Once you get the tech-heavy stuff down pat you'll start enjoying Melee more :D It's very funsies.

Much funsier than Brawl.

I find that the buffering system in Brawl makes me feel sluggish, and is the main reason why I don't enjoy playing it.

How does everyone know so much about frame rates and buffering and stuff?

I just press the buttons and watch the manz fell down XD

LOLOL i'm the same :D Guys stop reading up on frame data and whatnot. I don't have a clue about the numbers; everything I've learnt was from simple observation.

"Shine comes out fast. Shine eats through lots of thingsies. Use it lots."

 

[Pirate.]

Well you don't needto know the exact theory and frames etc, i just find it useful for knowing whats theoretically possible, so in certain circumstances i don't just give up on something/stop trying when it can be done, i'm just not moving my fingers fast enough/timing it right.

It's also useful is for knowing the times in which the hitbox comes out for certain moves so you know whats best for punishing cross ups/spot dodges/grab releases etc.

In both games (in melee cause good people are super awesome) (in brawl because there is buffering) it can occassionally come down to moves which are 1 frame faster, beating the other one out.

Knowing frame can probably help you in a few situations, and can give you an appreciation for the programmers who tried to hard to make certain actions frame times synch up so perfectly (like all the autocancelling in brawl) (not really, they're made of failcake).

Conclusively, i actually just need to learn the timings in game. (i dont really know who this post is directed at, i just kind responded to a question no one asked me)

---

To actually answer your question S.D: 'I' know what i do about frame rates and buffering and stuff because frame rates seem quite useful and buffering is in most fighting games, and its quite noticeable that it's not in melee, especially when switching from brawl and then switching back etc.

Inbred offspring, i take offense to that . I'm aware of hit-stun and sheild stun , i'm just fail at button pushing. Sheild stun would just make Lucas overpowered imo, haha

boringest thing to read ever? yep!

EDIT: @ unreon. pft, so not possible recognise if you inputted something 1/60th of a second late! or react and input in the 1/60th of a second after the animation finishes, lol. who looks at there own character anyway! shenanigans imo.

 

[tedeth]

So many text walls coming out.

The only good text walls are flaming text walls.


********************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************

Something like that.

 

[S.D]

Well you don't needto know the exact theory and frames etc, i just find it useful for knowing whats theoretically possible, so in certain circumstances i don't just give up on something/stop trying when it can be done, i'm just not moving my fingers fast enough/timing it right.

It's also useful is for knowing the times in which the hitbox comes out for certain moves so you know whats best for punishing cross ups/spot dodges/grab releases etc.

In both games (in melee cause good people are super awesome) (in brawl because there is buffering) it can occassionally come down to moves which are 1 frame faster, beating the other one out.

Knowing frame can probably help you in a few situations, and can give you an appreciation for the programmers who tried to hard to make certain actions frame times synch up so perfectly (like all the autocancelling in brawl) (not really, they're made of failcake).

Conclusively, i actually just need to learn the timings in game. (i dont really know who this post is directed at, i just kind responded to a question no one asked me)

---

To actually answer your question S.D: 'I' know what i do about frame rates and buffering and stuff because frame rates seem quite useful and buffering is in most fighting games, and its quite noticeable that it's not in melee, especially when switching from brawl and then switching back etc.

Inbred offspring, i take offense to that . I'm aware of hit-stun and sheild stun , i'm just fail at button pushing. Sheild stun would just make Lucas overpowered imo, haha

boringest thing to read ever? yep!

EDIT: @ unreon. pft, so not possible recognise if you inputted something 1/60th of a second late! or react and input in the 1/60th of a second after the animation finishes, lol. who looks at there own character anyway! shenanigans imo.

Naww I was just kidding

 

[Pirate.]

The large majority of my posts are text walls.. sadly none of them flaming

 

[EverAlert]

I think this is where "ILAG" learned to play MK.

Guide Meta Knight is actually superior to I LAG Meta Knight.

True story. Battle-tested theory.

How does everyone know so much about frame rates and buffering and stuff?

Well, yakno... There's this little thing I discovered called reading. It's actually pretty useful!

But seriously, for me it's just fukken interesting. I go nuts over theory and mechanics and ****. I don't know why, but I just love finding out the exact inner workings of stuff, from actual formulas to just plain random info, and frame data is no exception. xD

Guys stop reading up on frame data and whatnot.

I don't really see what's so inherently bad about it. Obviously you're not going to be instantly better at a game just by reading up on frame data, and just as obviously you don't need to know frame data to be decent at a game. But at the same time it is useful to know and can help explain some things/help make decisions, and is just interesting. It's one thing to not rely on it (understandable, even advisable), but outright refusing to read up on it because it's frame data is just stupidity.

So many text walls coming out.

The only good text walls are flaming text walls.

zomg, not logical, constructed, in-depth posts! How can this be happeninggggg??!?!!

Embrace the text walls, tedeth! EMBRACE!

 

[luke_atyeo]

dedu doesn't believe in brawl.
fight the power dedu, fight it!

 

[isthattim?]

Lol at all the best smashers knowing the least about frame data etc.
Just goes to show you don't need to stress about knowing that stuff

 

[Isorropia]

Well, best -Australian- smashers. The American guys are all over that sorta crap.

 

[isthattim?]

Well, best -Australian- smashers. The American guys are all over that sorta crap.

?
start making sense
M2K?

 

[Bjay]

yeah i dunno how the topic went from tiers or frames and that stuff but yeah I've no idea about it

I just play and hope for the best, that works for me.

 

[S.D]

I guess you just get a 'feel' for it after a while.

 

[M]

Apparently all I do is dash grab anyway...

 

[tedeth]

Apparently all I do is dash grab anyway...

Sounds like you've been talking to Shaya.

 

[Bjay]

Sounds like you've been talking to Shaya.

I see what you did there.

 

[Pirate.]

Lol i'm pretty sure people said m2k memorised the frame data for all the characters , but that was mainly supporting evidence for him being a robot . But really, he was all over the melee frame data and theory, i'm pretty sure his website had a ton of frame and statistic information (like weights and resistances etc). It's shut down now though.

 

[EverAlert]

His website had an insane amount of stupidly technical but insignificant stuff. It was pretty interesting, actually. No actual character frame data though, if I remember. But yeah, I believe I saw him say once that he learnt all the frame data for Melee, but wasn't bothered to learn all of it for Brawl (just the characters he was curious about).

 

[tedeth]

The fact is that if you're playing a decent player you won't have time to think about how many frames you've got to do something, especially in melee. All you can do is learn timing and get an instinct for what you're doing.

 

[Pirate.]

Yeah, lol obviously, you don't try and calculate frame advantages and disadvantages mid-match. It's just useful for knowing things you can potentially do... and whats best in certain situations... then you learn to implement those actions into your gameplay.

Crappy example: if i start a jab attack with link, intending to hit someone... and they shield the first hit, theoretically it would be better to use the second hit (giving me a smaller frame disadvantage) and then try to jump away/go for a grab/spotdodge/3rd hit and hope to pushem away.

slightly Better example: with link... if i crouch cancel a dancing blade... it would, in most circumstances be much better to punish it with a dsmash who's hitbox comes out on frame 9... rather than a dtilt whos hitbox comes out on frame 14.

 

[EverAlert]

The fact is that if you're playing a decent player you won't have time to think about how many frames you've got to do something, especially in melee. All you can do is learn timing and get an instinct for what you're doing.

You can apply the knowledge while you're practicing though, so that when you come up against said decent player (in a situation where it matters, at least), it's already in muscle memory and you can execute it efficiently. :3 Learning frame data is just another method of learning the timings of moves, the same as "learning by feel" (though certainly a faster and more accurate method). Either method's fine in my books, I don't even care, I just don't think frame data is given enough emphasis.

Thinking about any strategy right when you need to use it will guarantee you screw up. This doesn't just apply to frame data. This act must be natural, something you’ve done a thousand times before. You shouldn’t have to think “I’m pretty sure I can win this in theory. The textbooks say I should do X.” You should take control of the game simply, quickly, and instinctively, just as you have done countless times. (I should really stop quoting Sirlin shamelessly.)

Just saying, while knowing frame data isn't necessary, it's definitely not useless.



... God, that was a mess of an argument.

slightly Better example:... if i crouch cancel a dancing blade...

Haha, that's probably not a very good example; if you CC a Dancing Blade you're just going to eat another one. xD

 

[Pirate.]

lolwut? how are you gonna eat another one?

 

[EverAlert]

You'll be sitting right in front of the Marth... >.>

Granted, it's probably the same if you don't CC. You're better off trying to DI out.

I'm not disagreeing with your point, just saying that was a bad example. xD



Edit: Solo Climber training against computers is ********. They edgeguard you when you go to kill your Nana. FFS

 

[F_T_S]

im pathetic wen it comes to the whole technical side crap.....i jus play DK on a stage...if you get hit...its your own fault

 

[I LAG]

i am not even going to bother to read posts in this thread anymore when i look at the screen i just see a wall of grey text.


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use rainbow walls they are much more pleasing to look at.

 

[luke_atyeo]

thinking out loud, I wonder how many people have been bothered to read your posts?
im so mean, anyways does anyone know what frame jiggly's rest comes out on, and what frame luigi's up b comes out on, I think I've found a nice new trick.
youtube is best

 

[SummonerAU]

thinking out loud, I wonder how many people have been bothered to read your posts?
im so mean, anyways does anyone know what frame jiggly's rest comes out on, and what frame luigi's up b comes out on, I think I've found a nice new trick.
youtube is best

Jiggs:
As far as I know

Comes out frame 1
Hitbox lasts 3 frames
34 frames of invincibility

EDIT: What's the trick luke ;_;

 

[ComboTurtle]

>.> u can cc marths dancing blade into grabs or tilts at low to mid %

 

[Aorist]

It is possible that I will turn up to this. I have a friend who lives nearby and I'll check with him.

If I do, I'll probably only be playing Brawl, definitely single, potentially double with my friend.

Er... This is where you sign up, yeah?

 

[ComboTurtle]

Auto-Cancelling is when you land during the IASA frames of an aerial you tard. gb2melee




It's not the same thing but is easily confused with certain aerials. So people do tend to refer to it as the same thing.






Eh, I do it with the button, it makes the whole sequence so much easier to input and it's hard to short hop with tap jump in the first place. Also I jump with Y. xD

you're the perfect example of a brawl ***, ugly, fat and **** at life and besides i'd still smash you at your kiddy girl game.

 

[Aorist]

Okay, turns out I'm a bit of an idiot and the first page of the thread was actually for something on January 17. Can someone link me to the information or tell me it?

Does the first page get updated?

 

[ComboTurtle]

umm there is another tourney on march 15th

 

[Aorist]

Thanks. Yeah, the thread title says.

Where is it and how much does it cost?

I'd find out myself but the **** thread is 56 pages long.

 

[ComboTurtle]

umm emu plains... 10$?

 

[Aorist]

So, the same place as the January one? The Community Centre on Lawson Street?
If so, awesome.

I'm in your debt, Turtle of Combination.

So, will the first page be updated sometime to tell me the rest of the info (specific times and stuff)?

 

[luke_atyeo]

oi, turt back off, e alert is my ranga bro

 

[I LAG]

wat is with these ranga's