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Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

Scrimblo Bimblo

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 30, 2023
Messages
741
14 something has been the usual amount of new characters since basically forever. That's going to more or less be the number regardless of how many cuts there will be.

If I was the director, I'd go the extra mile and add 18 characters. Keeping the 82 characters from Ultimate here's the first fighting game with 100 unique fighters!
 

pitchfulprocessing

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 13, 2024
Messages
321
Been playing a lot of fighters lately and got bored, so I decided to make something awesome.

View attachment 388758

What's your reaction if this suddenly happened? Disappointed by the lack of variety? Pumped to see more fighting games represented in Smash? Just happy to suddenly get 10 new characters?
I think Mai probably isn't the best choice for a KOF character, her playstyle is all about high mobility and exact spacing that makes her kind of a pseudo-zoner which I could see being difficult to handle well in Smash. Though you could just tone her down of course. I think if you were to pick a KOF character, Athena might make more sense for the reasons listed above, or Kyo or Iori for obvious reasons.

Speaking personally, I think I'd want to sub out Mai and Sub-Zero to get new series in there, I think it'd be a shame to only have one anime fighter character. I'd probably switch them with Ragna and a UNIST character, probably Orie cause she's iconic to the series and would have a really fun playstyle. Could also go with Arcueid if you're feeling a bit more out there and want a Melty Blood character. I can also see the angle with going with Ayane for the DOA character, but I do feel like Kasumi would probably be the best choice. I love Darkstalkers and I think Morrigan would be great, but she's also an understandable exclusion.

I'd definitely be content with an all fighting game pass, yeah variety is nice but I like all these characters and they'd bring a ton with them both gameplay and content wise.
 
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Gengar84

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 9, 2009
Messages
6,845
What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series. It would just be cool to see the game represented. For me, I’ll go with Bill Rizer and Lance Bean from Contra. Bill and Lance are still really cool characters but my primary reason for wanting them is that I grew up playing Contra on the NES and SNES. I really enjoyed those games as a kid and it would be great to relive that experience through Smash.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite. Some examples for me here are Vi and Shionne. Vi is just a really badass character with a great story in Arcane and I really loved Shionne’s character growth in Tales of Arise.

3) You really like the visual design or moveset potential of the character. One example for me here is Raziel from Soul Reaver. I’ve always really loved his design and he has a unique gimmick of life loss and life gain that could make for an awesome Smash character. Playing as a blue skinned vampire wraith that gains power by absorbing souls is just so unique and cool for Smash. Legacy of Kain is really cool but I was never able to get very far in the games.

4) You really like other aspects of what the character could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them. For this, I’ll go with H’aanit from Octopath Traveller. I really like H’aanit as a character but I’d be happy with almost any Octopath character. Those games have such amazing soundtracks and cool, unique visual design, I’d love to see it get some kind of content.

5) Something else that I didn’t mention above. Whether you feel the franchise is too iconic or impactful to leave off the roster or the character has a lot of fan support and you want to please as many people as possible with their inclusion.
 
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Perkilator

Smash Legend
Writing Team
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Apr 8, 2018
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11,449
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The perpetual trash fire known as Planet Earth(tm)
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SW-3204-0809-5605
What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite.

3) You really like the visual design or moveset potential of the character.

4) You really like other aspects of what the character could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them.
For me, it's a matter of whether I think the character is cool and whether their canon abilities could feasibly translate to a Smash moveset.
 

dezeray112

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 25, 2012
Messages
5,620
Location
Wales, United Kingdom
Been playing a lot of fighters lately and got bored, so I decided to make something awesome.

View attachment 388758

What's your reaction if this suddenly happened? Disappointed by the lack of variety? Pumped to see more fighting games represented in Smash? Just happy to suddenly get 10 new characters?
As someone who is very familiar with fighting games, I do like your choices.

I could definitely see Chun-Li as the most likely candidate from Street Fighter considering that she is one of the most iconic female characters within the fighting genre.

As for the others, I could perhaps see Rock Howard as a potential candidate for the SNK representation and perhaps Jin Kazama, Lili or King from Tekken.
 
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Diddy Kong

Smash Obsessed
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Dec 8, 2004
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26,386
Switch FC
SW-1597-979602774
On a similar note, any other veterans you guys want reworked for similar reasons?
So late to this but...

I'd indeed change Mario by removing FLUDD for the original Mario Tornado and make Down B either the Ground Pound or Goomba Stomp attack. Also boost recovery to Smash 64 levels. And make Fire Ball like the 64 version but fast like it currently is.

With Samus I'd make Charge Shot function much like it does in Metroid. The fully charged shot is weaker, but more spammable and charges faster. Uncharged shots are relatively more usable. Also Side B triggers Missile Mode which fires Missiles as quickly as the beam attack. Hold Side B to shoot a Super Missile, Down B is now Morph Ball and works like everyone else says it should work. I also would include the Melee Counter somewhere. Possibly U Smash or U Tilt. Screw Attack as N Air attack while freeing up Up B is also interesting, but not sure if I'd want it.

With DK, I want a size reduce except for his arms. Make him a little lighter, and faster and make him more of a heavy weight semi rushdown grappler. Keep the explosive KO power tho! Remove Headbutt for either a barrel throw or a grappling command grab attack. Make Handslap come out significantly faster and give him super armor on the move. This will make his archetype prosper. I'm also a fan of removing Headbutt and putting Spinning Kong there and make Up B grounded the barrel throw and off stage a Barrel Cannon.

With Diddy I want him to be less defensive and more offensive and semi rush down too. Buff F Air to it's Smash 4 self. Faster F Tilt, maybe F tilt with a tailslap like Mewtwo always had as a reference to DK64. Give him back his old range and better air speed. Not even fully against removing the Banana if they'd give him a sort of better option for offensive game play. As a sort of cartwheel version of Sonic's neutral B. However the Banana is staple and fine as it is.

I'd also probably wanna change both Lucina and Chrom. Give them their own moves which they share with each other, not with Marth and Roy. They can still borrow from them however.

Mewtwo I would also change up. Confusion should be changed into a ranged command grab with Psychic, which deals good damage and KO power as well as reflective properties. Something telekinesis should resemble. Disable I'd also remove for Psycho Cut or Psystrike. He can be overtuned in the Specials. Everything with the tail I'd replace with attacks that are energy based but ranged and disjointed. Think F Air and his Smash attacks, but more ranged and more disjointed. Also, more weight. Definitely 90+, ideally around 100 even. Mewtwo can afford to be more of a powerhouse character, as long as he's technically hard to play. I am also not against Mewtwo being more like his Pokken self.

Lucario I'd change around too. No more Aura mechanic. Make him more a balanced rushdown fighter. And give him his "Aura staff" thing. This could allow for way more range on attacks. Buff his attack power to be around 75% damage as he is right now. And buff his speed too. I think this character is honestly way undertuned and has potential to be way better represented and be a overall more fun character to play. Think of the Pokken version of Lucario basically.

Kirby I'd also change. Make him like the 64 version but less oppressive. More air speed, more range, better Smash attacks, Copy doing more like how it works in the Kirby games mostly. Kirby should be able to eat up non energy projectiles for example, be able to spit them back at his enemies. Up B I would simply make it to be the Warp Star cause WHY NOT!? Not the biggest Kirby expert but I do think there's way, WAY more to work with. He's a popular character after all, don't make him un fun to play.

Ness I would also change a little. U Smash and D Smash are becoming energy based attacks like Lucas. U Tilt and D Tilt are now the Yo Yo. And F Tilt is also a bat swing attack, like his attack with a battering item like Homerun Bat or Beam Sword.

Charizard I also want to make more aerial based. Better air speed and jumps for starts. That would allow for less weight cause that would boost his survivability a lot. If a solo character, down B becoming Fire Blast is a cute idea. Long ranged powerful fire attack. Boost his recovery. Make Flare Blitz more like Dragon Rush, the Custom Move of Smash 4. Or make Up B function like that, but be able to tilt the movement. I also definitely want something of an aerial Flamethrower. Also, speaking of that move, it's really bad. Either more range or devastating damage on impact or it's not worth it.
 

WeirdChillFever

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 10, 2014
Messages
6,594
Location
Somewhere Out There
What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series. It would just be cool to see the game represented. For me, I’ll go with Bill Rizer and Lance Bean from Contra. Bill and Lance are still really cool characters but my primary reason for wanting them is that I grew up playing Contra on the NES and SNES. I really enjoyed those games as a kid and it would be great to relive that experience through Smash.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite. Some examples for me here are Vi and Shionne. Vi is just a really badass character with a great story in Arcane and I really loved Shionne’s character growth in Tales of Arise.

3) You really like the visual design or moveset potential of the character. One example for me here is Raziel from Soul Reaver. I’ve always really loved his design and he has a unique gimmick of life loss and life gain that could make for an awesome Smash character. Playing as a blue skinned vampire wraith that gains power by absorbing souls is just so unique and cool for Smash. Legacy of Kain is really cool but I was never able to get very far in the games.

4) You really like other aspects of what the character could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them. For this, I’ll go with H’aanit from Octopath Traveller. I really like H’aanit as a character but I’d be happy with almost any Octopath character. Those games have such amazing soundtracks and cool, unique visual design, I’d love to see it get some kind of content.

5) Something else that I didn’t mention above. Whether you feel the franchise is too iconic or impactful to leave off the roster or the character has a lot of fan support and you want to please as many people as possible with their inclusion.
At this point the biggest factor that goes into it is “Can I be a contrarian for having this opinion while still being right?”
 

Wonder Smash

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 8, 2013
Messages
2,238
Even if the next game does have some cuts, do people think it'll still be a good follow up to Ultimate overall?

If not, then that's when I think another company needs to take advantage and make their own crossover game.
 
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RileyXY1

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 8, 2016
Messages
7,504
Even if the next game does have some cuts, do people think the next game will still be a good follow up to Ultimate overall?

If not, then that's when I think another company needs to take advantage and make their own crossover game.
It might. This is an unprecedented moment for Smash, as this might be the very first Smash game to ever have a smaller roster than its predecessor. All of the cuts will draw some backlash, but they will still enjoy the game regardless.
 

fogbadge

Smash Obsessed
Joined
Jun 29, 2012
Messages
22,822
Location
Scotland
What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series. It would just be cool to see the game represented. For me, I’ll go with Bill Rizer and Lance Bean from Contra. Bill and Lance are still really cool characters but my primary reason for wanting them is that I grew up playing Contra on the NES and SNES. I really enjoyed those games as a kid and it would be great to relive that experience through Smash.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite. Some examples for me here are Vi and Shionne. Vi is just a really badass character with a great story in Arcane and I really loved Shionne’s character growth in Tales of Arise.

3) You really like the visual design or moveset potential of the character. One example for me here is Raziel from Soul Reaver. I’ve always really loved his design and he has a unique gimmick of life loss and life gain that could make for an awesome Smash character. Playing as a blue skinned vampire wraith that gains power by absorbing souls is just so unique and cool for Smash. Legacy of Kain is really cool but I was never able to get very far in the games.

4) You really like other aspects of what the character could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them. For this, I’ll go with H’aanit from Octopath Traveller. I really like H’aanit as a character but I’d be happy with almost any Octopath character. Those games have such amazing soundtracks and cool, unique visual design, I’d love to see it get some kind of content.

5) Something else that I didn’t mention above. Whether you feel the franchise is too iconic or impactful to leave off the roster or the character has a lot of fan support and you want to please as many people as possible with their inclusion.
for me it really does just come down do i like the character. not that this is 100% there are characters i like who's inclusion i'm disappointed with and characters i have no connection with i like playing as
 

Wonder Smash

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 8, 2013
Messages
2,238
What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series. It would just be cool to see the game represented. For me, I’ll go with Bill Rizer and Lance Bean from Contra. Bill and Lance are still really cool characters but my primary reason for wanting them is that I grew up playing Contra on the NES and SNES. I really enjoyed those games as a kid and it would be great to relive that experience through Smash.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite. Some examples for me here are Vi and Shionne. Vi is just a really badass character with a great story in Arcane and I really loved Shionne’s character growth in Tales of Arise.

3) You really like the visual design or moveset potential of the character. One example for me here is Raziel from Soul Reaver. I’ve always really loved his design and he has a unique gimmick of life loss and life gain that could make for an awesome Smash character. Playing as a blue skinned vampire wraith that gains power by absorbing souls is just so unique and cool for Smash. Legacy of Kain is really cool but I was never able to get very far in the games.

4) You really like other aspects of what the character could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them. For this, I’ll go with H’aanit from Octopath Traveller. I really like H’aanit as a character but I’d be happy with almost any Octopath character. Those games have such amazing soundtracks and cool, unique visual design, I’d love to see it get some kind of content.

5) Something else that I didn’t mention above. Whether you feel the franchise is too iconic or impactful to leave off the roster or the character has a lot of fan support and you want to please as many people as possible with their inclusion.
I like the character, the series they come from, the design or moveset potential, and the soundtrack they bring. I don't really think much of the story or personality of the character since doesn't get displayed much anyway.

So I guess it's 1, 3, and 4 for me.

As for 5, I only consider that if it's either part of a series I like or part of a genre that's already featured in Smash. I have MWs that are from beat'em ups and FPSs, two genres that are not represented in the Smash roster.

But I also look at genres that I'm not a fan of and see what other series I think would make just as much sense to represent. For this, I look at RPG series like Shin Megami Tensei, Ys, and Dragon Slayer. It just feels odd to leave these series out when they were also pioneers in the genre, have a long history on Nintendo consoles, and iconic in their own ways.
 
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Louie G.

Smash Hero
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Aug 21, 2013
Messages
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Rhythm Heaven
What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?
My most wanted are Chorus Kids and Arle, with Sans and Chun-Li / Morrigan trailing somewhere close behind.

So judging my most wanted characters right now, I think I'm most driven by the desire to see my favorite series acknowledged. Rhythm Heaven and Puyo Puyo have so much unique flavor to give, and as a fan of rhythm games and puzzle games I feel like those are general points of neglect on the roster. Even though they aren't my distinct preference, I'd gladly and excitedly take something like Don-Chan and Lip if that meant we get to explore the potential of these styles of games interpreted into Smash gameplay. So the moveset potential is certainly a factor too, I think they would be plenty unique.

I've been on record saying I'll take anybody from Rhythm Heaven, so I suppose it's not so much a matter of which character connected with me the most. I think Chorus Kids have the strongest case for themselves so I chose to continue backing them. But I've also convinced myself they're the best way to represent the series, being relative blank slates and their role being distinctly musical. As well as a troupe of characters being a common trend among Rhythm Heaven minigames, allowing them to adopt that style nicely and give a great visual indication of whatever 1-2-3 rhythm is expected to execute.

Arle is essentially the main character of Puyo, so it's pretty clear cut. But I do love her as a character, how spunky she is and the way she eggs people on. Puyo has some hilarious banter between its characters and Arle's instigator personality is a standout. She also has a tendency to fail spectacularly or wander into embarrassing scenarios. I appreciate how Puyo was allowing its female protagonist to be this goofy all the way back in the 90s, it has the rhythms and character dynamics of a comedy anime. With all that in mind she's a character who has resonated with me a lot. I also especially adore her partner Carbuncle, and would be very excited to see how he's implemented in Smash.

Many similar points of judgement can apply to the other three characters I mentioned. I guess it's hard to pinpoint one specific reason why a character would be my most wanted - again, I suppose it's first and foremost because I love the series. But endearing myself to the characters, aesthetics and unique gameplay attributes of a series are exactly how it becomes a favorite. So all of that contributes to why I think they'd make great additions.
 
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MasterCheef

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 7, 2021
Messages
746
What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?
.

correct order

1) You really like the , ( move-set potential & visual design ) , of the character. One example for me here is ; ( Vault Boy ). I’ve always really loved his design and he has lots of unique weapons which would make for an impressive playable Smash zoner character.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite. For me it is Star Guardian Ahri , her taunts would be sooo much fun in addition to her play-style.

3) You really like other aspects of what the franchise could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or getting a great spirit with a unique effect or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them.

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series. Personally not interested.

5) Something else not mentioned above. Whether you feel the franchise is too iconic or impactful to leave off the roster or the character has a lot of fan support and you want to please as many people as possible with their inclusion.
 

toonito

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 10, 2017
Messages
828
Been playing a lot of fighters lately and got bored, so I decided to make something awesome.

View attachment 388758

What's your reaction if this suddenly happened? Disappointed by the lack of variety? Pumped to see more fighting games represented in Smash? Just happy to suddenly get 10 new characters?
this would be a dream pass for me lol
in terms of Smash I'd swap Mai for Morrigan
 

Pupp135

Smash Champion
Joined
Mar 30, 2020
Messages
2,288
How many newcomers do you guys think we'll get next game base? I can't imagine we ever getting over 10 newcomers base game ever again but i could be wrong.
I’m going to guess between 8-12 unique fighters and 3ish (semi-)clones, so roughly 11-15 newcomers. For SSB6, there will probably be a complicated balance between veterans and newcomers.

What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series. It would just be cool to see the game represented. For me, I’ll go with Bill Rizer and Lance Bean from Contra. Bill and Lance are still really cool characters but my primary reason for wanting them is that I grew up playing Contra on the NES and SNES. I really enjoyed those games as a kid and it would be great to relive that experience through Smash.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite. Some examples for me here are Vi and Shionne. Vi is just a really badass character with a great story in Arcane and I really loved Shionne’s character growth in Tales of Arise.

3) You really like the visual design or moveset potential of the character. One example for me here is Raziel from Soul Reaver. I’ve always really loved his design and he has a unique gimmick of life loss and life gain that could make for an awesome Smash character. Playing as a blue skinned vampire wraith that gains power by absorbing souls is just so unique and cool for Smash. Legacy of Kain is really cool but I was never able to get very far in the games.

4) You really like other aspects of what the character could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them. For this, I’ll go with H’aanit from Octopath Traveller. I really like H’aanit as a character but I’d be happy with almost any Octopath character. Those games have such amazing soundtracks and cool, unique visual design, I’d love to see it get some kind of content.

5) Something else that I didn’t mention above. Whether you feel the franchise is too iconic or impactful to leave off the roster or the character has a lot of fan support and you want to please as many people as possible with their inclusion.
It’s mostly characters that I like from their original games, characters that sound fun to play as, or characters that have fun movesets in mods/fangames.
 
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JOJONumber691

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 28, 2020
Messages
1,791
yes and he also turned a super mario land stage into a kirby's dreamland stage.
Because Mario had 5 Stages (8 counting the sub-series) in Smash 3DS, and was expanded even more in DLC. No wonder he didn’t want the stage to be based on Mario Land.
 

Arcanir

An old friend evolved
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What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series. It would just be cool to see the game represented. For me, I’ll go with Bill Rizer and Lance Bean from Contra. Bill and Lance are still really cool characters but my primary reason for wanting them is that I grew up playing Contra on the NES and SNES. I really enjoyed those games as a kid and it would be great to relive that experience through Smash.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite. Some examples for me here are Vi and Shionne. Vi is just a really badass character with a great story in Arcane and I really loved Shionne’s character growth in Tales of Arise.

3) You really like the visual design or moveset potential of the character. One example for me here is Raziel from Soul Reaver. I’ve always really loved his design and he has a unique gimmick of life loss and life gain that could make for an awesome Smash character. Playing as a blue skinned vampire wraith that gains power by absorbing souls is just so unique and cool for Smash. Legacy of Kain is really cool but I was never able to get very far in the games.

4) You really like other aspects of what the character could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them. For this, I’ll go with H’aanit from Octopath Traveller. I really like H’aanit as a character but I’d be happy with almost any Octopath character. Those games have such amazing soundtracks and cool, unique visual design, I’d love to see it get some kind of content.

5) Something else that I didn’t mention above. Whether you feel the franchise is too iconic or impactful to leave off the roster or the character has a lot of fan support and you want to please as many people as possible with their inclusion.
Overall, I'd say 2.

Looking at Ridley for instance, I wanted him because he was a character I greatly enjoyed in his franchise. He had a very cool design that crossed elements of dragons, xenomorphs, and pterosaurs, his fights generally were a highlight of the games he appeared in, and I enjoyed his personality that he shown in the manga. So when discussion started for Brawl and I saw people talking about him I immediately jumped on board, the character himself had already sold me so I didn't need much convincing to join the alliance for my favorite space dragon.

The same goes for my other previous most wanted characters like K. Rool and Diddy, and my current ones like Elma or Monster Hunter. They're characters that have appealed to me when playing their respective games and ones that I want to see in Smash since I'd like to be able to play them here. Things like Franchise representation and Moveset Potential may play a role, but overall it's the characters themselve that sell me the most on wanting them in the game.
 
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DarthEnderX

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 10, 2014
Messages
8,475
It's characters who were not in the previous game and had to be made mostly from scratch. They most likely ate into the development time of newcomers, not into that of veterans.
That doesn't make them newcomers though.

No veteran character has to truly be "made from scratch". Because even if they have to remake their model and animation, all the design work on their movset has already been done before.

And yet Tekken 8 started with 32 characters despite most fighting games these days starting with around 16 for the exact reason you said.
And only 3 of those characters were newcomers! WTF even is that example? You're disproving your own point.

The fact of the matter is, the next Smash isn’t gonna do EiH again. Sakurai has already stated as such.
Well that's just plain false.

"probably won't happen" ≠ "it's a fact it's not happening"
 
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Gorgonzales

Smash Lord
Joined
Jan 23, 2021
Messages
1,299
Location
Forgotten Isle
the number of Mario stages in ultimate rather suggests he’s not bothered
I mean they were trying to bring a lot of classic stages back, so at some level I can understand it.

But on the other hand, when you look at the Mario stages they had available to bring back...

1714841820149.png


I think I would have preferred some new stages from other franchises instead.
 

Louie G.

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
9,890
Location
Rhythm Heaven
the number of Mario stages in ultimate rather suggests he’s not bothered
This doesn’t really mean anything when most stages returned in general.

Most of the loose ends were older more redundant stage layouts, those complicated by obtrusive gimmicks - 3DS w Pac-Maze, Jungle Hinjinx not really jiving with Stage Morph, the verticality of Rumble Falls or Icicle Mountain posing a likely similar issue - or would simply have been too much of an undertaking to be worth it on their own (Orbital Gate Assault, Rainbow Road).

All that to say I don’t think using Ultimate’s stage list to judge this is very productive. Sheer quantity was the name of the game with little regard to balance. Ultimate’s maximalist, completionist philosophy is too different than its predecessors where series balance was a crucial factor.
 

ScrubReborn

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 6, 2024
Messages
236
What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?
A: Do I think their design is cool?
B: Does their moveset potential appeal to me?
C: Do I already like the character?

Only one of these is necessary though two or more are nice.

I would imagine 20 or so newcomers.

the budget and team making the next smash will be wayy larger, smash is a bigger deal than ever before
I just remembered Brawl and Smash 4 both had 18 newcomers, on two old, weaker console generations. Yeah this tracks.
 
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Ivander

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I mean they were trying to bring a lot of classic stages back, so at some level I can understand it.

But on the other hand, when you look at the Mario stages they had available to bring back...

View attachment 388791

I think I would have preferred some new stages from other franchises instead.
1714842236845.png

Cause we all know gamers can't touch grass.
 

Opossum

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What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series. It would just be cool to see the game represented. For me, I’ll go with Bill Rizer and Lance Bean from Contra. Bill and Lance are still really cool characters but my primary reason for wanting them is that I grew up playing Contra on the NES and SNES. I really enjoyed those games as a kid and it would be great to relive that experience through Smash.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite. Some examples for me here are Vi and Shionne. Vi is just a really badass character with a great story in Arcane and I really loved Shionne’s character growth in Tales of Arise.

3) You really like the visual design or moveset potential of the character. One example for me here is Raziel from Soul Reaver. I’ve always really loved his design and he has a unique gimmick of life loss and life gain that could make for an awesome Smash character. Playing as a blue skinned vampire wraith that gains power by absorbing souls is just so unique and cool for Smash. Legacy of Kain is really cool but I was never able to get very far in the games.

4) You really like other aspects of what the character could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them. For this, I’ll go with H’aanit from Octopath Traveller. I really like H’aanit as a character but I’d be happy with almost any Octopath character. Those games have such amazing soundtracks and cool, unique visual design, I’d love to see it get some kind of content.

5) Something else that I didn’t mention above. Whether you feel the franchise is too iconic or impactful to leave off the roster or the character has a lot of fan support and you want to please as many people as possible with their inclusion.
Mostly 2 for me, with a rare instance of 1 here and there (for example, Sans isn't my favorite from Undertale, but I do really like him, and I think if anyone were to get in it'd be him, not Papyrus or Mettaton).

For the most part, who the character is is my prime motive for supporting their inclusion.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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Just out of curiocity, I took a look back at the Mario stage locations. Bold is grass levels, Italics are somewhat grass levels.
  1. Peach's Castle (Super Mario 64) x2
  2. Ground Level (Super Mario Bros.) x2
  3. Rainbow Ride (Super Mario 64)
  4. Ground Level (Super Mario World)
    1. Considered to be a Yoshi stage but...c'mon.
  5. Ground Level (Super Mario Bros. 2)
  6. Isle Delfino (Super Mario Sunshine)
  7. Figure 8 Circuit (Mario Kart...DS?)
  8. Luigi's Mansion (Luigi's Mansion)
  9. Various level themes (3D Land)
  10. Ground level (New Super Mario Bros. 2)
  11. Various level themes (Paper Mario series)
  12. Various level themes (New Super Mario Bros...Wii? U? Both?)
  13. Gateway Galaxy (Super Mario Galaxy)
  14. Mario Circuit (Mario Kart 8)
  15. Ground Theme (Super Mario Maker)
  16. New Donk City (Super Mario Odyssey)
If we go by all the levels that use grassland aesthetics at all, we've got 8/18 stages using it, which is less than half. Granted, that is still 8, and I think people also find they blend in from grass stages of other series (Dream Land, Yoshi's Story, Green Greens, Yoshi's Island, Hanenbow, Green Hill Zone, Dream Land GB, Gaur Plain, Duck Hunt, Wuhu Island, and Windy Hill Zone could all be argued to have that aesthetic, though some fit more than others), which brings the number of grassy stages up by quite a lot.

So I guess my question is, is it the number of stages itself that's the issue, or is it more of a perceived opportunity cost, like with New Super Mario Bros. Wii/U's stage being a mashup of the games' generic themes instead of picking one of its more unique ideas?

EDIT: I just realized...the stage is called Mushroom Kingdom U. I was even looking at a list for this. What part of U, did I not understand? sigh
 
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Noipoi

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What does everyone prioritize when choosing a most wanted character for Smash?

1) You really like the game or series the character comes from even if the character themselves isn’t your absolute favorite from that series. It would just be cool to see the game represented. For me, I’ll go with Bill Rizer and Lance Bean from Contra. Bill and Lance are still really cool characters but my primary reason for wanting them is that I grew up playing Contra on the NES and SNES. I really enjoyed those games as a kid and it would be great to relive that experience through Smash.

2) You really like the personality or story of a particular character. Basically, you just really connected with the character themselves in some way even if the game they came from isn’t your absolute favorite. Some examples for me here are Vi and Shionne. Vi is just a really badass character with a great story in Arcane and I really loved Shionne’s character growth in Tales of Arise.

3) You really like the visual design or moveset potential of the character. One example for me here is Raziel from Soul Reaver. I’ve always really loved his design and he has a unique gimmick of life loss and life gain that could make for an awesome Smash character. Playing as a blue skinned vampire wraith that gains power by absorbing souls is just so unique and cool for Smash. Legacy of Kain is really cool but I was never able to get very far in the games.

4) You really like other aspects of what the character could bring to Smash. Whether you love the soundtrack from their game, think that the game has a perfect setting for a stage, or something else. Getting a character would be the easiest way to get many of these along with them. For this, I’ll go with H’aanit from Octopath Traveller. I really like H’aanit as a character but I’d be happy with almost any Octopath character. Those games have such amazing soundtracks and cool, unique visual design, I’d love to see it get some kind of content.

5) Something else that I didn’t mention above. Whether you feel the franchise is too iconic or impactful to leave off the roster or the character has a lot of fan support and you want to please as many people as possible with their inclusion.
My reasoning is as follows: I think they’re a funny little guy and I wanna see ‘em in the game.
 

ninjahmos

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RE: Bandana Waddle Dee

I'd definitely love to see Bandana Dee in Smash and I agree that his moveset could be based on Kirby Star Allies and Kirby Fighters (and older games, of course). I'm kind of hoping they add in some more music from Kirby Super Star and Super Star Ultra.
 
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