Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Sari]

Do you guys see PapaGenos' video regarding Fawful?

Looks at thumbnail

"Oh no, please don't tell me he's gonna try to connect Fawful to Bowser's Fury just because of the 'Fury' in the title."

Watches video because I have nothing else to do

"God damnit"

 

[Deleted member]

Looks at thumbnail

"Oh no, please don't tell me he's gonna try to connect Fawful to Bowser's Fury just because of the 'Fury' in the title."

Watches video because I have nothing else to do

"God damnit"

Okay.

I don't think Fawful will be involved. I have never seen Fawful appear in any Mario games that isn't Mario & Luigi, please correct me if I am wrong. Either way, you don't really see Nintendo mention Fawful much when not referring to Mario and Luigi.

I think it is just going to be some tough levels and maybe a Bowser boss, that is my speculation. It seems very unlikely they will pull Fawful suddenly and put him in Bowser's Fury for Super Mario 3D World.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Forget MH, add the Palicos

 

[7NATOR]

I don’t really care for monster hunter. They’re a SUPER predictable pick.

Honestly at this Point, I would say Dante is a more Predictable pick than Monster Hunter. not that's it's a bad thing, Because Dante is Cool, but He's been predicted soo much, and is also Completely missing from Smash unlike Monster Hunter

 

[chocolatejr9]

Okay.

I don't think Fawful will be involved. I have never seen Fawful appear in any Mario games that isn't Mario & Luigi, please correct me if I am wrong. Either way, you don't really see Nintendo mention Fawful much when not referring to Mario and Luigi.

I think it is just going to be some tough levels and maybe a Bowser boss, that is my speculation. It seems very unlikely they will pull Fawful suddenly and put him in Bowser's Fury for Super Mario 3D World.

Actually, didn't Emily Rogers call this the most ambitious Wii U port to date? I don't know what that means, but I feel like it would be a little more than that. This has nothing to do with Fawful, of course, but I felt I should point that out.

By the way, does Rogersbase know any insiders? Apparently, he recently said something about a SMRPG remake/sequal, and now you-know-who are getting a bit restless, even bringing back Cacomallow again.

Also, I apologise in advance for starting ANOTHER Geno discussion. We really do talk about the same characters all the time...

 

[Deleted member]

Honestly at this Point, I would say Dante is a more Predictable pick than Monster Hunter. not that's it's a bad thing, Because Dante is Cool, but He's been predicted soo much, and is also Completely missing from Smash unlike Monster Hunter

I don't like this argument. It just feels like, "This series deserves it more than this series!". Both Devil May Cry and Monster Hunter have a lot of things going for them.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

I like to hypothesise Crash's trailer. At the end, he beats up Mario who is on his last legs, Sonic comes in to join Crash's side but as they're about to finish Mario off, Banjo & Kazooie wonderwing into them to Mario's aid, Crash and Sonic taking the brunt force but are still up for a fight, then the final shot is Mario and Banjo & Kazooie vs Sonic and Crash, all about to clash with Pac-Man and Megaman in the background to signify all of the company mascots.

It'll never happen but it'd be pretty cool.

If Crash Bandicoot (Hopefully) makes it into Smash then without a doubt everyone can agree that his debut trailer has gotta revolve around Mario and Sonic, I can see other mascots or platformer icons join in like Donkey Kong and Banjo-Kazooie, But obviously Mario and Sonic have to be front and center of the pack.

Just like how everyone wanted Banjo-Kazooie's trailer to feature Rareware characters (Donkey Kong, Diddy Kong and King K. Kool).

Crash's should be about the late 90's rivalry regarding Nintendo vs Sega vs Sony on how it's a thing of the past, But they can still have a friendly competition under one roof that is Super Smash Bros Ultimate.

 

[7NATOR]

I don't like this argument. It just feels like, "This series deserves it more than this series!". Both Devil May Cry and Monster Hunter have a lot of things going for them.

What arguement are you talking about though? I was just saying Dante is more predictable pick at this point then Monster Hunter... that's not anything against Dante, or for Hunter or anything. I just see Dante being predicted more often than Monster Hunter

 

[Cosmic77]

Actually, On Gen 8 Pokemon...

If a Gen 8 Pokemon's inclusion follows the same logic of Byleth, A Gen 8 Pokemon would actually have to be either FP7 or FP8 (pretty much a character revealed this year). I mean i don't know exactly what people are thinking on what FP the hypotheical Pokemon would be, but I feel like people were expecting it to be the last fighter the most, mostly since it follows the creteria of final reveals

However, The 2nd Expansion DLC for Sword and Shield is releasing late this year, and with no further indication of more DLC, that may be as far as it goes. Byleth was chosen cause Nintendo wanted a character from a game "people would be Playing now". I would assume Gen 8 Pokemon, if they were chosen, would follow that same Criteria, as I don't know what else they'd be chosen, unless they were chosen for Casual Appeal. Even then, if that's the reason, they still would have to be revealed as FP7 or FP8, closer to the beginning of the Pass than the end

So i guess if we go FP7 and FP8 (maybe FP9) wihtout Pokemon, I think you could say it's likely chance of no Pokemon happening

It's hard to say exactly why Byleth was last though. Honesty, if they really wanted to, they could've bumped him up to F2 and released him within days of 3H. Since they didn't, I'm guessing Sakurai may have requested that Byleth be the last character he worked on for the first pass so he'd have a few months after the game launched to polish everything as best he could.

With a Gen 8 Pokemon (and any character really), it mostly depends on what works best for Sakurai. Nintendo might push for certain characters to come out at a certain time, but if they aren't in any rush, I could see them allowing Sakurai to work on a character later if that's what he'd prefer.

 

[Schnee117]

The content Monster Hunter already has is substantial when held to the standard of being a franchise currently without a fighter.

Most just get a few songs and some spirits.
Very few also get assist trophies.
Even fewer have a stage.
Monster Hunter has two music tracks, a spirit and an assist trophy that doubles up as a more intricate boss fight with its own arena.

It can certainly get a lot more, and it ought to, but it's in a pretty nice position already.

 

[Lamperouge]

I don’t really care for monster hunter. They’re a SUPER predictable pick.

...How? Most people seem to be predicting either Dante or Phoenix Wright if we get another Capcom character.

 

[Shroob]

Actually, didn't Emily Rogers call this the most ambitious Wii U port to date? I don't know what that means, but I feel like it would be a little more than that. This has nothing to do with Fawful, of course, but I felt I should point that out.

By the way, does Rogersbase know any insiders? Apparently, he recently said something about a SMRPG remake/sequal, and now you-know-who are getting a bit restless, even bringing back Cacomallow again.

Also, I apologise in advance for starting ANOTHER Geno discussion. We really do talk about the same characters all the time...

No offense to the fanbase, but they never let Cacomallow die in the first place.

 

[Deleted member]

The content Monster Hunter already has is substantial when held to the standard of being a franchise currently without a fighter.

Most just get a few songs and some spirits.
Very few also get assist trophies.
Even fewer have a stage.
Monster Hunter has two music tracks, a spirit and an assist trophy that doubles up as a more intricate boss fight with its own arena.

It can certainly get a lot more, and it ought to, but it's in a pretty nice position already.

True. I think it has so much content in Smash, it is kind of difficult for me to see Monster Hunter being in, but I am not saying it is impossible.

Either way, Monster Hunter is very succesful in Japan. It is one of the top selling PS4 games in Japan. It is close to Resident Evil in terms of sales. Resident Evil even got its own spirit event.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Whatchu mean, we already have Monster Hunter.

If everyone had a nickel every time this was said, we'd all be drowning in nickles.

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

Nintendo Direct Speculation |OT13-2| lighting strikes twice OT

So we now have "leaks" behind paywall, "great"...

www.resetera.com

this guy's claiming general direct on the 9th. is it just speculation or does he have info?

Speculation. EASILY speculation.

 

[Deleted member]

If everyone had a nickel every time this was said, we'd all be drowning in nickles.

Jones wasn't joking when he made that post?

Ugh, I legit cannot tell what is a joke and what isn't a joke anymore. O_O

Anyways, how is Byleth Monster Hunter?

I know many games that have more unique and interesting weapons than Three Houses.

For example, I can name a hundred interesting weapons in Terraria, and I am not making a joke when I say a hundred.

Three Houses has cool weapons, yes, but I don't see how Byleth makes Monster Hunter irrelevant.

 

[Lamperouge]

Jones wasn't joking when he made that post?

I'm fairly certain that he was.

SMAASH! Puppy brought that up because some people actually do believe that the two are incredibly similar and that Byleth's inclusion would make MonHun redundant.

 

[PeridotGX]

Nintendo Direct Speculation |OT13-2| lighting strikes twice OT

So we now have "leaks" behind paywall, "great"...

www.resetera.com

this guy's claiming general direct on the 9th. is it just speculation or does he have info?

I don't plan on leaving or anything, but I do agree that speculation has changed, and not for the best. Most of what we do is either talking about when we'll get news, or listening to leakers (both, more often than not).

case in point. I think people are genuinely more interested in calendar speculation than character speculation...

 

[Deleted member]

I'm fairly certain that he was.

Oh, which is it?

I am never able to tell jokes at all, I don't know what this is called.

 

[Shroob]

case in point. I think people are genuinely more interested in calendar speculation than character speculation...

I mean, yeah.

Because let's not kid ourselves, this community loves to toss around the same handful of picks, and anyone outside of that window is deemed not likely, so when you play with the same toys for long enough, you're going to get bored.


I'd love to discuss more off the wall picks, but the discussion always gets shot down as them being "Unlikely", and then discussion goes back to Sora/Geno/insert current flavor of the minute character here.


....also, let's not kid ourselves. Min Min came out 3 months ago, but it feels a lot, LOT longer due to the guessing game in March. I think we're all just... starved for news right now, especially since the future seems soo damn shaky with the unpredictable schedule and releases that Nintendo has been doing as of late.

 

[Dark Bagel]

If everyone had a nickel every time this was said, we'd all be drowning in nickles.

If I had a nickel for every time this was said, I'd be rich enough to buy full copyright ownership of Nickelback songs, travel back in time to meet Nicodemus, and create a dark, gritty Drake and Josh spinoff based solely off of Josh Nichols from Nickelodeon, featuring Nico Yazawa as a special guest-star.

 

[Deleted member]

If everyone had a nickel every time this was said, we'd all be drowning in nickles.

We would all have more nickel than the number of nickel in the Earth's inner core.

 

[SharkLord]

Lately, I've noticed that Sakura Shinguji might actually have a pretty decent shot if we're going for a Japan-appeal character. TPC raised some pretty good points in his send-off writeup, so I'll bring that up as a reminder.

Spoiler: Sakura Shinguji

View attachment 284540


Sakura got discussion here for like, one week, and then never got talked about again really. Besides that one period and discussion on some surprisingly convincing fake "leaks" Sakura sees little to no discussion, which is rather odd considering how popular the Sakura Wars series is. I suppose it makes sense given that most of the series' popularity stems from Japan, and it's only just now seeing a large push into the West, but regardless Sakura is another one of the likeliest characters that nobody talks about.

Before the release of the 2019 reboot, the series had sold 3.8 million units, and has since sold upwards of 4 million units as of December 2019. This does not factor in continued sales of the reboot as well as sales of the reboot in America, so the series has surely surpassed that number by now. (This figure exists that says the series has sold a lifetime 4.5 million units, but this seems to be in the context of the original series so this may not be an accurate indicator of the series' lifetime sales, especially when compared to official Sega reports.) Prior to the series falling dormant in 2010, Sakura Wars was one of the largest gaming series in Japan, period. Three of the first four games in the series placed among the best selling Sega Saturn and Dreamcast games of all time, and the fourth, the first Sakura Wars game, placed thirtheenth, and also sold out several stores near hours after its release. Considering how popular Sega consoles were in Japan, this is significant. The series also spawned a variety of other popular media, including anime, manga, stage shows, light novels, concerts, CD releases, and a cafe/merchandise store that successfully ran from 1998-2008. The series also received mass critical acclaim at the time, with both journalists and fans praising the game in various ways, be it acclaim or awards. To provide two (of many) examples, the original Sakura Wars was the second most-wanted game in a 1996 Famitsu poll, only after Final Fantasy VII, and in another 2009 Famitsu poll Sakura was rated as the 17th best Japanese video game character, placing ahead of other prominent characters such as Luigi, Sephiroth, Mega Man, and Dante among others. The series has also crossed over with multiple other franchises, including Granblue Fantasy, To Aru Majutsu no Index, Star Ocean (twice), and most notably, multiple Capcom and Namco series as a part of Project X Zone and Project X Zone 2.

Most recently, the series was revived due to large fan demand (with Sakura Wars topping a Sega series revival fan poll in a landslide by a little under 1000 votes). The reboot has done incredibly well sales wise, most recently placing in the top 1/3 (Rank 32) of the Top 100 best-selling games of 2019 according to Famitsu, making it the third best selling Sega title only behind Persona 5 Royal and Mario and Sonic at the Tokyo Olympic Games. For reference, both of the former games have playable representation in Smash Brothers Ultimate.

The reboot has marked a significant revival of the series, bringing its own manga series, anime series (which was picked up for a simulcast by Funimation), and a stage play (which was unfortunately canceled due to COVID complications). And the developers of the reboot want to keep the momentum going as much as possible, with them stating in a recent interview that they're "actively researching to see where there is high demand and determine what actions will be feasible" and "pushing to make it (a continuation of the new series) happen." Even during its lull, the series was popular within Sega, with the devs stating in an earlier interview that ideas for the series' continuation were being pitched yearly. Sakura Wars is an incredibly popular both within and outside of Sega. Considering the close relationship that Nintendo and Sega share alongside the strong precedent that they have working on Smash together, I could definitely see Sega suggesting Sakura to represent the Sakura Wars series, and Nintendo/Sakurai adding her to the game due to the massive popularity and acclaim surrounding the series.

You know, the image of a series that's incredibly popular in Japan but just recently seeing a push into the West almost makes me think of another series currently in Smash. I swear I talked about it in-depth, but I just can't remember...

View attachment 284559

Beats me.

Regardless, I'd say Sakura is one of, if not the most likely Sega characters if we get another one.

Aside from Sakura Wars being popular both in it's golden age and it's dormancy, not to mention it being adapted into pretty much every medium, the points that caught my attention was this and this. For the former, the 2019 revival was in the upper third of the 100 best-selling games of 2019, as well as being one of Sega's best-sellers, beaten out only by proven money-printers Persona 5 Royal and Mario and Sonic.. For the latter, it won a revival poll by a landslide, beating out runner-up Jet Set Radio by almost 1000 votes.
However, something TPC didn't mention in his writeup was that the revival interest poll also had a more general Sega brand interest poll... And Sakura War won that as well, beating out Yakuza, Shenmue, Puyo Puyo, Persona, and Sonic the ****ing Hedgehog himself. I repeat, Sakura Wars outvoted Sonic the Hedgehog, Sega's very own mascot, by about 600 votes.

I honestly think Sakura could be a major dark horse here. And hey, even if you think she's unlikely, it's something to talk about that isn't Geno, Byleth, or the new date for the nonexistent Nintendo Direct. So let's discuss.

 

[PeridotGX]

Maxwell from Scribblenauts would be pretty cool, here's a moveset I made for him.

Maxwell

PLAYABLE MAXWELL Maxwell is the main character of Scribblenauts, a series where the main premise is that you can do almost anything. Wielding a sword to kill a dragon? That’s allowed. Wielding a dragon to kill a sword? That too. With the object editor and the official crossover with DC, it’s co...

docs.google.com

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Oh, which is it?

I am never able to tell jokes at all, I don't know what this is called.

I'm sure he was joking as well. My response was just lamenting the thought process.

 

[SirBillyBob]

What is this, acknowledgement of Starfy?

2002年のきょう『伝説のスタフィー』発売!! pic.twitter.com/1l96IN0ipu

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) September 6, 2020

 

[Perkilator]

What is this, acknowledgement of Starfy?

2002年のきょう『伝説のスタフィー』発売!! pic.twitter.com/1l96IN0ipu

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) September 6, 2020

Man, Sakurai's Twitter must've glitched out or something...

 

[Guynamednelson]

I'd love to discuss more off the wall picks, but the discussion always gets shot down as them being "Unlikely", and then discussion goes back to Sora/Geno/insert current flavor of the minute character here.

Don't mess with us 2020 Smash fans

We're so unwilling to think outside the Crash/Master Chief/Sora box that if they still aren't in by CP11, we'll think CP11 will be all of them combined.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

If anybody was wondering, yes.

I was kidding. Byleth is not Monster Hunter.

 

[7NATOR]

Lately, I've noticed that Sakura Shinguji might actually have a pretty decent shot if we're going for a Japan-appeal character. TPC raised some pretty good points in his send-off writeup, so I'll bring that up as a reminder.

Aside from Sakura Wars being popular both in it's golden age and it's dormancy, not to mention it being adapted into pretty much every medium, the points that caught my attention was this and this. For the former, the 2019 revival was in the upper third of the 100 best-selling games of 2019, as well as being one of Sega's best-sellers, beaten out only by proven money-printers Persona 5 Royal and Mario and Sonic.. For the latter, it won a revival poll by a landslide, beating out runner-up Jet Set Radio by almost 1000 votes.
However, something TPC didn't mention in his writeup was that the revival interest poll also had a more general Sega brand interest poll... And Sakura War won that as well, beating out Yakuza, Shenmue, Puyo Puyo, Persona, and Sonic the ****ing Hedgehog himself. I repeat, Sakura Wars outvoted Sonic the Hedgehog, Sega's very own mascot, by about 600 votes.

I honestly think Sakura could be a major dark horse here. And hey, even if you think she's unlikely, it's something to talk about that isn't Geno, Byleth, or the new date for the nonexistent Nintendo Direct. So let's discuss.

I'm surprised you guys didn't mention one fact

Sakurai loves Samurais. You can tell by his name, and also the fact that he's considered Takamaru for 2 Games. I'm being semi-Joking, and Semi-Serious with this point though. She also has Mechs, which is like a One-Two Combo of Awesome.

 

[MarioRaccoon]

I think that Monster Hunter case is a bit different than ARMS, they could have put a MH fighter (the series is around 2004) while ARMS dubted mid 2017 (and Sakurai stated that they can not put an ARMS fighter because the series released later than Sakurai decided the fighters, late 2015).

So I think that he thought of a MH back when he finished ultimate document’s proposal. I know that MH World is massively popular worldwide but the franchise was selling great before (fact: MH Generations, that came out in 2015, was best selling retail game in japan that year). Its likely that discussing with Capcom, they preffered to repesent the IP with Rathalos than the hunter.

Though I would have like they finish the job and release a DLC MH stage with more music and spirits.

 

[SneakyLink]

What is this, acknowledgement of Starfy?

2002年のきょう『伝説のスタフィー』発売!! pic.twitter.com/1l96IN0ipu

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) September 6, 2020

Yep, the text states that 2002 is when Densetsu no Stafy first released.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

2002年のきょう『伝説のスタフィー』発売!! pic.twitter.com/1l96IN0ipu

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) September 6, 2020

Oh look he remembered Mario Sunshine

’d

 

[BlondeLombax]

I read somewhere that the Monster Hunter creator's didn't want to see the player characters appear in crossover fighting games, and were miffed when they were added to MvCI anyway. Am I misinformed? Because that could be a potential bane to their chances.

 

[Perkilator]

I read somewhere that the Monster Hunter creator's didn't want to see the player characters appear in crossover fighting games, and were miffed when they were added to MvCI anyway. Am I misinformed? Because that could be a potential bane to their chances.

We've already discussed this, and I'm pretty sure they've changed their minds since then. The player characters have been appearing in a lot of crossovers since, not just MvCI.

 

[SharkLord]

I read somewhere that the Monster Hunter creator's didn't want to see the player characters appear in crossover fighting games, and were miffed when they were added to MvCI anyway. Am I misinformed? Because that could be a potential bane to their chances.

If so that's a monster-sized oof. This is actually pretty important, so it would be nice if someone could confirm this.
EDIT: Well that was quick. Thanks, Perkilator.

 

[Shroob]

Don't mess with us 2020 Smash fans

We're so unwilling to think outside the Crash/Master Chief/Sora box that if they still aren't in by CP11, we'll think CP11 will be all of them combined.

Like


goddamn


It feels soo refreshing when this thread talks about something new for a change. Remember Ryza? You don't have to think a character's likely, but what's the harm in just discussing them period? It feels like people are soo set in their ways that they're not willing to consider any possibilities that aren't their own.



Aside from legitimate leaks, the best moments of this thread are the 30~ odd minutes where people try discussing something new before someone comes in and interjects "Ehhh, they're not likely", and everything resets back to how it was.

 

[N3ON]

Lately, I've noticed that Sakura Shinguji might actually have a pretty decent shot if we're going for a Japan-appeal character. TPC raised some pretty good points in his send-off writeup, so I'll bring that up as a reminder.

Aside from Sakura Wars being popular both in it's golden age and it's dormancy, not to mention it being adapted into pretty much every medium, the points that caught my attention was this and this. For the former, the 2019 revival was in the upper third of the 100 best-selling games of 2019, as well as being one of Sega's best-sellers, beaten out only by proven money-printers Persona 5 Royal and Mario and Sonic.. For the latter, it won a revival poll by a landslide, beating out runner-up Jet Set Radio by almost 1000 votes.
However, something TPC didn't mention in his writeup was that the revival interest poll also had a more general Sega brand interest poll... And Sakura War won that as well, beating out Yakuza, Shenmue, Puyo Puyo, Persona, and Sonic the ****ing Hedgehog himself. I repeat, Sakura Wars outvoted Sonic the Hedgehog, Sega's very own mascot, by about 600 votes.

I honestly think Sakura could be a major dark horse here. And hey, even if you think she's unlikely, it's something to talk about that isn't Geno, Byleth, or the new date for the nonexistent Nintendo Direct. So let's discuss.

I think if Smash was only concerned with Japan, Sakura would then be a good dark horse pick. But they also have the rest of the world to contend with.

And it's not like Banjo, where even if "overseas demand" is what got the character in, he's not some little-known, unpopular quantity over there. Or Hero, where not only is DQ an institution over there, but it at least has some visibility globally.

To put things in perspective, there have only been two Sakura Wars games that even released outside Japan, ten years apart, and neither performed well. She's, in some ways, to the west what Spyro is to Japan.

So all in all, good luck to the Sakura supports. Frankly I think people are overestimating her odds by considering her anything more than a very remote possibility, and her current status as a semi-frequent point of discussion is partly due to the typical afterglow that a recent release affords a character in Smash speculation. Sorry to come down so hard, but to mince words wouldn't properly evoke my thoughts on the matter.

 

[Deleted member]

Don't mess with us 2020 Smash fans

We're so unwilling to think outside the Crash/Master Chief/Sora box that if they still aren't in by CP11, we'll think CP11 will be all of them combined.

WE FOUND CP11 EVERYONE, PACK IT UP!

 

[PeridotGX]

WE FOUND CP11 EVERYONE, PACK IT UP!

sorry, gonna need to destroy that cursed image