Q&A Mechanics & Techniques Discussion

[shoops]

Sorry if this has (probably) been asked already, but is up-smash OoS still possible?

 

[Kofu]

Yes, you can use USmash out of shield.

 

[XalchemistX]

Actually there is a Smooth Lander Brawn Badge that is a set value that works on every character. It can take as low as 15-20 min to unlock.

How do you unlock it?

 

[Twigler]

Is it possible to concatenate all the techniques into the first post so we can all easily look at the known techniques for the game?

 

[Steel_Samurai]

I'm not sure if this is the place to ask this, but have the blast zones been made smaller in the Wii U version?

I keep reading that they have been, and it sure feels like it, but I never got 100% confirmation

 

[Twigler]

I'm not sure if this is the place to ask this, but have the blast zones been made smaller in the Wii U version?

I keep reading that they have been, and it sure feels like it, but I never got 100% confirmation

They feel larger to me

 

[Shaya]

I've noticed Vertical kill moves being a bit better, but that could be confirmation bias.

 

[Sirgabite]

well as for something simple i found that dropping the ledge and then up b as shulk at higher % usually gives you a free opening and some free damage on your opponent if they dont shield or run away,

 

[san.]

The blastzone on Battlefield is the same as 3DS. FD, Town & City, and other Brawl neutrals like Lylat are quite a bit smaller. Tested FD, BF, SV, and Town & City.

 

[wmo_]

What are my options when someone bounces? (when they don't tech the landing). I know they're invulnerable for parts of it, but I have no idea what parts. I try to attack but I always fail. I saw someone grab someone else when they bounced, I haven't tried much to do it but I haven't yet.

And can I SDI out of jab attacks so I can miss the last attack? (The last attack usually sends you far and does more dmg). I know there's DI in this game but I don't know about SDI. I also never practiced SDI so there's that.

 

[Epok]

How do you unlock it?

-1 golden hammer on your challenges menu

-beat all star mode in 6 minutes or less with shulk on easy difficulty. This will open a window and give you another hammer.

-break tge two windows directly above the shulk challenge and you'll get the smooth lander badge.

*the actual challenge window the awards it is for unlocking all the custom move sets.

Does anyone else feell like Nintendo set it up that to reward competitive smashers to play casually?

 

[XalchemistX]

-1 golden hammer on your challenges menu

-beat all star mode in 6 minutes or less with shulk on easy difficulty. This will open a window and give you another hammer.

-break tge two windows directly above the shulk challenge and you'll get the smooth lander badge.

*the actual challenge window the awards it is for unlocking all the custom move sets.

Does anyone else feell like Nintendo set it up that to reward competitive smashers to play casually?

Thanks

 

[Big O]

I can also confirm that the blastzones are smaller for some stages on the Wii U.

 

[SnorlaxPie500]

I'm having trouble applying shield dropping in this game. I just run off bair or fall through and bair without shield dropping. It just seems like a better option or at least an easier one to perform.

Is shield dropping worth the time and effort to master? Are there better techniques I should be applying instead? Thanks.

 

[RhyRhychan]

Unless you can explain what else happened... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFlnSZfIFYM
I found this out while streaming on my twitch account (www.twitch.tv/rhyrhychan) with my friend Milesg2g. He knocked me off the ledge, and I went to recover while he was on the ledge and right as I went to the ledge he did the ledge attack to get back on the stage and I just fell past it..

 

[Saito]

If this ends up being another Robin only glitch, I'm going to be mad.

I'll see if I can reproduce it in the morning.

 

[HeroMystic]

I'm actually pretty sure this is due to Robin's Elwind animation.

 

[RhyRhychan]

I'm actually pretty sure this is due to Robin's Elwind animation.

Well I hope it's not a Robin only glitch (I don't need more problems). Someone on my stream said they remembered that happening to them before to on multiple other characters.

 

[hotdogturtle]

It looks to me like you were in that cooldown period after grabbing the ledge when you can't regrab it (one of the mechanics that they changed in this game). You did use your up-B immediately after dropping from the ledge, so it was probably too soon for you to grab it again. I don't think that Shulk's actions had anything to do with it.

 

[RhyRhychan]

It looks to me like you were in that cooldown period after grabbing the ledge when you can't regrab it (one of the mechanics that they changed in this game). You did use your up-B immediately after dropping from the ledge, so it was probably too soon for you to grab it again. I don't think that Shulk's actions had anything to do with it.

I've never had a problem with it before, but maybe..

 

[Swiggin]

It looks to me like you were in that cooldown period after grabbing the ledge when you can't regrab it (one of the mechanics that they changed in this game). You did use your up-B immediately after dropping from the ledge, so it was probably too soon for you to grab it again. I don't think that Shulk's actions had anything to do with it.

I'm pretty certain this is what happened.

 

[RhyRhychan]

Also I can't say how credible or not the person who said it had happened to him on other characters is since he was just a viewer in stream, however this also might be a robin only thing, and that makes me sad.

 

[Saito]

I tried to reproduce it but I can't.

Even after the up B right after dropping off the ledge, robin misses it while going upwards but grabs it while going downwards normally. I even did shulk's get up attack like in the video, but robin still grabs the edge while coming back down.

Even in 1/4x speed with a fast fall after elwind, robin still grabs while going downwards normally.


I did notice that in the video shulk was invincible during the entire thing from the ledge grab to the get up attack, but I couldn't imitate that exactly.

 

[RhyRhychan]

It looks to me like you were in that cooldown period after grabbing the ledge when you can't regrab it (one of the mechanics that they changed in this game). You did use your up-B immediately after dropping from the ledge, so it was probably too soon for you to grab it again. I don't think that Shulk's actions had anything to do with it.

I'm pretty certain this is what happened.

Really I don't think that's what happened, I'm sort of leaning towards a Robin only problem with Elwind, because I have grabbed the ledge MUCH faster before than I tried to do in this video, as Robin, and other characters, and NEVER have had a problem with it.

 

[Shaya]

If you hold down you will not grab ledges, no matter what move or action.
Please use the mechanics thread in the future to ask.

 

[RhyRhychan]

I tried to reproduce it but I can't.

Even after the up B right after dropping off the ledge, robin misses it while going upwards but grabs it while going downwards normally. I even did shulk's get up attack like in the video, but robin still grabs the edge while coming back down.

Even in 1/4x speed with a fast fall after elwind, robin still grabs while going downwards normally.


I did notice that in the video shulk was invincible during the entire thing from the ledge grab to the get up attack, but I couldn't imitate that exactly.

Yea.. it's weird I didn't have it happen to me again after that, or during the rest of the stream, and this was the first time it had happened to me before

If you hold down you will not grab ledges, no matter what move or action.
Please use the mechanics thread in the future to ask.

I didn't hold down after up b, I fell normally.

 

[Shaya]

You don't need to be fast falling to be considered a down input for it, IIRC.
Could've been as you tried holding left to move towards the stage, tilted downwards accidentally would kill your stock.

 

[RhyRhychan]

You don't need to be fast falling to be considered a down input for it, IIRC.
Could've been as you tried holding left to move towards the stage, tilted downwards accidentally would kill your stock.

I don't remember my fingers at the exact time, but I don't remember holding any form of down. Maybe... but I don't think I did, Idk..I've never had a problem grabbing the ledge before with any character moving left to it or otherwise. I know Robin has a few problems with Elwind already, so maybe its just another thing that's wrong with the move. Maybe it was a technical error, I wonder if anyone can reproduce it somehow. I just don't remember holding down in any way, and I don't think I was.

 

[Hong]

I tried to reproduce it but I can't.

Even after the up B right after dropping off the ledge, robin misses it while going upwards but grabs it while going downwards normally. I even did shulk's get up attack like in the video, but robin still grabs the edge while coming back down.

Even in 1/4x speed with a fast fall after elwind, robin still grabs while going downwards normally.


I did notice that in the video shulk was invincible during the entire thing from the ledge grab to the get up attack, but I couldn't imitate that exactly.

Just to add to this, but I have the same results. I was not able to replicate this with Shulk, Mario, and Robin holding the ledge. I tried the ledge getup, attack, jump, and roll, at both 0% and 100%

Edit - Not like I'm writing off any potential issues. It is likewise difficult for me to detect specific timing windows at the moment.

 

[|RK|]

Oh, I've never seen too much discussion on the removal of edgehogging. What did the competitive community think about that?

 

[_Malal]

Do we know yet if you mash too fast on jab pummels you won't fill up the stale moves queue per pummel?

I remember this being a problem with Luc and Samus in brawl

 

[Opana]

I have recently found out you can Jump Cancel Throw by dropping the item. You know how if you press grab with an item on the ground it tosses it back? Well I didn't know this was jump cancelable and was wondering if this was known.

 

[Azazel]

Skid canceled shield grab from brawl did not return as you can't cancel skid with shield,but heres some thing that do cancel skids.

1. Item pick up
2. Jump
3. Pivot Grab

 

[kupo15]

Is it possible to concatenate all the techniques into the first post so we can all easily look at the known techniques for the game?

I second this motion since I have something I would like to share and forgive me for not wanting to go through 11 pages of info to see if its been known.

I figured out that S4 no longer has "stance" requirements anymore (or at least partially)

What I mean is we all know that Smash has stances (stand, walk, dash, run, skid etc) and those stances limit your options. For example you can't do anything out of a turnaround skid, you can't do a Fsmash from a run but you can do it during a dash via pivots. It seems like S4 removed this rule:

Case in point, you can now go into a full run then instantly do a pivot fsmash in the other direction. This is something you never could have done because of the turnaround. You can even do a Fsmash from a full run in the same direction which proves that you can do things during a skid as well. I've even been able to do tilts as well

I'm not sure if all options are available at all times on the ground but I know that more options are.

The second thing I noticed is that if you are shielding at an edge and get hit, you no longer will slide off of it unless you drop your shield immediately after getting hit.

 

[Azazel]

What I mean is we all know that Smash has stances (stand, walk, dash, run, skid etc) and those stances limit your options. For example you can't do anything out of a turnaround skid, you can't do a Fsmash from a run but you can do it during a dash via pivots. It seems like S4 removed this rule:

You can even do a Fsmash from a full run in the same direction which proves that you can do things during a skid as well.

Err you can't F-smash or F-tilt from a Skid, you can Fsmash, ftilt whilst doing a Turnaround as you mentioned as well.
(edit) oh i see. it's really just refered to as a turnaround though other things are refered to as turnaround such as specials. Skid officially refers forward facing skid. Run > Skid. Run > turnaround. I guess it's confusing since Turnaround isn't exactly official terminology

 

[kupo15]

Err you can't F-smash or F-tilt from a Skid, you can Fsmash, ftilt whilst doing a Turnaround as you mentioned as well.
(edit) oh i see. it's really just refered to as a turnaround though other things are refered to as turnaround such as specials. Skid officially refers forward facing skid. Run > Skid. Run > turnaround. I guess it's confusing since Turnaround isn't exactly official terminology

I distinctly remember doing an Fsmash in the same direction I was running which is why I concluded that I was able to do it out of a skid...unless B. jr has an extremely short skid that I was actually in idle. I don't have the game so I can't test right now

And what is the official term for a turnaround? I'm not talking about pivots which occur at the start of a dash. I thought it was called turnaround.

 

[Icy Whatever]

Hello everyone, I noticed something while messing around in training and it seems like it could be pretty useful.

If you do a jump cancelled up smash during your initial dash animation, you slide farther than just doing a normal up smash out of that beginning dash. I would love for other people to try this because I am having a little trouble replicating it consistently. It may all be in my head haha. It might also increase full dash up smash slide distance but its less noticeable if it does.

Seeing as this is 11 pages deep I dont feel like checking if this is already a thing so sorry if it is

If anyone feels like trying it, its pretty apparent on Sheik and Lucina.

 

[Shaya]

I second this motion since I have something I would like to share and forgive me for not wanting to go through 11 pages of info to see if its been known.

I figured out that S4 no longer has "stance" requirements anymore (or at least partially)

What I mean is we all know that Smash has stances (stand, walk, dash, run, skid etc) and those stances limit your options. For example you can't do anything out of a turnaround skid, you can't do a Fsmash from a run but you can do it during a dash via pivots. It seems like S4 removed this rule:

Case in point, you can now go into a full run then instantly do a pivot fsmash in the other direction. This is something you never could have done because of the turnaround. You can even do a Fsmash from a full run in the same direction which proves that you can do things during a skid as well. I've even been able to do tilts as well

I'm not sure if all options are available at all times on the ground but I know that more options are.

The second thing I noticed is that if you are shielding at an edge and get hit, you no longer will slide off of it unless you drop your shield immediately after getting hit.

Anyone who fleshes out something like this, then they're free to make a topic that will likely find itself in the Academy Subforum.

A complete 'spiel' of Dashrun and all of the options relating to it is yet to be done, although there is a thread about "dash dancing/pivots" in that subforum.

 

[Azazel]

Anyone who fleshes out something like this, then they're free to make a topic that will likely find itself in the Academy Subforum.

A complete 'spiel' of Dashrun and all of the options relating to it is yet to be done, although there is a thread about "dash dancing/pivots" in that subforum.

http://smashboards.com/threads/all-things-momentum.379576/
Meh, I tried. Tried to cross reference it with the smash dictionary as well so it isn't too cluttered with made up jargon, but I'm newish cut me some slack.
Also need to add some stuff like canceling teh initial frames of dash with another dash or perfect pivot or Fsmash

 

[Shaya]

Needs a tad bit more clean up and cleaner formatting, but it's definitely a good start.
To me, reading it is complicated even as someone with a good understanding of most common terms (and am aware of most things you describe otherwise), I'm constantly having to go back to the top to cross check what you mean/refer to.

You can likely take out character specifics (or at least properly sub-section them/if you want I can give you the second post of the thread for them).