#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
That second thing (camping) is how Falco does a MU 'normally'
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Match-Up Discussion ~ Final Week Ganon/Falcon/Link >__>
- Thread starter Blad01
- Start date
- Status
Max Ketchum
Collegiate Starleague Smash Director
Just watched Rayku vs. Kismet. That Lucario was pretty awful. <_< All he did was roll behind Kismet.
phi1ny3
Not the Mama
Yeah, but it does illustrate the difference I was going for. (I couldn't really find any other lucario vs. falco vids of the difference across matches).
Edit: Wait, maybe D. Disciple, he's decent and he plays some falcos *looks*
Edit: Wait, maybe D. Disciple, he's decent and he plays some falcos *looks*
Max Ketchum
Collegiate Starleague Smash Director
Zucco vs. Bleachigo would be great if there were vids up.
phi1ny3
Not the Mama
Ya, I hear from Zucco that Bleachigo's pretty creative.
Also bleachigo, careful of Ness
Also bleachigo, careful of Ness
Alphicans
Smash Hero
I played a lot of pika vs falco yesterday and I think the match-up is probably 45-55 for pika or maybe 40-60 for pika. Either way, yes he does have the advantage but not a 65-35 advantage. I recorded a lot of them, and I am going to try and get them uploaded.
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
Yo dawg i herd u like logic so i imitated u
I played a lot of pika vs falco yesterday and I think the match-up is probably 90-10 for pika. Either way, yes he does have the advantage but not a 65-35 advantage. I recorded a lot of them, and I am going to try and get them uploaded.
Alphicans
Smash Hero
Yeah I can understand how videos won't fully prove my point, but the idea is for the videos is to supplement my points. There is no need to troll me, when I am just trying to contribute to the falco community.
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
I'm not trolling you.
I just think that you shouldn't make a statement about that without supplying a healthy dose of logic, or just wait till the videos are uploaded (IF they get uploaded) and provide them at the same time as your argument.
sooo edit
I think teran wants to do jiggly before we start with rediscussing, not sure though. Teran what's your shot on this?
Alphicans
Smash Hero
You were definitely trolling me. I was just giving a prelude into what I thought, whether or not you found the amount of logic to be enough was no concern to me, and it shouldn't bother you either.
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
You were definitely trolling the boards. You were giving a prelude into what you thought even though it isn't even the topic, whether or not I found the amount of logic to be enough was apparently no concern to you, even though you're posting off-topic in a thread, and it does bother me that you are.
Alphicans
Smash Hero
The topic is match-up discussion, how am I posting off topic? People were discussing lucario match-ups as well, why doesn't that bother you? You question my logic, but then yours is even more flawed than mine. And actually you trying to troll me is making this thread go off topic even further...
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
People are discussing the lucario match-up with logic and they're trying to go in-depth on the match-up.
What you did is post a thought and left without supporting anything.
I don't question your logic, I question your ability to support your statements with logic. Be free to tell me wrong.
This didn't even have to go off-topic if it was just left at 1 reply, though I admit it was my fault here.
Also please tell me wrong on the pikachu match-up thing, because I'd love to have the difficulty decreased.
I apologize for being so offensive though >_>
Notra
Smash Ace
i can actually agree w/ xonar for once.......u came in here and said u have more experience than all of us at pikachu. i mean yes xonar and friends r duches at some times. but i can agree w/ him at times. and a video doesnt mean much. the match ups can only be decided w/ highskill (more perfect skill)falco vs highskill pika. so unless sk92 plays anther. or dehf plays pika pika. Even better lvl 99 falco vs lvl 99 pika play we will nvr surely know. but a collection of our opinions (seeing how we r all better at r own special techs) in the best we can do. and so we do it...................
Alphicans
Smash Hero
I said I have more pika experience because I literally play a pika every day, I know the match-up really well. I wouldn't say such an outrageous thing if I didn't have reason to. Match-ups also shouldn't be based off of only high level games. In fact I think low-high(mid) games are better determiners for match-ups because at those levels mostly fundamentals are used in matches. Mindgames/reads should not be included in match-up analysis, so SK92 vs Anther would not be a good determiner for the pika vs falco match-up, because at that level there are way more things determining the result of the match then just the match-up by itself. And I know lots of people would agree with me on this.
Max Ketchum
Collegiate Starleague Smash Director
Matchup discussion should only include theory of the characters in question at the highest level available at the time of the discussion.
Y'all need to chill out before I get mad.
U mad.
So like, yes, I'll make a Jigglypuff MU thread so we can finish this nonsense for good. Unless someone would like to beat me to it, I really don't care either way.
10lasers
U mad.
So like, yes, I'll make a Jigglypuff MU thread so we can finish this nonsense for good. Unless someone would like to beat me to it, I really don't care either way.
10lasers
HRNUT (Honey Roasted)
Smash Master
Hey um...i just kinda picked up falco a month ago as a second to marth, and got second in a tourney because i couldn't beat a defensive tornado spamming mk (seibrik), how do i get back on the stage safely without getting sent into the air by tornado and how do approach/beat a defensive mk...
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
ledgehop laser?Hey um...i just kinda picked up falco a month ago as a second to marth, and got second in a tourney because i couldn't beat a defensive tornado spamming mk (seibrik), how do i get back on the stage safely without getting sent into the air by tornado and how do approach/beat a defensive mk...
and you dont approach mk as falco
HRNUT (Honey Roasted)
Smash Master
really lol, well i won one match appraoching so i figured to keep doing that lol okay good to know and i mean when i get sent flying he tornados the ledge so i can't really do much cuz he just rises if i go high and is able to react faster cuz i have lag and mk is ********...
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
yeah if he gets the ledge its pretty bad, but the best thing is keep your jump and stall till he has to move back onstage to end the nado
HRNUT (Honey Roasted)
Smash Master
okay cool i'll try to apply those things, hopefully i can win next time
adumbrodeus
Smash Legend
MK planks/aircamps, what do you do now?ledgehop laser?
and you dont approach mk as falco
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
Falco has no answer to planking, that's universally known.
If they dair camp on your shield bair oos is your best option to trade damage, SK92 said that, and I believe it to be true.
Nidtendofreak
Smash Hero
lol hi
Why do you guys have the Falco VS Ike match-up at only 6-4? It should be 7-3. >_> /off topic
Why do you guys have the Falco VS Ike match-up at only 6-4? It should be 7-3. >_> /off topic
Notra
Smash Ace
even better if he is nadoing on the edge like that. do a long canceled phantasm. cause of how the physics w. it works falco shoots straight up into the air out of it. and can acutally dair the meta out of nado. be sure to have the spacing so its when falco starts falling diagonal. if u dont feel like learnign all that then try phantasming high or earlier than he would expect.
@ that one pikachu dude. like i said i play pikas all the time too. and the boards idea of it i can actually trust. and i said sk92 and anther not cause of there player skills, but because they r prob the best at controlling falcos and pikas tech skills (consistently). Sure they have mistakes sometimes. but there tourney results can back up their tech skill(not only player skill)
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
That's actually pretty smart, just phantasm on the tip and you'll be out immediately with a split second of DI.
Thanks notra
And guys, it seems that you all know pikachu very well, write all your information down and safe it for the next thread, please
Thanks notra
And guys, it seems that you all know pikachu very well, write all your information down and safe it for the next thread, please
BleachigoZX
Smash Master
Not just Ness all of Low Tier too. I don't know any of those MU's!!!Ya, I hear from Zucco that Bleachigo's pretty creative.
Also bleachigo, careful of Ness
HRNUT (Honey Roasted)
Smash Master
okay thanks, i can cancel fairly well, i'll post matches from the tourney if they can find them so you guys can tell me what i did wrong/right etc.
phi1ny3
Not the Mama
Actually, I think lucario vs. Falco is 50:50 again. Falco can definitely try to make Phantasm mixed up, but lucario has the tools to keep him checking on it, plus lucario can avoid kill moves really well, since his moves are pretty safe on block + have low endlag (unless you PS, which applies to nearly every attack/option in the game anyways 
), and if spaced are going to be a bugger to punish. I saw a set awhile ago and discussed the MU with some people, and have seen that lucario can pull the strings to make it very even.
Sowwy to bwing it up again.
), and if spaced are going to be a bugger to punish. I saw a set awhile ago and discussed the MU with some people, and have seen that lucario can pull the strings to make it very even.Sowwy to bwing it up again.
PoweredVolt
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Jun 5, 2009
- Messages
- 28
It would be a lot more helpful if you put it all in one post instead of pages.
Ray_Kalm
Smash Master
So, are we discussing Link, Falcon, and Ganon here?
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
We're discussing nothing at the moment, lols.
was waiting for terans say on discussing jiggs before moving on, if he wants order who am i to deny it to him
Yumewomiteru
Smash Master
d-tilt work really well against jiggs.
BleachigoZX
Smash Master
I think Falco wins.Actually, I think lucario vs. Falco is 50:50 again. Falco can definitely try to make Phantasm mixed up, but lucario has the tools to keep him checking on it, plus lucario can avoid kill moves really well, since his moves are pretty safe on block + have low endlag (unless you PS, which applies to nearly every attack/option in the game anyways
Sowwy to bwing it up again.
Lord Chair
Smash Master
Almost as good as Phantasm spam /endsarcasm.
Deoxys
Smash Lord
You should put numbers up for the MK matchup if planking is allowed.
NxtGenFalco93
Smash Apprentice
hahaha lol i hope that ganon isnt werious 95-5 i would use falco in that case if he was my worst char. lol
PK-ow!
Smash Lord
Certain stages can ease things a bit for Ganon - if you can't just run around freely with pew pew - but even if you get close, you have frame 2 jab, combo into clearout option, long lasting bair, etc. etc. and Ganon's still pretty *****.
Ganon has to completely stop everything you want to set up.... but he can't because you always have Phantasm and Blaster lying around if we are open to that for the slightest moment.
It gets to 15-85 at the best.
Correct me if I'm wrong here, Ray.
I'm more interested in the Link matchup. Seems hard to analyze. Lasers really screw up Link's normal flow, though, that much is clear. Once Falco starts making Link play a firefight, Falco will just bumrush him. And the gimps.
Dear Ganondorf, the gimps.
Ganon has to completely stop everything you want to set up.... but he can't because you always have Phantasm and Blaster lying around if we are open to that for the slightest moment.
It gets to 15-85 at the best.
Correct me if I'm wrong here, Ray.
I'm more interested in the Link matchup. Seems hard to analyze. Lasers really screw up Link's normal flow, though, that much is clear. Once Falco starts making Link play a firefight, Falco will just bumrush him. And the gimps.
Dear Ganondorf, the gimps.
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