Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[JOJONumber691]

I'm more pulling for Dixie Kong, Medusa and Black Shadow myself, but yeah, Octoling would be great also.
But I have a question: How do you think they'd make the ink mechanic work to avoid it clashing with Inklings? For instance, there's already an alt that uses the same shade of pink for their ink that the Octolings typically use, so if the Pink Inking (the Pinkling, if you will) and the Octoling fire ink, how will you be able to tell which is which?

Dixie Kong wouldn't work. Like, at all. The Hair causes too many proportional problems that she has to be a Semi-Clone at the very least. Though Rock Howard, and Medusa would be perfect. Now, Cross-Series Echoes (Paper Mario over Ice Climbers)

This is something i have to agree on, not just Steve, but a lot of recent post-Brawl newcomers. I think Smash Ultimate REALLY overcomplicates the moveset, this trend started with 4's newcomers like Mac's KO Meter, Luma, and so on. Ultimate's base newcomers thankfully don't follow that trend, but the DLC..............god it's one of the main reasons why Banjo is the only one i play with regulary.

Joker's rebellion gauge is a *****, Ryu and Ken's entire "Press this button in this sensitive manner to deliver this amount of damage" ruined any interest i had on them, plus while i can do quarter circle punches and the like, doing them in Smash is not as intuitive as doing it in a 1 to 1 fighting game (try bringing Smash mechanics into a 1-to-1 fighter and see how fun that is) Terry is fun when i stop trying to play as him as a fighting game character and instead as a normal Smash character, but the point still stands. Then there's Min-Min's A and B buttons.

Then there's Hero, who somehow manages to be really dull and really complex. His Smash Attacks are run of the mill, and instead of having Magic to complent those simplistic attacks via Smash Attacks, all of them are tied to the special moves and have MP onto them because apparently you can't have a magic user without Magic Meters if Robin taught me anything (yet Mega Man doesn't have to worry about Weapon Ammo) If im honest SSF2's Black Mage is the best magic user in Smash so far, and that game has Naruto on it. Don't even get me started on the RNG.

To me the best "unorthodox" characters are those who use their mechanics not tagged onto the moveset, but use their unique movest as part of the basic moveset. Mega Man is unorthodox sure, and you can definetly pretend you are playing an actual Mega Man game due to his Jab, tilt and NA being the Mega Buster, but he doesn't have to worry about Weapon Armory for his Specials or any attack that is not his Mega Buster. Simon uses his whip flailing and can latch his whip onto legdes like SCIV, but he doesn't have to worry about upgrading his whip from leather to chainwhip, nor about Heart Ammo for his specials. (much to the dismay of certain people) they are themselves, they fight as they would fight in their games. They translate the character and their abilities, not their game's actual mechanics.

Don't get me wrong, i love Smash Movesets using ACTUAL moves and powers from the character's source material. I would LOVE Wario to be like his Smash 2 Mod incarnation, with the Shoulder Bash as a Side Special, his Ground Pound for his Down Special, turning flat for his down tilt like his "Flat" transfomration, or his Dash Attack where he literally gets Drunk, using actual Wario Land references instead of "haha he farts because the instruction manual of the japanese version of Wario's game states he is gross LMAO" (i know Smash 2 still has Wario Waft BTW). But i DO NOT want the bring the actual Transformation Mechanic from the Wario Land series, i don't want Wario to get fat(ter) when he eats food, i don't want Wario to get on Fire when he gets hit with a Fire Attack like a Fireball, etc.

I hope FP2 gets a "Banjo", someone who is simplistic and only relies on their moves from their source material without extra **** tagged on top. Maybe someone like Crash or Lloyd Irving would satisfy me.

Hopefully you get your wish I guess.

All of the good echos of Steve are alts, and I don't know who would echo Byleth. I can also see Ninten as a Lucas echo.

Anarchy Steve with Hacks, Armor, and End Crystals. Death Knight with Scythe Animations over the Sword of the Creator Stuff.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Dixie Kong wouldn't work. Like, at all. The Hair causes too many proportional problems that she has to be a Semi-Clone at the very least. Though Rock Howard, and Medusa would be perfect. Now, Cross-Series Echoes (Paper Mario over Ice Climbers)

Do people forget about?

He's still an Echo despite having some different moves from Roy.

 

[JOJONumber691]

Do people forget about?

He's still an Echo despite having some different moves from Roy.

This is a skelatal Issue. Since the Hair causes MANY problems that one Move Change can't fix.

 

[Eldrake]

Oh **** forgot that. Maybe honestly? There's not as many damage types in Smash as there are in Half-Life (no characters who deal nuclear damage unless I'm missing something here) although there'd still be quite a bit for it to talk about. They might need to approach the suit's voice actress (Kathy Levin) again though, she's not voiced anything since Half Life 2 Episode Two it seems.

It'd be so cool if they got Kathy Levin to return to voice HEV suit lines just for Smash. Just imagine the suit warning Gordon that Inkling's ink is rapidly eroding the suit's armor and defensive systems.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Im a few pages back, but since we're talking about MK- or were...

Scorpion/ Sub Zero;

STYLE: Incapacitate and annihilate. Majority of the Ninja’s special movesets are not to deal direct damage, but are to put the Ninja’s in priority during various states of incoming attacks. Each of the specials does minimal damage, but is special for offering a counter in different situations, to put the ninja’s into advantage to string combos.

As with other fighting game characters, they will always be aimed at the opponent. They will also have separate front and back specials, as well as an enhanced version of standard special if they perform the input made classic from the game.
I believe these work as echoes because essentially, the moves balance overall in having similar effects, achieved differently. For example, Scorpions standard special functions a lot like Sub Zero’s Front Special. Their back specials achieve similar effects of countering.

Standard Special:

• Scorpion; GET OVER HERE!
• Sub-Zero; Ice Freeze- sends straight, but can aim in any direction.

Front Special:

• Scorpion: Scorpion Shoots fire. Can be aimed into any direction
• Sub-Zero: Create a large puddle of ice right in front of you, that makes anyone who runs onto it slide happlessly into you.

Down Special:

• Scorpion- Teleport; if Hit, Scorpion teleports directly behind the opponent who hit him and attacks back.
• Sub-Zero; Ice Clone. If Hit, Sub Zero jumps backwards and leaves a clone of himself in ice. It removes damage of the attack and freezes the opponent in it’s place.

Up Special: Honestly, I don't know. Whatever is Ninja and balances the moveset. And to be fun, include their swords just because Sakurai is a troll.

Back Special:

• Scorpion: Launches Flames into the Z axis that locks onto a nearby opponent and burns them into a temporary stun.
• Sub-Zero: Ice Shaker: Sub Zero emmys frost into the z axis that locks onto a nearby opponent and freezes them.

FINAL SMASH: FATALITY: Each Ninja gets two versions.
ONE (1) is triggered by larger proximity, and hits multiple opponents. THE OTHER (2) is triggered by closer proximity and hits one opponent more severely.

1- Friendship (Scorpion)
1- Friendship (Sub-Zero)
2- Hell Flare (Scorpion) rips off his mask and incinerates an opponent in front of him. Auto kill.
2- Fatal Flurry (Sub-Zero) freezes the opponent and smashes them into pieces. The opponent vanishes, instant K.O.

Other:

• Up Smash would have to be Uppercut.
• Taunt: One for each is ‘Toasty’
• The MK stage would offer a special Final Smash to the entire roster, triggered by the same button combination. It would be some kind of stage based fatality, such as punching the character into a pool of acid or a spike.

 

[osby]

It'd be so cool if they got Kathy Levin to return to voice HEV suit lines just for Smash. Just imagine the suit warning Gordon that Inkling's ink is rapidly eroding the suit's armor and defensive systems.

So Isabelle or Pichu can take buckets of ink to their faces and shrug it off while an advanced sci-fi suit can't take it?

Weak.

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

New PapaGenos video.

 

[SKX31]

Dixie Kong wouldn't work. Like, at all. The Hair causes too many proportional problems that she has to be a Semi-Clone at the very least. Though Rock Howard, and Medusa would be perfect. Now, Cross-Series Echoes (Paper Mario over Ice Climbers)

Honestly I could see Dixie working as a Diddy Echo(esque) character because the skeleton wouldn't be that changed...

But I'd rather have Dixie as her own character because it'd feel a bit like a wasted opportunity otherwise. I kinda feel the same way about at this point - he's been a veteran for three games now, and there's been a couple opportunities to introduce an item or two from WW / ST / PH to help differentiate him from the other Links. It's not a total dealbreaker, but it feels a little jarring when got the Phantom as her Down B in the interim.

So Isabelle or Pichu can take buckets of ink to their faces and shrug it off while an advanced sci-fi suit can't take it?

Weak.

The advanced sci-fi suit wasn't originally built for cartoony slap stick, TBF.

Also, well, found something kinda-sorta, uhm, I dunno how to describe this:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Spoiler

I'm still having trouble comprehending the thought process behind a Minecraft esports tournament using Devil Trigger as music.

FTR, NetEase (the ones hosting the tournament) is Minecraft's Chinese distributor, about as big as Spotify and it's also the same company that offers tools to circumvent blocks and bans in China.

It's weird.

 

[Perkilator]

I’m sorry, WHAT’S the voice theory?

 

[andree123]

I’m sorry, WHAT’S the voice theory?

It is like box theory but it is for the voice clip section in the sound test menu.

Basically, there are currently 5 empty voiced slots in the voice clip section as of 9.0.0, add in the remaining 4 from the fighters pass 2 to replace the empty voice slots and it leaves us 1 empty voice slot, this means that one of the fighters in the fighters pass 2 will have a alt that gives it a different voice (older/younger, different character, and opposite gender).

 

[Guynamednelson]

In regard to voices, how will they handle crowd cheers for a character with different names in different regions? Both FP2 characters use the same cheers worldwide as opposed to having them localized for the base game and FP1, and you can hear "Stivu!" and "Arexu!" when those respective characters are able to get the crowd cheering.

 

[pupNapoleon]

It is like box theory but it is for the voice clip section in the sound test menu.

Basically, there are currently 5 empty voiced slots in the voice clip section as of 9.0.0, add in the remaining 4 from the fighters pass 2 to replace the empty voice slots and it leaves us 1 empty voice slot, this means that one of the fighters in the fighters pass 2 will have a alt that gives it a different voice (older/younger, different character, and opposite gender).

Our speculation scene is nonsense.

I remember when someone tried to tell me that the number of characters in Smash 4 was given away.... when they eventually came to the right number of slots after updating it three times.

We might as well get into tea leaf theory.
Well--- that actually makes more sense to me.

 

[StarBot]

Eh, what's this? A new theory huh? Mind explaining?

SmashBoards has OCD, so they believe a extra space = a certain thing is definitely happening and totally couldn't be remove or changed more in the future

 

[The Prankster 16]

Our speculation scene is nonsense.

I remember when someone tried to tell me that the number of characters in Smash 4 was given away.... when they eventually came to the right number of slots after updating it three times.

We might as well get into tea leaf theory.
Well--- that actually makes more sense to me.

Well this speculation is based on actual data in the game, so it's not farfetched to use these slots to speculate.

 

[osby]

SmashBoards has OCD, so they believe a extra space = a certain thing is definitely happening and totally couldn't be remove or changed more in the future

Nobody is saying that it's 100% true.

It's just something to keep in mind, considering it did turn out to be correct for Fighter Pass 1. Unlike most "theories" we regularly discuss, this one has supporting evidence, precedent, and a plausible outcome.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

New PapaGenos video.

I may not like this person much but at least he has the common sense to know that Square Enix will be part of the negotiations for Sora in the end considering Disney would have to ask nomura for permission to use Sora. I wish people would remember that before going on their Tangent and about how he isn't going to be in Smash because of Disney

 

[MooMew64]

I mean...

If there's actual data backing this one here up, then it definitely seems like something worth keeping in mind. Honestly, I was about ready to brush it off until osby posted that this lined up with what happened with FP1, so this is officially on my radar now.

Does it mean 100% one of the characters in here is going to have an alt that requires a separate voice? No, but it's fascinating speculation and theory crafting that has the rare trait of having actual evidence, precedent, and data to back it up. Just because a lot of fan theories tend to reach doesn't mean all of them do.

 

[SKX31]

In regard to voices, how will they handle crowd cheers for a character with different names in different regions? Both FP2 characters use the same cheers worldwide as opposed to having them localized for the base game and FP1, and you can hear "Stivu!" and "Arexu!" when those respective characters are able to get the crowd cheering.

Looks at the SSBWiki Crowd page

Huh, that's weird. Maybe it's the pandemic and lockdown preventing the usual voice recording sessions for at least one of the crowds, and Sakurai's team / Nintendo not having the workaround infrastructure or the confidence that someone in those crowds won't leak?

FTR, the crowds are:

• English
• Japanese / Chinese (the two share, huh. Then again, the Chinese name for Smash Bros. borrow directly from the Japanese, so perhaps not surprising.)
• Italian
• Dutch
• French (Some characters have separate Quebecois / French cheers, most have just one. Villager has four different French chants, two for each gender.)
• German
• Spanish (Some characters have separate LatAm / European Spanish cheers, others have just one crowd cheer.)
• Russian
• Korean

So we're looking at 9+ different non-Japanese crowds recording stuff (at least pre-Min Min). Leaning towards the pandemic being a reason why there's only one cheer, although not 100 % sure of course.

EDIT: I'm not sure I can answer the question, but if they used "Stivu" chanches are they're going to go with the Japanese / Chinese option.

 

[JOJONumber691]

It is like box theory but it is for the voice clip section in the sound test menu.

Basically, there are currently 5 empty voiced slots in the voice clip section as of 9.0.0, add in the remaining 4 from the fighters pass 2 to replace the empty voice slots and it leaves us 1 empty voice slot, this means that one of the fighters in the fighters pass 2 will have a alt that gives it a different voice (older/younger, different character, and opposite gender).

Or an Echo Fighter in some cases.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Well this speculation is based on actual data in the game, so it's not farfetched to use these slots to speculate.

So was the data that provided character slots.

Ultimately, we can find a lot of data. Whether or not it actually indicates anything can singularly be seen in the future.
If they want more slots, they will add more. This was why I referenced the example in my above comment that you quoted. It's identical.

 

[osby]

I mean...

If there's actual data backing this one here up, then it definitely seems like something worth keeping in mind. Honestly, I was about ready to brush it off until osby posted that this lined up with what happened with FP1, so this is officially on my radar now.

Does it mean 100% one of the characters in here is going to have an alt that requires a separate voice? No, but it's fascinating speculation and theory crafting that has the rare trait of having actual evidence, precedent, and data to back it up. Just because a lot of fan theories tend to reach doesn't mean all of them do.

Also, let's not forget that DLC characters getting alts isn't anything new or uncommon.

In Smash 4, we got ,(different voice lines) and .

Ultimate gave us , (different voice lines) in the first pass and now we got Steve/Alex/Zombie/Enderman.

If anything, this theory is perfectly in line with what we're discussing. One of the four remaining fighters can have model swaps with their own voices, be it Dante, Monster Hunter or whoever.

Doesn't mean it's true but it seems like a fairly likely scenario even without a theory backing it up.

 

[cashregister9]

I remember all the times Nintendo has made their menu's perfect rectangles...

there is no harm in keeping track of it. but like this theory says nothing tbh

 

[Deleted member]

The most interesting part about this is there'd only be one character with multiple voice slots, assuming we don't get another Steve situation. Big blow to a lot of character's chances if true.

 

[pupNapoleon]

The most interesting part about this is there'd only be one character with multiple voice slots, assuming we don't get another Steve situation. Big blow to a lot of character's chances if true.

Or we could have three mute characters and one with all the alts. Or any combination in between. Or they could just add more slots, particularly if it's not an equal number of alts and only one alt requires a v.o.

I don't understand what there is to speculate upon, here.

 

[chocolatejr9]

I remember all the times Nintendo has made their menu's perfect rectangles...

I would keep an eye on that theory though there is no harm in keeping track of it.

I mean, stacking rectangles on top of each other is pretty fun, if you ask me.

 

[PeridotGX]

All of the good echos of Steve are alts, and I don't know who would echo Byleth. I can also see Ninten as a Lucas echo.

Steve's echo fighter will be the infamous griefer Popbob, from the oldest anarchy server in Minecraft, 2b2t.

 

[MarioRaccoon]

What kind of characters can we get that would be mute ? I think any human or animal based characters would get a voice.

 

[Aerospherology]

Steve's echo fighter will be the infamous griefer Popbob, from the oldest anarchy server in Minecraft, 2b2t.

Hack client version of Steve. You just move by the opponent and they die.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Something I'd like to confess-

As much as I rag on Fire Emblem being the favorite child, I actually really enjoy playing Corrin (female only... gosh that male hair makes me want to punch the wall).

 

[JOJONumber691]

Hack client version of Steve. You just move by the opponent and they die.

Nah. They have End Crystals that they get to spam. And yes, they lag the game.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

So wait... Is this theory founded on in game data evidence or for the apparent need of perfect symmetrical squares?

If it's the latter, I'm kinda doubtful on any validity tbqh. They had this layout since when the game launched in 2018. I doubt when selecting characters and alts, they went into the mindset of lining up with the voice test mode of all things. It being perfectly squared with pass 1 feels like luck to me.

Fun to humor though.

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

So wait... Is this theory founded on in game data evidence or for the apparent need of perfect symmetrical squares?

If it's the latter, I'm kinda doubtful on any validity tbqh. They had this layout since when the game launched in 2018. I doubt when selecting characters and alts, they went into the mindset of lining up with the voice test mode of all things. It being perfectly squared with pass 1 feels like luck to me.

Fun to humor though.

It's based on in game data evidence, it was already true for FP1.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Something I'd like to confess-

As much as I rag on Fire Emblem being the favorite child, I actually really enjoy playing Corrin (female only... gosh that male hair makes me want to punch the wall).

Peoples hate toword male corrin just because of hair confuses me considering both corrins are useless dumb peices of flesh

 

[3BitSaurus]

Also, well, found something kinda-sorta, uhm, I dunno how to describe this:

Spoiler

I'm still having trouble comprehending the thought process behind a Minecraft esports tournament using Devil Trigger as music.

FTR, NetEase (the ones hosting the tournament) is Minecraft's Chinese distributor, about as big as Spotify and it's also the same company that offers tools to circumvent blocks and bans in China.

It's weird.

Oh, I can definitely imagine weirder advertisement than that.

Behold, the japanese League of Legends commercial.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Peoole hate tword male corrun just because of hair confuses me considering both corrins are useless dumb peices of flesh

I cannot explain it in any way other than that his hair gives him the face of someone I want to punch. It's just a gut reaction. It makes me angry to look at.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

I cannot explain it in any way other than that his hair gives him the face of someone I want to punch. It's just a gut reaction. It makes me angry to look at.

thats a bit extream but you do you

 

[pupNapoleon]

Also... can someone maybe tell me how to exit from a rewatch of a fight?
The prompt is that to quit, hit "L + R + A + (+)"
I cannot hit it with my human hands without feeling like I'm playing a scale on the piano.
"There's got to be a better way!"

 

[DarthEnderX]

This is a skelatal Issue. Since the Hair causes MANY problems that one Move Change can't fix.

Joke's on you, Dixie was always planned as a Diddy Alt, which is why Diddy already has the necessary hair skeleton. He simply doesn't use it.

 

[SKX31]

Oh, I can definitely imagine weirder advertisement than that.

Behold, the japanese League of Legends commercial.

It wasn't an ad I linked to: again, it was choice of music in a Minecraft tournament - I'll reiterate, Devil Trigger does not fit a competitive Minecraft stream. And IIRC DMC V has not seen an official Chinese release which makes the music choice even weirder. Even if NetEase offers what's practically VPNs officially and the Chinese government tolerates that.

That said, uuuuuhm... that ad is certainly an ad.

What kind of characters can we get that would be mute ? I think any human or animal based characters would get a voice.

Hmm.... Chrono (and Serge) are IIRC silent. Chell is another possibility, although there might be another HEV suit situation here if GLaDOS does the talking. If Sakurai / Nintendo wanted to go for some really unexpected characters, there's the Sims or even Myst as possibilities.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Joke's on you, Dixie was always planned as a Diddy Alt, which is why Diddy already has the necessary hair skeleton. He simply doesn't use it.

It's sad to think Dixie... actually was planned. And had Brawl just gone slightly differently, we could have had both of them... and then each of them as individuals in Smash 4-- or if Dixie were just cut, she at least would have come back.

So much our current timeline offers, it still really seems odd without Dixie. I know it's said, but... damn, gurl.